Radiant Silvergun help--XBLA release

[Icarus]

Has anyone figured out how to 100% the first boss of the game in 3A? The thing timeouts way too quickly. So instead I end up Hyper Sword for 50% or 60 % rate.

Destroy all four side parts, the cannon and the main body (six bits in total). Demonstrations of the safer two-hypersword technique are abundant on the interwebs (look around for T3-CYR-WIZ, VTF-INO and ben.shinobi's replays), but there's a lesser known, more difficult but quicker one-hypersword technique I've uploaded here.
I haven't played this game seriously since 2001. Rusty as all hell. Using a stick doesn't help much.

Also, I noticed a mirrored enemy pattern near the beginning of 4C (after the long missile portion, there are a group of blue and red enemies that fire the slow 5 radial fire-ball shots.. in the Saturn rev, blue enemies appear on the left and red enemies appear in the middle and right....

It's part of the stage design - I have an old replay of 4C done a decade ago with the blue enemies on the right side, and a replay by alamone from the same time with those enemies on the left. I've always had a hypersword stocked for this bit anyway, so I can get to the correct side of the screen for the continuation of the blue chain without flying into a missile.

[Kiken]

Also, I noticed a mirrored enemy pattern near the beginning of 4C (after the long missile portion, there are a group of blue and red enemies that fire the slow 5 radial fire-ball shots.. in the Saturn rev, blue enemies appear on the left and red enemies appear in the middle and right....

It's part of the stage design - I have an old replay of 4C done a decade ago with the blue enemies on the right side, and a replay by alamone from the same time with those enemies on the left. I've always had a hypersword stocked for this bit anyway, so I can get to the correct side of the screen for the continuation of the blue chain without flying into a missile.

Weird. It must be one of those "once in a blue moon" placement shifts.

[Plasmo]

Has anyone figured out how to 100% the first boss of the game in 3A? The thing timeouts way too quickly. So instead I end up Hyper Sword for 50% or 60 % rate.

Destroy all four side parts, the cannon and the main body (six bits in total). Demonstrations of the safer two-hypersword technique are abundant on the interwebs (look around for T3-CYR-WIZ, VTF-INO and ben.shinobi's replays), but there's a lesser known, more difficult but quicker one-hypersword technique I've uploaded here.
I haven't played this game seriously since 2001. Rusty as all hell. Using a stick doesn't help much.

Actually there's an even quicker strategy where you get 6 sets of bonus enemies instead of only 4. ben.shinobi had a replay of this somewhere, but I couldn't seem to find it right now...


EDIT:
Found it! It's up on super-play: http://www.super-play.co.uk/index.php?superplay=581
His score is 373,350 for 3A, which is quite incredible. The strategy itself is basically the same as yours, ICR, but perfected a little bit.

[ben.shinobi]

EDIT:
Found it! It's up on super-play: http://www.super-play.co.uk/index.php?superplay=581
His score is 373,350 for 3A, which is quite incredible. The strategy itself is basically the same as yours, ICR, but perfected a little bit.

The most important thing in this first boss pattern is that you can get 1 more set of 3 red + 3 blue if you destroy the boss with perfect timing. I must admit that I've done this only once... Perfect timing here is almost random pattern !!! It's not the best way to score +370k on 3A.

[Sumez]

It's optimized for HDTVs because Treasure realized that's what everyone in 2011 plays their 360s on, save for a few cranky holdovers. I love the look of vintage CRT monitors as much as the next guy, but they're only meant for similarly vintage gaming hardware (and the handful of modern Cave PCBs).

Are you saying that Low-res 1 mode on an HDTV does NOT look really good?

You're spot-on really. (except from the part about low-res mode looking better than hi-res, whatthehell?)
As much as I don't see any reason to NOT include 4:3, when it's a 4:3 game, you gotta realise that 99% (a number I just pulled out of my ass, but it's not far from reality) of all X360 owners, play their X360 on a widescreen TV and DON'T CARE about this.
I'm sorry, but only people on shmups.system11.org would assume that everyone who buys shooters on XBLA are going to hook them up to an arcade cab.
If I wanna play Radiant Silvergun on my arcade, I'll get the STV cart.

I hope Treasure makes a patch to fix the 4:3 issue just so people can shut up about it and discuss the game instead.

[Zerst]

Can't use continues when screwing around in multiplayer :<

[Sumez]

use continues

[Elaphe]

Is anyone writing to Treaure to address the 4:3 problem and suggest a patch to fix it? We could make a petition webpage also.

[Zerst]

use continues

Getting tired of making it to stage 2 with full stock and having to quit because the other guy game overed

[gs68]

Also, do people really find this harder than Ikaruga? After level 1 of Ikaruga I can't do anything but play for survival, I find the pace far to frantic to try and chain, and I only scraped through Ikaruga on my last credit on the Xbox 360 version.

You can play Ikaruga purely for survival, ignoring the chaining system, and be able to 1CC just fine, as the game has no powerup system.

The same cannot be said for RSG. Fail to chain = fail to power up weapons on time = bosses get stupidly long.

[Icarus]

Actually there's an even quicker strategy where you get 6 sets of bonus enemies instead of only 4. ben.shinobi had a replay of this somewhere, but I couldn't seem to find it right now...
His score is 373,350 for 3A, which is quite incredible. The strategy itself is basically the same as yours, ICR, but perfected a little bit.

Of course he's perfected it, lol. I'm admittedly quite horrible at Slvergun, and haven't played it for a decade. ^_-
Still working on my chaining routes, then going to add in weapon bonuses and scratching points later on.

The most important thing in this first boss pattern is that you can get 1 more set of 3 red + 3 blue if you destroy the boss with perfect timing. I must admit that I've done this only once... Perfect timing here is almost random pattern !!! It's not the best way to score +370k on 3A.

I think the most important factor here is timing the hypersword as early as you can - in all the clips I've seen for 2x sets, the boss is destroyed when the background has scrolled off-screen, but in your 3x set video (and a really old clip by CHA where I originally learned of the one hypersword kill), the boss is destroyed while the large brown platform in the background is still partially on-screen. Agreed, it is very difficult to do, as it's possible you can end up with 50% destruction rather than 100%. :/

[bcass]

Is anyone writing to Treaure to address the 4:3 problem and suggest a patch to fix it? We could make a petition webpage also.

I'm more concerned by the Penta graphics glitch. I suggest we bombard Mjr Nelson and the other Xbox 360 online "celebs" (like the myriad of dunces who appear on the dash features/interviews). Microsoft are the publishers so it may be best to target them.

Icarus - any chance you could upload a video of said glitch?

[defected78]

They dont need to patch the game to 4:3 because it is not designed to run in arcade cabinets. Its designed to run in widescreen like 99% of every other xbox and PS3 game. If they do do it, its an extra feature.

Anyone who plays modenr hidef stuff in 4:3 it must look really shit. Dead Island, After Burner climax, Outrun 2, Call of Duty games, Half Life 2, Wow that would look rubbish in 4:3. Especially in a cabinet. This is just taking it too far.

Mame by all means is great in a cab but xbox 360 games expected to run in HIDEF in cabinets when the original resolution was raster 240 is ridiculous.

People that complain thats the way it originally was well why not complain about BLU RAY movies being released in HD because they were originally shot in a lower resolution with analogue equiptment and should only be watched in exacto replicas of cinema projectors.

[Paradigm]

This forum really needs a facepalm smiley.

[burgerkingdiamond]

They dont need to patch the game to 4:3 because it is not designed to run in arcade cabinets. Its designed to run in widescreen like 99% of every other xbox and PS3 game. If they do do it, its an extra feature.

Anyone who plays modenr hidef stuff in 4:3 it must look really shit. Dead Island, After Burner climax, Outrun 2, Call of Duty games, Half Life 2, Wow that would look rubbish in 4:3. Especially in a cabinet. This is just taking it too far.

Mame by all means is great in a cab but xbox 360 games expected to run in HIDEF in cabinets when the original resolution was raster 240 is ridiculous.

People that complain thats the way it originally was well why not complain about BLU RAY movies being released in HD because they were originally shot in a lower resolution with analogue equiptment and should only be watched in exacto replicas of cinema projectors.

why do people feel the need to defend this? It's not like we're asking them to reinvent the fucking wheel. Of course the majority of people have HDTVs now so it's a good thing that they optimized the game in that respect. But it was originally 4:3. There should be absolutely minimal work involved in having real 4:3 support as an option.

I know this has been talked about to death, but people who defend this just don't get it.

[moozooh]

People that complain thats the way it originally was well why not complain about BLU RAY movies being released in HD because they were originally shot in a lower resolution with analogue equiptment and should only be watched in exacto replicas of cinema projectors.

Sorry to undermine your argument, but in vast majority of cases FullHD is a downscale from the original resolution captured by analogue equipment (which is hard to pinpoint exactly due to ints analogue nature). :)

[man9child]

And about the 4:3 argument, I don't think everyone is claiming that all modern games should run full screen on a 4:3 monitor. It would be nice if they did, (say like SF4) but if they don't, (MvC3, KoF 12) it's no big deal. I get that. The game was designed for a 16:9 monitor, and borders on the top and bottom of the screen are appropriate.

Point is that while this is supposed to be a remastered special edition of soughts, it is inferior when played in its original aspect ratio. XBOX 360 Radiant Silvergun was designed to run on a 16:9 monitor. But Radiant Silvergun itself is 4:3. It's like vertical shooters without a tate option. Most people won't tate their tvs, but for those that would, it's annoying.

As the original assets are included, and this is the first time this game is being released in most of the world, the option should be available to experience the game as it was originally intended. In addition to the smaller play area, the resolution is all squashed, making the original assets look janky when they're actually quite nice. It's an oversight. You can argue about how many people it will affect, but it's still an oversight.

At least this changed the discussion from Radiant Silvergun is overrated/expensive. Notice how we're still not talking about the actual game itself, though?

[worm1974]

People who do not know why there should be a 4:3 option. The same people will ask you why you wan't to have scanlines with a SLG3000
Everybody on this forum should want to have a 4:3 option in RSG is my opinion.

[mrsmiley381]

That bloom effect is so bad that it actually makes bullets invisible when fighting laser-blasting bosses. So I just turned it to all the original resolution stuff and I was happy. Since this game isn't made by Compile and can't be described as a "busy hori" I want to punch everything in my apartment. I still like it, but it's pretty goddamn frustrating right now. I'm sure Hitoshi Sakimoto and his delicious soundtrack will keep me playing.

[Tyjet]

speaking of video effects, what does the mesh1, mesh2, mesh3 in the transparency option do?

[Elaphe]

I really don't understand why some people in this forum are against the idea of a fix. We're not asking them to remove the 16:9 support, so why do you care? I play all my XBOX 360 games in a 29" CRT TVset and I'm happy. I don't have to worry about issues like... is the game 1080 or 720? or does the reescaling look fine? All my games look the same. Even some games which look like crap in TFTs (for instance, Tekken 6 show horrible jaggies in the character graphics) look fantastic in the CRT, and I don't have any problem with the scaling of the sprites in KOF XII, since I don't notice any pixelation. I don't complain about other games lacking 4:3 support. I just accept playing in a smaller area. But this!? this was a 4:3 game. Remaking it means showing respect and admiration to the original game, so something as simple as a 4:3 option is not a crazy idea, but something we all expected to be there.

[WarpZone]

you gotta realise that 99% (a number I just pulled out of my ass, but it's not far from reality) of all X360 owners, play their X360 on a widescreen TV and DON'T CARE about this.

And yet, supporting 4:3 is still basically standard. Virtually all my 360 games support 4:3 unless the game was specifically designed around widescreen and would be unplayable otherwise, like Pac-Man CE. It's actually Treasure that's failing to conform to a standard here.

Is anyone writing to Treaure to address the 4:3 problem and suggest a patch to fix it?

I emailed Treasure but don't know Japanese. I don't know of any feedback system MS has in place anywhere.

Also, do people really find this harder than Ikaruga?

On defaults I find it considerably harder. I've 1CC'd Ikaruga many times but have never gotten past stage 2 in this. Even if you memorize chains to keep in pace with the bosses, there's just much more hairy dodging and randomization in this game. I also don't think the default life/extend settings feel very balanced for the length and difficulty of the game. I wish this port had score attack for individual stages (that started you with fixed weapon levels), as I'd find that much more digestible.

[PC Engine Fan X!]

I wasn't saying that they absolutely shouldn't have included 4:3 support--I can't deny it would be a better product if they did. I am simply of the opinion that this version of the game and the hardware it's running on were meant to be viewed on an HDTV, and will inherently look superior on one.

Not saying I'm not a "cranky holdover" either--I still own and regularly use a 1989 Model 1 Genesis. Sadly, Treasure probably didn't even consider that there might be people with 360s hooked up to cabs, whether they're wrongheaded or not.

It's quite amazing with the right hardware to hook up an 360 console to an arcade cab...such hardware to allow the opportunity to hook up your favorite gaming console to a dedicated arcade upright cab wasn't around back fifteen or twenty years ago. How the times have changed since then.

Suppose if Atari Corp. had some dedicated arcade cabs showcasing it's Atari Jag 64-bit powered console in the American arcades, would it have done better market-wise? Not to mention, Atari Corp. still had it's, small but dedicated, Atari Games arcade division when the Jag launched in late 1993 (but it was regulated off to a seperate wherehouse section away from the main Atari Corp. headquarters and largely forgotten/ignored by the big brass indeed).

PC Engine Fan X! ^_~

[evil_ash_xero]

The one thing I'd like to point out, is that even though this has been put into hi-res for the XBLA, some of those polygons still look....well, you can tell where they originated from. On a CRT, it all looks pretty amazing. The LCD, is just really rough on anything that isn't PERFECT. And Ikaruga, looked pretty perfect for XBLA, but they didn't re-do the whole thing here. It just looks better on a CRT.

[bcass]

After a few days play, I have to admit that I've gone back to the original Saturn graphics. I'm playing on a (widescreen) CRT. I think they have more personality than the hi-def graphics. In a weird way, the Saturn graphics suggest more detail than there actually is. The hi-def graphics show up the limited number of polys more too. The hi-def graphics would have worked better if they had made the 3D models more complex. See the XBLA Banjo Kazooie/Perfect Dark remakes to see how it can be done to great subtle effect. I agree with the other person who, earlier in the thread, stated that those old low-poly graphics from the PS1/Saturn era have a certain charm that's missing from a lot of modern game graphics.

I always wonder why Treasure went with the Saturn for this game when it first came out. There's nothing on display that the PS1 couldn't do, the Saturn was on its last legs at the time, and the PS1 was booming. I can only assume that they had already invested so much time developing libs for their previous releases that they had little option but to keep with it.

[Estebang]

bcass, Treasure actually had plans for a Playstation port, but they found that the hardware just wasn't able to handle it. They would've had to downgrade it a lot more than even Thunder Force V: Perfect System. It was pushing the limits of the ST-V already.

And yes, 32-bit pixel soup polygons often look like they're on the verge of collapse, which makes normally mundane objects seem to burst with life and energy.

[bcass]

Just because they say they couldn't do it doesn't mean the hardware wasn't capable. It's not like they ever produced anything that pushed the PS1 hardware.

[Estebang]

And on a technical level, Silvergun was leaps and bounds over anything they'd done before.

I actually doubt they'd have been able to do a faithful SNES port of Alien Soldier! The SNES may have had a more powerful processor, but it was very inefficient compared to the Genesis' (hence "Blast Processing"), and all the painstakingly hand-coded sprite rotation would've been replaced by clumsy Mode 7. There was a canned SNES port of Dynamite Headdy--I can't imagine that was coming together too well.

[bcass]

IMO they invested more time/money in Saturn development which naturally led to them being more proficient on that platform. The most impressive thing about RSG is the amount of polys being thrown around, something which the PS1 is inherently better at than the Saturn. On a technical level, games like R-Type Delta and Omega Boost are just as impressive, probably even more so given the presence superior effects like real transparencies.

[moozooh]

IIRC SNES actually had a slower CPU but better graphic and sound capabilities (which in 95% of cases hadn't been put to good use). Coming to think of it, if it could handle Super Metroid—and that one wasn't an example of efficient code by far,—maybe a complete rewrite of Alien Soldier specifically for the SNES wouldn't be too far out of the question...