Are VGA cables for Saturn commonly referred to as RGB cables

[Rock Man]

Usually when people talk about RGB cables I assume they meant SCART but does the term serve as two separate meanings?

Yes, I know Saturn doesn't support VGA by any practical means. The whole process is rather confusing but it turns out this system could tap VGA potential (480p) via Hi-Vision leads. I saw it on forums explaining this can be achieved through modifying SCART RGB cables, question is would that involve changing the lead on the output end? I read on Fudoh's Classic Gaming website, Saturn and PC Engine could use RGB leads from the blue RGB port of the XRGB-3 to take 15khz sources. I'm unfamiliar with VGA being practiced through 15khz, then again I do recall a discussion regarding the DC Box, what's normally 31khz can be equipped with a 15khz switcher. Should work without any mods to the Dreamcast hardware. I should have suspected VGA input would be able to process this.

That said does both SCART cable and Saturn require modding to achieve a progressive sync signal or just the SCART cable? It'd be hella conveniant if it was just the cable. To think I was ready stop once I've achieved a "sync" SCART cable for my Saturn. But the world of RGB is plentiful, still more uncharted ground to explore. I was thinking about getting the same lead upgrade done on my future PC Engine RX. Though Component Video mods are more prevalent than SCART RGB or VGA when it comes to that platform.

Here is what sparked my interest on the subject at hand: http://www.hdtvarcade.com/hdtvforum/ind ... topic=4355

This along with Fudoh's guide is making me view the Saturn in a whole new light.

[Fudoh]

So much misinformation in the hdtarcade.com thread....

- The Saturn is limited to 15khz.
- VGA describes both a 31khz RGBHV signal (whereas 15khz RGB is usually RGBs) and a 15-pin connector type.
- The XRGB-3's VGA input supports 15khz RGBs, 15khz RGBHV and 31khz RGBHV.
- HiVision is a analogue compressed 1080i signal used for HD broadcasts in Japan in the 90s. The format was available on Laserdisc.

If you want to connect your Saturn to the back input of your XRGB, you can either use a female Scart to male DSub15 adapter or you cut of the Scart head of your Saturn RGB cable and attach a DSub15 connector instead. No need for any further processing. You just have to set the input to RGBs in the configuration menu.

[Rock Man]

So much misinformation in the hdtarcade.com thread....

- The Saturn is limited to 15khz.
- VGA describes both a 31khz RGBHV signal (whereas 15khz RGB is usually RGBs) and a 15-pin connector type.
- The XRGB-3's VGA input supports 15khz RGBs, 15khz RGBHV and 31khz RGBHV.
- HiVision is a analogue compressed 1080i signal used for HD broadcasts in Japan in the 90s. The format was available on Laserdisc.

If you want to connect your Saturn to the back input of your XRGB, you can either use a female Scart to male DSub15 adapter or you cut of the Scart head of your Saturn RGB cable and attach a DSub15 connector instead. No need for any further processing. You just have to set the input to RGBs in the configuration menu.

That's good information, I will use it. Female SCART to male SDub15 adapter here I come!

Question: Vs. SCART how much greater will SDub15 quality be as a result? That's pretty cool about Japan pushing an analogue of 1080i during the 90s. Though some how I doubt Sega was fully ready to take advantage of this format, that's why they didn't produce any such cables. If they followed up on their offer the 1080i would've been a major technology leap for the console in the States, it would've leap frogged the PS1, PS2, Gamecube, and Dreamcasts output exclusively from a cutting edge output angle.

It's funny how those guys were misinformed.

[Fudoh]

Question: Vs. SCART how much greater will SDub15 quality be as a result?

no difference at all. If your source signal is quite noisy (which isn't the case on the Saturn), then the back-RGB input might be a little bit better as it's less sensitive to noise.

[Ex-Cyber]

VDP2 does have VGA and "Hi-Vision monitor" modes, but those top out at 480 lines (i.e. the "Hi-Vision monitor" mode is not actually Hi-Vision res, more like a hybrid of VGA and NTSC), and I don't know that any games actually used them anyway. They may have been intended for arcade use rather than for Saturn itself.

[antron]

- The Saturn is limited to 15khz.

Saturn games are limited to 15kHz. It seems the hardware isn't:
http://nfggames.com/forum2/index.php?topic=3819.0

[Rock Man]

Question: Vs. SCART how much greater will SDub15 quality be as a result?

no difference at all. If your source signal is quite noisy (which isn't the case on the Saturn), then the back-RGB input might be a little bit better as it's less sensitive to noise.

I see, I will look into it at a later time then as any improvement, be it reduced sound interferences or otherwise is welcome.

In the previous comment I accidentally put "I need to look-up this hdarcade site." when I meant to say it's remarkable how misinformed this source is. Mistake corrected.

[BuckoA51]

I see, I will look into it at a later time then as any improvement, be it reduced sound interferences or otherwise is welcome.

For the Saturn there will be no difference, none, not one iota.

In a nutshell, the Saturn could potentially do 480p or VGA resolutions, but not in any games or indeed any software that was ever released. It's not just a matter of flipping a switch like the Dreamcast, displaying the extra resolution would take more processing power.

Also, I've tried 3 different SCART to VGA cables and none of them work with my XRGB3! The only cable I could get working was the Syncblaster one from Keene, so if you really want to go SCART to VGA (as in VGA the connector not VGA as in 31khz) I think you're better off making your own cable up as lots that are available don't seem to work.

[Ex-Cyber]

It's not just a matter of flipping a switch like the Dreamcast

It's not just a matter of flipping a switch on Dreamcast, either; the game has to support it. There's a handful of games with their disc header set wrong where you can fool the BIOS by flipping a switch, but there are also some games that just don't support VGA at all.

[RGB32E]

I've tried out Saturn VGA output. It just takes a RGB cable that's wired for composite sync, and a program that runs in VGA mode. I don't think I've tried connecting through the D2 (VGA) input on the XRGB-3 though. I just used an Extron RGB interface to convert from RGBS to RGBHV and connected directly to my TV. I also tried via component - RGBS to component. When in VGA mode, my TV registered the signal as 480P!

[BuckoA51]

What did you find to run in VGA mode on the Saturn?

[antron]

What did you find to run in VGA mode on the Saturn?

certainly a homebrew program

[ED-057]

The docs say that VDP1`s output just gets scan-doubled when using the VGA/hi-vision modes. So you can`t really get any 480p 3D rendering out of it unless you use software rendering or put VDP1 in interlaced mode and then copy the framebuffers to VDP2`s memory after every frame. I think they should have included a CPUclock/3 resolution for making a better picture without the increased memory requirements of having to switch from a 512-wide framebuffer to a 1024-wide one. That, and/or a YUYV color mode.

[Rock Man]

Yeah, this seems like a lot to process. Think I'll just skip RGB cables and go straight to Composite Sync RGB lead which comes in the form of a SCART cable. After Composite Sync signal it's essentially the same quality except the wire also gives you sound.

[Endymion]

You definitely want to skip VGA cable from the Saturn when you consider no actual games you might have will work with it.