Castlevania 64 and Legacy of Darkness get a bad rap

[JBC]

... when in fact they are actually both pretty damn good games, despite some major camera and control issues.

I got Castlevania 64 on it's release day back in 99' and remember loving the hell out of it. It didn't quite capture everything I ever wanted a 3D Castlevania game to be but I can certainly say it's come closer than the PS2 duo and modern 3D iterations like Lord of Shadows (which barely feels like a Castlevania game at all). In both games once you get used to the camera and controls gameplay that seemed choppy at first becomes fluid and seemless.

I also find both games to have a nice level of depth when it comes to fulfilling requirements to achieve alternate endings/reach extra areas/etc... There's even that cool trick where if you spend over $30,000 during a playthrough you'll have to fight the demon merchant, Renon at the end. Nice touches like that make the game give you more for your money.

Once you learn the controls game play feels good too. The lock-on system in Legacy is fun to mess with, you just have to learn to keep your distance and center your view appropriately. One of my favorite parts, and a part that a lot of people complain about, is the nitro sequence where you have to navigate through some clocktower stuff without bumping anything. I found it to be a great test of patience and concentration. If you keep your wits about you you won't explode. In fact alot of the platforming is like this, you just have to think with clarity and keep a cool head about your movements.

Finally, the graphics are really clean and pretty for a set of 64 games. The way they would use a 2d tile to place some trees in the background and such lends the atmosphere a classic Castlevania feel that I can't get enough of. I'm playing back through the games in Project 64 right now on my laptop with increased resolution and such but I remember enjoying them on the old systems anyway.

I can't say if it's too bad I waited so long to play Legacy of Darkness or if I'm glad this is my first time. From the moment I fought that dragon on the drawbridge I didn't understand why people knocked it.

[Kaiser]

Same reason Lament of Innocence, Curse of Darkness and Lords of Shadow, for being different and most of the badmouthing I see is just because it isn't a 2D castlevania seriously.

[maxlords]

I didn't really get into the N64 ones but that's more cause they're on the N64. I hate that system. That being said...it was tough but playable...never really tried Legacy though.

As for the later games...I wasn't impressed by LoI but I liked the story. The gameplay felt too generic Devil-May-Cry-ish for me. I never played CoD, but I really love Lords of Shadow.

[JBC]

Well I just finished a go at Legacy with both Cornell & Henry. Henry's game is so very worth unlocking. You start out with a powerful, upgradable shot pistol with unlimited ammo that makes a most satisfying blast sound. You're given 7 in game days to rescue 6 children scattered about the castle, which is a fairly forgiving time limit. However, it will still have you racing the clock. Some areas & bosses are optional in this mode depending on which kids you discover & rescue. It's the combat that drew me in here though, feels so good to finally be handed a shotgun in Castlevania for some gunpowder laced revenge.

Probly gonna give it another go on Hard before I revisit Reinhardt & Carrie's tale. When I do I'm gonna try to keep it under four in game days so I can do that ridiculous boss run at the end, including Renon. If I remember right there's a way to fight a crapload of battles back to back, including one against an adult form of Malus.

[Casper<3]

I really loved C64 but just couldn't get into Legacy for some reason. The controls were an issue.

I absolutely LOVE LoI. It's probably the highlight of the Castlevania series for me. I didn't care for Curse of Darkness thing. The whole monster hunter aspect is just not for me.

[JBC]

I realize I neglected to mention some of the shortcomings of the games but I wanted to wait until I had finished them before I made any complaints. The biggest one I have by far is for Legacy of Darkness' Normal difficulty setting. The game is ridiculously easy compared to Reinhardt & Carrie's quests in the original. I guess this has a lot to do with how well Cornell controls during combat. It could also be that there just aren't enough enemies. The entire game is filled with these wide open sections devoid of anything that very well could have been filled with hordes of things for me to smack. I suspect this was due to hardware limitations rather than artistic design. Still, I guess the open expanses do a lot for the atmosphere of the game.

Secondly, Carrie's quest in the original is a welcome addition that adds to the longevity of the game but when playing the quests back to back its hard to shake the feeling that it was tacked on. Cinematics coincidentally transpire in the same places & 90% of the dialogue is swapped over, even if the exchange is between two completely different people. And by different I mean the difference between a fully grown hardened vampire slayer to the spectre of Death & a 12 year old little girl to a child murdering biddy. It just doesn't fit.

[Leader Bee]

I actually really enjoyed Castlevania 64 so much so enough to play it through once with each character. Despite the horrible camera which was prevalent in games around this time which subsequently contributed to my despisement of most 3D games over their 2D counterparts; It managed to create an amazing atmosphere for the setting.

I found the levels interestingly designed and that the way they were connected made logical sense instead of unrelated levels one after the other, it made it feel more like you were progressing through a castle. From what i remeber the combat wasn't brilliant but nor was it awful, infact it amounted to whipping the enemy and using your sub weapons which is all you can ask for when this was what worked perfectly for every other Castlevania to this point, only ruined by the ridiculous camera making you fight enemies you cannot see.

I missed the familiar music from earlier castlevanias, bar a short appearance from bloody tears but overall the score was nice and used sparringly which lended itself to the atmosphere similar to how Demons Souls worked.
Between this and Ecco the Dolphin I can't think of many non-rpgs that managed to set up such an eerie atmosphere with such basic premises.

I'm not sure if it was Project 64 not emulating 100% correctly or if the original cart was designed like this, but one thing that bothered me was the fact that when you make it to the mansion grounds (it's been a while but I think it's here) just where Dracula speaks to you for the first time that this was the only part of the game with voice acting where other plot important scenes just got text dialogue; Meeting Rosa for example. I don't understand why this is the only spoken dialogue in the game.

If it wasn't for the horrible camera I believe this would have been the best 3D iteration of Castlevania to date but considering CV is an action platformer and not being able to platform without dying being the cameras fault means it doesn't quite make the grade.

Because of the obtrusive camera I only played to just after the ship in Legacy of Darkness but as much as people labelled it as more of a remix than a sequel, from what I played certainly looked like it was more than that and a worthy game in it's own right. Instead of Lords of Shadow I just wish they'd go back and retouch these two games, fix the camera and update the graphics; Not to everyones taste but I wish they'd remake a lot of games rather than re-boot them.

Resident evil worked wonders on the GC, right?

[BIL]

They're both very decent action-adventure games. I absolutely loved them back when they came out, and they're atmospheric and well-designed enough to be enjoyable today, despite the simplistic pre-DMC combat. One caveat for anyone planning to try them for the first time - the original game's opening forest level is indeed bland and vacant. Level design improves tremendously afterwards.

I much prefer the N64's 3D CVs to the PS2's Lament of Innocence. Serviceable combat with towering, perilous level designs is preferable to rather good combat with atrociously bland level designs. If Konami had ever gotten both halves of the equation together they'd have had a genuinely excellent 3D Castlevania.

I'm not sure if it was Project 64 not emulating 100% correctly or if the original cart was designed like this, but one thing that bothered me was the fact that when you make it to the mansion grounds (it's been a while but I think it's here) just where Dracula speaks to you for the first time that this was the only part of the game with voice acting where other plot important scenes just got text dialogue; Meeting Rosa for example. I don't understand why this is the only spoken dialogue in the game.

The actual cartridge is like that. To keep cart size down, I guess.

[louisg]

My only experience with these was at GameStop. It was some boss scene, I guess near the beginning of the game. I was thinking, "Hey, this isn't too bad!"... and then I fell off a cliff that I couldn't see due to the camera angle.

It's good to know that these might be worth checking out- I'm always looking for more carts to get for that thing.