"Sign up for 2 year subscription to Xbox Live Gold Membership* at $14.99 per month and receive a 4GB Xbox 360 with Kinect for $99."
$14.99 x 12 x 2 +$99 = $458.76
Versus
$299 + $50 (XBLG) x 2 = $399
(Not to taking into consideration that buying the 4GB version of 360 is stupid in the first place because it requires you to purchase a grossly overpriced proprietary hdd sooner or later)
I challenge that math as it is not a fair comparison. It's a monthly payment subscription to XBL so you have to compare it to the monthly rate, which is $8.99. You are not paying for two years up front so you can not validly compare it to the price of full year subscription cards (which is $59.99 not $49.99 btw). As I said in the little things that annoy you thread:
The Deal offered by MS:
- Xbox 360 4GB Kinect Bundle for $99
- Two year contract for live at $14.99 a monthly
Total Cost: ~$459
Media Comapares it to:
- Xbox 360 4GB Kinect Bundle at $299
- Two 1-year Live subscription cards at $59.99 a piece
Total Cost: ~$419
What they should compare it to (i.e. the actual comparative package)
- Xbox 360 4GB Kinect Bundle at $299
- Two years of Xbox live at the regular monthly rate ($8.99/mo)
Total Cost: ~$515
That's ignoring the fact that this also means you don't have to pay it all up front.
Look at our friendly members:
MX7 wrote:I'm not a fan of a racist, gun nut brony puking his odious and uninformed arguments over every thread that comes up.
$8.99 a month? Nobody pays that. And the only reason anyone ever would would be so they could cancel at any given month and not have to pay any more, which this new deal does not allow, so that's not an equivalent rate.
If you shop around or wait til the right time you can get a 12 month for $40.
Clerk: "Those are buy one, get one half off."
Me: "Sounds good." I grab two and go to checkout.
Clerk: "Would you like to join our store membership? It's $15 a year, but you get 20% off."
Me: "Does that stack with the sale?"
Clerk: "No, but you get 20% off which is a better deal."
I pay that and I pay it because at the time I couldn't justify spending $50 on a year of live. Even though the monthly rate was more in the long run, it was less money up front and that is exactly what this deal is about. The only XBL payment that is available to be paid monthly is the $8.99 plan. You may be committing to 2 years when you get this $99 Xbox, but you're not paying for two years up front. You are agreeing to pay a set amount every month for two year and that's what makes it the fair plan to compare to.
Look at our friendly members:
MX7 wrote:I'm not a fan of a racist, gun nut brony puking his odious and uninformed arguments over every thread that comes up.
antron wrote:$8.99 a month? Nobody pays that. And the only reason anyone ever would would be so they could cancel at any given month and not have to pay any more, which this new deal does not allow, so that's not an equivalent rate.
If you shop around or wait til the right time you can get a 12 month for $40.
A lot of people will do this because they can't come up with the money up front. This is like saying it's dumb to finance a car because if you do so, you'll pay more in the long run.
Breaking news: Dodonpachi Developer Cave Releases Hello Kitty Game
brentsg wrote:A lot of people will do this because they can't come up with the money up front. This is like saying it's dumb to finance a car
If someone feels the need to purchase a new gaming console (for which a single game costs ~$50 USD) and can't even come up with the $300 USD it takes to purchase the game system, then maybe they are dumb.
Just a thought...
Last edited by Friendly on Tue May 08, 2012 10:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
brentsg wrote:A lot of people will do this because they can't come up with the money up front.
If you feel the need to purchase a new gaming console (for which a single game costs ~$50 USD) and can't even come up with $300 USD, then maybe you are.
Just a thought...
Are you suggesting that these people don't exist? They most certainly do.
Breaking news: Dodonpachi Developer Cave Releases Hello Kitty Game
brentsg wrote:A lot of people will do this because they can't come up with the money up front.
If someone feels the need to purchase a new gaming console (for which a single game costs ~$50 USD) and can't even come up with the $300 USD it takes to purchase the game system, then maybe they are dumb.
Just a thought...
Are you suggesting that these people don't exist? They most certainly do.
Oh, they do. I'm just pondering if maybe, just maybe, they aren't exactly bright (= the target group suggested in the topic of this thread).
Mmmm... there are a lot of other variables to this to consider. First of all, 299$ isn't necessarily a hard price for a 4GB 360. You might be able to find it significantly cheaper if you shop around. I'm pretty sure I've seen the XBL membership cards for as low as 30 dollars, too.
On the other hand, I wonder if there is some way to break the contract. It would be a really good deal if you could get the console for 99 bucks, then bail out of the contract somehow (you know, if you're of questionable morality).
brentsg wrote:A lot of people will do this because they can't come up with the money up front. This is like saying it's dumb to finance a car
If someone feels the need to purchase a new gaming console (for which a single game costs ~$50 USD) and can't even come up with the $300 USD it takes to purchase the game system, then maybe they are dumb.
Just a thought...
...unless your Xbox shit the bed, so you already own games and you don't feel like shelling out the $300 up front for another console. My 360 died not too long ago so I'd be tempted by this if Live wasn't a complete waste of time for me.
Blackbird wrote:
On the other hand, I wonder if there is some way to break the contract. It would be a really good deal if you could get the console for 99 bucks, then bail out of the contract somehow (you know, if you're of questionable morality).
The ad mentions fees for breaking the contract so I'd assume the price of breaking the Xbox Live contract makes up for the rest of the cost of the system.
In any case, there are likely to be further price cuts very soon as the 360 is getting pretty dated at this point. I would be extremely surprised if we did not have an announcement about the next Microsoft console very soon (if it hasn't been announced already). Once the new console is announced, the price is gonna drop like a brick and it will be down to:
1) Pick up old gen console on the cheap.
or
2) Wait and get probably-backwards-compatible new console that can run your 360 games and new stuff.
Anyway, giving it a rough look this deal is about like buying everything up front with a credit card with a not so good interest rate. Even then as you payed it off the interest would decline, unlike that inflated Xbox Live monthly payment.
It would be nice for someone with real finance skills to give us an equivalant CC APR for this deal.
Using $420 ($300 + $60 +$60) as the base amount, paid over 24 months.
APR: 19.0000 % (average credit card interest rate)
Monthly Payment: $21.17
Total Payment: $508.12
Total Interest: $88.12
APR: 28.0000 % (Average store credit card rate)
Monthly Payment: $23.05
Total Payment: $553.28
Total Interest: $133.28
APR: 11.0000 % (My CC interest rate)
Monthly Payment: $19.58
Total Payment: $469.81
Total Interest: $49.81
In all three cases the end cost is more than MS and at a higher monthly payment. The difference is that CC debt can be paid off early for less total interest. Still. MS deal is not looking so bad.
Last edited by njiska on Tue May 08, 2012 11:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Look at our friendly members:
MX7 wrote:I'm not a fan of a racist, gun nut brony puking his odious and uninformed arguments over every thread that comes up.
This "deal" also includes an extra year of warranty, which brings the value closer to actual MSRP. That said, it makes a lot more sense to wait for sales.
Friendly wrote:(Not to taking into consideration that buying the 4GB version of 360 is stupid in the first place because it requires you to purchase a grossly overpriced proprietary hdd sooner or later)
Eh, not really. A pair of 16gb flash drives would get the job done. And there's also the custom HDD option, but I guess that's moot, since I doubt anyone who would find this deal appealing would actually do that.
The point is that people who are willing to pay more than 20% on top of what it would cost to buy a game system directly are poor for a reason: Because they are dumb.
Friendly wrote:The point is that people who are willing to pay more than 20% on top of what it would cost to buy a game system directly are poor for a reason: Because they are dumb.
And people who shell out hundreds of dollars they don't have to save $40 over two years (a cost of $0.06 per day) are somehow smart? Look this is obviously not a best case-cost scenario, but it was never meant to be. It just another option to people with lower monthly income. Not just the poor, but also students and kids who don't make a whole lot of cash.
Cuilan wrote:This "deal" also includes an extra year of warranty, which brings the value closer to actual MSRP.
Keep forgetting about that. Do you happen to know the cost offhand?
Look at our friendly members:
MX7 wrote:I'm not a fan of a racist, gun nut brony puking his odious and uninformed arguments over every thread that comes up.
Friendly wrote:The point is that people who are willing to pay more than 20% on top of what it would cost to buy a game system directly are poor for a reason: Because they are dumb.
And people who shell out hundreds of dollars they don't have to save $40 over two years (a cost of $0.06 per day) are somehow smart? Look this is obviously not a best case-cost scenario, but it was never meant to be. It just another option to people with lower monthly income. Not just the poor, but also students and kids who don't make a whole lot of cash.
I think we can all agree that it kinda works as a layaway type deal. Don't knock financing until you're trying to support some doe-eyed kids who just want to fit in with their friends playing Black Ops.
OTOH, it was likely a cynical attempt at tricking people into paying more than they expected.
Moniker wrote:Don't knock financing until you're trying to support some doe-eyed kids who just want to fit in with their friends playing Black Ops.
Why would you let a child play Black Ops!? It's an M-rated videogame with tons of profanity and horrible ultraviolence.
I am not a parent, but judging by what I played when I was 12-14, probably. Junior high is tough when it comes to fads and trends. For a less contentious example, let's say Halo.
Wouldn't a poor (but not stupid) person just buy a cheap, used game system (eg an Xbox slim with less chance of a RRoD)?
The kind of people who finance cheap consumer goods are the ones who often end up tens of thousands of dollars in debt. CC companies love them. Every American credit card holder has an average credit cart debt of $6,000 USD. Let that sink in.
My reasoning is simple. If I can't afford something, then I save money until I can.
Last edited by Friendly on Wed May 09, 2012 7:00 am, edited 1 time in total.
Blackbird wrote:Why would you let a child play Black Ops!? It's an M-rated videogame with tons of profanity and horrible ultraviolence.
I know a family who practically uses Call of Duty as a babysitter. It's more common than you'd think. I guess it's okay because the kids are being trained to DEFEND AMURRICA!
Their son told me Deathsmiles was "too cartoony."
The kind of people who finance cheap consumer goods are the ones who often end up tens of thousands of dollars in debt.
This. Unless it's a car or a house, I always insist on buying everything in full, up front.
Friendly wrote:Wouldn't a poor (but not stupid) person just buy a cheap, used game system (eg an Xbox slim with less chance of a RRoD)?
The kind of people who finance cheap consumer goods are the ones who often end up tens of thousands of dollars in debt. CC companies love them. Every American credit card holder has an average credit cart debt of $6,000 USD. Let that sink in.
My reasoning is simple. If I can't afford something, then I save money until I can.
and that's great for you man, pat on the back and all that, but in the real world it's sadly not that black and white. I was in a position a few years back where my wage dropped by £350 a month and I was struggling my ass off, at the time the 360 was about all I had to pass the time with. Had it died, this woukd have been a godsend to me. The argument about the cost of games is also entirely redundant since a lot of folk going for this deal are never going to shell out RRP for a new game. Hell, I only bother maybe once a year. Bit harsg to call these people 'stupid', I'd suggest.
Marc wrote:Had it died [a few years back], this woukd have been a godsend to me.
A few years back Microsoft's extended warranty was in place to counter the RRoD fiasco.
PS.
So in this hypothetical scenario without RRoD and extended warranty you would have been able to pay $99 + $15 a month but not buy a cheap used one instead? I see.
I don't do pre-owned consoles, given their fucking horrid reliability issues these days. I really fail to see the problem here. Say the next Xbox launches at £300, or £100 upfront with the £15 p/m sub. With three kids, i'm happier to lay out the lower initial payment, even if it does cost a (not entirely unreasonable as credit goes, as pointed out above) bit more over two years, rather than take the full hit up front. Same as with my phone. Why do some get their panties in such a twist? Yep, the world would be grand if I could afford to pay up front for what I wanted whenever I wanted, sadly that's not always the case.
