Why modern anime sucks nowadays?

[Barrakketh]

I'll throw in a recommendation for Kara no Kyoukai. It's a series of OVAs, if you want to watch one of them and don't mind spoilers just pick up #5 (Paradox Spiral). The story isn't told chronologically.

I enjoyed Black Lagoon (A Better Tomorrow and The Wild Bunch references are welcome in my house and - unlike so many "mature" shows such as Texhnolyze - it wasn't padded with juvenile melodrama for people mentally stuck in their teens), but boy, was the TV anime diluted. What was the point of telling the U-Boot story in TWO episodes, no less?
Still, one of few genuine cases of "not taking itself too seriously". A rare and underappreciated gift (as opposite to "self consciousness").

Black Lagoon was good fun. You know you're watching the right series when you see a boat take down a helicopter with a torpedo. It has a pretty good dub, one of the few that hasn't offended me with how terrible they are.

Speaking of good dubs, I enjoyed Baccano and also recommend it.

[iconoclast]

Skykid, I would highly recommend Darker Than Black and Black Lagoon. I think they're right up your alley.

Seconding this.

Other series that you might like: Baccano, Monster, Aoi Bungaku (aka Blue Literature), Sword of the Stranger (movie), Detroit Metal City (a comedy). You might like Kaiji and Akagi as well, but they have almost zero action.

[Icarus]

I'll throw in a recommendation for Kara no Kyoukai. It's a series of OVAs, if you want to watch one of them and don't mind spoilers just pick up #5 (Paradox Spiral). The story isn't told chronologically.

Seconded. I adore this series.

[Skykid]

Just watched High School of the Dead ep1.

Wasn't bad overall. It smacks of being very underwritten, there's barely any semblance of point to any of the dialogue (but this is just the opener.)

The character designs are cool enough and the animation was very good at points. It got down to business real quick, no messing around, so it has pace. Being a red-blooded male I've really got no problem with loads of tits n' crotch shots, but this was a bit silly in its excess.
The trouble is it takes itself waaay too seriously. I'm not expecting ultimate teacher slapstick, but some kind of simple humour would have worked wonders. They are, after all, a bunch of big titted, panties-up-the-asscrack gals getting either slain or taking out zombies. Because of the sombre tone it feels a bit hollow. The characters have no development at all... yet - it could get better of course. I do feel inclined to check out the next episode to see where it goes.

The rip off of 28 Days Later's signature track 'In the House - in a heartbeat' in the last scene really cheapened it though, that was disappointing.

[cstle]

I thought Kara no Kyoukai was pretty damn boring. Anything with an attachment to Type-Moon is like the opposite of entertaining and engaging, really.

[Ganelon]

Aint that the truth. But, this was a time when only the best of the best was translated, or sub-titled, the rest was left alone. In the late 80's and early 90's was the best when fan subbed tapes were passed around, it was truly the best stuff and nothing but. It was when DVD made it cheap to mass produce did we really get an over exposure to all of the crap that never would have seen the light of day outside of Japan.

DVD certainly had companies pushing to release everything but did we really miss a lot of undesirables back then or was there less bad stuff as a whole? I mean, in those days, we got trash like Urotsukidoji where it's hard to see the appeal of beyond tentacle fanatics while we missed stuff like Yu Yu Hakusho that were anime staples of the time. What mega hits can be localized in the US now that can compare to DBZ, Sailor Moon, and Gundam Wing? Stuff like Naruto and Bleach are unquestionably 2 of the hottest modern series yet they haven't fared all that well with US audiences.

I tend to compare my favorites of each era and disregard the misses; it's not just lacking quantity I see nowadays but a questionable design shift that focuses on different aspects of characterization, storytelling, and art styles. And for those who think my views are colored by rose-tinted glasses, I hadn't finished watching Hokuto no Ken and Saint Seiya until just a few years ago and still found them as amazing as I remembered them to be.

It stands to repeat that folks definitely have it way, way easier today with a wealth of tools, translators, and distribution methods. Back around 1990, I remember when a standard price for an hour-long OVA was $30 ($35 for a subtitled version). And even now with all its advantages (or disadvantages because of piracy), anime is still in decline. That said, if I was a little kid with nothing better to do, I'd likely still have a fun time watching today's shows.

[Observer]

Just give someone the resources to do moar of this.

Hello anime. This is what I'm talking about!

I guess you already watched Macross Plus and Zero right? Glad I'm not alone in this. It's just no swordfight moves me as much as seeing all those pyrotechnics, fancy gigantic cannons, robotos, ships and shit delivering enough ordnances to tear down planets. There are two incredibly AWESOME videos, 19 minutes each, portraying some of the best motherfucking badass Itano Circus ever. Well, some silly stuff and parodies too, heh.

Hell, I will recommend you Earth Girl Arjuna just because of that. (Warning, the series is pretty slow paced and Greenpeace-like at times =P)

I guess I have my bets on Redline. That trailer left me drooling even when I'm more of a fan of the Patlabor/Macross/Nadesico type of mechs (you know, the ones that look strangely more realistic in their unrealism, lol).

Oh, did anyone ever watch Tekkaman (not the disaster called Technoman, the massacred US version, the original)? That one is badass as hell.

And what Ganelon said too. Drop it with the rose-tinted glasses thing. There is a pattern around (just look at those charts of stuff being released every season) and it's not precisely the "kareidoscope pattern" patented by ZUN's Touhou.

See, even the american cartoons were awesome. (Those Goofy videos linked recently in another thread come to my mind, or Bugs Bunny shooting the coughing guy when he plays the piano, or anything by Tex Avery)

Of the animes this season, I'm finding "C: The money of soul and possibility of control" to be really enjoyable despite its flaws and glorious engrish. The opening is pretty badass in its okane-obsession too. Also, THAT CLOWN. It's not Pennywise but, jeez, it's close.

[cstle]

Of the animes this season, I'm finding "C: The money of soul and possibility of control" to be really enjoyable despite its flaws and glorious engrish. The opening is pretty badass in its okane-obsession too. Also, THAT CLOWN. It's not Pennywise but, jeez, it's close.

The director of C directed two of the other shows I recommended too, Mononoke and Kuuchuu Buranko/Trapeze. Make sure to check those out.

They're also several times better than C imo.

[Skykid]

Just give someone the resources to do moar of this.

Hello anime. This is what I'm talking about!

I guess you already watched Macross Plus and Zero right? Glad I'm not alone in this.

Not Zero but I bought Macross Plus when it first came out on VHS years ago and loved it (watched it several times). I always remember that quite amazing futuristic concert scene vividly, but moreso when the dudes are flying back into Earth's atmosphere and have to get through the orbital sentry guns and that mad music kicks in!

And what Ganelon said too. Drop it with the rose-tinted glasses thing.

For posterity, I actually mentioned the same feelings on the first page. It's one of the most annoying arguments.

This is a fair argument and one that has elements of truth, because nostalgia is always a defining factor in having an affection for something from a particular era.

However it's an argument I hate, because quite simply there is a difference between awesome stuff and crap stuff, and it really annoys me when folk play the 'nostalgia' card like it simply excuses a pile of generic twaddle because "you don't understand it because it's not something you grew up with."
I'm not saying everything produced today is guff, but why the hell would any generation want to grow up watching shows about teen angst ridden, gang sign throwing yaoi kids?

[doctorx0079]

Truth is, Voltron does kind of suck. I used to like it when I was 7 because it had big robots and it was basically free.

[Skykid]

@Observer

Just thought I'd rekindle some Macross Plus memories and found this actually rather good Danger Zone/Top Gun parody.

If you can't be bothered to watch it all, I suggest skipping to 5:30 - it's pretty amusing.

[Observer]

cstle> I'll take your suggestions and check those shows because this season...

With the exception of C and Gosick (well, Gosick is from the previous season, and I'm a tard for this kind of show with classical/early 20th century ambience/hats and stuff), the other three I was following are quickly starting to disappoint me: Hanasaku Iroha (I saw everything coming circa ep. 1 and, unless they try to surprise the audience, I know by the end most people will hate it) Nichijou (peaked at ep. 6 with the godly argentine peso, then I could no longer stand it...) Ano Mita Hana whatever this thing is (lacks direction, it seriously needs a compass; crossdressing and ghostly necrophilia stop being funny after a couple of episodes).

And don't get me started with the next fad/tendency of crossdressing I've noticed in recent shows. I blame Bakatest for it but there have to be others. So, not happy with the lolis, the pathetic attempts of men in the rising sun simply erase real women, turn themselves into women/gay and that's it. Human extinction. Ph´nglui mglw´nafh Cthulhu R´lyeh wgah´nagl fhtagn!

(edit: in case nobody notices it, I'm exaggerating, I always forget to add this kind of clause )

Skykid> That Top Gun crossover was glorious. It also made me want to watch Macross Plus again. Check Macross Zero too, it's nice but maybe with a bit too much CGI. Still, man, if only they could make more of that.

Jin-Roh was mentioned already? Criticized as too slow, blah this, blah that, I could care less when you have a bunch of brutes in awesome armors carrying the same awesome chainguns that always remind me of that particular scene in Predator (what a great movie btw!).

[cstle]

Yeah, this season is pretty boring. I'm only following C and Dororon Enma-kun, kinda. HanaIro fell off after the first two episodes, AnoHana was never good and had terrible character designs, Nichijou has too much unfunny mixed within the funny, etc.

Dororon is great btw. It's a remake of a 1970s anime/adaptation of a 1970s manga by Go Nagai.

[Skykid]

Jin-Roh was mentioned already? Criticized as too slow, blah this, blah that, I could care less when you have a bunch of brutes in awesome armors carrying the same awesome chainguns that always remind me of that particular scene in Predator (what a great movie btw!).

"Buncha slack jawed faggots round here!"

Jin-Roh has one of the best opening scenes of any Anime ever. Remarkably terrifying. Although Oshii wasn't the director, it's certainly a film with his stamp on it. The quality of the animation is incredible too, unsurprising considering the director was a key animator on Akira.

[cstle]

Oshii wrote the movie.

The Jin-Roh director is directing a new movie too, A Letter to Momo. Known staff so far is pretty good. Gonna be great.

[duckman]

And what Ganelon said too. Drop it with the rose-tinted glasses thing. There is a pattern around (just look at those charts of stuff being released every season) and it's not precisely the "kareidoscope pattern" patented by ZUN's Touhou.

What the fuck does Touhou have to do with this.

[Observer]

And what Ganelon said too. Drop it with the rose-tinted glasses thing. There is a pattern around (just look at those charts of stuff being released every season) and it's not precisely the "kareidoscope pattern" patented by ZUN's Touhou.

What the fuck does Touhou have to do with this.

Nothing, aside from the word "pattern". I know it doesn't make any sense, my bad.

[Blackbird]

Am I the only person that thinks Type/Moon is terribly overrated? *spoilers ahead*

Fate/Stay annoys the hell out of me. The protagonist is a dumb as bricks, and it completely breaks the suspension of disbelief that he survives the story. The level of plot immortality is just stupid. Everybody bends over backwards to help him out, for no compelling reason. There's no tension in the story at all, because the plot goes out of the way to browbeat you with the fact that the protagonist is never going to die because some bullsh*t will happen to keep the plot going. My loathing for the protagonist aside, all the remaining characters are divided into three categories:

1 - Fanservice characters with about as much depth as a cardboard cutout.
2 - One-note villains that don't really have any interesting motivation.
3 - Potentially interesting characters that are ignored in favor of the previous three categories.

I think a lot of people like this show for it's novel presentation of magical powers and it's twist on Arthurian legend, but ultimately this seems shallow and kitschy to me. Ugh.

Moving on to Kara no Kyoukai, I had a lot of the same complaints. The characters were a bit better, but I don't even know what they were trying to do with Shiki. She's a girl with a fetish for murdering, only she (maybe) doesn't really murder, she just entertains fantasies about being a murder fetishist? /boggle. Shiki's mentality is so estranged that I find her impossible to relate to. Hell, I liked Google the best out of the entire cast, because he's the only person that seems to have any humanity in him - he's at least relatable, if boring.

The overall message or theme of several of the movies absolutely INFURIATED me. In one film, Shiki lectures a rape victim for being angry and wanting to take revenge on her oppressors, because that would constitute giving in to hatred and make her a murderer. This from a protagonist who fantasizes about murdering people, and is possibly a murderer herself. The entire plot was so full of sh*t that I wanted to puke. Do as I say, not as a I do?

When it wasn't making me enraged, the rest of it was just kinda boring.

*end spoilers*

[cstle]

Nah, everything related to Type-Moon is dead boring nonsense. You're not alone in that line of thought.

Canaan is awful too.

[duckman]

Am I the only person that thinks Type/Moon is terribly overrated? *spoilers ahead*

Fate/Stay annoys the hell out of me. The protagonist is a dumb as bricks, and it completely breaks the suspension of disbelief that he survives the story. The level of plot immortality is just stupid. Everybody bends over backwards to help him out, for no compelling reason. There's no tension in the story at all, because the plot goes out of the way to browbeat you with the fact that the protagonist is never going to die because some bullsh*t will happen to keep the plot going. My loathing for the protagonist aside, all the remaining characters are divided into three categories:

1 - Fanservice characters with about as much depth as a cardboard cutout.
2 - One-note villains that don't really have any interesting motivation.
3 - Potentially interesting characters that are ignored in favor of the previous three categories.

I think a lot of people like this show for it's novel presentation of magical powers and it's twist on Arthurian legend, but ultimately this seems shallow and kitschy to me. Ugh.

Moving on to Kara no Kyoukai, I had a lot of the same complaints. The characters were a bit better, but I don't even know what they were trying to do with Shiki. She's a girl with a fetish for murdering, only she (maybe) doesn't really murder, she just entertains fantasies about being a murder fetishist? /boggle. Shiki's mentality is so estranged that I find her impossible to relate to. Hell, I liked Google the best out of the entire cast, because he's the only person that seems to have any humanity in him - he's at least relatable, if boring.

The overall message or theme of several of the movies absolutely INFURIATED me. In one film, Shiki lectures a rape victim for being angry and wanting to take revenge on her oppressors, because that would constitute giving in to hatred and make her a murderer. This from a protagonist who fantasizes about murdering people, and is possibly a murderer herself. The entire plot was so full of sh*t that I wanted to puke. Do as I say, not as a I do?

When it wasn't making me enraged, the rest of it was just kinda boring.

*end spoilers*

Anything by TYPE-MOON that isn't Tsukihime is overrated.

[Danza]

Anime adaptations of VNs are always fucking awful. Tsukihime is the best from Type Moon.

[originalz]

can anyone propose a reason for this cultural decline?

http://www.cnngo.com/tokyo/play/decade-anime-682165

This guy seems to be on to something!

Anyway, there's still plenty of excellent retro shows out there if you look, no reason to restrict yourself to new stuff. For something recent...I guess the anime version of "Phoenix"? It's quite good, although mid-2000s so not exactly new at all. I could give you plenty of recommendations of older shows, though (although it may be hard to find fansubs since there doesn't seem to be much interest in retro anime, sadly)!

Anyway, you guys were talking about how series are now about selling "chara". I recently put something up on my blog that talks about it, maybe you'll find it interesting: http://tokyoscum.blogspot.com/2011/04/m ... ra-to.html

[Skykid]

Oshii wrote the movie.

I know, I just meant in directing terms it has his pacing and style too.

can anyone propose a reason for this cultural decline?

http://www.cnngo.com/tokyo/play/decade-anime-682165

This guy seems to be on to something!

Yes he does, very interesting article. That basically puts things in a very black and white fashion.

Quoting a poll figure featured in the article:

"In Japan, a poll conducted by the otaku matchmaking service Otakuma reveals that four out of five of the top shows watched by female anime fans are about giant robots, while four out of five of the top shows watched by male anime fans are about little girls."

This is atrocious. That's certainly a critical decline, not only in terms of basic social development but in terms of general masculinity. I'm not saying everyone should be waltzing like John Wayne, but a large male demographic entranced by pre-teen girls is worrying. Perhaps moreso for Japan, who always had a fairly well established lolita-complex within certain parts of society, but rarely at such a mainstream level.

Meanwhile, in a Japanese radio interview, director Mamoru Oshii publicly admits that he was forced to use computers to animate his latest film "Sky Crawlers," because there simply "aren't enough animators out there to let us do everything hand-drawn. They're not around anymore."

This makes me sad. That basically means a part of Japanese media culture I loved so fondly is on its way out, perhaps for good.

[Ex-Cyber]

"In Japan, a poll conducted by the otaku matchmaking service Otakuma reveals that four out of five of the top shows watched by female anime fans are about giant robots

Yeah, I'm sure girls are into the robots, and have no interest in the cute, emotionally damaged boys piloting them.

[BrianC]

Truth is, Voltron does kind of suck. I used to like it when I was 7 because it had big robots and it was basically free.

From what I have seen, even the original Go Lion isn't that great. It gets repetitive and the main characters aren't very likable.

[Skykid]

"In Japan, a poll conducted by the otaku matchmaking service Otakuma reveals that four out of five of the top shows watched by female anime fans are about giant robots

Yeah, I'm sure girls are into the robots, and have no interest in the cute, emotionally damaged boys piloting them.[/quote]

Sure, but at least there are robots in the first place!

[Nico87]

Speaking of anime, Amazon just had a huge sale on loads of anime movies/series. Probably should have mentioned this sooner but I was too busy buying too much anime. Some of the stuff is still on sale though.

Anyway, I picked up the following;

Basilisk - Box Set
High School of the Dead Complete Collection (Blu-ray, pre-order)
Kanon - Complete Series Box Set
Trigun - The Complete Series Box Set
Code Geass: Lelouch of Rebellion Complete
Fullmetal Alchemist - The Complete First Season
Fullmetal Alchemist - The Complete Second Season
Baccano - The Complete Series
Summer Wars (Blu-ray)
Samurai 7 Box Set
Gungrave - The Complete Series Boxset
Cowboy Bebop Remix Complete Collection
Evangelion 1:11 & 2:22 (Blu-ray)
Welcome to the NHK - The Complete Box Set
FLCL: The Complete Series

[xris]

^ wow some really great suff there! Basilisk was awesome! Have fun watching it all!

[Nico87]

Thanks! I promised myself I was never going to buy anime since it's so widely available for free, but I hate watching stuff on my PC. I get too easily distracted and can't really keep focus, then I start alt+tabbing like a maniac. Some of the stuff was really cheap too. Basilisk was $17.90 down from $79!

[Barrakketh]

Quoting a poll figure featured in the article:

"In Japan, a poll conducted by the otaku matchmaking service Otakuma"

Something tells me their results would be naturally skewed towards something we'd find disturbing.

"In Japan, a poll conducted by the otaku matchmaking service Otakuma reveals that four out of five of the top shows watched by female anime fans are about giant robots

Yeah, I'm sure girls are into the robots, and have no interest in the cute, emotionally damaged boys piloting them.

Sure, but at least there are robots in the first place!

I am Gundam! Setsuna from Gundam 00, in case you didn't get the reference. Of course, being emotionally troubled seems to be a pre-requisite for joining Celestial Being.