Pink Gorilla U-District in Seattle - Shmupmeet 10/02 @ 2pm!

[KevinDDR]

The proposed date sounds good for me.

I had a great time at the meeting! It was really cool to meet other people who play shmups. I also especially loved getting the chance to play Daifukkatsu. Kudos to Mr. Anonymous Dude for letting Bobby borrow the board!

A little competition sounds great, and I'm sure it would motivate people to play more as well.

[wnka]

Superb-ness all around. The people, the games, the cabs. Bobby did an amazing job setting everything up and having MuchiMuchi Pork and Daifukkatsu side-by-side was pretty epic.

Incredibly, I got my first ever Cave 1CC at the event on Daifukkatsu! Goes to show how far auto-bomb will get you...

I will definitely be interested in any events in the future. Let's keep this going. Thanks all!

[bobbyconover]

Hey guys, thanks for all the comments! I can't take credit for a lot of things, though -- it was truly a team effort, and I think as long as it continues to be one, we should be able to keep making these things bigger and better. So first off, huge thanks to everyone for coming out! Pretty much all the shmuppers I knew already were there, in addition to quite a few who I'd never met and even a number of my buddies from the arcade collecting scene, who I was really excited to see. They know nothing of shmups and I think/hope they came away from the gathering with at least a little more understanding and appreciation of them.

More specifically, thanks to:

Rob and the other PG guys for putting up with us and helping to keep the store open late!
Vexorg for the DoDonPachi PCB (which is still in the arcade now, so play it while it lasts), hooking me up with joysticks beforehand, and bringing a tub of other PCBs we didn't even get to check out!
Marus/EPS for helping to set the whole thing up and bringing equipment!
Tom/Paladin for filming! (hopefully I'll get ahold of the footage soon and can link to some videos)
Ahmet, who doesn't even really like shmups but came to hang out anyway, and lent us his Twinkle Star Sprites PCB (also still in the arcade for a limited time)!
Wnka and KevinDDR for coming by to hook me up with joysticks and buttons before the meet -- several cabs would not have been playable if not for these guys and Vexorg coming through for me!
And of course a HUGE thanks to our PCB/arcade collector buddy Jeff, for the last-second donation of his MMP and DFK PCBs. I think everyone agrees that they elevated the whole thing to the next level, and here's hoping he'll be willing to help out in the future.

Hope I didn't forget anyone, but needless to say I really appreciated everyone's help. I, too, am eager to do it again soon, and the best part is that next time I won't be scrambling to get cabinets ready, so I'll be able to concentrate more on other aspects of the meet. The tournament, or more specifically "ranking battle" format sounds awesome. Just a little friendly competition to keep things interesting. Also, seeing the posted rankings in the arcade will make other random players more interested in jumping into the shmup world, I think?

I think Oct 2nd will work OK for the next one, and I know it's important to EPS that we do it then since he's starting school and might not be able to make it out for others later in the year, but I think we should space them out a bit more in the future. Just so they don't go stale too quickly. Also, starting earlier and maybe going a couple hours past closing time, as opposed to starting later and staying until 2am, would probably be appreciated by Rob. If it were me I'd stay open all night, but I don't have that kind of authority at the store.

[seattlexc]

I might not be able to make the 10/2 date, but it's all good. I'll just show up to the next one. Thanks again for putting on a truly epic event Bobby, I'll be sure to attend every event I can

[sunburstbasser]

I'll be in Seattle this weekend. I'll have to stop in and play a few games. Wish I could be there for a tournament, maybe another time.

[marus]

Okay, so here's my rough draft/proposal for the Pink Gorilla Shmups Ranking Battles! (title tentative):

Basic format:
At every PG shmupmeet we will hold a tournament for a shmup, where players will compete for the highest score. Players that place within the top 8 of the tournament will receive a number of points that will contribute to their overall ranking throughout the season. For example, 1st place will receive 8 points, 2nd place will receive 7 points, ect. all the way to 8th place who will receive 1 point. At the end of the season, the player with the highest number of points will be declared the winner.

• The tournaments will be open to all players regardless of skill level or region.
• You don't have to play at every tournament to be eligible for overall rankings. However, missing tournaments will reduce the number of opportunities for you to build points.

Ranking Battle #0
The first test tournament will be held on October 2nd.
Registration starts at 2:00pm, the tournament starts at 3:00pm.
There is no entry fee for the tournament (meaning it's free)!

Format/Rules for the tournament:

• Each participant will play 1 credit(?) of the specified game.
• After a participant has finished playing their credit, their score will be recorded.
• After all participants have finished playing, the player with the highest score will be the winner.

Since this is just a test tournament (to see if this system will actually work), no points will actually be awarded this time. However, I'll see if I can maybe put together a small prize for the winner (though don't get your hopes up)! I'm hoping that once we start the real season, we can keep the rankings posted somewhere in the arcade along with photos of the top finishers, and maybe get a trophy for the winner!

As far as running the tournament, I do have a few questions for all of you, and I'd appreciate it if you could answer them. It'll help me if you back up your answers with arguments as well.

1. How many tournaments should make up a season (keeping in mind that future shmupmeets will be held about every 6 weeks)?
2. Should the game being played each tournament be posted in advance, or should it be kept secret until the day of, ala STGT?
3. I definitely want this first event to be free, since it's just a test run, but in the future should there be an entry fee for the tournament? And if so, how much do you think would be acceptable? (Note that any money to enter the tournaments would go towards the tournament itself - to pay for prizes, upkeep, ect).
4. Should players be allowed to play more than 1 credit per tournament (as in, more than 1 run)?
5. Do you have any other concerns, either with the format, rules, or whatever?

[marus]

And to answer my own questions:

1. Four or five games a season should be good. That will make one season about half a year.

2. I think it'd be better to post the game in advance. For one, this will encourage people to practice the game at the arcade before the tournament date, which will bring in extra revenue to the arcade. Also, giving an opportunity to everyone to practice the game beforehand will mean that the skill level all around will be higher, which is good for the community as a whole (and is also good for spectators). The only argument I can think of for hiding the game is that it would "even the playing field", in that the winner would be based on overall shmup skill as opposed to who's best at a particular game, but if the game ends up being something that one person has played and no one else has, then everyone who hasn't played the game won't stand a chance. By revealing the game, even if a player already has considerable experience with a game, everyone else will still have up to six weeks to practice and catch up.

3. I'm leaning towards keeping the tournaments free, just because this is meant to be more of a casual thing, and anyways I don't think our scene is currently large or competitive enough to produce a good turnout if the tournaments cost money. On the other hand, if we did have an entry fee and still pulled in a decent turnout, we could have some pretty cool prizes, or at least a decent size pot for the winners, which in turn could help draw in more players.

4. I'm honestly not really sure about this. As far as running a smooth tournament goes, I'm worried that if we let people play 2 or 3 credits each, that the tournament will end up running overtime. Of course, I understand some people might want a "warm-up run", or want to go again if they got unlucky and had a bad run, but I don't want the tournament to run late into the night either.

[RNGmaster]

1. 4 games a season sounds fine.
2. Well duh, post in advance or we won't have time to learn the scoring systems. That's always what bugged me about STGT.
3. Yeah, let's keep it free. I don't know what kind of prizes we'd be offering anyway.
4. I understand the concern about running overtime, but at the same time only being able to play one run seems kinda weird. If we have multiple copies of certain PCBs, those games would probably be better candidates for tournaments, because we could get the tournament over quicker and there'd be less pressure on players.
5. Do we really have enough attendees for a "top 8" to work? I didn't see anyone taking attendance for the first meet, but I estimate about 20 there. That's pretty small attendance to run a good tournament.

[marus]

I understand the concern about running overtime, but at the same time only being able to play one run seems kinda weird. If we have multiple copies of certain PCBs, those games would probably be better candidates for tournaments, because we could get the tournament over quicker and there'd be less pressure on players.

I thought about getting multiple PCBs for a bit, but unfortunately I don't think that's financially feasible for most games. The other option would be to run the tournament on console, but that kind of eliminates the point of having the tournament at PG. I think with our current numbers, two runs would probably be okay even with just one setup. I'm just worried about what would happen when/if the event grows larger, or if we get more people than I expect.

Do we really have enough attendees for a "top 8" to work? I didn't see anyone taking attendance for the first meet, but I estimate about 20 there. That's pretty small attendance to run a good tournament.

I'm basing this off the fighting game scene, but top 8 point distribution is fairly typical for local ranking tournaments with anywhere from 16-64 players. Even if we had just 8-10 participants, I think it would work okay, but I can make the point distribution smaller if the tournament doesn't get a lot of interest.

[EPS21]

Wow, looks like this thing is quite a bit more elaborate than I thought it'd be! I figured some random game would be chosen and whoever has the highest score wins for the day, and that's it

Should we really do a game that people can practice/know about beforehand? I thought it'd be best to have a game most have little to none experience with so that one or more people don't have the advantage of having played it for a long time.

Hey Bobby, is our good friend Jeff going to loan us some PCB's again for next time? I think IBARA black label would be a good game to do our tourney on, since I'm certain none of us have ever played that before.

[marus]

Wow, looks like this thing is quite a bit more elaborate than I thought it'd be! I figured some random game would be chosen and whoever has the highest score wins for the day, and that's it

Well I typed out a lot, but aside from the point system it really isn't that different from what you just described. I just figured it's best to plan ahead to make sure everything is covered.

Should we really do a game that people can practice/know about beforehand? I thought it'd be best to have a game most have little to none experience with so that one or more people don't have the advantage of having played it for a long time.

I don't have a problem with using an obscure or hard to find game (I actually think that would be cool, since everyone would start on equal footing and it would broaden everyone's experience with different titles), but I still think giving people a chance to practice it beforehand would be best, like I explained above. Keeping the game hidden until the day of makes more sense for something like STGT, where you have a week to play and figure the game out, but I don't think it would work for something like this, where everyone will likely have only a few plays to figure out the system. Of course, if enough people disagree with me on this though, I'm fine with a different format. Also, I still haven't talked to Bobby much about this, so I don't know what his thoughts are on it (admittedly I may have jumped the gun by posting everything, since I don't know if he had ideas of his own... )

[RNGmaster]

So, what's the game gonna be? It's a week to the contest, and I have to troubleshoot MAME. I am eager to hear what punishment lies in store for me.

[marus]

Sorry, I've been slacking off. I'm going to send Bobby a message to make sure everything is good to go, then figure out what game we're going with.

Can we get a head count of who from here is coming, as well as who is going to be bringing equipment again? I'll have my XBox360 and stick like last time.

[RNGmaster]

I'm going to be there. One question - can we bring freeware shmups? I have the Crimzon Clover demo on me, and I could probably get Eden's Aegis and BWR. I don't know if there are computers there, but I don't think I could personally bring one.

[marus]

Ok, I just had a conversation with Bobby, and got everything squared away regarding the shmupmeet:

Pacific Northwest Shmupmeet Part 2!

• U-District Pink Gorilla Store + Arcade, University Ave N Seattle, WA 98105
• Satruday, October 2, from 2:00pm until when the store closes
  We don't know if Rob will be willing to keep the store open late like he did last time, so currently we should plan to finish by 9pm
• Play shmups and chew gum! And we're out of gum!

Same thing as last time, this event is open to everyone. If you have time then please feel free to stop by and hang out!

Pink Gorilla Website
Pink Gorilla Arcade Facebook page (includes game list)

Current list of equipment:
marus - JTAG XBox360, XBox360 stick (seimitsu)


And now for the big announcement: This week's tournament game will be...
.
..
...
.............................




Dangun Feveron! aka Fever SOS!
This is also the current game for this week's STGT, so those of you playing this week can show off what you've been practicing! Also, Bobby said that he'll try to get the board set up in the arcade either today or tomorrow, so you can come in and practice before Saturday.
Here are some resources to help you guys out:
shmups.com strategy thread
superplay.co-uk page

The format will be like what I posted above. Sign ups start at 2:00, tourney starts at 3:00 (I won't be too strict if you show up late and want to play, as long as we have a reasonable amount of time left - that being said, try to show up on time if you can). Everyone will play one credit and have their score recorded. After everyone has played, if there is time left we will let people do a second run if they like. Once everyone is done, everyone will be ranked based on their best score.

I don't think I forgot to mention anything, but I'll update this post if I did.

[marus]

Oh yeah,

One question - can we bring freeware shmups? I have the Crimzon Clover demo on me, and I could probably get Eden's Aegis and BWR. I don't know if there are computers there, but I don't think I could personally bring one.

It's really Bobby's call, but if there's room, and if someone brings a computer, then I think it'll be fine. A laptop would probably work the best, since that would take up the least room and be easy to work with. The main thing is we need to keep these meets lucrative for the store as well, and make sure that the cabinets get plenty of play.

[RNGmaster]

Oh Jesus, I have enough trouble surviving at that one. Annnnd my MAME copy won't run. Time to watch superplay videos obsessively.

[KevinDDR]

You know, it's not possible to see your final score unless you get in the top 5 on the machine records...

[marus]

You know, I didn't even consider that
But as long as someone is watching, they can write down the score after each stage and at game over.

[KevinDDR]

Except you can't because the stage score is all that's displayed and even then it disappears literally as soon as the continue timer appears. :G

[marus]

Grrr... alright, I'll think of something.

[RNGmaster]

Why don't we... just make it Top 5? Most shmups only have 5 high score slots (besides Mars Matrix).

[bobbyconover]

Hmm, this is a bit of a problem.. Top 5 would be OK but that kinda messes with our whole idea of keeping a running ranking of places throughout the various tournaments. Then again, being the first one (#0), it wouldn't really matter since it sounds like these results won't go on to factor into the overall standings?

Another idea would be to use Time Attack mode for the tournament. That would actually be really cool in ways, but it would obviously make for some very short games, so we would probably need to bump up the number of allowed attempts to 5 or so (or even make it unlimited) or the whole thing would be over in about half an hour.

It's a bit hard to work all of this out since there's no real precedent set for competitive, in-person, unemulated shmup playing. It might be rocky at first but we'll figure it out one way or another. I still think doing Fever first would be a good idea if at all possible, since I might be selling the PCB in the near future.

BTW, as for bringing PCs to the meet, the PG guys don't really want to go down that road just yet due to the potential headaches setting them up and such. A laptop would be fine if that's an option, but based on a few conversations I've had with others in the group, you (RNG) might be one of the only ones who is enthusiastic about the Doujin stuff? Also, this goes for all non-arcade stuff -- if bootlegs are a must, please try to be discreet, as this is an import game shop hosting our meet. We can't have burned discs and such sitting around in plain view. I'm not personally too uptight about it, but I know the PG guys take it really seriously!

[EPS21]

if bootlegs are a must, please try to be discreet, as this is an import game shop hosting our meet. We can't have burned discs and such sitting around in plain view. I'm not personally too uptight about it, but I know the PG guys take it really seriously!

Haha, sorry about that. Next time we'll do it in the back of the store/alleyway like a drug deal

How about instead of score for dangun, we just judge by whoever gets the farthest in the normal game? I doubt any of us can 1cc it anyways (I know I sure can't), seeing as getting in the high score table is pretty tough in the first place.

Also I'll be taking the bus up this time so at most I can probably bring is a stick, and maybe an lcd monitor if we really need it. Just can't haul that 50lb crt on a bus unfortunately!

[RNGmaster]

How about instead of score for dangun, we just judge by whoever gets the farthest in the normal game? I doubt any of us can 1cc it anyways (I know I sure can't), seeing as getting in the high score table is pretty tough in the first place.

Heed this man. He speaks wise words. I can't help but think of how many bombs and lives I've lost while playing DF, just so I can grab one of those dancing men.

Survival would be far more fun.

[marus]

Survival sounds like a good idea. In the case that more than one person ties for first place (by 1CC, or multiple people happen to die in the same place), then score will be the deciding factor.

The only weird thing will be keeping track of where everyone died to determine the full results, but it should be fine. Future tournaments will hopefully be planned out better to avoid stuff like this.

EDIT: Also EPS21, I'd really appreciate it if you could at least bring your monitor, unless someone else volunteers to bring one. I'll have my 360 and stick, so you could even leave your stick at home if you want. I don't expect there to be a large demand for 2-player shmuping (or shmupping? Stupid English).

[KevinDDR]

I will be there by 3:30.

[bobbyconover]

Well I was going to keep it a secret, but why bother? If it gets someone to come out who wasn't planning on it that's a good thing, so here's the latest news.. I just picked up PCBs of DFK, Pink Sweets, and Ibara Kuro for the meet today! So if anyone was on the fence about coming, hopefully this will push them over the edge.

Thanks again, so much, to our PCB donor!

[mesh control]

One of these day's I'll road trip up to Seattle and join you guys!

[EPS21]

Well I was going to keep it a secret, but why bother? If it gets someone to come out who wasn't planning on it that's a good thing, so here's the latest news.. I just picked up PCBs of DFK, Pink Sweets, and Ibara Kuro for the meet today! So if anyone was on the fence about coming, hopefully this will push them over the edge.

Thanks again, so much, to our PCB donor!

Cool, DFK again! Should've really studied those superplay vids some more, 2nd loop is so out of reach without knowing the silo mystery magic