Modding my X-arcade, help-a-noob topic

[Evilmaxwar]

So about two months ago i bought the X-arcade solo, Ok ok i already know what alot of you think about the x-arcade. It was considered in the calculation and i dont regret my purchase.
I had never played with a stick before. I wanted something not too expensive that i could experiment with and mod.
Took me a while to get used to playing with a stick but a like it now. I use it on pc and 360.
Problem is the crappy stick is getting all sticky rubbery now after playing for a while and it sucks big time. I definitely want to change that stick and im considering the options.

Sticks i have considered so far:

-Il Eurostick - From what i understand this is likely the best direct replacement stick for the x-arcade( that use same screw pattern )
-Seimitsu LS-32 - Would this be an optimal shmup stick? I think this stick looks promising, i feel it in my gut. Would need to mod a little harder to make it fit though.
-Also, round gate? square gate? octo-gate? damn im lost.
-I dont really have a problem with the stock buttons but of course imstill open to conselling.
Any suggestions ?

Other question: The 360 adapter scheme from x-gaming sucks balls. Im thinking of hacking a wired 360 controller into the x-arcade and soldering directly at the contact points. Can i have all the x-arcade switches connecting both the x-arcade board and the 360 board safely? Im thinking that it should be ok as long as only either the 360 connection or the usb connection are used. I fear that accidentally having power in boths at the same time could be a bad idea. Maybe i should use one of toodle'S boards somehow ?

Sorry if these subjects have been discussed before, i did look around the forum a bit and it helped but i felt like starting a new thread for my specific issue. Any help, tips or whatever will be appreciated, thanks in advance.

[emphatic]

If you can fit a SUZO 500 (aka, the Omni Stick etc) in there it will be the optimal shmup stick. I know you already don't care about how it all looks as you got an XArcade. (Don't worry, I've owned one myself).

[brokenhalo]

as far as swapping parts on the x-arcade, the Il Eurostick is a simple drop in replacement. any japanese sticks will require some router work because the cp is so thick.

the gate is pretty much determined by the stick. the Il will come with a round gate, the ls-32 will come with a square gate. personally, i find it easier to hit diagonals with a square gate as you'll stop in the corner. circle is a little more vague, but you get used to it.

for your pcb, which systems do you want to run this stick on?

[Evilmaxwar]

If you can fit a SUZO 500 (aka, the Omni Stick etc) in there it will be the optimal shmup stick. I know you already don't care about how it all looks as you got an XArcade. (Don't worry, I've owned one myself).

Looks like a great stick

The human race has not created a more perfect joystick,

Sure is a good argument.

any japanese sticks will require some router work because the cp is so thick.

You mean the MDF panel on the top is too thick? I have a router and i can make it thinner, will it still be robust enough though ?

for your pcb, which systems do you want to run this stick on?

Mainly PC or 360 and idealy original xbox. However I have pretty much all consoles so i might want to use it on anything eventually. I have the newer 3 in 1 GC. DC , PSX xadapter that they claim is lag free, i tried it briefly on my ps1 and it seemed fine. Maybe Toodles Cthulhu for Multi-Console would be better? and maybe using Toodles ChimpSMD for the 360? Im just starting to educate myself about all of this. If i could somehow cram all this hardware in the x-arcade to make it multi console that would be awesome.

Thanks for help guys

[brokenhalo]

You might want to just wire the joystick and buttons to a db-15 jack and do a project box setup. That way you've got every imaginable base covered system-wise. The mc cthulu board is extremely versatile, and you should check out the new ps360 board that akihabarashop sells. Looks promising.

As far as mounting an ls-32, you can either undermount it, or top mount it and put plexiglass on the cp, either way involves routing out some of the cp space. Im at work right now, but when i get a chance i'll link you some pics for a reference.

[Evilmaxwar]

After reading quite a bit on both Suzo 500 and Ls-32, i think i will go for the Suzo. Im still a bit thorn between the two but Suzo looks more comfortable to me considering i have a pretty large hand. Any suggestion as to where order it from considering im in North America ?


Also in the meantime i opened my X-arcade to put myslf in the modding mood and to clean and oil a little the crappy stock stick. Just Look at that.

At X-gaming they dont bother to pre-drill when they screw the bottom panel so the wood was split and there were wooden bumps and scrap between the box and panel. No wonder my stick was wobbly when sitting on a perfectly flat surface, what a bunch of dicks. I glued the wood back together properly , sanded a bit. Now im gonna reassemble with a proper Pre-drill. Getting rid of the wobbliness will be a good start to a better stick.

[Evilmaxwar]

you should check out the new ps360 board that akihabarashop sells. Looks promising.

I tried to find it on akihabarashop but its not where they list other pcbs such as Toodles. Could not find a search function either.

[emphatic]

After reading quite a bit on both Suzo 500 and Ls-32, i think i will go for the Suzo. Im still a bit thorn between the two but Suzo looks more comfortable to me considering i have a pretty large hand. Any suggestion as to where order it from considering im in North America ?

Groovy Game Gear (called Omni Stik Basic): http://groovygamegear.com/webstore/inde ... 78091021a9
Ultimarc (called Euro stik): http://www.ultimarc.com/JShopServer/section.php?xSec=6

I think that Lizard Lick has these as well, but I can't reach them right now and I'm off to work.

At X-gaming they dont bother to pre-drill when they screw the bottom panel so the wood was split and there were wooden bumps and scrap between the box and panel. No wonder my stick was wobbly when sitting on a perfectly flat surface, what a bunch of dicks.

Built like a tank!

[brokenhalo]

you should check out the new ps360 board that akihabarashop sells. Looks promising.

I tried to find it on akihabarashop but its not where they list other pcbs such as Toodles. Could not find a search function either.

hmmm, it's not listed anymore. i checked their thread on srk and apparently they are sold out for now. it's a neat looking board. basically looks identical to toodles boards as far as size and layout. has the screw terminals along the sides for easy installation. and it was only $35. i definitely want to grab a few to test out when they get them back in.

edit--looking around on srk, i found a thread where a bunch of people are complaining about ps360 board malfunctions. looks like they've got some bugs to work out still. http://shoryuken.com/f177/ps360-malfunction-268818/

[emphatic]

PS360 PCBs can be found here: http://www.focusattack.com/products/Aki ... ve%29.html

[Barrakketh]

Keep in mind that there are some problems with the PS360 board:

After 30 min USB Sniffer, and ripping apart my install as a sanity check, i separated the Sparky Jr PWM and the PS360 to test them on their own.

The Sparky Jr PWM was behaving as desired. The PS360 was not.
There was some signal noise (like random pickup / feedback) on 1 and 5 (X and RB)

I managed to solve the issue (read... ..you need to solder!!!)
Taking some small signal diodes (1N4148) i soldered them inline with the 2 misbehaving buttons. Pointing them in the direction of the output that way no 'noise' can come through unless you actually press the button, at which point the intended 'signal' is received.

The problem is now remedied.

The solution provided above will:
1. Void your warranty if there was any provided.
2. Require some soldering chops.
3. Require you to be patient and test, test, test, unplug, plug, unplug, USB sniff, test.
4. Try your patience and make you want to go back to a Ch1mp (sorry Per, something is wonky on the PS360)

Not all users have been affected, it could be from a bad batch. AFAIK Per is having some of the defective boards returned and will be having the people who designed it take a look at them to see what the problem is.

If you can fit a SUZO 500 (aka, the Omni Stick etc) in there it will be the optimal shmup stick.

How does it compare it to a LS-40?

[emphatic]

If you can fit a SUZO 500 (aka, the Omni Stick etc) in there it will be the optimal shmup stick.

How does it compare it to a LS-40?

I've never tried an LS-40, but I'm sure that the SUZO has both quicker engage and a shorter throw. With my experience from the LS-32 as well as the JLF though, let me put it like this:

When comparing a SUZO 500 to a Seimitsu LS-32, the LS-32 feels like it's near broken.

[Evilmaxwar]

Ok so i just ordered an Omni stick from Groovy game gear.
Next time i order stuff its probably going to be pcbs from lizard lick and maybe buttons. I need to read and study a little about all those pcbs before i do that though. I still like the idea of cramming everything inside the x-arcade but after looking inside i noticed its actually more cramped there than i imagined. I made a plan to make more room inside but i end up modifying the x-arcade alot. Part of it is making the box bigger and maybe changing the buttons and CP. Buttons in there are very long so i may end up changing them, and why not then make a new better CP ?

Once again i have not much experience in arcade stuff but i like the Seimitsu smoke button alot.
Of course i play mostly shmups and buttons are not crucial the way the stick is but i do fire a beat em up or fighting game once in a while, would be cool to have a button layout thats good for that too.
Was wondering what you guys have to say about your push-bottons: Is it very important to you ? Favourite buttons ?

Thanks again for the recommendations.

[emphatic]

If you play mostly modern games, autofire is often included, but if your like older shmups where you need to buttonmash, I recommend Seimitsu buttons as they kinda have a pressure sweetspot. Not too easy to push (SANWA) or too hard (HAPP).

[gray117]

. I still like the idea of cramming everything inside the x-arcade but after looking inside i noticed its actually more cramped there than i imagined.

If you're reconsidering this I would recommend the project box route. I must say it does help you keep solutions as separate and simple as possible. Depending on you're physical layout i suppose you could also have more than one device per box.

I suppose the only possible downside is that your interconnecting cable [typically a vga type one ] is going to be thicker than a usb cable...Plus partners frown at the appearance of random boxes which don't look like controllers or consoles - although telling them it prevents you from owning 5 more big arcade sticks usually makes the frown go away.

[Barrakketh]

I suppose the only possible downside is that your interconnecting cable [typically a vga type one ] is going to be thicker than a usb cable...

I see more DB-25 connectors in use than VGA. Depending on your preferred layout 15 pins wouldn't be enough (eight main buttons, home/guide, back/select, start, four directions, and ground puts you one over). And you might want an extra pin for VCC if you're using something like a FGWidget or Sparky board, or a stick like the Sanwa Flash or Suzo Inductive. If you're fine with six main buttons then you'd be good for most uses. Cable thickness isn't really a big issue IMO.

telling them it prevents you from owning 5 more big arcade sticks usually makes the frown go away.

If you wanted to get fancy you could go the project box route, get a dual-mod setup with a MC Cthulhu in it, and take the modular cable approach for each console you're interested in.

[Evilmaxwar]

Ok so im ready to install that Suzo 500 in there.

Looks like its not going to be too hard, screw patterns seem compatible with the bolts on X-arcade, just a small bit of router work and it should fit right in

Im actually having problems removing the shaft from the omnistick though. There is a circular metal clip holding the metal shaft, a bit like the x-arcade stick but the x-arcade was very easy to take off with a screwdriver.
On the omnistick the thing is very tight and i dont want to brake it by doing it wrong. Is there a special trick? Or maybe the trick is to somehow take off the ball top/cone shaft? I could not find a service manual yet for the omnistick

[emphatic]

Grab a pair of fat pliers and grab that clip, then pull until it's off. Just don't do any "wiggle"-motions so you warp it. Then to put it back (unless the X-Arcade clip fits) just place it on, then press with a hard, flat thing (the plier) until it pops back on. I don't remember it being very hard to remove, but it's been a while now.

[Evilmaxwar]

I finally took the time to make a picture of the resulting modded x-arcade.

I had an awful time with that omnistick spring lock btw, horrible little thing. Unlike the one on x-arcade it needs special pliers to take off. Next time i see one of these im gonna buy the pliers. Anyway, took a bit of patience and some dremel work to fit the omnistick in there but the final result is pretty nice. So far i love this stick but did not take the time to try it much. I am not shmupping much lately, that will come however.

Stick feels great but im gonna have to get used to it. Its very tight and I often hit the diagonal when i dont want to.

Next step will be to upgrade the innards and probably a CP overhaul. Ill post back here when im ready to do that but for now im gonna enjoy the stick as it is. My main annoyance with the x-arcade is fixed.

Thank you much for the assistance!

[shmuppyLove]

. I still like the idea of cramming everything inside the x-arcade but after looking inside i noticed its actually more cramped there than i imagined.

If you're reconsidering this I would recommend the project box route. I must say it does help you keep solutions as separate and simple as possible. Depending on you're physical layout i suppose you could also have more than one device per box.

I suppose the only possible downside is that your interconnecting cable [typically a vga type one ] is going to be thicker than a usb cable...Plus partners frown at the appearance of random boxes which don't look like controllers or consoles - although telling them it prevents you from owning 5 more big arcade sticks usually makes the frown go away.

This this this ^

I also started with a cheap stick and upgraded the parts, and for a while the PS2/PC USB PCB it came with was perfect for me. Now I'm looking to hook it up to my supergun and possibly a DC in the near future, so I'm beginning the process of switching to project boxes.

Going modular opens up so many options for you, and is also less expensive, takes up less room, and lets you use one familiar, (hopefully) high-quality reliable stick across all your platforms.

The MC boards from Toodles are very nice, and can result in a more compact solution overall -- but it's impossible to integrate functions for every possible platform into one PCB, and you still need to build a modular cable solution in order to physically connect to each system.

[emphatic]

That came out great! A tip about the SUZO 500 is to make sure that all the switches get seated at the same distance from the center. If you have to take it apart to mount it, the micro switches WILL move around a bit, making the stick need some calibration or the diagonals will be involuntarily hit. Just open the screws a bit, then use a flat screwdriver to push the micro switches either as far away from the shaft as possible (there's a small plastic edge that stops them from falling out) or as far towards the shaft as possible. It's up to you what you prefer.

[wildchild22]

I actually bought a tankstick and absolutely love it for mame. I use it for everything besides Mortal Kombat. For mortal kombat I have a 360 PDP mortal kombat stick . I also have 2 street fighter mad catz te sticks (1 ps3 and 1 xbox360). I would still buy the x-arcade stick and do not see much difference in it between that and the highly sought after mad catz te. I like the layout and trackball on the tankstick.

Maybe not the greatest but I can't complain about it or see the need to upgrade parts (YET).
I may need a 4 way joystick just for mrs pacman and stuff as I find the 8 way hard to use for that.

(I quess I should put on my flame suit

[Evilmaxwar]

I actually bought a tankstick and absolutely love it for mame. I use it for everything besides Mortal Kombat. For mortal kombat I have a 360 PDP mortal kombat stick . I also have 2 street fighter mad catz te sticks (1 ps3 and 1 xbox360). I would still buy the x-arcade stick and do not see much difference in it between that and the highly sought after mad catz te. I like the layout and trackball on the tankstick.

Maybe not the greatest but I can't complain about it or see the need to upgrade parts (YET).
I may need a 4 way joystick just for mrs pacman and stuff as I find the 8 way hard to use for that.

(I quess I should put on my flame suit

I also like it alot for mame, At least it does not lag with the usb ps/2 input. I did not use many more arcade sticks but im pretty sure alot of people criticizing the x-arcade are making it sound much worse than it is.
I guess button layout could be a bit improved however my biggest complaint with it is that the stick ( which at first was all right ) quickly became sort of sticky like plastic parts were rubbing each other inside the stick and it became less easy to make smooth circular motions and just plain less fun to use. I had to change the stick. I tried cleaning and lubricating first but it merely improved and did not fix the problem.