Upcoming Cave arcade title (Akai Katana)

[emphatic]

How about they have a couple of characters to choose from when you start, 2 lolis, 2 ships. Or two game "modes". The exact same game, but sprites are changed from cutesy to mecha, dirt and macho military.

[moozooh]

And the music is changed from Namiki's generic j-sugar-techno to Lords of Thunder soundtrack.

[sh00g]

The more obscure, the better.

[Matsunaga]

Too bad it's not Galuda III.

[apple arcade]

How about they have a couple of characters to choose from when you start, 2 lolis, 2 ships. Or two game "modes". The exact same game, but sprites are changed from cutesy to mecha, dirt and macho military.

hhhhmmm i think you might like muchi muchi pork!

[Cuilan]

If you mean dedicated as in a separate chip, Cave has definitely used one for their DS II board. Running 3D on a CPU is just economically ineffective since GPUs at those clock speeds are not only almost an order of magnitude more powerful, but also dirt cheap.

No, that's not what I meant. The DSII board is using on-board video (a GPU built into the motherboard), which is inferior to a dedicated video card. On-board video would be more than enough for a hi-res 2D game, but since Cave is apparently switching their focus to full real-time 3D (at 480p and at a constant 60fps), on-board video is not enough for that.

[moozooh]

Yeah, it is "inferior" in the sense that no on-board graphics chip will handle antialiased Crysis at 1600x1200. On the other hand, both Xbox 360 and PS3 have their GPUs built into a motherboard, and both of them possess processing power far above whatever Cave will ever need for its games. This argument is largely misinformed.

Graphics cards as separate devices only have use in modular designs where manufacturers, assemblers, or consumers are supposed to be able to choose and mix hardware components, which is definitely not the case with game PCBs.

[Cuilan]

Yeah, it is "inferior" in the sense that no on-board graphics chip will handle antialiased Crysis at 1600x1200. On the other hand, both Xbox 360 and PS3 have their GPUs built into a motherboard, and both of them possess processing power far above whatever Cave will ever need for its games. This argument is largely misinformed.

Graphics cards as separate devices only have use in modular designs where manufacturers, assemblers, or consumers are supposed to be able to choose and mix hardware components, which is definitely not the case with game PCBs.

The problem is that Cave designed DSII with their arcade hardware in mind, arcade hardware that is basically composed of off-the-shelf PC parts, parts that are designed to run a complex OS alongside multiple applications. Whereas consoles are built with custom CPUs/GPUs designed for very specific tasks (excluding the first Xbox) and a stripped-down OS. If they went with a separate video card, DSII probably would have looked just as good as the the DS1 360 port running in 360 mode. I really don't see any other reason why DSII would look worse, other than Cave's arcade hardware not being powerful enough to handle DS1 HD-level graphics being rendered in real time while maintaining a good framerate.

And for what it's worth, most PC based arcade hardware (at least ones intended for 3D games) have separate video cards.

[drunkninja24]

Yeah, it is "inferior" in the sense that no on-board graphics chip will handle antialiased Crysis at 1600x1200. On the other hand, both Xbox 360 and PS3 have their GPUs built into a motherboard, and both of them possess processing power far above whatever Cave will ever need for its games. This argument is largely misinformed.

Graphics cards as separate devices only have use in modular designs where manufacturers, assemblers, or consumers are supposed to be able to choose and mix hardware components, which is definitely not the case with game PCBs.

The problem is that Cave designed DSII with their arcade hardware in mind, arcade hardware that is basically composed of off-the-shelf PC parts, parts that are designed to run a complex OS alongside multiple applications. Whereas consoles are designed with custom CPUs/GPUs designed for very specific tasks (excluding the first Xbox) and a stripped-down OS. If they went with a separate video card, DSII probably would have looked just as good as the the DS1 360 port running in 360 mode. I really don't see any other reason why DSII would look worse, other than Cave's arcade hardware not being powerful enough to handle DS1 HD-level graphics being rendered in real time while maintaining a good framerate.

And for what it's worth, most PC based arcade hardware (at least ones intended for 3D games) have separate video cards.

Doesn't DSII run on the Taito Type X2 (which is the same machine SF4 runs on)?

[croikle]

No, it's weird Cave-specific hardware. Similar idea though, in that it runs Windows.

[ChurchOfSolipsism]

Graphically, even Neo-Geo Pulstar & Blazing Star impress me more than DS II

What do you mean "even"....

[Kollision]

Well, it would be nice to be able to show the games to friends without having to go "no, it's fun, honest!"

People/friends do not give a shit about shmups. Be it military, loli or you-name-it themed.
I've long given up in trying to make people understand shmups. They see us as gaming freaks of nature.

[General Martok]

DSII runs on a Radeon HD3200 IGP , which is FAR slower than the Xbox 360.
The reason they use it is because it's the cheapest way possible to build a PC capable of running basic 3d gaming while providing hdmi output.
I have such a mainboard with the same igp in my htpc , it was only 40 bucks and that was like 1,5 years ago .

[Dave_K.]

Another horizontal game? I've had enough of Carne Asada. Wake me up when IKD is back in charge.

[GaijinPunch]

It's worth noting that Cave announced recently they are pulling out of the direct-arcade-hardeware-sales market which they *ONLY* did with DSII. Apparently their add-ons/rentals plan didn't work out for them. I'd say there should be an assumption that the game is not the same hardware as DSII, which means there's a fairly good chance it's not 3D either.

[Macaw]

Well man I hope your right.

Any word on a date for the location test?

[Van_Artic]

great news from Cave-STG about the game

-Danmaku type horizontal scrolling shooting game
-Hardcore military shooter
-Each ship has a pair of characters (pilot and gunner?) with specific attacks
-Each ship changes its attacks when you change "mode"
-The characters (enemies, allies, and others - all human) are quite diverse
-Ships are designed as hardcore, 1950s style retro mechas
-Game is designed around destructible objects and dodging bullets - the core elements of an enjoyable STG - rather than obstacles and topography. This gives it a refreshing feeling.
-It has been carefully developed for over 1 year.
-Release in summer/fall 2010

source: http://gfront.sblo.jp/article/39460871.html

[Macaw]

Damn for the first time since the first Deathsmiles I am excited for a Cave game.

-Game is designed around destructible objects and dodging bullets - the core elements of an enjoyable STG - rather than obstacles and topography. This gives it a refreshing feeling.

This is wierd though, this has been the case mostly for the last 15 years except in a couple of titles such as Ikaruga.

[Udderdude]

Damn for the first time since the first Deathsmiles I am excited for a Cave game.

-Game is designed around destructible objects and dodging bullets - the core elements of an enjoyable STG - rather than obstacles and topography. This gives it a refreshing feeling.

This is wierd though, this has been the case mostly for the last 15 years except in a couple of titles such as Ikaruga.

They are probably saying that because it's a hori.

[Slump]

Damn for the first time since the first Deathsmiles I am excited for a Cave game.

-Game is designed around destructible objects and dodging bullets - the core elements of an enjoyable STG - rather than obstacles and topography. This gives it a refreshing feeling.

This is wierd though, this has been the case mostly for the last 15 years except in a couple of titles such as Ikaruga.

They are probably saying that because it's a hori.

Heh, yeah. Probably Cave's way of reassuring us they're not planning on making an R-Type clone anytime soon. Who knew?! Always good to hear about another Cave release though. *Awaiting more details*

[BulletMagnet]

Sounds almost like a spiritual successor to Progear...interested to see what they do with it.

[cools]

Sounds almost like a spiritual successor to Progear...interested to see what they do with it.

Add lolis.

[moozooh]

There were lolis in Progear, except they were inside the crafts so we didn't see them. Maybe this time they'll be dangling outside or something…

[MX7]

Damn for the first time since the first Deathsmiles I am excited for a Cave game.

-Game is designed around destructible objects and dodging bullets - the core elements of an enjoyable STG - rather than obstacles and topography. This gives it a refreshing feeling.

This is wierd though, this has been the case mostly for the last 15 years except in a couple of titles such as Ikaruga.

They are probably saying that because it's a hori.

Yeah, horis tend to be more terrain orientated, verts more bullet oriented. Exceptions: Progear, Deathsmiles and Deathsmiles II

Sounds interesting! I'm not a fan of macho, wanky shooters, but in my head, this game is very pretty

[cools]

There were lolis in Progear, except they were inside the crafts so we didn't see them. Maybe this time they'll be dangling outside or something…

Maybe it'll be like Dangun and you'll have to collect them.

[AraraSPAMWitch]

the shmups forum: where every thread is about lolis

[Jockel]

[garrz32]

Well, it would be nice to be able to show the games to friends without having to go "no, it's fun, honest!"

People/friends do not give a shit about shmups. Be it military, loli or you-name-it themed.
I've long given up in trying to make people understand shmups. They see us as gaming freaks of nature.

Never a truer word spoken!!

[Subterranean Sun]

Sounds almost like a spiritual successor to Progear...interested to see what they do with it.

Add lolis.

Doesn't matter if it is Progear II.

[PC Engine Fan X!]

Sounds almost like a spiritual successor to Progear...interested to see what they do with it.

Add lolis.

Doesn't matter if it is Progear II.

Sounds like it could be the much anticipated Progear II sequel with the verbal clues given us. Or it could be an entirely new shmup IP from the ground up.

PC Engine Fan X! ^_~