SNES/SFC RGB quality - earlier models vs. later models ?

Fudoh · Post by **Fudoh** » Mon Dec 19, 2011 12:26 am

I think to remember that the later SFC (and/or SNES) revisions have a sharper RGB picture than the earlier machines. Can anyone confirm this from first hand experiences ? What about RGB-modded SFC jr. models ? How do they compare to original SFC units in terms of RGB quality ?

SGGG2 · Post by **SGGG2** » Mon Dec 19, 2011 1:24 am

Sharpest output from best to worst according to RGB32E; SNES with molded eject button, RGB modded mini, SNES with printed eject button.

Zapf · Post by **Zapf** » Mon Dec 19, 2011 2:28 am

http://sd2snes.de/blog/archives/75

Fudoh · Post by **Fudoh** » Mon Dec 19, 2011 8:16 am

Great, thanks ! The first link was the one I was thinking of. Any ideas how this behaviour translates to japanese models ?

grahf · Post by **grahf** » Mon Dec 19, 2011 10:36 am

Here is a pretty good digitpress thread that goes over this topic:
http://www.digitpress.com/forum/showthread.php?t=144910
Apparently there are a total of 5 different board revisions.
My personal Super Famicom has the 3 dots visible through the
bottom expansion port, and ended up having an SNS-RGB-CPU-01
revision board. I don't know if it's possible to identify the SFCs
by the case like the US ones, but If someone has the info please
share.

fagin · Post by **fagin** » Mon Dec 19, 2011 1:28 pm

This is interesting....

I have a launch JAP SNES and my RGB SCART lead is wired internally. I must admit that the image is not the sharpest (it's fine, but its certainly not as clear as my other retro consoles) and I did think it a bit weird. It was never a problem on CRT of course, but using linedoublers into a LCD certainly shows this slight fuziness.

Fudoh · Post by **Fudoh** » Mon Dec 19, 2011 1:34 pm

Mine too. 1990 Launch SFC. It was initially RGB modded with a SubD9 port, but I've remodded it to the original connector. You can reduce the blur to a minimum by using the original Nintendo cable or building one as close to the original specs as possible. From the above link (with the comparison screenshots) I'd like to switch to better one though (although the sound might take a tiny hit when going from Sony to something else.

grahf · Post by **grahf** » Mon Dec 19, 2011 2:35 pm

You mean the sound is different too? The newer ones are still using a Sony IC, but it's on the main board instead of in the removable module. I never heard anything about the newer SFC/SNESs sounding different.

Fudoh · Post by **Fudoh** » Mon Dec 19, 2011 3:29 pm

Sure about that ? I assumed the change in sound was a given fact. I remember an article from about 1996 or 1997 which detailed this change in hardware and I think to remember that the sound chip was not only integrated on board, but also not longer done by Sony.

grahf · Post by **grahf** » Mon Dec 19, 2011 3:42 pm

Yes, you can see it in the digitpress thread. There is a picture of a newer big-body SNES with two sony ICs at the top right. There is also a picture of a SNES2/SFC Jr. with a clearly visible Sony IC. I've also taken apart a lot of SNESs myself, and all of them had Sony sound ICs. There may be different ones out there that don't use Sony ICs, but not that I have seen.

Even so, it's still possible that there is a sound quality difference. I just never heard anyone mention it. They combined a few ICs into one, so something could be different. I can't imagine it would be much difference though, since the SFC sound chip is a fairly digital design, relying on samples mostly.

I'd be curious if anyone has any old and new machines that they could record sound samples from.

Fudoh · Post by **Fudoh** » Mon Dec 19, 2011 4:05 pm

I'd be curious if anyone has any old and new machines that they could record sound samples from.

I'm trying to borrow a newer unit for testing right now and I'll do this.

grahf · Post by **grahf** » Tue Dec 20, 2011 3:27 pm

Cool, I'm looking forward to it.

retr0gamer · Post by **retr0gamer** » Wed Dec 21, 2011 11:15 pm

Any idea if the sound being on the same board as the video for the later SNES model has something to do with the audio buzz during high contrast pictures?

Fudoh · Post by **Fudoh** » Wed Dec 21, 2011 11:19 pm

no, that's a cable issue.

retr0gamer · Post by **retr0gamer** » Wed Dec 21, 2011 11:42 pm

Are you sure? I've used 3 different cables (one raw sync) from 3 different places, and all had the same issue on my SNES. Regardless, I'm going to "solve" it with an optical audio mod

retr0gamer · Post by **retr0gamer** » Tue Dec 27, 2011 5:43 am

I noticed retro_console_accessories updated the raw sync SNES cable they were selling. This new version claims to eliminate the audio buzz. I'll give it a try and report back.

RGB32E · Post by **RGB32E** » Tue Dec 27, 2011 7:12 am

retr0gamer wrote:I noticed retro_console_accessories updated the raw sync SNES cable they were selling. This new version claims to eliminate the audio buzz. I'll give it a try and report back.

Fully rewired with made in USA Belkin shielded cable to guarantee no audio buzz.

Belkin...? Were you contacted about the updated cables?

RGB32E · Post by **RGB32E** » Tue Dec 27, 2011 7:16 am

The serial number of the SNES I've used with my XRGB-3 and mini is UN602678294. Hope this helps with your quest for a SNES that has good RGB output!

There's a decent chance that swapping out the caps in the SHVC-010 will also give a PQ improvement (won't fix the SNES/SFC though).

retr0gamer · Post by **retr0gamer** » Tue Dec 27, 2011 1:38 pm

RGB32E wrote:Belkin...? Were you contacted about the updated cables?

Nope, I had already bought one of em so when I looked at what they were selling now it allowed me to visually diff the changes. The cables used to be $11, now they're $17 and mention the audio buzz stuff.

retr0gamer · Post by **retr0gamer** » Sat Dec 31, 2011 2:25 pm

So I said I would report back once I tried the new cables that said they would eliminate the audio buzz. I'm happy to report it's all gone! I can finally enjoy my RPGs

Coligion · Post by **Coligion** » Thu Apr 05, 2012 5:01 am

retr0gamer wrote:So I said I would report back once I tried the new cables that said they would eliminate the audio buzz. I'm happy to report it's all gone! I can finally enjoy my RPGs

Can you please elaborate on the difference between the raw sync cable and the original?

lettuce · Post by **lettuce** » Sun Apr 29, 2012 11:08 am

Damn I never knew about a display difference depending on what revision you had. I must admit I have approx 4 US NTSC consoles and never noticed that vertical line.......I'm scared to look now. I might take them apart some time and see what revision they are, should add that I'm using a custom made psu and not a stepdown

ryu · Post by **ryu** » Mon Apr 30, 2012 8:49 am

so would it be better to use s-video for older models? i've never used s-video for anything before, but heard that it's almost just as good as rgb.

grahf · Post by **grahf** » Tue May 01, 2012 11:27 am

ryu wrote:so would it be better to use s-video for older models? i've never used s-video for anything before, but heard that it's almost just as good as rgb.

It depends on your TV (quality of comb filter, etc.). On a nice quality set, it really can look almost as good as RGB. You really won't know until you try though.

shmups.system11.org

SNES/SFC RGB quality - earlier models vs. later models ?

SNES/SFC RGB quality - earlier models vs. later models ?

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