What converter is needed to play NES games on Famicom AV?

[Rock Man]

Thinking about investing in a Famicom AV, which is the original Japanese version of the NES 2. I have nothing but American games, I've been using them on my raggedy old toaster NES. I'm thinking it's time for an upgrade.

My motives for collecting a better Nintendo.

1.) Play imports - Don't own any yet but soon will.

2.) Play unlicensed games - ^Same as above.

3.) Left and Right Audio - Unlike the regular Nintendo's Mono sound, Famicom AV does Stereo Left and Right.

4.) No ZIF method required - I don't have to keep inserting my carts like a VCR, bending pins and what not. Should fit like the SNES/N64 with lesser blowing and alcohol use.

5.) Better sound chip - Particularly for Konami and Capcom titles.

6.) Sleek looking controllers - Equally appealing as the SNES. Much better than NES IMO.

7.) 60-Pins > 72-Pins

It's time to put that old NES dog down and invest in getting a new Famicom puppy! So, what's the best converter out there that unlocks all region games for Famicom and Nintendo? Do these converters come with other purposes? I'd like to be able to use a Game Genie on it. Granted I haven't used a Game Genie since 1998 but it's always nice to have that option available.

[drunkninja24]

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 602_263622

There's probably others though if you look around.

[Ganelon]

I went this approach years ago to replace my classic Famicom. You already know the 60-72 pin converter so Google away. I don't know of any difference between the converters besides how much plastic encloses the PCB; I got my PCB version for $10 and recall fully enclosed converters at $20. Unfortunately, none of them have any other function.

[Rock Man]

Ah, I gotcha Ganelon. Thanks guys.

[Zapf]

I hope you didnt pay 35 for that already, stoneagegamer has the same one for $10 (its the one that came with the yobo). Do note that it doesn't work well with the av famicom - I had to put it in only halfway, or finagle with it for 5 minutes before I got it to work. There is a black one out there that works much better. However, with either one, I had problems with at least two games - Gauntlet and Castlevania III.

[Rock Man]

I hope you didnt pay 35 for that already, stoneagegamer has the same one for $10 (its the one that came with the yobo). Do note that it doesn't work well with the av famicom - I had to put it in only halfway, or finagle with it for 5 minutes before I got it to work. There is a black one out there that works much better. However, with either one, I had problems with at least two games - Gauntlet and Castlevania III.

One of the reasons why I desired an AV Famicom is to play my US Nintendo games easier. But if the converter makes it even worse then it hurts my reasoning.

Are there any other converters out there that would work with the AV Famicom? I'm looking for one without discrepancies.

[ZOM]

I don't have an AV famicom in my posession to test it, but I'm using a plain old black no-name HK converter on my famicom - it works good enough, but I'm not sure about CVIII either. Otherwise, I don't see why that one wouldn't work for an AV famicom... Are there any major changes from a famicom cartridge slot to an AV fami that would impede certain adapters to work different(or not work at all)??

[Zapf]

I dont really know, and I'm having trouble trying to find someone with an AV famicom, a converter, and CVIII to double check with. I know I've seen at least one video on youtube where a regular famicom, a converter and cvIII works (ill try to find it now), but it seems theres not a lot of people around with av famicoms or something. Which is weird because thats what I always see as the recommended model to get for top loading, av out, nes controllers, etc. The main problems it has are:

a) the intro movie does not appear (sound, but no video)
b) the cross at the title screen is corrupted (that appears next to start or password, whatever you're selecting
c) corruption on the name input and little beginning vid
d) screen turns black, no sound either

In my frustration and trying to figure out if a connection is not being made, I shifted the right side of the converter higher the the left side. I was able to get a heavily corrupted intro video, but thats it. Maybe its a pin thing on my end, but everything else I've tested works fine (even unlicensed bible games)

[Ghegs]

I dont really know, and I'm having trouble trying to find someone with an AV famicom, a converter, and CVIII to double check with. I know I've seen at least one video on youtube where a regular famicom, a converter and cvIII works (ill try to find it now), but it seems theres not a lot of people around with av famicoms or something. Which is weird because thats what I always see as the recommended model to get for top loading, av out, nes controllers, etc.

I think the problem in finding people with that combination is the game. I have an AV Famicom and a converter to play the few NES games I have, but I have Castlevania III as a Famicom version. No reason to get the slightly worse NES version when you have a Famicom to play the real deal with.

[Zapf]

Yeah, thats what most people reccomend to me =/ I will be getting it soon, I just want to have some closure on it...

[RGB32E]

Hmm... I think "we" need to get high quality converters made... so that cheap crap doesn't need to be dealt with... think Viletim's Arcade RGB amp!

I would think the highest quality fami to nes adapter would be the ones in Gyromite carts...

[ZOM]

I dont really know, and I'm having trouble trying to find someone with an AV famicom, a converter, and CVIII to double check with. I know I've seen at least one video on youtube where a regular famicom, a converter and cvIII works (ill try to find it now), but it seems theres not a lot of people around with av famicoms or something. Which is weird because thats what I always see as the recommended model to get for top loading, av out, nes controllers, etc.

I think the problem in finding people with that combination is the game. I have an AV Famicom and a converter to play the few NES games I have, but I have Castlevania III as a Famicom version. No reason to get the slightly worse NES version when you have a Famicom to play the real deal with.

True. I take Akumajou Densetsu over CVIII anyday. Don't care if it's less challenging, the big difference in music-quality makes more than up for it.

[Zapf]

Hmm... I think "we" need to get high quality converters made... so that cheap crap doesn't need to be dealt with... think Viletim's Arcade RGB amp!

I would think the highest quality fami to nes adapter would be the ones in Gyromite carts...

We are talkin the other direction, nes games on famicoms. There is a bare one called the family converter that seems popular, but I dont know where you can currently buy it. There there is the ones that came with yobo famiclones, those are cheap and readily available, but have really short pins on the famicom side, which makes for connection issues on av famicoms (I got it to work but its not optimal). The best one I've found is this clear black one - http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... K:MEWNX:IT fits well, works with everything I've currently thrown at it, minus cvIII and gauntlet, they even cared enough to wire it so the nes cart still faced you.

[Ed Oscuro]

I'm gonna take this space to note that the best converter to play NES games is an actual Famicom cartridge.

Now, NES games...for Castlevania, CV2, and CV3, I have the first on both systems as cartridge, the third on both systems (I'll play either version), and no copies of the second (I'd maybe take the second version) with no real regrets about that. Not a horrid game but it has never been on my list of priorities. There are a fair number of NES games that are far and beyond Famicom equivalents - like Jackal, and, uhh, The X (Skate, Ski) or Die series - and there are also a number of games only on the Famicom (quite a few Sunsoft ones) or otherwise not for the NTSC region. I don't feel it's been too big a commitment to have both systems, because the games take up much more space already.

Really, though, you can't beat the price of getting a NES for NES games. The things are still like $20. Reliability problems are overrated IMO. I've got two in perfect working order.

[Jockel]

I have an old-style famicom w/ av-mod and i'm going the ugly pcb route.
Things don't look pretty, that's for sure ;<
But at least it's working fine.

[ZOM]

ugly pcb route

I'm not sure if I'm familiar with it, can you elaborate?
I too have an original famicom with AV mod and I feel the urge to stick my soldering iron in it. deep in it.

[speedlolita]

Need the RGB chip from the PlayChoice 10 or something.

[ZOM]

Oh that one... nah, IMO it's not really needed for the famicom; It changes some of the colors a bit too much for my taste.

[Zapf]

I think he was talking about a bare pcb nes->fami adapter, nothing related to video output...

[Rock Man]

I'm gonna take this space to note that the best converter to play NES games is an actual Famicom cartridge.

Now, NES games...for Castlevania, CV2, and CV3, I have the first on both systems as cartridge, the third on both systems (I'll play either version), and no copies of the second (I'd maybe take the second version) with no real regrets about that. Not a horrid game but it has never been on my list of priorities. There are a fair number of NES games that are far and beyond Famicom equivalents - like Jackal, and, uhh, The X (Skate, Ski) or Die series - and there are also a number of games only on the Famicom (quite a few Sunsoft ones) or otherwise not for the NTSC region. I don't feel it's been too big a commitment to have both systems, because the games take up much more space already.

Really, though, you can't beat the price of getting a NES for NES games. The things are still like $20. Reliability problems are overrated IMO. I've got two in perfect working order.

I have atleast 15 NES games, most of which are 3rd party action titles. CV series is cool and all but I play NES games like TMNT 1-3, Mario Bros., Arkanoid, Darwkwing Duck, Mega Man, Captain America & Hawkeye and things like that. I'd like to upgrade from an NES to the AV Famicom. It's time I retired my toaster NES. It's served me well for years but let's face it the AV Famicom is better. I do not have any more room for game consoles. My space is already maxed out as I have over 16 systems, including the NES. There can only be one, if I get an AV Famicom then NES must go.

I do own a second NES but it's stored away. Both of which are in working order it's just that I get the annoying flickering from time-to-time. I'm fed up with cleaning NES games and systems. I'd like them to work like my SNES, N64, Genesis/32X, Master System where I only have to clean them a few times and BAM! They work.

Hmm... I think "we" need to get high quality converters made... so that cheap crap doesn't need to be dealt with... think Viletim's Arcade RGB amp!

I would think the highest quality fami to nes adapter would be the ones in Gyromite carts...

We are talkin the other direction, nes games on famicoms. There is a bare one called the family converter that seems popular, but I dont know where you can currently buy it. There there is the ones that came with yobo famiclones, those are cheap and readily available, but have really short pins on the famicom side, which makes for connection issues on av famicoms (I got it to work but its not optimal). The best one I've found is this clear black one - http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... K:MEWNX:IT fits well, works with everything I've currently thrown at it, minus cvIII and gauntlet, they even cared enough to wire it so the nes cart still faced you.

Damn! Someone bought it... aw well. Atleast I'll know what to look for in the future for when I get my stereo with superior controllers, zero matanaince, AV Famicom. Supposedly with the AV Famicom I won't have to clean it as much. If I can just pick up one of those black converters I'll have full access to my American games with a potential interest in imports.

Anyone know if that black box works for Game Genie?

[Ed Oscuro]

It's time I retired my toaster NES. It's served me well for years but let's face it the AV Famicom is better.

No. What are you basing this claim the A/V is better on?

I've played both recently on the same (decent) television, there's really no difference in my opinion. They even take the same controllers.

I don't think there's a "WAY THE GAME WAS MEANT TO BE PLAYED" issue with the NES, and maybe your mileage varies because of the NES reliability problems. I haven't had any to speak of. I don't think the A/V uses markedly different color generation than the NES...haven't compared. But neither strikes me as being out in front of the other.

[Rock Man]

It's time I retired my toaster NES. It's served me well for years but let's face it the AV Famicom is better.

No. What are you basing this claim the A/V is better on?

I've played both recently on the same (decent) television, there's really no difference in my opinion. They even take the same controllers.

I don't think there's a "WAY THE GAME WAS MEANT TO BE PLAYED" issue with the NES, and maybe your mileage varies because of the NES reliability problems. I haven't had any to speak of. I don't think the A/V uses markedly different color generation than the NES...haven't compared. But neither strikes me as being out in front of the other.

AV Famicom give me stereo sound and more comfortable controllers. The sound chip is better for select Capcom and Konami titles. When you insert a cart do to the zero force insertion methods absence, you won't run the risk of bending the pins under the black thing that the NES cart sits on. It's also less prone to corrotion. I still like the NES but I get tired after troubleshooting it for so long. My Genesis and SNES didn't have to be cleaned constantly... plus the extra L/R Audio and superb sound chip makes for an added bonus.

[Ed Oscuro]

AV Famicom give me stereo sound and more comfortable controllers.

Fake stereo (no such thing on NES / FC; you could just use a splitter to get fake stereo on the NES as well), and the controllers work fine on a normal toaster.

The sound chip is better for select Capcom and Konami titles.

Erm, are you talking about sound chips, or extended memory mappers? NES games don't use memory mappers that have extended sound generation capabilities (Japanese CV III -> VRC6; US CV III -> Nintendo MM5). If you're talking about the Famicom versions of those Capcom and Konami titles, sure, you need a Famicom to make use of the sounds; it's pretty pointless to buy Famicom games and then use a Honey Bee / Gyromite converter to play them badly on a NES. I wouldn't say to ditch the FC for FC titles, obviously. But I've never seen any evidence of enhanced sound from NES games on the FC, unlike the situation with the SMS. If anything I'd expect compatibility problems from using NES games on the FC.

I'll give you the reliability issues as a plus for the A/V, though unless you live in the sea I don't think corrosion is a major issue with the toaster.

Might as well run down the list in your OP:

1.) Play imports - Don't own any yet but soon will.

A given but I wouldn't toss my NES.

2.) Play unlicensed games - ^Same as above.

I'm not sure what you mean. The NES plays NES games; the FC plays FC games. There are pirates and unlicensed games for both - Sachen, Wisdom Tree, etc. (oh boy!) If its shell is in the shape of an NES cartridge (or roughly so) it'll play on the NES. In other words, a bullet point to extend the kind of obvious from point 1. But yes, many of the "famous" Contra "Hong Kong originals" should be considered to require a Famicom. Again no reason to knock out the NES.

3.) Left and Right Audio - Unlike the regular Nintendo's Mono sound, Famicom AV does Stereo Left and Right.

Noted before - I doubt that splitting the output from one RCA jack to both left and right inputs is going to weaken the signal level so far that you only get noise.

4.) No ZIF method required - I don't have to keep inserting my carts like a VCR, bending pins and what not. Should fit like the SNES/N64 with lesser blowing and alcohol use.

ZIF means Zero Insertion Force, and it's misapplied in this case. You have to press down firmly to get cartridges into either system. The NES just has a particularly terrible design for making pin contact. The FC pins will eventually wear out though, but in theory it should be easier to find replacements for or to service.

5.) Better sound chip - Particularly for Konami and Capcom titles.

No benefit to NES games as mentioned above.

6.) Sleek looking controllers - Equally appealing as the SNES. Much better than NES IMO.

You can use A/V FC controllers on the NES, and the Advantage works on both (I prefer the Advantage for many games...plus it keeps my A/V dogbones fresh The toploader NES controllers seem identical with their A/V Famicom counterparts; in any case, the people at Messiah are said to have made good NES compatible controllers. In short, thankfully on the FC and NES there is no special barrier to the search for the ultimate controller.

7.) 60-Pins > 72-Pins

Meaningless bullet point. You already cover the ZIF method so you've got reliability covered. There's nothing inherently better or worse in a lower or higher number of pins, from a player's standpoint. (More pins means slightly more current but when it's 72 versus 60, not much of a difference really). It's not the '90s, the "16-BIT," 64-bit, "The only TRUE 24-bit home console," etc. marketing-style gimmicks are no longer welcome.

Extra points for consideration:

You have to do some wacky stuff to connect a Zapper to a Famicom's expansion port since the A/V Famicom is missing two pins used by the NES to read the zapper! Go Go Cost Lowered Productions!

Game Genies probably open up a whole other realm of issues; Nintendo fought to knock them out of compatibility with newer releases of the NES (and subsequent consoles), and the differences between the NES and FC might be enough to make the Genie nonfunctional. I use a SNES Genie as a sort of ghetto region converter for many import games though.

The A/V Famicom does use less power than the NES - hardly noticeable unless you run bittorrent off the thing, but still there. 10V / 850mA for the FC adapter; and something like 9V / 1000mA+ for the NES.

[Rock Man]

Darn it Ed Oscuro! Your helping me is compromising my decision, lol. Now I'm not completely certain whether I desire a Famicom anymore. (Pretty much the mention of the Zapper and Game Genie is what's putting me off right now. I'm not 100% sure why though, I can't use the Zapper on my HDTV set. As said it's been atleast a decade since I touched the Game Genie. Still, I remembered how exhilarated I felt that 1 time I cheated on TMNT1 owining those annoying depth charges with the phasing code! What a wonderful feeling that was.

I already knew what ZIF stood for... even stated it in an earlier post but thanks for including the explanation I guess. Bullet points can be fun :p but I'll admit you were right, I had already asserted my stance on hardware reliability so I'll give you that one. When I commented on the sound chip, the general consensus was that I would be playing Japanese games to utilize it's key purposes. Again, I'm not a mega huge Castlevania person but I do think the games are okay. I was thinking of trying a couple out on the NES and if I did then I should pick up the Famicom editions so I'll own the superior versions, audio wise. Yes I like my fake stereo, but thanks to your input, I am now aware I can get it out of my toaster NES. I had no idea you could use AV Famicom controllers on NES. o_O The heck!?!?!! I'm so glad I asked around here. That about cuts my needs for a Famicom in half.

That's it my plans for picking up a Famicom are officially out the door! I can't tell you how grateful you have made me this day. You just saved me from potentially making a 100+ dollar purchase that I wasn't too keen on to begin with (The AV Famicom itself is a sleek looking piece of hardware, however the Ebay price tag is rather unattractive despite the FC's qualities). Factor in that I already have an NES plus power glove, Zapper, Game Genie and NES gains value.

Maybe I'll just buy some wd40 or something and pop the cartridge shells open to give them a thorough cleaning. I'll be picking up an RCA and video cable from Radioshack with the red and white sound plugs, might even fish out those AV Famicom controllers on Ebay while I'm at it. I'll just have to get over the troublesome hardware issues. This might turn out good for me after all since what this does is it frees up the money for me to pick up a VGA to HDMI converter for my Dreamcast, Time Crisis AV adapter for the PS2, and the Official Microsoft Brand Optical Audio + HDMI lead for my now bulky 360! At first I was considering sacrificing all for the Famicom this month coming up but not anymore!

Nintendo proved it's staying power, it will remain apart of my 16 family of console.

[Zapf]

I ended up just getting an nes 2 for a good price, its currently being modded for AV out (I still wanted toploading, bleh). The AV fami will just be shelved until I get some actual famicom games or an FDS.

I would probably recommend alcohol and a q tip over wd-40. I've also used brasso and some elbow grease to get the contacts really shining, but you shouldn't have to put that effort in unless theres some significant corrosion.

[Ed Oscuro]

Now I'm not completely certain whether I desire a Famicom anymore. (Pretty much the mention of the Zapper and Game Genie is what's putting me off right now. I'm not 100% sure why though, I can't use the Zapper on my HDTV set. As said it's been atleast a decade since I touched the Game Genie. Still, I remembered how exhilarated I felt that 1 time I cheated on TMNT1 owining those annoying depth charges with the phasing code! What a wonderful feeling that was.)

Glad to be of service, lol.

Some ideas on your predicament:

1.) I would get a A/V Famicom anyway, just to play Famicom games the "right" way. Most of the things you said were essentially true, but overstated as a replacement for the NES.

2.) I have heard many times that HDTVs, especially LCD screens, don't play nice with any kind of light gun. CRT televisions are the best for this.

3.) There are some light guns for the Famicom anyway - at the very least you can get a knockoff Chinese one; at best, there's the revolver-like Nintendo light pistol, or the Hyper Shot Gun (one has been languishing on eBay for a long time). I think that a few Konami games used them...maybe, or maybe I'm thinking of the eye-tracking glasses used for some other games.

[fanfamicom]

Yah! There's a HyperShot SUBMACHINE GUN for the Famicom @ Auction on eBay right NOW!


http://cgi.ebay.com/HyperShot-Famicom-S ... 335e7a47a5

[Arasoi]

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[Ed Oscuro]

Hey arasoi, is that gun compatible with anything else than Space Shadow? And what kind of connector does it use?

[Arasoi]

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