North Korea launches rocket (Nope, didn't happen)

[tinotormed]

http://www.interaksyon.com/article/2868 ... r-the-best

Yup, considering the fact that either it is coming for Japan or for my country (Philippines)!

[evil_ash_xero]

I wouldn't be too concerned.

[BryanM]

It would be nice if they'd at least pretend it wasn't practice for an ICBM.

[Eno]

“We will ask for everybody who has knowledge about it. So, initially, the Americans, baka the Japanese also… we’ll also talk to them,”

I know this is quite serious, but, what the hell?

[Mortificator]

In Tagalog, baka means maybe.

Also beef. But probably not in this context.

[JBC]

Haha, those crazy North Koreans! What will they do next?

[GaijinPunch]

Haha, those crazy North Koreans! What will they do next?

Starve their people, nuke South Korea... if they're still standing, send one to Japan (probably Tokyo) for perfecting their kidnapping methods.


On a more serious note, it is the new fearless leader's advisers having him show his teeth, so those nasty white people don't get any big ideas.

[Ed Oscuro]

It would be nice if they'd at least pretend it wasn't practice for an ICBM.

They are saying it's a satellite test launch - and even an outside expert allowed in agreed that it didn't look like an ICBM test.

Of course, South Korean intelligence said at the same time that it appeared that the DPRK was digging a long trench for another nuclear weapons test.

[Moniker]

Haha, those crazy North Koreans! What will they do next?

Starve their people, nuke South Korea... if they're still standing, send one to Japan (probably Tokyo) for perfecting their kidnapping methods.


On a more serious note, it is the new fearless leader's advisers having him show his teeth, so those nasty white people don't get any big ideas.

You gotta wonder how shitty things really need to get before those morons get ousted from within. My previous theory was that widespread starvation was sufficient impetus for rebellion in general, but I guess I judged wrong.

[Randorama]

You gotta wonder how shitty things really need to get before those morons get ousted from within. My previous theory was that widespread starvation was sufficient impetus for rebellion in general, but I guess I judged wrong.

North Korea is all mountains and small villages. The military also have a tight control on territory, too. Famines ravage countryside populations - people in Pyonyang have a vaguely better life, and famine is not that much a problem.

China is also slowly pumping money in the country, to make people's life a tad better...and sedate any remote seed of rebellion. Enough food to live and cell phones, basically.

I believe that organizing a coup d'etat would be remarkably difficult, in these conditions. My mother-in-law's family had the right intuition and moved to Japan in 1948, sensing that the Northern part was going to have a remarkably dark future.

[GaijinPunch]

You gotta wonder how shitty things really need to get before those morons get ousted from within. My previous theory was that widespread starvation was sufficient impetus for rebellion in general, but I guess I judged wrong.

The problem is their military to peasant ration is extremely skewed. So, that's one thing that keeps everyone in check -- get in the military, and you get to eat. No military = no food. There's an article floating about the intarweb about a guy that was born in and escaped a concentration camp. Interesting read. I'll gig it up for you if you want.

EDIT: Duh, now realizing the timeline of Korea splitting. I really should know that since I'm always bitching about all the cocked up racist shit here.

[Randorama]

EDIT: Duh, now realizing the timeline of Korea splitting. I really should know that since I'm always bitching about all the cocked up racist shit here.

What do you mean, GP? Please expand.

[TonK]

[Ruldra]

There's an article floating about the intarweb about a guy that was born in and escaped a concentration camp. Interesting read.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/2012/ma ... rison-camp

Shit like that shouldn't exist in this day and age.

[njiska]

There's an article floating about the intarweb about a guy that was born in and escaped a concentration camp. Interesting read.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/2012/ma ... rison-camp

Shit like that shouldn't exist in this day and age.

Thanks for linking this and to GP for bringing it up. An interesting, albeit horrifying read.

[Jonathan Ingram]

Shit like that shouldn't exist in this day and age.

Why not? What`s so different about this day and age compared to before?

[njiska]

Shit like that shouldn't exist in this day and age.

Why not? What`s so different about this day and age compared to before?

Humanism?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humanism

[Jonathan Ingram]

Humanism?

No.

[njiska]

Humanism?

No.

Yes.

[Ed Oscuro]

I believe that organizing a coup d'etat would be remarkably difficult, in these conditions. My mother-in-law's family had the right intuition and moved to Japan in 1948, sensing that the Northern part was going to have a remarkably dark future.

That seems to have been a very wise prediction, especially in light of the fact that for a while after the war, the Stalinist north reportedly upheld better conditions than South Korea. I guess that explains why so many went to Japan instead of elsewhere, though.

[CIT]

Most Korean families in Japan actually came to Japan before WW2, during the colonial time, often as forced labor. During the 50s and 60s there was a large repatriation movement where about 1/3 of Koreans in Japan moved to North Korea, because only the Kim Il-Sung regime was seen as legitimate, having fought (or at least claiming to have fought) against Japanese occupation. Many of these "returnees" were then robbed of their assets and set to labor camps.

[Jonathan Ingram]

Most Korean families in Japan actually came to Japan before WW2, during the colonial time, often as forced labor. During the 50s and 60s there was a large repatriation movement where about 1/3 of Koreans in Japan moved to North Korea, because only the Kim Il-Sung regime was seen as legitimate, having fought (or at least claiming to have fought) against Japanese occupation. Many of these "returnees" were then robbed of their assets and set to labor camps.

The legitimacy thing was only one of the reasons. DPRK was the second most industrialized country in Asia at the time and the economic situation there was better than in the South. It wasn`t until the late 70s that it really started to lag behind its Southern neighbor.

Numerous reasons have contributed to the dire situation NK is in right now: the disappearance of the Eastern Bloc that DPRK traded with, the termination of Soviet aid(which was already getting progressively smaller during the Brezhnev years as the relations between the two countries grew colder), the economic sanctions imposed by imperialist nations, the series of catastrophic floods that caused colossal economic damage and the excesses of Juche/Songun policies. There are very concrete material reasons that have made DPRK the miserable place that it is, although listening to some bourgeois sources one would think that it`s all down to the evil nature of the Kims.

[Moniker]

There are very concrete material reasons that have made DPRK the miserable place that it is, although listening to some bourgeois sources one would think that it`s all down to the evil nature of the Kims.

As interesting as that is, whatever befell the country before is immaterial now. It has been within the power of the Kim dynasty to open the country to trade and aid, and they refuse to do so. If brainwashing and allowing the starvation of a populace to maintain absolute control isn't evil, I don't know what is. Although at this point it isn't clear where evil ends and incompetence begins.

[GaijinPunch]

Most Korean families in Japan actually came to Japan before WW2, during the colonial time, often as forced labor. During the 50s and 60s there was a large repatriation movement where about 1/3 of Koreans in Japan moved to North Korea, because only the Kim Il-Sung regime was seen as legitimate, having fought (or at least claiming to have fought) against Japanese occupation. Many of these "returnees" were then robbed of their assets and set to labor camps.

My question though, is about the Koreans that remained in Japan and were (later) given the right to choose Tokubetsu Eijuuken with Korean citizenship. I read an article once (can't find?) that just said, "Korean citizenship" but it didn't talk about South vs. the North. The fact that there are North Korean communities in Japan generally shocks people but I assume they are simply remnants of this time. I should know more about this time period which was so pivotal for the Asian Pacific region.

Here's this

Although Koreans in Japan prior to World War II suffered racial discrimination and economic exploitation, the Japanese authorities nonetheless counted ethnic Koreans as Japanese nationals and sought to fully assimilate Koreans into Japanese society through Japanese education and the promotion of intermarriage. Following the war, however, the Japanese government defined ethnic Koreans as foreigners, no longer recognizing them as Japanese nationals. The use of the term Zainichi, or "residing in Japan" reflected the overall expectation that Koreans were living in Japan on a temporary basis and would soon return to Korea. By December 1945, Koreans lost their voting rights. In 1947, the Alien Registration Law consigned ethnic Koreans to alien status. The 1950 Nationality Law stripped Zainichi children with Japanese mothers of their Japanese nationality; only children with Japanese fathers would be allowed to keep their Japanese citizenship. As of 1952, former colonial subjects–the majority of whom were Korean--whose homeland was not recognized by Japan as a legitimate nation-state (including Korea) were rendered stateless. In 1955, a law required that all registered foreigners be fingerprinted. Ethnic Koreans were even excluded from the rights granted to non-nationals in Japan's postwar constitution. Employment policies excluded Koreans from all "Japanese" jobs after 1945. Barred from all public and private-sector employment, Koreans pursued jobs in the informal-sector and engaged in illegal or marginal economic activities such as illegal alcohol production, scrap recycling, and racketeering.

[CIT]

Most Korean families in Japan actually came to Japan before WW2, during the colonial time, often as forced labor. During the 50s and 60s there was a large repatriation movement where about 1/3 of Koreans in Japan moved to North Korea, because only the Kim Il-Sung regime was seen as legitimate, having fought (or at least claiming to have fought) against Japanese occupation. Many of these "returnees" were then robbed of their assets and set to labor camps.

My question though, is about the Koreans that remained in Japan and were (later) given the right to choose Tokubetsu Eijuuken with Korean citizenship. I read an article once (can't find?) that just said, "Korean citizenship" but it didn't talk about South vs. the North. The fact that there are North Korean communities in Japan generally shocks people but I assume they are simply remnants of this time. I should know more about this time period which was so pivotal for the Asian Pacific region.

Roughly speaking the Koreans in Japan can be put into four distinct groups:

- Zainichi-Kankokujin (在日韓国人) - (who are backed by the organization Mindan) and hold ROK citizenship and permanent special residency in Japan. They were the first to gain permanent special residency after Japan normalized relations with the ROK.

- Zainichi-Chosenjin (在日朝鮮人) - (who are backed by the organisation Chongryon (jpn. = "Chosen Soren")) and hold DPRK citizenship. Chongryon Koreans live in a kind of North Korean parallel universe in Japan and make a big effort to resist assimilation into Japanese society, e.g. by running their own schools and a university. Chongryon Koreans are also a big source of foreign currency for the DPRK. Ironically this resistance to Japanese culture is exactly what the Japanese government wanted too (since it was a nice and convenient way to keep the Koreans out of mainstream society) so that is why Chongryon is able to exist and function so well in Japan. Zainichi Chosenjin got Tokubetsu Eijuuken sometime in the 1990s.

- Zainichi-Korian (在日コリアン) - who aren't affiliated with any organization and who do not feel connected to either Koreas but emphasize their distinct Korean-Japanese heritage. May have Japanese citizenship or be tokubetsu eijuusha.
(My former prof belongs to this group and she became a citizen after it no longer became necessary to adopt a Korean name. Still: when she showed her passport to open a bank account they didn't believe her and called the cops. Oh, Japan... )

- Assimilated Koreans - who have taken Japanese names and blend in completely with Japanese society. Some younger people in this group may even be completely unaware that they have Korean heritage.

The legitimacy thing was only one of the reasons. DPRK was the second most industrialized country in Asia at the time and the economic situation there was better than in the South. It wasn`t until the late 70s that it really started to lag behind its Southern neighbor.

While this is correct, the repatriation was very much ideologically driven. North Korea was still far behind Japan even in the 50s and 60s and repatriating Koreans were generally aware that this would put them at an economic disadvantage.

[Ed Oscuro]

Update: North Korea still doesn't launch rocket.

[Skykid]

There's an article floating about the intarweb about a guy that was born in and escaped a concentration camp. Interesting read.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/2012/ma ... rison-camp

Shit like that shouldn't exist in this day and age.

Thanks for linking this and to GP for bringing it up. An interesting, albeit horrifying read.

Fascinating article. The occurrences in concentration camps were expanded on, and real footage inside NK were shown in the documentary, Children of the State.

[Krimzon Kitzune]

Update: The rocket had finally launched... then it fell apart shortly after take-off.

I'm serious.

[trap15]

Surprise level: nearly 0.

[cj iwakura]

That's oddly relieving.