DVDO EDGE - How it performs

[Konsolkongen]

Ah of course. But all VGA sources should still work, right? Would I be able to pass through component video interlaced and progressive too?

[BuckoA51]

Yep, won't work unless you convert it.

The RGBHV/VGA inputs on the Edge aren't really designed for 15khz (works sometimes, but usually not) and I doubt they work at all with component. Use the other set of analogue inputs for that.

Somewhat related, the DSP option on the Extron sure is odd, in some instances it completely screws the colours up, other times it makes the picture more stable, other times less so, I'm glad I have an Extron with the DDSP switch at the front

[Konsolkongen]

I run all my VGA and component stuff through the same Matrix. So it's important that component would still work through the Extron device, and I don't think it would. 480i doesn't work through my RGB 190, but it might be different for other versions?

But with the Frame Meister coming out soon it would be crazy not to wait for Fudoh's review before buying more gadgets to increase compatibility on a setup that may be obsolete in the near future

[ZueriHB]

Got myself a Edge for all my scaling needs, works great and I'm quite happy with it.

But SCART RGB looks washed out and too bright, like a PAL N64 on modern TVs.

I use a Super Famicom with PAL GC RGB cable and a HiSaturn with RGB cable.
Setup: SCART-RGB -> SCART to RCA (intended for YUV-Connections) -> Edge

SFC with Composite


SFC with RGB


Saturn with Composite


Saturn with RGB


PS2, Wii and GC are connected with Component cables, no problems whatsoever.
All, Saturn, Wii, SFC and PS2 looked great on my CRT, so it's not the cables, does the edge accept different levels than PAL-TVs?

[BuckoA51]

Your Saturn looks fine to me, the SFC probably just has the wrong caps in the cable. Try a new cable. Also, when troubleshooting SCART be sure to remove any switches and try the connection directly. I don't want to think about the number of times I've thought a SCART switch was fine, only to find it was actually causing me problems.

[ZueriHB]

Your Saturn looks fine to me, the SFC probably just has the wrong caps in the cable. Try a new cable. Also, when troubleshooting SCART be sure to remove any switches and try the connection directly. I don't want to think about the number of times I've thought a SCART switch was fine, only to find it was actually causing me problems.

Thanks, I did try without any SCART-Switches in between, same result.

I can't say for sure about caps in the GC-Cable (used for SFC), but on any other TV (CRTs or flat screens), I didn't notice any image problems. I'll upload some different screenshots of my Saturn today afternoon, as its picture is worse than composite, but not that bad as the SFCs.

[BuckoA51]

Hmm wait a second...you said

"SCART to RCA (intended for YUV-Connections)"

Are you transcoding to component?

[ZueriHB]

Hmm wait a second...you said

"SCART to RCA (intended for YUV-Connections)"

Are you transcoding to component?

No. its only an adapter. have to get composite sync seperatly.

its still RGB, the Edge recognices it as RGB.

EDIT:
Looks like it's only a real problem for a Super Famicom, I will check the cable. for your information, it's the standard PAL RGB cable sold for use with GameCube. It's useless for a PAL SNES, but worked great for my SFC on a CRT (or TFT/LCD/Plasma etc).

But Saturn still looks a little washed out in comparison to composite or RGB on my old CRT.

[BuckoA51]

Yeah I'd definitely try a new SCART cable for your SFC, I get good results with the retro_console_accessories (ebay) raw sync one. You can't really compare DVDO Edge's 240p handling to a CRT, the CRT is always going to be miles better.

[ZueriHB]

Yeah I'd definitely try a new SCART cable for your SFC, I get good results with the retro_console_accessories (ebay) raw sync one. You can't really compare DVDO Edge's 240p handling to a CRT, the CRT is always going to be miles better.

Funny, but my CRT's 240p handling wasn't that great (deinterlacing).

But I keep my eyes open for SFC RGB cables. Thank you.

[BuckoA51]

CRT's don't deinterlace.

[ZueriHB]

CRT's don't deinterlace.

31kHz only. And my Grundig did, didn't do well on 240p images.

[fagin]

To keep EDGE stuff in the same place......

Below is a screen capture of connection to the EDGE via PS2 -> Sync Strike -> EDGE via RGBH


Below is a screen capture of connection to the EDGE via PS2 -> SCART to RCA -> EDGE via RGBs


The difference is subtle but obvious imo.... look at the word WEAPON between both captures. The RGBH connection is certainly sharper. Also look at the "I" on CREDIT... less ringing by the looks of it.

It's more obvious seeing the output in "real life".

[fagin]

Dark image on the EDGE:

You get a dark image on the EGDE when you feed it a clean sync but to the SYNC RCA as opposed to the HSYNC RCA. Use the same SYNC RCA but with a composite video sync.... no problems.

[BuckoA51]

Since I still get asked about the 15khz RGBHV trick and since my setup is all dismantled, I decided to do some tests. Here's my results using the Sync Strike, Console->Sync Strike->Edge(RGBHV)->Sony KDL40Z4500:-

Amiga CD32 (RGBHV direct, no sync strike) 50hz (PAL Console) Pure sync - Works
Amiga CD32 (RGBHV direct, no sync strike) 60hz (PAL Console) Pure sync - Fail (unsupported signal)
Atari Jaguar 50hz (PAL Console) Comp Video for sync - Fail (unsupported signal)
Sega Genesis 50hz (NTSC Console) Pure sync - Works
Sega Genesis 60hz Pure sync - Fail (unsupported signal)
Sega Saturn (model 2) 50hz (NTSC Console) Comp Video for sync - Works
Sega Saturn (model 2) 60hz Comp Video for sync - Works
Super Famicom 50hz Pure sync - Works
Super Famicom 60hz Pure sync - Fail (unsupported signal)

As you can see, compatibility is really rather too hit and miss to make this useful, the Saturn was the only console that still worked when set to 60hz for instance.

Fagin, in your experience, is compatibility improved at all by using only RGBH? I didn't have suitable cabling to try this myself.

[fagin]

I can't say I've noticed any increased compatibility by using this..... however, all my 60hz consoles worked that I tried (PS2, SNES, Saturn, AES, TG16) iirc.

[BuckoA51]

Interesting, maybe using composite video for sync actually /improves/ compatibility in this particular instance, I'll have to try.

[BuckoA51]

Pure sync vs Composite video doesn't make a difference, but RGBH vs RGBHV does, my results from this round of testing, all going Console->Sync strike->Extron (to sync split since I don't have any cables to do this on the Sync Strike) -> Edge (RGBH) -> TV

Atari Jaguar - 50hz - Comp Video for sync - Fail (no signal)
Sega Genesis - 50hz (NTSC Console) - Pure sync - Works
Sega Genesis - 60hz - Pure sync - Works
Sega Saturn (model 2) - 50hz (NTSC Console) - Pure sync - Works
Sega Saturn (model 2) - 60hz Comp Video - Pure sync - Works
Super Famicom - 50hz - Pure sync - Works
Super Famicom - 60hz - Pure sync - Partial (picture warped at top, occasionally drops out)
Super Famicom - 50hz - Comp Video for sync - Works
Super Famicom - 60hz - Comp Video for sync - Partial (picture warped at top, occasionally drops out)

Still rather hit and miss, but if you want to try this, RGBH is absolutely the way to go.

[fagin]

This is where it all goes Pete Tong with the SNES.... I never had a problem on 60hz.

[BuckoA51]

Different models of SFC/SNES I think have different problems, as is happening over in the Frame Miester thread !

[Overkill]

Just received my syncblaster scart to VGA, buyed as a good bargain in ebay (usual price is 70€) hoping it will fix my pal sega saturn issues, but it won't. My DVDO edge gets a strange wave like interference, very strange and ugly. I thing only a real NTSC US or JAP 60hz sega saturn will do the job. Strange too is it connected to a Xrgb3 works without that wave interfeance.

[BuckoA51]

PAL Saturn works just fine. Did you try connecting only the H sync from your VGA breakout cable? (I think the Syncblaster supports RGBc, but really the Sync Strike is better value) Also, time to fess up, are you using any kind of SCART switch?

Also, if you have an XRGB3 why on earth are you even bothering with putting your Saturn directly to the Edge?

[Overkill]

PAL Saturn works just fine. Did you try connecting only the H sync from your VGA breakout cable? (I think the Syncblaster supports RGBc, but really the Sync Strike is better value) Also, time to fess up, are you using any kind of SCART switch?

Also, if you have an XRGB3 why on earth are you even bothering with putting your Saturn directly to the Edge?

Yes, i tryed connecting only the H Sync, give me the same issues. I allready have a Sync Strike, works great on all consoles, except for My PAL sega saturn, so when i saw the Syncblaster bargain i give it a try. I don't use a scart switch, just a female to female scart adaptor. I tryed the saturn directly to the edge because i want to try if i can get rid of strange shaking, and lost of sync/image when i connect the saturn to the xrgb 3 or the edge directly with a sync strike, or the regular scart cable.

I don't know how to describe in english, maybe shaking image don't explain it right, it don't do that on all games. Street fighter alpha 2 for example, in the intro, the screen starts to flash and loses image, and the image is allways shaking, trembling.

Sorry for my bad english.

[BuckoA51]

The issues sound sync related, however my PAL Saturn (Model 2) was nowhere near that bad. I'd try modding the console for pure sync or, as you said, just buying a NTSC Saturn and using the pure sync that is already available on those machines. I take it you already tried a different SCART cable, yes?

[Overkill]

Yes, i tryed the oficial sega made, and two third party buyed on ebay

[BuckoA51]

The only other thing to try is a fresh power cord and/or make sure you don't have any ground loop interference in your power distribution. I've had two PAL Saturn's and I do get the strange patterns on the image if I don't use raw sync, but never anything this bad.

[Konsolkongen]

Does anyone know the power consumption in stand-by mode with auto wake-up enabled? Regular Edge (not green). It doesn't say in the manual.

[cfx]

.

[Fudoh]

I can confirm that it does NOT handle 240p as well as the Edge.

[cfx]

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