Is Border Down a bit rubbish?

[pooch]

A troll title, I know. But I've recently bought this for literally a million pounds and after 5-10 goes I'm rather underwhelmed. I've read the ST so I'm aware of the mechanics - I'm supposed to be cancelling bullets with the break laser, and having big laser duels with the bigger baddies - but possibly because i'm rubbish I haven't had much chance to do this yet, and I'm yet to see the "hook." Maybe I should find some superplays to see what I'm missing, but disappointed so far.

I like how the whole style is rather different, and the border system seems novel, but the graphics and music don't pull me in either (unlike, say, Under Defeat graphics and Psyvariar 2 music, which would almost be good enough to draw me in regardless of the quality of those respective games).

Do I need to stick it out? Are the later levels much better? I'll fully admit I'm rubbish and can't get further than about level 3, but honestly having to replay those levels is starting to grate - level 1 particularly seems a bore. It's my only horzie and I quite enjoy sneaking through gaps and that, but I'm tempted to give it all up and try to get some of my money back.

[mjclark]

I've recently bought this for literally a million pounds

Think you may have been overcharged a bit there.
And I too am utterly rubbish at BD. It's definitely one of the most visually stunning and atmospheric of all the DC shooters but all that bordering down is really frustrating. I've always felt that this is a shmup that deserves some serious time, attention and practice to be properly appreciated but that's time, attention and practice that I havn't got.

[apple arcade]

I always thought the game was "okay" at best.

Under Defeat, Ikaruga, Triggerheart Exelica and Psyvariar 2 are my favorite shmups on the system, so you can gauge that to tell how different your taste is from mine.

If you own a DC, I don't understand why you wouldn't at least test out a pirated copy before taking such a costly plunge?

[Jockel]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JAqYYLt5Ip8

[pooch]

Think you may have been overcharged a bit there.
And I too am utterly rubbish at BD. It's definitely one of the most visually stunning and atmospheric of all the DC shooters but all that bordering down is really frustrating. I've always felt that this is a shmup that deserves some serious time, attention and practice to be properly appreciated but that's time, attention and practice that I havn't got.

I feel the same. Just conscious I may be missing something and don't want to dismiss it prematurely. I remember playing Psyvariar 2 for about a year and enjoying it before I discovered invincibility on level up and the ability to ram things!

If you own a DC, I don't understand why you wouldn't at least test out a pirated copy before taking such a costly plunge?

Hmm, yeah. Good point.

[DEL]

Every game that you can't get far on soon seems rubbish/trash/basura.
But the moment you start getting good at a game and make proper progress, you start liking it.
Border Down is not a pick up and play shooter like most other recent (last 12 years) STGs. You have to learn it
.
I guess its my favourite of all time.

[ROBOTRON]

Is Border Down a bit rubbish?

No it isn't, its a top ten title.

[Evrain]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JAqYYLt5Ip8

"PRO review"... oh boy, this is so "pro" they should have him review just about everything (/sarcasm)

[clp]

Its a great title way above average but its really one for the more experienced , I was in the same boat as you when i first got it i just couldnt handle it . Just dont try and copy the superplay tactics straight off the bat oh yeah and the stage 3 boss will rape you hard for a whilst.

[clp]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JAqYYLt5Ip8

"PRO review"... oh boy, this is so "pro" they should have him review just about everything (/sarcasm)

[Jockel]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JAqYYLt5Ip8

"PRO review"... oh boy, this is so "pro" they should have him review just about everything (/sarcasm)

Ninja-edit: tongue-hi5 to clp

[subcons]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JAqYYLt5Ip8

Ha. Never saw that one. Pretty funny.

He makes good points about the game though. I've never been too fond of BD myself, but I always just chalked it up to not having spent enough time with it. And the ship and enemy designs... ugh. They're horrible.

[DEL]

clp wrote;

but its really one for the more experienced

Very true. Its a mix of old and new. Old style memorization and new style scoring engine. Its the memorization that scares many people off. Players nowadays aren't used to having to learn a game just to survive. Take Mush for example or the DDPs - simply dodging can get you far into the game. Whereas simply dodging in Border Down will get you nowhere.
This is why (I believe) the Border Down Hi Sc thread is so underpopulated. Plus of course its a bit rare and only on the DC and Naomi.
I think its a masterpiece, programmed by very experienced guys. The GREV Director having stated that 'even if the company goes under, he would get Border Down completed and released'. It is the evolution of the Darius titles and Metal Black. It is the end result of those games. It is the best of them.

[louisg]

I'm not down with the scoring system, but as a survival game, Border Down is ace (and tbqh, it's hard enough for me to just get past that st3 boss). I do think though that the st3 boss is way too hard, takes too long, and spikes the difficulty, and some of the chosen colors in that part blend in with the background too much.

[antares]

I guess its my favourite of all time.

+1

Believe us, it's the best

[pooch]

I'll give it some more play tonight I SUPPOSE

[agustusx]

I'll give it some more play tonight I SUPPOSE

Whatever ya do don't play it frustrated, it only makes it worse. You could always leave it alone for a few days and try it on a fresh head.

It seems like you have some other titles you are more interested in at the moment, and it might be a good to play them instead.

[Evrain]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JAqYYLt5Ip8

"PRO review"... oh boy, this is so "pro" they should have him review just about everything (/sarcasm)

Ninja-edit: tongue-hi5 to clp

Sorry, this one is the winner (and it's the truth, in fact)

[louisg]

Also, the soundtrack is incredible.. (listening to it as I code =))

[ROBOTRON]

loligans.

[Rozyrg]

I could never get into it... at all. I always got the sense that there was something greater under the surface; but I never had the patience to reach it.

The last shooter I felt like that about was probably.. Raycrisis? I'll try to pick it back up now and then; but after a few (futile) attempts to make progress, I'm through with it again and it goes right back on the shelf.

[professor ganson]

best thread title in quite a while

[lilmanjs]

Border Down is by no means rubbish. I used to think so, but then I played and played and got somewhat decent at it and now love it. the music is great, and I think the remix mode has the best music

[Skykid]

It's an incredible game, and I can see that even though I'm shit at it. It's a very tough shmup to get to grips with, but the style and atmosphere are lovely. You need to give it months and months of your life though.

[BulletMagnet]

It's far from perfect (what is it, one third of your total score can be gained at one boss?), but I think some of its detractors would probably be a bit more forgiving towards it if it wasn't so stupidly expensive.

[Ed Oscuro]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JAqYYLt5Ip8

Oh man, I missed that one. "Straight downhill, in both directions"

[Battlesmurf]

Rubbish? Nononono

I file this one with Battle Garegga. Beautiful games, deep, but with certain mechanics I absolutely *hate*. That being said- for the people that these games click with- they really stick with them forever and I can really appreciate that. Some day I think I'll figure them out myself.

I would totally love to give a remake/re-release a go on XBLA to give it more time.

[PsychoGun]

Border Down is fucking terrible for what it costs.

When you buy "rare" games you'll always be disappointed 9 times out of 10.

Honestly the Dreamcast doesn't have many amazing shooters. They're all "okay" games that cost way too much, so most people hold them up on a pedestal to defend their purchase.

[Rob]

This game felt special when there weren't any (good, R-Type Final) side-scrolling shooters being released. Then Gradius V came out.

[Elixir]

Why spend such an elaborate figure on merchandise without beforehand ensuring it's what you wanted?