The BIG thread of Shmup grievances.

[AntiFritz]

Why does everybody say this? With that mentality you're just gonna have to relearn a game completely when you do decide to play it for score.

I meant that playing for score is only going to give him a harder time to 1cc. Especially with futari's rank and proximity mechanics. Playing fore score would get him the extends quicker though.

I don't think that playing for survival vs playing for score are all that different in Futari. To keep the rank down you can basically just do the opposite and use focus mode when the counter is green. Not too hard to switch. You do have to learn proximity, though. Although that's not a huge switch either--you have to learn the enemy entrance patterns to survive, after all, so when you start playing for score you already know the gist of what to do.

Maybe not, i generally try to play for score but in futari i couldnt seem to get past stage 3 boss. Then I decided to not even look at the counters and stay safely at the bottom of the screen and got to stage 5 easily (with a crap score of 150 million or something).

[GrimoreLibrarian]

I can never seem to look away from Gob-Robo's cannon crotch from the Raizing games.

[DrTrouserPlank]

The thing is that if you played purely for survival (and presumably used shot most of the time) I can't imagine you'd make much more than 100M with a clear, assuming of course you aren't getting 50M lives bonus at the end.

I don't think that the extra 100M you can add from paying some attention to scoring by Maxing stage 1+2, and doing as much scoring as is safe in 3+4+5 really costs you anything in terms of survival. You'll still get hit regardless. I can only imagine that scoring is a problem if you really are using the shot type that doesn't suit the situation purely because you want the additional score.

[Gus]

From my experience the thing that makes the scoring difficult is the proximity aspect rather than the rank and shot types. If all you're doing is staying at the bottom and switching shot types while dying/bombing it shouldn't be much harder than clearing for pure survival but you won't score too well either.

[Seahawk]

I'm mad so I'm safely ranting here. Prepare yourself for a ragey post full of fuck. I apologize for offending anyone.

Seriously fuck that fucking stage 8 ice world from fucking Parodius da.
Also fuck that fucking super scaling boss.



Where the fuck do you want me to go Konami?! What the fuck do you want me to do here?!

Also fuck this game's rank system.
It's fucking Battle Garegga on fucking steroids man, and there are only two fucking extends on default settings so you have a total of four fucking lives for the whole game.
I never would have thought that I could play the game with no power all the way fucking through, hitting the ?! all the time just to keep the game sane, I only get my first laser weapon upgrade on stage 4, up to that point its just 1 speed up and the normal shot, no missiles, no lasers, no double, no option, no shield. But damn it the game still goes crazy without you sacrificing your lives on purpose just to keep the rank low, and thats still not enough with fucking super scaler fish filling 80% of the screen, some 10% covered by crashable background, and then spikes coming right ON YOUR ASS WITH SCALING HITBOXES AND SHIT.

NO FUCKING MERCY WITH THIS BITCH.

AAAAAAAAAGGHHHHH

/rant

Sorry, I'm just so mad right now . I really want this clear. Also its 2:30am.

Thank you system11 for having the only forum where I can vent out shmup frustration.

[Vamos]

He mad etc , anyways tbh i think my only shmup grievance is scoring systems that punish to hard when you die once and becomes a run restart issue .

[Chaos Phoenixma]

Are there any Parodius Da! 2-all vids out there?

It's definitely one of the hardest ones made.

[Seahawk]

SO CLOSE.



I know I've got this now.


Anyways, legitimate complaint coming up.
I wish that when game makers released their shooting games on consoles, they put in fully controllable and customizable practice modes.
For example, if I practice a later stage in Gradius V, the stage I select will have its rank counter initialized to zero. This makes it much easier than if I were playing that stage on an actual playthrough, defeating the purpose of practicing.

I want full rank control, gameplay speed control, hitbox displays, powerups configurable at any time, everything.

[Ruldra]

I want full rank control, gameplay speed control, hitbox displays, powerups configurable at any time, everything.

DOJ had full rank control in practice mode, but it had so many variables it was impossible to replicate the rank of an actual run, so it was useless Same with Gradius III's ice cube rush practice on the PS2.

My only shmup grievance is not having Radiant Silvergun for PS3 users.

[Gus]

My only shmup grievance is not having Radiant Silvergun for PS3 users.

In case you haven't noticed Sony hates 2D games.

[the.borg]

My only shmup grievance is not having Radiant Silvergun for PS3 users.

In case you haven't noticed Sony hates 2D games.

Except Radiant Silver Gun is not a 2D shmup... as far as I know...

[dunpeal2064]

Radiant Silvergun definitely has 2D gameplay, even if it has 3D sprites.

[Gus]

So here I am on vacation at my sister's place in California and I got some free time and decide to play a few credits of Futari 1.5 Ultra

My god, my eyes. This is probably the worst TV I've ever seen as it only seems to know how to display bright green and red. So yeah, probably not gonna get anything decent until I get home in another week.

[Drum]

My only shmup grievance is not having Radiant Silvergun for PS3 users.

In case you haven't noticed Sony hates 2D games.

They only gave a shit about that fairly early in the lifetime of the PS1, and they were very inconsistent in applying the policy. There are lots of 2D games on PS3/PSN/PSP. Really bizarre to see this still kicking around, especially when it's so contrary to evidence.

[Despatche]

They only gave a shit about that fairly early in the lifetime of the PS1, and they were very inconsistent in applying the policy. There are lots of 2D games on PS3/PSN/PSP. Really bizarre to see this still kicking around, especially when it's so contrary to evidence.

I like how you cleverly avoid "PS2".

[Chaos Phoenixma]

Why does Phaser's final attack instant game over me even with 2 or 3 lives in stock on Gundemonium Recollection? Does anyone know if that still happens with 4 or 5 lives?


But still it feels pretty cheap to lose multiple lives just from one hit, and it's really annoying that you have to play through 3 full stages and most of the 4th just to possibly get hit by it and have the run end instantly. Sure, it shouldn't be a hard attack, and I was getting it pretty consistently, but it's been ending most of my full run attempts on Revised recently. It really sucks to have to classify something like that as autobomb just because you might get hit while trying to turn around, but of course if I don't have a bomb in stock, it's all about whether or not the attack goes well.

[Drum]

They only gave a shit about that fairly early in the lifetime of the PS1, and they were very inconsistent in applying the policy. There are lots of 2D games on PS3/PSN/PSP. Really bizarre to see this still kicking around, especially when it's so contrary to evidence.

I like how you cleverly avoid "PS2".

I don't know about any PS2 shenanigans, I assumed they'd completely given up by then because I remember Fantavision being a launch title and Gradius III & IV was released in 2000. But they were inconsistent in the PS1 days so I guess they were dumb enough to do the same in the PS2 era.

[RNGmaster]

Why does Phaser's final attack instant game over me even with 2 or 3 lives in stock on Gundemonium Recollection? Does anyone know if that still happens with 4 or 5 lives?


But still it feels pretty cheap to lose multiple lives just from one hit, and it's really annoying that you have to play through 3 full stages and most of the 4th just to possibly get hit by it and have the run end instantly. Sure, it shouldn't be a hard attack, and I was getting it pretty consistently, but it's been ending most of my full run attempts on Revised recently. It really sucks to have to classify something like that as autobomb just because you might get hit while trying to turn around, but of course if I don't have a bomb in stock, it's all about whether or not the attack goes well.

Yes. It's a 1hko no matter how many lives. If you deathbomb you can keep 1 or 2 lives depending.

Planeshift or a carefully timed bomb is really the only way around it.

[Chaos Phoenixma]

How do you control Planeshift anyway? Yes, I just 1cc'd it without actually knowing that.

I saw that you could time out Phaser and it wouldn't be used, so I did that like a wuss.

[BPzeBanshee]

My only greivance at this moment is that for some reason I'm #1 on XOP Black Ultra Special's online leaderboard (at least when I checked Christmas Day, would like be proved wrong) and it's because no one else is playing this game seriously at all rather than me actually being any good. The furthest I've gotten is Stage 2's midboss.

[Battletoad]

My only greivance at this moment is that for some reason I'm #1 on XOP Black Ultra Special's online leaderboard (at least when I checked Christmas Day, would like be proved wrong) and it's because no one else is playing this game seriously at all rather than me actually being any good. The furthest I've gotten is Stage 2's midboss.

Just got to stage 2 boss with over 30M. I can't say that I like this version too much though.

[DrTrouserPlank]

Just played DFK black label and that is without a doubt the hardest Cave game on the 360. By miles in fact. Novice mode is about comparable to one of their normal games. Playing normally feels like futari ultra.

Ketsui is definitely not as hard; it's not easy, but both it and daioujou are easier than DFK black.

[Gus]

Kind of dumb to compare the 1st loop of a looping game to a non-looping one and declare it easier. Especially for stuff like Ketsui and DOJ where the 2nd loop plays a huge factor in scoring.

Unless, of course we're pretending those are just jokes from the devs.

[Obiwanshinobi]

That nonsense again? Sony did more for 2D on the PSX than Nintendo on the N64 (if any company flipped 2D off that gen, it would be Nintendo). On the PS2, two 2D games I know Sony developed/published (Fantavision and ChainDive) are pretty good and unique at that. What 2D did Nintendo develop/publish for the 'Cube again? Super Smash Bros. Melee, Four Swords Andentures and Kururin Squash? Hardly overkill.

[mesh control]

Ketsui is definitely not as hard; it's not easy, but both it and daioujou are easier than DFK black.

lol


You've never played Ketsui's Ura loop, have you?

[Zaarock]

Just played DFK black label and that is without a doubt the hardest Cave game on the 360. By miles in fact. Novice mode is about comparable to one of their normal games.

Were you holding laser and shot together all the time on strong type with autobombs off? Would be pretty cool of you, though

[Eaglet]

I don't get why people say that DFK BL is so hard.
I would say that Power is equivalent to Ketsui first loop. Would have been even easier in comparison if it wheren't for that last stage with the spinning laser thingys.
Strong is by far easier than Futari Ultra.

[Erppo]

DFKBL is easier than 1.5 in many ways. Everything cancels bullets, you get more hypers and they are a lot more powerful, you can cancel the hypers to get out of tight situations, and there are plenty of tricks that make the TLBs a lot easier. This is not even counting the fact that when playing BL, you want to hyper as much as possible, while in 1.5, you have to mostly avoid it.

[DrTrouserPlank]

Just played DFK black label and that is without a doubt the hardest Cave game on the 360. By miles in fact. Novice mode is about comparable to one of their normal games.

Were you holding laser and shot together all the time on strong type with autobombs off? Would be pretty cool of you, though

That red rank bar maxed very quickly. I don't know what I was doing, Just played it as I felt it needed to be played. I was using strong and auto off, although I can't say I recall auto on being any easier.

Actually had to continue on the first level on my first try which is something new. It was ridicudifficult.

Thought the soundtrack for DFK BL was shite as well, 1.5's is much better.

Quite enjoying ketsui though. Don't understand the scoring one bit though. I assume you are meant to "chain" to get 5-cubes and then get more 5-cubes. Don't understand the counters, read the guide in the strategy section... didn't help.

[TheSoundofRed]

Ketsui scoring is relatively easy compared to other Cave games.

Point-blank enemies with auto-shot to gain 5 point cubes, then use laser to destroy enemies for more 5 point cubes until the timer at the top left runs out. Rinse and repeat.