if u aim for hi score board:get used to record your replays.

[Aguraki]

Hi everyone,
I've lurked this forum for quite a while and recently got WOLFMAME to work and practicing donpachi as by now.
I'm the typical average player that have to practice a lot just to reach last stage of 1st loop and am happy with that.

After looking at the hi-score thread I realised that providing a record of your play was a good (and frequent) way to prove yourself and settle your score.

I started to record my runs this week and here what I've learnt:
There seem to be an added pressure while playing and I had a lot of troubles achieving the same moves I did without recording.
It's not easy.
I have no idea about why,but it is a fact for me.
Obviously its gonna be player dependent so take it for what its worth.
After more and more records I started to feel better and play better.

So here my advice for new players:record every of your complete runs.

ps:I use save states too but only since a week too so it wasn't the trigger here,though I advice playing a lot full runs as often as u can since a hi-score is never a part of a run but in its entirety.

Also I'd like to here about your experience recording runs and how you got your top score.

edit:title edited

[MathU]

I don't record my replays because I'm not obsessed with proving how great I am on the internet.

Here's some great advice for new players:
Don't get caught up in competitive high score elitism.
Seriously, this stuff only exacerbates how niche this genre is. You're scaring everyone away with that attitude.

You don't have to "prove" anything to anyone to enjoy playing for score, and you don't need to play for score in every game to enjoy it either.

[emphatic]

Each credit I start in Ketsui I use the "Record replay" option. I really love going back and watching all those "oh fuck, I didn't die right there" moments. Watching a super-play where the player knows the game inside out is very nice and all, but you loose all those lucky breaks that only dumb luck will give ya.

[Aguraki]

I don't record my replays because I'm not obsessed with proving how great I am on the internet.

Here's some great advice for new players:
Don't get caught up in competitive high score elitism.
Seriously, this stuff only exacerbates how niche this genre is. You're scaring everyone away with that attitude.

You don't have to "prove" anything to anyone to enjoy playing for score, and you don't need to play for score in every game to enjoy it either.

hummm your warm welcome for sure won't scary newcomers I guess...

[TrevHead (TVR)]

Allthough i dont bother recording myself I cant see anything wrong with making and sharing replays between the general gaming comunity In the spirit of helping everyone excel in a perticular shmup aslong as the person recording the replays remembers to have fun whiles hes doing it.

As for the Op feeling nervous while recording all i can say is that you will get used to it in time especially if u make a habit of making replays everytime u make a run. Although tbh i think feeling tense and nervous is just part of playing shmups (the spice of life goes the saying)

[CptRansom]

I think his advice to enjoy a game and not get hung up on proving your high score (which, if you're a new player, you're not likely to be getting scores you'd need to "prove" anytime soon) is much warmer to newcomers than telling them they should record everything to validate their accomplishment.

That extra 20 seconds to record a run adds up when you're someone like me who fucks up on stage 1 and resets 5+ times for every one decent run. That time adds up after a while.

Besides, I don't need replays to prove that I suck at Mars Matrix and should just quit playing shmups in general.

[Aguraki]

Ah I think I badly worded my thread,maybe I should change the title or something.
It was mostly aimed at players who'd like to figure on the score board.
Also I don't think complete noobs are coming in this forum tbh,and the competion aspect in this site and in shmups in general is huge actually since every shmup is clearable with endless credit feeding,but where's the fun?
(though I had fun playing some games even after credit feeding,its a bit like playing poker for playmoney).

I've read the thread about "niche genre" and one reason people are missing on the shmups is that there is a lot of competition aspect to enjoy them(competition begins as soon as u try to 1cc the game or at least try not dying frequently).
There is usually no scenario(not worthy one I mean) so what does it stay if u remove the effort to 1cc a game?Bom
Bombing all the way through doesn't make the game exciting,and I'll bet its for the majority of players out there.

In other games,the scenario and cinematic aspect,all combined,force a minimum hour of play(by now way this is a mark of quality by the way).
Without efforts,shmups are done in less than 40mins for most of them.

So maybe this thread wasn't titled well to begin with but you get the idea now I hope.

[BIL]

I've read the thread about "niche genre" and one reason people are missing on the shmups is that there is a lot of competition aspect to enjoy them(competition begins as soon as u try to 1cc the game or at least try not dying frequently).

It's been covered in there, several times.

[TLB]

You guys are kind of missing his point. It's kind of disappointing. He's giving advice to help newer players play better per run and improve their strategies for each game, and all he's getting is replies of "RECORDING REPLAYS IS ELITISM FUCK YOU ELITISTS YOU'RE KILLING THE GENRE NOBODY WANTS TO PLAY WITH YOU PEOPLE AROUND I DON'T NEED TO PROVE ANYTHING TO YOU SUCK A DICK".

Did you even consider his points before you wrote your responses? Try to realize that not all new players play "just for fun", and lots of newer people DO, in fact, like to play for score. A MAME-recorded replay is really nothing more than proof of your knowledge and ability to fake a replay, at worst. A MAME replay is far better used as a learning tool than a verification tool.

Personally, I think it's easier to scare someone off by saying, "Hey! Look at this game! It's twenty-five minutes long, let's credit-feed it! Alright, that was fun! Now what are we going to do with this fifty dollar game that we just played once?! :D LET'S PLAY IT AGAIN FOR FUN WITHOUT ANY REGARD TO THE GAME'S SYSTEM OR OUR ABILITY TO PLAY IT, IT'LL BE SO MUCH FUN!!!!!!!!" than it is to offer advice and encourage them to score/play a game well.

[TrevHead (TVR)]

I think some of the guys here just want you to have fun first and foremost and the way i see it if been competative is your way of having fun then good for you, shmups can be different things to different ppl, even if they are only credit feeding (although tbh i would try to "educate" credit feeders into playing shmups the so called right way)

I can see that making a seperate replay for every run woul;d grate on me very quickly especially if you repeatedly fuck up your runs on stage 1 untill u get your shmupping head on (like i do). How about just making one big recording of the whole session and to so that it doesnt get inthe way of u having fun, if u get a part u want to cut and save just fast forward and camstudio that segment.

[TLB]

Playing through a fuckup, even on the first stage, is one of the most common pieces of advice I've seen from top players. It's also a good way to get you ready for your next run. While you might not get as far into the game, where your credit ends will be a harder spot than where it begins.

As for having a shitton of game recorded, there's nothing really wrong with that. F10 works wonders. It's not like these runs need to be uploaded to verify that you fucked up on stage 1, they're for the player to watch himself and recognize the roots of his mistakes to make them easier to avoid in the future.

[PC Engine Fan X!]

For Aguraki,

Once you've played a certain game whether it be on a real arcade PCB or a port of the same name or even a PC doijin title enough times to know it forwards and backwards, you'll eventually hit a situation or barrier known as the "law of diminishing returns".

This "LoDR" situtation/barrier will reveal it's true nature many times over when you try to attempt to do a 1LC no-miss or even a 1CC session and fail. This happens to the best of the Japanese ace shmup players as well in their serious 1CC attempts.

On the classic Atari Klax puzzler game, I had devoted countless hours playing the NES Tengen version of Klax to trying to figure out how to play it in back in 1990-1991. I couldn't figure out how to play it properly until it hit me that the object of the puzzler game is to make use with the current tiles given to you and score as high as you can with them despite the tile bin holding a maximum of 25 tiles at best. What you do with your current tiles and how you cash them in is entirely up to you leaving you to devise some cool personal tricks up the sleeve to score "big time".

Of course, if you ever do get into "The Zone", no matter what the CPU throws at you, you can simply brush it off as it is merely child's play. It means devoting countless hours to master a single game until you truly know it inside and outside while developing some personal "tricks of the trade" to help you out in the process. The real cincher is that no two Klax gaming sessions are ever the same due to the randomness of the colored tile generator by the CPU. So you make do with whatever colored tiles are given to you at the current time to your own advantage. So by scoring with multiple Klax chains, huge scores are possible -- requires lots of planning & a bit of luck as well.

Remember the ol' Klax hint: Buy low, sell high? Makes perfect sense to cash in for lots of free points if it's doable on certain Waves. There is always the possibility of the CPU throwing too many tiles on the conveyor belt if you do end up taking too long to clear a given Wave. This is known as the 'Ramping Factor" which is selectable on the PCB version indeed.

When an Atari Games Klax cab finally appeared at my local arcade in the spring of 1994, I was prepared to try it out and see how I fared. On the average, I'd score over 2,000,000+ points easily on a single credit. That was until I decided one fine day in May of 1994 that I would try to see how many Waves I could clear on a single credit and managed to reach and finally beat Wave 100 on a single credit starting from Wave 1 (using the convienient Warp option when it was presented to me at the proper times). So with a score easily over 6,000,000+ points, a 1CC session on a Klax PCB is doable but you're looking at playing a single Klax game session that lasts anywhere from two to two & half hours of solid gameplay time alone with absolutely no breaks or pauses whatsoever (aside from the next Wave number appearing telling you what your goal is next). This is more gameplay time than your average arcade shmup 1CC session, of course. This 1CC 6+ million point score session on a Klax PCB was never properly recognized by my local arcade nor was it recognized by Walter Day of Twin Galaxies fame either but I had fun seeing if I could pull it off and did. There was a few instances of where I almost screwed up big time but managed to pull through in the nick of time as some Waves require super-fast reflexes and perfect timing to clear. One stupid and/or careless mistake & you're done for (especially on the Fast Tile Waves).

PC Engine Fan X! ^_~

[CptRansom]

You guys are kind of missing his point. It's kind of disappointing. He's giving advice to help newer players play better per run and improve their strategies for each game, and all he's getting is replies of "RECORDING REPLAYS IS ELITISM FUCK YOU ELITISTS YOU'RE KILLING THE GENRE NOBODY WANTS TO PLAY WITH YOU PEOPLE AROUND I DON'T NEED TO PROVE ANYTHING TO YOU SUCK A DICK".

Where does "After looking at the hi-score thread I realised that providing a record of your play was a good (and frequent) way to prove yourself and settle your score." mention self-improvement?

I read it as, "get used to recording your runs so that when you DO make the odd high-scoring run, you'll have the replay available and won't need to defend yourself as much". If I misread what he wrote in his OP, then I definitely apologize (EDIT: hell, he already came back and said that I misinterpreted what he said - so hey, I apologize). I'm also fairly certain that in my reply I mentioned nothing about recording replays being elitist, killing the genre, or anything else of the sort.

Personally, I think it's easier to scare someone off by saying, "Hey! Look at this game! It's twenty-five minutes long, let's credit-feed it! Alright, that was fun! Now what are we going to do with this fifty dollar game that we just played once?! LET'S PLAY IT AGAIN FOR FUN WITHOUT ANY REGARD TO THE GAME'S SYSTEM OR OUR ABILITY TO PLAY IT, IT'LL BE SO MUCH FUN!!!!!!!!" than it is to offer advice and encourage them to score/play a game well.

Again, I didn't see anyone saying credit feeding was the way to go. Where were you getting this information?

Playing through a fuckup, even on the first stage, is one of the most common pieces of advice I've seen from top players. It's also a good way to get you ready for your next run. While you might not get as far into the game, where your credit ends will be a harder spot than where it begins.

This was obviously directed at me... I know it's very common advice, but it doesn't mean I always follow it. Sometimes frustration just takes over and I end up resetting a few times in a row. Is it wrong? Sure. Should I try to stop in the future? Absolutely. Does that negate the fact that I'm doing it NOW? Nope. At least I recognize I'm in the wrong and I'm working on controlling it in the future.

[TLB]

You guys are kind of missing his point. It's kind of disappointing. He's giving advice to help newer players play better per run and improve their strategies for each game, and all he's getting is replies of "RECORDING REPLAYS IS ELITISM FUCK YOU ELITISTS YOU'RE KILLING THE GENRE NOBODY WANTS TO PLAY WITH YOU PEOPLE AROUND I DON'T NEED TO PROVE ANYTHING TO YOU SUCK A DICK".

I'm also fairly certain that in my reply I mentioned nothing about recording replays being elitist, killing the genre, or anything else of the sort.

Nah, that was MathU, who never hangs around chat long enough to play more In the Hunt with me, if you'll direct your attention a few posts up. He said all of that, and I'm going to kill his genre if he doesn't /j #shmups on a day when I don't work.

Personally, I think it's easier to scare someone off by saying, "Hey! Look at this game! It's twenty-five minutes long, let's credit-feed it! Alright, that was fun! Now what are we going to do with this fifty dollar game that we just played once?! :D LET'S PLAY IT AGAIN FOR FUN WITHOUT ANY REGARD TO THE GAME'S SYSTEM OR OUR ABILITY TO PLAY IT, IT'LL BE SO MUCH FUN!!!!!!!!" than it is to offer advice and encourage them to score/play a game well.

Again, I didn't see anyone saying credit feeding was the way to go. Where were you getting this information?

This was actually more directed at MathU again. It was really just a hyperbole on how most non-STG players tend to credit-feed through a game, say it's too short, and then bitch about how it's too expensive. Unless a newcomer has a reason to play the game after the first credit feed, they're going to walk away pissed or bored. If they want to clear it on a credit, they're going to have to improve, and looking at replays, particularly one's own, is a good way to do that.

Playing through a fuckup, even on the first stage, is one of the most common pieces of advice I've seen from top players. It's also a good way to get you ready for your next run. While you might not get as far into the game, where your credit ends will be a harder spot than where it begins.

This was obviously directed at me... I know it's very common advice, but it doesn't mean I always follow it. Sometimes frustration just takes over and I end up resetting a few times in a row. Is it wrong? Sure. Should I try to stop in the future? Absolutely. Does that negate the fact that I'm doing it NOW? Nope. At least I recognize I'm in the wrong and I'm working on controlling it in the future.

I can see that making a seperate replay for every run woul;d grate on me very quickly especially if you repeatedly fuck up your runs on stage 1 untill u get your shmupping head on (like i do). How about just making one big recording of the whole session and to so that it doesnt get inthe way of u having fun, if u get a part u want to cut and save just fast forward and camstudio that segment.

PLAY GAMES WITH ME MATHU

[Ed Oscuro]

After looking at the hi-score thread I realised that providing a record of your play was a good (and frequent) way to prove yourself and settle your score.

I think what you mean here is "prove you can play well to yourself." It is pretty rare that there are any claims of score falsification, and those generally are at rarified levels of skill.

Not to be an 'elitist' but many people have difficulty taking anyone seriously who uses "u" in place of "you" when writing something seriously. Unless you are the world champion #1 player of some cellphone game that only works on an ABC DEF keyboard that you also have to post to the Internet from, please.

So here my advice for new players:record every of your complete runs.

As Bil says, this has been covered; I'm not going to question your scores, but I think it's kind of strange to think that people here are looking for advice from somebody who we honestly don't know has advice worth giving. This is better left as an open-ended discussion.

My $0.02 as somebody who hasn't proven themselves, but has made some observations regarding their own play and those of others:

There are different levels of improvement; you can improve a little by some methods, but other methods can improve a player a lot. A newbie frankly may not know the difference between poor and worthwhile improvement methods, and may consider that shooting games are not fun if they attempt to play them "seriously" one way or another. If I had to record a savegame manually every time I went to play a game...set up a second monitor by an arcade game and then a camera on a tripod...it could become a chore.

Recording scores at the beginning probably will not help some, probably most, players much; I've tried it, and the extra setup time and aggravation on messing up only slows me down, and it also reinforces the (negative in my opinion) tendency to quit after every little mistake. It is an artificial (and distracting) way to attempt reinforcing the focus on good playing that is already provided by the score counter. As was said before, playing through mistakes is a good way to learn what the game responds to your actions, and how you will respond to it; you can find unexpected things this way, instead of trying to play exactly the same way every time.

My favorite method, above playing through mistakes (depending on the game; many of the older style shooters I play profit from the "keep playing" method), is to use savestates to play and replay segments segments I have difficulty with so that I become okay at them, and then I try to play from the beginning through them later on. Yeah, it's also artificial, and it's not always possible, but it saves time. I generally prefer to play through the beginning and go as far as I can but that's not always practical (and sometimes the beginnings of games bore me if I wear them out).

Shooting games are not like an RPG where you have a map to explore and lots of things that you might not be able to see in the first play, but all the same many games in the genre allow different styles of play to be successful, so it's worth exploring.

tl;dr

hey guys I had four posts here and a long history of lurking (not long enough to find the search function) therefore i have good ideas

[Aguraki]

u're the king

[ncp]

screenshots are fine, learn to play

[TrevHead (TVR)]

Not to be an 'elitist' but many people have difficulty taking anyone seriously who uses "u" in place of "you" when writing something seriously. Unless you are the world champion #1 player of some cellphone game that only works on an ABC DEF keyboard that you also have to post to the Internet from, please.

hehe I do that aswell (plus i cant spell for shit)

(EDIT) oh and about making every credit count I too have a habit of restarting repeatedly untill i start playing with no fuck ups. Ive found that since ive started playing DDP and other arcade shmups im having to change my ways somewhat since its so easy to fuck up from start to finish that ive found that resetting all the time i rarely get past stages 2 or 3 during a session that that just isnt much fun. In the past i could get away with ressetting because playing mostly doujin and indie shmups i would fucked up a lot less once i had praticed a stage.

[Icarus]

I've been recording replays for many years now, and its as much a habit as automatically picking Score Attack Mode for the single-credit only play over Normal Game, and using savestates and Training Modes to practice later stages. In fact, when I started out recording, I was a novice too, and still am in some respects.

I find making replays useful in both a self-learning sense, and a teaching sense, as I often distribute my stuff to the public through various places such as super-play.co.uk and YouTube, and make them part of my player guides. I find if people can see the techniques I discuss, it makes it easier to understand. I demonstrate better by doing anyway.

If you're already getting into the habit, then well done, it's a decent habit to have, but only if you learn to use it efficiently. If you're a novice, it better to learn good observation first, some good safe strategies second, and then record and use replays to refine your strategies once you start to develop confidence with a game. You should probably take a look at this thread if you're serious about improving your play, too.

[Ed Oscuro]

u're the king

It doesn't bother me, lurn2rede

If you're a novice, it better to learn good observation first, some good safe strategies second, and then

Winner.

[Aguraki]

You should probably take a look at this thread if you're serious about improving your play, too.

eheh I saw it and read it already,good stuff there-)

[Keade]

I think it's a shame not more people record their games (look at the scores here, then look at the best shmups replays scores at MARP, they are kind of disappointing) but there is no rule, so many people choose not to record. In many cases, I suppose it's because people play the original games and not an emulated version, though ...

[TrevHead (TVR)]

I think it's a shame not more people record their games (look at the scores here, then look at the best shmups replays scores at MARP, they are kind of disappointing) but there is no rule, so many people choose not to record. In many cases, I suppose it's because people play the original games and not an emulated version, though ...

I agree, even for DDP there isnt that many replays for the CS shot type and other shot types.

[Dave_K.]

So here my advice for new players:record every of your complete runs.

I think this is good advice, and something I wish I started doing from the very beginning. Recording my runs now, I find myself too self conscious, and end up restarting more often, and generally making more mistakes, defeating the purpose of using replays to get better. Sure its something I'll get used to and feel more comfortable with over time, but the point is I wish I started doing this a long time ago.

[gs68]

I try to ignore scoring in Ikaruga, only to onechain my way to a ragequit.

[Keade]

Recording my runs now, I find myself too self conscious, and end up restarting more often, and generally making more mistakes, defeating the purpose of using replays to get better. Sure its something I'll get used to and feel more comfortable with over time, but the point is I wish I started doing this a long time ago.

I don't think recording your runs can make you much better. It can help you spot errors you make faster, but if you watched other players replays before, you probably have a valid "strategy" already.
Of course, I've the restart problem too, when recording on the occasion of a competition : the first big mistake I make, I want to restart.
I fully agree with m3tall1ca there : one early mistake shouldn't make you restart the game. Easier said than done, though
Better record only a few games from time to time, like once or twice per session, imho, unless you've reached your top level on the game and feel pretty confident already.

Anyway, I think savestates can help lots more than recording every run : they save considerable amounts of time.

[CptRansom]

I try to ignore scoring in Ikaruga, only to onechain my way to a ragequit.

First stage is pretty easy to chain with just a little practice. As soon as I get to the beginning of stage 2, all chaining effort goes out the window. I hate that shit.

Of course, I've the restart problem too, when recording on the occasion of a competition : the first big mistake I make, I want to restart.
I fully agree with m3tall1ca there : one early mistake shouldn't make you restart the game. Easier said than done, though
Anyway, I think savestates can help lots more than recording every run : they save considerable amounts of time.

I decided yesterday that I wasn't going to restart anymore, and the difference is remarkable. There's something about only having one life in a place where you normally have three that just really kicks your mind into high gear.

Save state and single-stage practice is AMAZING and I wish I started doing it months ago when I first started.

[Gungriffon Geona]

I started recording my runs of TFIV the other day since I haven't attempted to in quite awhile. after awhile you just sorta forget that it's recording so the game goes pretty easily. still need to get back in the groove though, as I only made it as far as metal squad on my first try D;

[Aguraki]

I think this is good advice, and something I wish I started doing from the very beginning. Recording my runs now, I find myself too self conscious, and end up restarting more often, and generally making more mistakes, defeating the purpose of using replays to get better. Sure its something I'll get used to and feel more comfortable with over time, but the point is I wish I started doing this a long time ago.

yep and this is quite a weird feeling right

Of course, I've the restart problem too, when recording on the occasion of a competition : the first big mistake I make, I want to restart.
I fully agree with m3tall1ca there : one early mistake shouldn't make you restart the game. Easier said than done, though
Better record only a few games from time to time, like once or twice per session, imho, unless you've reached your top level on the game and feel pretty confident already.

Well surely you can chose how and when to record your runs,my point was just as Dave.K said too,that you its not as easy as it seems to get used to the recording.
I mean since I record my runs I do mistakes and horrible moves where before it was a breeze,and that just because of that unexplainable reason(I know that must sound silly).
But the more I record my runs and the better I'm doing and forgetting I'm recording them.

Also I use save states too as I have said before,and clearly that didn't influence my game when I started recording runs,since before I used save states I wasn't recording too and did full runs without recording(started both at the same time when I got WOLFMAME).

I'm also playing all my lives usually(expect if I die early in stage one) as it is a good practice.

[TrevHead (TVR)]

I tried recording myself yesterday and found that like everyone else i fucked up allot more but because i cant use savestates to quickly restart without having to restart a new recording It forced me to stop restarting and make every credit and live count.