Akira 'n Stuff (from anime thread)

[NTSC-J]

Me too.

It's been almost three years since I last went to a movie. Maybe if they didn't charge two month's worth of rent for a ticket I'd go more often. wtf Japan.

I think they may have been the best 1300 yen I've spent ever.

It really was a lot cooler than I expected.

Just to recap, GP, adverse, and I saw Akira in the theater on Saturday and it kicked ass. The sound system they had set up for this was nuts, that had to be the loudest movie I've ever seen and it made it that much more epic. When the little psychic dude screamed and broke all the windows I could feel my fillings pop out. Had I been stoned at the time, I likely would have jumped onto GP's lap.

Plus I forgot how beautiful the ending was when Tokyo gets annihilated, probably my favorite music in the whole soundtrack (maybe after the main theme).

With all that said, it was a shame that the way the characters moved was so unrealistic. I think I could hear some people vomiting in disgust.

[Obiwanshinobi]

Embarrassing/awkward rather than disgusting. Like seeing a person struck by a severe medical condition you're not familiar with. That's how I imagine victims of ergotism, but I'm probably wrong about that.

[Randorama]

Ban of animation discussions, please. People, please open your own thread on frames, graphics on the need of realism in fiction (...eh), thank you.

By the way: after watching Eureka Seven, I wonder: has Bones done bad series? I am tempted to check all of their works.

[Obiwanshinobi]

By the way: after watching Eureka Seven, I wonder: has Bones done bad series? I am tempted to check all of their works.

No really bad series I know about, but Soul Eater didn't do much for me. Scrapped Princess is every bit as adorable as Eureka Seven (albeit cheaper looking and shorter). Wolf's Rain and RahXephon have some pacing issues, but audiovisually are superb. Darker than Black is certainly above average. Tokyo Magnitude 8.0 is something of a return to form (if somewhat thin on the budget). As for Angelic Layer, I liked it better than Cardcaptor Sakura for what it's worth. The first FMA series is probably as close to "bad" as they got in their heyday.
Steer away from their feature films. Just saying.

[GaijinPunch]

Just to recap, GP, adverse, and I saw Akira in the theater on Saturday and it kicked ass. The sound system they had set up for this was nuts, that had to be the loudest movie I've ever seen and it made it that much more epic. When the little psychic dude screamed and broke all the windows I could feel my fillings pop out. Had I been stoned at the time, I likely would have jumped onto GP's lap.

Yeah, there was definitely a missing element but it didn't matter. I thought the audience chuckling at the entire theater rattling when the first Taiko was struck in the first few seconds of the movie was very appropriate. So many layers to the audio... and I just watched this on BluRay at a friends last year (with no audio restrictions due to kids).

Plus I forgot how beautiful the ending was when Tokyo gets annihilated, probably my favorite music in the whole soundtrack (maybe after the main theme).

未来 / Requiem
On the soundtrack, Kaneda's theme is mixed in. To commemorate the BR release, Geinoh Yamashirogumi performed the soundtrack in Nakano about 2 years ago. It was pretty dope, but I had one problem: it wasn't that loud. The second act of the show was new material, and was electronic, and just about blew me out of my seat. This movie was basically what I was hoping for at the live show but didn't get. It was cool watching them play though. I have something for mass destruction, especially when it's layered with moving music. Probably why I like the movie so much, is the last 3 minutes.

Also, w/o the subtitles and being forced to use my brain, I picked up on quite a few intricacies I hadn't before.
vomiting in disgust.

Embarrassing/awkward rather than disgusting.

Whew.... cool, for a minute there I was worried cartoons had to perfectly mimic real movement.

[Obiwanshinobi]

Whew.... cool, for a minute there I was worried cartoons had to perfectly mimic real movement.

It'd be nice if the animations made sense. Akira delivers no explanation why everybody moves like that. Surely they are not all sick there?
At no point I claimed cartoons should look like rotoscoped.
P.S. Sheesh, just watched this and I'm still not buying it. Even lip-synch rubs me the wrong way here. Like the "real time reflections" in Battle Gear 3 for the PS2, what they did there is technically unique, but not very good looking. Fake reflections would make for a better illusion, and so would phony lip-synch. Red Garden was a poor show, but they did lip-synch right, if you need a Japanese example.
I perceive Akira's bad puppetry as the animated equivalent of poor acting.

[GaijinPunch]

It'd be nice if the animations made sense. Akira delivers no explanation why everybody moves like that.

But nobody seems to care but you.

[Obiwanshinobi]

Nobody in this thread? That's a whole lot of people.
Two of you seem to care so little that you in fact brought up the subject again the other day.

[NTSC-J]

I didn't mean to get us started on this again, I just couldn't resist.

Back to the recommendations: Hansel and Gretel by Akira author Katsuhiro Otomo. He does his own take on classic fairy tales, like Hansel and Gretel, The Three Little Pigs, and the story of Jesus. A must-own.

[NTSC-J]

Sweet, I made an Akira thread without even pressing the new topic button. Such is the power of this epic of graphic fiction (and of the strange modding that goes on in this forum).

So...isnt the soundtrack badass? If I were a professional boxer I would use Kaneda`s theme as my entrance music.

[JJXB]

an absolute classic. original dub sounds like something out of one of the abridged teams. remaster sounds epic in 5.1 surround though.
have to look for the manga to put on my psp to read when i feel like though.

[psy]

Akira is fucking dope.

I really have to watch that movie with a good sound setup someday, I won't doubt it'd be a real treat.

[GaijinPunch]

Akira is fucking dope.

I really have to watch that movie with a good sound setup someday, I won't doubt it'd be a real treat.

You won't match this one. It was a club sound system moved in for the festival... some big guns up at the front (probably 2.5 meters tall) and then some other ones up from the ceiling all the way back. Craziness.

[psy]

You won't match this one.

From now on, my primary objective in life is to make you eat these words, by hook or by crook. :<

[chempop]

I think I was in 5th grade when I first saw Akira... Pretty much nullified any chance I had at a normal life.

For Bones Studio, Wolf's Rain is an all time favorite of mine. Currently watching Darker Than Black, it's alright I guess, nothing special but then again I'm only on ep20 of season 1. Have been meaning to check out Rahxephon for a while now. They didn't do Now and Then Here and There by any chance, that's a damn good series.

[NTSC-J]

Akira is fucking dope.

I really have to watch that movie with a good sound setup someday, I won't doubt it'd be a real treat.

You won't match this one. It was a club sound system moved in for the festival... some big guns up at the front (probably 2.5 meters tall) and then some other ones up from the ceiling all the way back. Craziness.

It's a shame they weren't also showing Empire. With those speakers you could probably hear the guy inside R2 blinking.

[Obiwanshinobi]

For Bones Studio, Wolf's Rain is an all time favorite of mine. Currently watching Darker Than Black, it's alright I guess, nothing special but then again I'm only on ep20 of season 1. Have been meaning to check out Rahxephon for a while now. They didn't do Now and Then Here and There by any chance, that's a damn good series.

I don't think so; BONES was founded by former Sunrise employees. In some shows by Sunrise (Gintama, Planetes, Escaflowne TV) you can see bits of that awesome animation style BONES are famous for.
If you think much of Wolf's Rain, RahXephon (the TV show) should be right up your alley.

[CIT]

I've seen Akira in cinemas twice, and it's always been really impressive. I think the animation is really great, even by today's standards.

Plot-wise the movie is kind of a mess though. Definitely can't keep up with the Manga in that respect. In fact, if you've never read it, you probably will no fucking clue at all what is going on in the movie.

So I have to say seeing the first Ghost in the Shell in a cinema is the overall better experience (cuz better movie).

[GaijinPunch]

From now on, my primary objective in life is to make you eat these words, by hook or by crook. :<

Well, the name of the festival is the "Bakuon Eigasai" which means Explosive Sound Movie Festival. So... there ya go. It was awesome though, and they do the festival once a year. Some of the movies are head-scratchers (Kick Ass, for example) others, not so much, like This Is It, and some Rolling Stones movie.

So I have to say seeing the first Ghost in the Shell in a cinema is the overall better experience (cuz better movie).

Good, but Oshii's not quite the director I think everyone lifts him up to be. I think this illustrates better where the manga trumps the movie. It's a great series, but I've never felt any of the animated versions can capture the feel of the manga (and I've only read bits & pieces).

Apples & Oranges when it all comes down to it. Honestly I think Akira (the movie) is a far better standalone story than Ghost in the Shell. It's easier to relate to a near-future Tokyo than whatever's going on in GitS.

EDIT: Again, Akira soundtrack too cool for words.

[CIT]

I dunno man, I think GitS with its cyber warfare and augmented reality themes has a lot more to do with our current time. Whereas I always felt Akira was more about the student protests of the 70s.

I read both GitS manga and the first is good, but Shirow is a really messy storyteller, so I feel it really needed somebody like Oshii to pull things together.

The second GitS manga is a complete trainwreck, with no discernable plot and pages upon pages of unintelligible tech/esoteric-babble. Really cannot recommend it for anything other than the artwork.

[NTSC-J]

For me, GitS symbolizes the change in eras of anime when it went from the hand-drawn stuff that had some grit and character to it, to the cold, sterile CG stuff that I see today. VHS anime and Saturday morning cartoons from my youth (TMNT, Ghostbusters) had their limitations, but I love them all. Partly because you could feel the passion (Daicon IV), and partly because I'm blinded by nostalgia (I still like Denver the Last Dinosaur).

GitS wasn't the first of its kind, but I feel like it looks like what anime strives to be now. Cold and slick, without the charm. When I look at shit like Gantz, I wonder wtf happened. Then I see how popular it is and I retreat to my 2D games and worn out VHS of the Legend of the Overfiend for comfort.

[ryu]

dunno about the gits movie, but i saw the stand alone complex series not too long ago and thought they had the best use of cg i've seen in animation.

the tachikomas hardly stood out like all those cg cars in anime these days.

[psy]

dunno about the gits movie, but i saw the stand alone complex series not too long ago and thought they had the best use of cg i've seen in animation.

the tachikomas hardly stood out like all those cg cars in anime these days.

Sup.

[ryu]

dunno about the gits movie, but i saw the stand alone complex series not too long ago and thought they had the best use of cg i've seen in animation.

the tachikomas hardly stood out like all those cg cars in anime these days.

Sup.

i'm pretty sure providing a source of parody is initial d's sole purpose. heck, at this point it appears like a parody in on of itself to me.

[Obiwanshinobi]

dunno about the gits movie, but i saw the stand alone complex series not too long ago and thought they had the best use of cg i've seen in animation.

the tachikomas hardly stood out like all those cg cars in anime these days.

That's funny, I thought CG in the first SAC series looked as tacky as it gets in anime (and Production I.G hardly bettered it since then, even with "better" technology you can see at work in Seirei no Moribito and The Sky Crawlers). In my opinion Last Exile takes the cake for utilising CG well (although by this I mean the first DTV-rip I saw as the DVD release looked faked up).
Not that hand-drawn bits of SAC were anything to write home about. The mystery of Fuujin Monogatari's excellence seems to be that it was Production I.G's swansong.

[Skykid]

In my opinion Last Exile takes the cake for utilising CG well.

Yeah s'alright, but the show is as boring as fuck.

No CG looks good in Anime, they should quit using it so much.

You won't match this one. It was a club sound system moved in for the festival... some big guns up at the front (probably 2.5 meters tall) and then some other ones up from the ceiling all the way back. Craziness.

I'm ferociously jealous, that sounds amazing. I've seen Akira in theatres countless times, but never with a sound system that sticks you to the back wall.

[Obiwanshinobi]

Yeah s'alright, but the show is as boring as fuck.

Lucky you have Paranoia Agent, isn't it?

No CG looks good in Anime, they should quit using it so much.

Give BONES enough money and I'm sure they'll be back on the roll. That is, if by CG you mean blatant 3D renderings, be it static or animated, since it's not easy to draw a definite line between CG and hand-drawn these days. For instance, the art of Odin Sphere and Muramasa was rendered with a remarkable assistance of digital tools.

[Skykid]

Yeah s'alright, but the show is as boring as fuck.

Lucky you have Paranoia Agent, isn't it?

God yes. Good call there.

No CG looks good in Anime, they should quit using it so much.

Give BONES enough money and I'm sure they'll be back on the roll. That is, if by CG you mean blatant 3D renderings, be it static or animated, since it's not easy to draw a definite line between CG and hand-drawn these days. For instance, the art of Odin Sphere and Muramasa was rendered with a remarkable assistance of digital tools.

I mean blatant CG renderings, as in, blatant 3D models existing amongst a bunch of 2D anime people that are quite obvious no matter how fine the line or improved the technology (ref: see Last Exile.)
Vanillaware's craftsmanship when it comes to using digital programs to create beautiful 2D is a completely different bag.

[drauch]

I dunno man, I think GitS with its cyber warfare and augmented reality themes has a lot more to do with our current time. Whereas I always felt Akira was more about the student protests of the 70s.

I read both GitS manga and the first is good, but Shirow is a really messy storyteller, so I feel it really needed somebody like Oshii to pull things together.

The second GitS manga is a complete trainwreck, with no discernable plot and pages upon pages of unintelligible tech/esoteric-babble. Really cannot recommend it for anything other than the artwork.

Agreed. Shirow is one of my favorite artists, and while I absolutely love his manga like GiTS, Appleseed, Black Magic, and the like, half of the time I can't comprehend what the fuck is going on. The man is a frickin' hermit, and while I love the cyberpunk world he has created, half of the time I just cannot follow it. One chapter will be some of the best illustrated action I've seen, while the next chapter is about wacky pseudo-religion, convoluted politics, or just like you said: tech/estoteric-babble about a mech or some sort of cyborg that no one can follow except Shirow himself. Sometimes he can really hit on the philosophy of cyberpunk "what is life?" and that sort of thing, but other times it just comes off as straight up pretentious and convoluted. Thankfully it's generally the former, rather than the latter. Regardless, I love his work, albeit slightly frustrating at times.

[Obiwanshinobi]

I rate the first GitS feature film on a par with Blade Runner. The cyberpunk fetish is hilariously fusty now (plugging a plug in your head, as if wireless communication was unheard of in the eighties etc.), but it's a fair piece of sorytelling that moves me, wrapped in dreamy artistic qualities and soundtrack (again - the last Kenji Kawai's OST this good was that of Fuujin Monogatari if you ask me).

I mean blatant CG renderings, as in, blatant 3D models existing amongst a bunch of 2D anime people that are quite obvious no matter how fine the line or improved the technology (ref: see Last Exile.)

Last Exile looked best as the aforementioned DTV-rip (not sure about the original TV output). Don't know what they did to it for the sake of DVD release, cranked up saturation or contrast or what, but it looked overlollied and too glossy after that. The hardsubbed version I watched back in 2004 looked way better and I'd like to see that artistic direction developed even further.
The point is, you won't escape CG in modern anime, just like Cave won't make anything looking like DonPachi, Batsugun or Mahou Daisakusen for shit because they can't afford it anymore. It's the budget thing. An OAV drawn entirely like, say, Golden Boy (to name not just drawn by hand, but actually well drawn one) wouldn't be easy to fund in today's climate.
Sure, Gundam SEED watched right after Zeta looks like a bad joke, but that's a particulary poor vs particulary rich endeavour situation (thankfully I don't care much for Gundams). That, however, doesn't prove there's no use for new technologies in anime.
Vanillaware games are a good example of ditching the old ways (orthodox pixel art) in favour of aesthetically just as potent (and presumably more cost-efficient) technique.
Of course good art, no matter the technique, will be always expensive, but CG trickery in films is still in its infancy and deserves some credit for it.
Another example - I still don't like CG colour in comic books as much as I like the old ways (for my money A New Beginning's colour was no match for The Forever War's palette by Bruno Marchand), but it keeps getting better (The Red Star didn't have all that great drawings, but the colour was ace).
Last but not least, I wish game engines mixing polygonal environments with sprites and pre-rendered backdrops with polygonal models developed further as well. Alas, even Falcom and Capcom ditched them.