Drug War + Dog Murder

[BryanM]

Sorry if this has been posted before. I used the search but you know me - flippers for hands.

So some guy liked pot so the police broke into his house and murdered his family's dog few months back. Completely common - with over a hundred of these a day, it's unusual for a week to go by where a human (from man to woman, adult to baby) isn't murdered by the gestapo.

What was really unusual in this case, was the police department made the massive PR blunder of actually releasing the video of the action in question.

So here is a copy of the vid. It's a great thing to watch if you feel like crying today.

[JoshF]

Couldn't you just make some kinda point about the drug war without the "hey looky guys I found a snuff film!"?

[BryanM]

No.

People don't fucking care about words. We've had decades of this - no one gives a shit.

[BryanM]

And any retard wanting to whine about a "drug war" with "snuff films" would have linked to the many, many dismembered bodies in Mexico. Which is another thing people don't give a shit about, as those people are much too tan to give a thought to.

Also we should cut out all those unpleasant war pictures in history books and documentaries so Josh doesn't have to be occasionally reminded that reality is real.

[Acid King]

The icing on the cake? Marijuana is decriminalized in Columbia, MO and the cops didn't find enough in the guys house to even charge him with possession. He paid a $300 fine for the pot and plead out to a drug paraphrenalia charge. The video didn't get released until after the court stuff was done.

EDIT: I should also mention that the family has filed suit against the police department. http://www.columbiamissourian.com/stori ... s-lawsuit/

[Square King]

Unbelieveable. Yet, there it is.

[JoshF]

And any retard wanting to whine about a "drug war" with "snuff films" would have linked to the many, many dismembered bodies in Mexico.

Okay so link to it. I can't contemplate the drug war enabling violent gangs without seeing a decapitation video.

[ROBOTRON]

This type of situation is a gray area to me.

I am a former pet owner and love my pets, so much so, I suffer through a grieving period whereas I am deeply depressed for quite some time...just if it were a humanoid that was killed.

There are 2 schools of thought.

1. I assume an investigation was done that says someone is in possession/dealing drugs or whatever....enough evidence a judge signs a warrant for the cops to go in there with force. The cops are given the job and they go to get it done. You go in, there's a dog running towards you barking and maybe gonna try to bite you...the dog is shot. Now if the officer is me, or a loved one, I say good, way to go. Protect yourself and your fellow officers from being bitten...had the douche bags been law abiding people and not selling/doing an illegal substance, the police never would've been called/raided the place, right? Job well done, I say.

OR

2. Cops got the wrong address or the dog runs away from the intruding officers or the dog is in a sitting or laying position (any non-threatening situation) and is shot to death...then I'm screamin' bloody murder and want to ring the neck of the officer that fired at my dog/cat whatever.

The only thing I can say is don't possess or traffic an illegal substance and there won't be any need for a raid...many people bring this type of sh*t down on themselves and then cry foul when something goes wrong. WTF...I mean the house that was raided had kids in it, what were those parents thinking possessing/trafficking an illegal substance in a house where children are present? Thats what we should be asking ourselves, instead of screaming about "dog murder".


Now the question of whether pot should be an illegal substance or not is a whole other argument. An illegal substance is an illegal substance...if you don't think weed should be labeled illegal to possess or trafficked, move somewhere else its classified "legal".

My 2 cents.

[JoshF]

The only thing I can say is don't possess or traffic an illegal substance and there won't be any need for a raid

Also keep the picture of Dear Leader framed at a perfect 90 degree angle.

[Ed Oscuro]

The only thing I can say is don't possess or traffic an illegal substance and there won't be any need for a raid

Also keep the picture of Dear Leader framed at a perfect 90 degree angle.

Did you know that you have to keep that wall clear of any other portraits? You can't even put your family portraits underneath, man, it's gotta be all or nothing. But nothing is bad because then the cops will plant a marijuana plant on that wall; it's trouble I tell you.

[ROBOTRON]

The only thing I can say is don't possess or traffic an illegal substance and there won't be any need for a raid

Also keep the picture of Dear Leader framed at a perfect 90 degree angle.

[Ed Oscuro]

What scares me is, his brain really is that big.

But the online ads told me his IQ was only 110. It's all a giant deception campaign, I tell you! THE TRUTH IS INSIDE YOU *lunges for the knife*

[BryanM]

1. I assume an investigation was done that says someone is in possession/dealing drugs or whatever....enough evidence a judge signs a warrant for the cops to go in there with force.

The investigation is someone calls them and then they go in. They don't have a guy in a mustache sit outside the house for hours on end.

You go in, there's a dog running towards you barking and maybe gonna try to bite you...the dog is shot.

The instinctual behavior of the average pitbull is to jump on new friends and drown them in slobber.

[Acid King]

This type of situation is a gray area to me.

I am a former pet owner and love my pets, so much so, I suffer through a grieving period whereas I am deeply depressed for quite some time...just if it were a humanoid that was killed.

There are 2 schools of thought.

1. I assume an investigation was done that says someone is in possession/dealing drugs or whatever....enough evidence a judge signs a warrant for the cops to go in there with force. The cops are given the job and they go to get it done. You go in, there's a dog running towards you barking and maybe gonna try to bite you...the dog is shot. Now if the officer is me, or a loved one, I say good, way to go. Protect yourself and your fellow officers from being bitten...had the douche bags been law abiding people and not selling/doing an illegal substance, the police never would've been called/raided the place, right? Job well done, I say.

OR

2. Cops got the wrong address or the dog runs away from the intruding officers or the dog is in a sitting or laying position (any non-threatening situation) and is shot to death...then I'm screamin' bloody murder and want to ring the neck of the officer that fired at my dog/cat whatever.

The only thing I can say is don't possess or traffic an illegal substance and there won't be any need for a raid...many people bring this type of sh*t down on themselves and then cry foul when something goes wrong. WTF...I mean the house that was raided had kids in it, what were those parents thinking possessing/trafficking an illegal substance in a house where children are present? Thats what we should be asking ourselves, instead of screaming about "dog murder".


Now the question of whether pot should be an illegal substance or not is a whole other argument. An illegal substance is an illegal substance...if you don't think weed should be labeled illegal to possess or trafficked, move somewhere else its classified "legal".

My 2 cents.

First, the crime he committed was the legal equivalent to getting a parking ticket. Second, the evidence used to justify the raid was an uncorroborated tip from a confidential informant and a bag with pot residue in the guys garbage, possession of which, as I said before, is technically not a crime in the city he lives in. Finally, the warrant was based on old information and it's obvious that they didn't do basic investigative work considering they didn't even realize there was a child in the house.

It's pretty fucked that you suggest the parents were being irresponsible or putting their child in danger by having a substance that's pharmacologically safer than aspirin in the house, while you give a pass to police whose shoddy investigative work and overzealous enforcement resulted in shots being fired wildly in a house with a child present.

[BryanM]

Wasn't there one recently where the guy shot a woman and her baby in their bed, killing the lady and blowing off the kid's hand?

All out of rage-a-hol and it's only Tuesday. Back to being a good little sheep...

[Danza]

It's pretty fucked that you suggest the parents were being irresponsible or putting their child in danger by having a substance that's pharmacologically safer than aspirin in the house

Come on.. Yeah weed and LSD are "safe" pharmacologically speaking, would you still want your KIDS around it? Especially in a trafficing situation? I don't know about you, but I wouldn't want a child with a brain that isn't fully developed being anywhere near the stuff, or expose them to that type of culture/situation.

Both pro-drug and anti-drog propaganda is equally bullshit. Anti-drug propaganda overblows the danger of drugs, pro-drug propaganda usually ends in a circle-jerk of people who claim nothing bad can come from drug use (cannabis, specifically) and all the usual shit. I've even seen people say that the effect on the brain THC has is similar to eating a chocolate bar. Absolute idiots.

As for the video, disgusting.

[Acid King]

I don't recall that one, but right in Robotron's backyard a 7 year old girl was shot in the head by a swat team when they raided the wrong apartment. http://www.freep.com/article/20100601/N ... nty-agrees

Come on.. Yeah weed and LSD are "safe" pharmacologically speaking, would you still want your KIDS around it? Especially in a trafficing situation? I don't know about you, but I wouldn't want a child with a brain that isn't fully developed being anywhere near the stuff, or expose them to that type of culture/situation.

I don't know why you brought up LSD, which is a far different drug, but if you wouldn't want your kid around pot or that "culture" I would hope you don't have any alcohol in your home either. Whether I would want my kid to be exposed to it is neither here nor there, because regardless of what I choose to allow my child to see, the fact remains that it's impossible to overdose on marijuana and as such, the drug itself represents no danger to the children. The danger to them was the over zealous cops.

[JoshF]

Reasons the ban pot:
1. It's bad because it's illegal because it's bad because...
2. And what of the little children?
3. Jails and jackboot manufacturers would go out of business.

I wonder how many authoritarians and moral crusaders realize that 15 million people have been jailed (pot alone) people who might have served more social utility as mothers and fathers, and 1 trillion of tax money has been wasted because a racist* war criminal smelled a JEWFAG CONSPIRACY.

* This page misses one of his greatest hits.

[BulletMagnet]

I'm not particularly informed on the subject of marijuana legalization, but one offshoot of the "war on drugs" thing that definitely strikes me as stupid is the federal government's inability (or unwillingness) to distinguish between dope and industrial hemp, which was cultivated in the US for years before "reefer madness" and has nowhere near enough THC to get high on in the first place - it's easy to grow, the seeds are edible, and the rest of it can be used in a variety of products, paper included, but apparently a readily-available alternative to deforestation is Communist, so we'll spend money importing it while prohibiting our own farmers to produce it.

[ROBOTRON]

I don't recall that one, but right in Robotron's backyard a 7 year old girl was shot in the head by a swat team when they raided the wrong apartment. http://www.freep.com/article/20100601/N ... nty-agrees

It was the the right house, wrong door, it was also pointed out later that that tearful dad, crying about the child that was shot, drove the gunman up to the party store to kill someone else's child (17 years old) because he didn't like the way he looked at him (this happened the day before Aiyana was killed.

You are mad at the wrong person(s), sir.

[greg]

Regardless of whether the SWAT raid was warranted --I can imagine this treatment for a meth lab and it's hard to believe that they'd storm somebody's house just for some bags of doobies, but whatever-- in general, if the SWAT teams are raiding somebody's house, they have too much crap to deal with than to worry about nonviolently subduing a dog that can potentially tear into the team members. I really cannot blame them for just taking care of the dog the swiftest way possible when they don't even know if somebody's waiting for them in the house with a gun. They can't just send in a dog catcher first into the house. The dog wasn't going to "play" with the police--the dog was just protecting the house like it is supposed to. It's a shame, but shooting a dog is just collateral damage. I don't know the specifics of this incident, so I'm just talking in general.

[Acid King]

It was the the right house, wrong door, it was also pointed out later that that tearful dad, crying about the child that was shot, drove the gunman up to the party store to kill someone else's child (17 years old) because he didn't like the way he looked at him (this happened the day before Aiyana was killed.

You are mad at the wrong person(s), sir.

I don't know from where you woudl derive who "I'm mad at" from one statement of fact about a fucked up swat raid. It was the wrong apartment in a two unit house and regardless of what the father did, there is no excuse for the flawed way the police performed the raid or the girl's death. Had they executed the search properly, that girl would still be alive.

[Ed Oscuro]

It's a shame, but shooting a dog is just collateral damage.

And what's "collateral damage" a euphemism for?

"Anything goes."

[Danza]

I don't know why you brought up LSD, which is a far different drug, but if you wouldn't want your kid around pot or that "culture" I would hope you don't have any alcohol in your home either. Whether I would want my kid to be exposed to it is neither here nor there, because regardless of what I choose to allow my child to see, the fact remains that it's impossible to overdose on marijuana and as such, the drug itself represents no danger to the children. The danger to them was the over zealous cops.

I brought up LSD because it is extremely safe as well. However, it can have unwanted psychological effects. So can cannabis. Predisposition or not, I know a number of people who have experienced episodes of psychosis after heavy use. Some have recovered, some get worse when taking drugs. For this reason, I wouldn't want to expose my kids to it (or alcohol, indeed if I had kids I certainly wouldn't drink like I do now) until they are mature enough to research drugs and make up their own mind. I understand it is predisposition, don't get me wrong, but this doesn't mean there is no risk (people generally assume there isn't a risk for them).

Honestly, I don't like the drug war or over zealous cops either, but I also dislike irresponsible behaviour and attitudes towards drugs (this isn't directed at you or anyone else). And honestly, I don't see a solution to the drug war. Just legalizing or decriminalising all these substances across the board seems like a naive solution after everything that has happened. It is a really complex situation.

[Ed Oscuro]

Just legalizing or decriminalising all these substances across the board seems like a naive solution after everything that has happened.

And Prohibition wasn't naive? We had a decade of murder and crime, in case anybody skipped that chapter of American history. What's happening right now is much the same as well. Even the former Mexican President, Vincente Fox, has called for legalization. I think there's a difference between putting an emphasis on personal responsibility and community resources for addicts, and ignoring the problems of drug use entirely, just as there's a difference between a nanny state whose policies backfire, and having well thought-out public policy.

[Danza]

I tend to agree with you, I said I didn't like the situation. Prohibition was a naive and stupid thing to do. I just don't know what the solution is, given how far this shitstorm has come. Just making everything legal across the board, I'm not sure would work, initially at least. It is hard to guage what the possible consequences would be.

Things can't stay the same, that is for sure. But I personally don't think that across the board legalisation would be the best solution (at least at this stage). As I said, I really don't know what the best solution would be.

[Acid King]

I brought up LSD because it is extremely safe as well. However, it can have unwanted psychological effects. So can cannabis. Predisposition or not, I know a number of people who have experienced episodes of psychosis after heavy use. Some have recovered, some get worse when taking drugs. For this reason, I wouldn't want to expose my kids to it (or alcohol, indeed if I had kids I certainly wouldn't drink like I do now) until they are mature enough to research drugs and make up their own mind. I understand it is predisposition, don't get me wrong, but this doesn't mean there is no risk (people generally assume there isn't a risk for them).

Cannabis induced psychosis is incredibly rare. We're taking about a tiny subset of a tiny subset. It's not that there is no risk, it's that the risk is quite remote. It's easily the safest of all recreational drugs as far as the effect on the body is concerned.

Honestly, I don't like the drug war or over zealous cops either, but I also dislike irresponsible behaviour and attitudes towards drugs (this isn't directed at you or anyone else). And honestly, I don't see a solution to the drug war. Just legalizing or decriminalising all these substances across the board seems like a naive solution after everything that has happened. It is a really complex situation.

Of course it's a complex situation, but dismissing legalization as naive strikes me as both short sighted and simplistic. We've already had this same exact experience with alcohol prohibition. If the object of government policy is to improve and maintain public safety, then across the board legalization has to be considered a viable option. The fact is that there is no relationship in the industrialized world between stringency or laxity of criminal punishment and use rates. The measure primarily associated with use rates is the perceived risk in use. We've already seen the way education affects behavior, what do you think has driven declines in tobacco consumption over the past few decades? We didn't have to lock up cigarette smokers to achieve that.

Honestly, I think when marijuana is legalized state by state in the coming years and everyone realizes the problems are nowhere near as dire as prohibitionists made them seem, more people will look at other drugs and realize that it's much easier to deal with public health and safety issues in a legal, regulated market than it is in an unregulated black market run by violent cartels.

[ROBOTRON]

I don't recall that one, but right in Robotron's backyard a 7 year old girl was shot in the head by a swat team when they raided the wrong apartment. http://www.freep.com/article/20100601/N ... nty-agrees

It was the the right house, wrong door, it was also pointed out later that that tearful dad, crying about the child that was shot, drove the gunman up to the party store to kill someone else's child (17 years old) because he didn't like the way he looked at him (this happened the day before Aiyana was killed.

You are mad at the wrong person(s), sir.

I agree, the raid was appalling, but again...it would never have happened had the girl's father not participated in a murder the day before...thats why the police went there in the first place. Also, the family knowing the dirtbag had killed someone the day before, shielded him and hid the guilty party knowingly in the apartment upstairs.

All this does not change the fact the police f*cked up, I'm not condoning that...but I still throw 60% of the blame on the girl's father and family for hiding a felon that the police were searching for in the house.

Thats why I'm saying its a gray area to me, there were people wrong on both sides. However, children cannot pick their parents, but adults have the mental capacity to choose whether or not to harbor a fugitive or keep an illegal substance in the house.

EDIT: Don't worry though, the infamous Detroit attorney, Geoffrey Fieger has taken the case, he'll make sure that the family of the poor little girl that was killed gets paid millions of dollars for doing the wrong thing. The girl's father a felonious dirt bag that participated in a murder the day before will become a millionaire overnight and move out of Detroit....perhaps next door to you.

[Lordstar]

The instinctual behavior of the average pitbull is to jump on new friends and drown them in slobber.

If im going in to a drug dealers/producers home and a dog like that comes running towards me its gettig shot to fuck. Sorry but of all the people who would have dogs trained to attack and defend the home it would be people involved in ilegal activity.

[BryanM]

The dog wasn't going to "play" with the police--the dog was just protecting the house like it is supposed to.

You've never had a fucking dog in your life have you? Assholes can break into your house, do the fuck they want, and poochie'll lick them on the way out.

Useless mutts..