Sony = WTF?

[Skykid]

So finally I've got a reason to turn on the PS3 as I'm sitting with a copy of Lost Planet 2 and it's begging me to play it.

I turn on the machine, ignore the system update icon (it's there every time I turn it on these days) and start playing.

Then I have to install the game, takes about 20 minutes (seriously, something wrong right here but that's a different thread), I go to play it and it's like "yo fuckstick, if you don't update, no online shenanigans for you" (or something to that effect.)

I go to update and then it tells me the update will wipe out the functionality of installing another operating system such as Linux - forever!

What the fuck? What if that feature yields some kind of fruit in two years time, what if some bright spark writes some amazing code for something really cool, or hackers turn the system into the most powerful emulation tool on earth - I don't want to miss that party.

But if I don't update, I ain't playing online today.

Seriously, this is a downgrade, as mentioned in the amusing comments in this official sony thread:

http://blog.us.playstation.com/2010/03/ ... nt-page-4/

I have no idea what Sony are doing. What next? Downgrading Blu Ray functionality?

Ceph once wrote something sarcastic about Sony 'walking on crutches after all that shooting in the foot'. I'm beginning to wonder if someone should send them a wheelchair.

[handsome_rakshas]

My PS3 stopped reading discs altogether 10 minutes after I installed that update. I was watching The Killer on Bluray and it died, maybe it was just it's time to go.

[Cuilan]

or hackers turn the system into the most powerful emulation tool on earth

That's one of the main reasons why Sony released this update. Someone found a way to hack the hypervisor through the Other OS function.

[PC Engine Fan X!]

Here's my thread regarding updating your PS3 to fw version 3.21 that loses the ability to install and/or use another OS: http://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.ph ... 93#p567193

PC Engine Fan X! ^_~

[Skykid]

My PS3 stopped reading discs altogether 10 minutes after I installed that update. I was watching The Killer on Bluray and it died, maybe it was just it's time to go.

Some chap at work was waving his ps3 across the office at me and doing the 'neck slicing' motion to signify its death. He went to see someone who said they may be able to fix it, but no dice apparently.

But PS3's die lots, that's another story. My second one is running fine at the mo, but it's the threatening to remove functionality that's really annoying me.

That's one of the main reasons why Sony released this update. Someone found a way to hack the hypervisor through the Other OS function.

Ah right. Hyperwhat?!

[UnscathedFlyingObject]

Have you ever used Linux on the PS3 or planned to do so? It's one of those weird features Sony put in that about .001 percent of people used so no big deal. And let's be honest, how many people have a Linux box to play games? I use Linux and all the emus and stuff in the software repositories are old and some don't even work correctly. My Linux box is mainly for work and browsing on the net, which are things better done on a PC.

[Elixir]

Updating Disgaea 3 made my save invalid. I wouldn't mind if the PS3 updated with an ability to disable other people's mics/headsets by default, because the headsets for PS3 seem to have intense clarity to the point of hearing every cough, sniff, and movement inside a person's room. I can't even mute them individually, since I don't know who's using a mic, and the usernames don't always appear in the "players met" list.

[ZOM]

Hyperwhat?!

The Hypervisor is that annoying "guy" in the PS3 OS who monitors all data-operations that go in & out from Linux, and prevents some "unwanted" functions to work - such as accessing the nVidia GPU or other secured hardware from linux. In short: It's a watchdog.

[Specineff]

@ UFO: Thing is, that Sony disables most of the GPU and CPU cores when using Linux. Enabling those within Linux would turn the system into a monstrous machine prime for emulation and open source programs, of course. Since that, and Arrr-ing games would be detrimental to Sony's business, they are promptly cockblocking it. (Which is reprobable. Not a single infringing application has been written so far.)

I heard there are ways to update without losing the Linux option, though.

[Skykid]

I don't know if I'd ever have a real use for Linux on the PS3, I'll admit. At least, there's nothing it's being used for yet that makes have to have it setup. But in future, who knows?

But it's the principal of it - why downgrade the system? It even removes disk partitioning as an option.

[Taylor]

Because it was going to be a huge backdoor into piracyville. It was the same guy who opened up the iPhone (of course he condemns piracy in the strongest terms!)

[antron]

I'm waiting for a class action lawsuit.

[UnscathedFlyingObject]

@ UFO: Thing is, that Sony disables most of the GPU and CPU cores when using Linux. Enabling those within Linux would turn the system into a monstrous machine prime for emulation and open source programs, of course. Since that, and Arrr-ing games would be detrimental to Sony's business, they are promptly cockblocking it. (Which is reprobable. Not a single infringing application has been written so far.)

I heard there are ways to update without losing the Linux option, though.

I'm not even talking about emulation on the PS3 (tho it'd probably apply too.) I have Ubuntu on my PC and the software in the official repositories are antiques. I have a GBA emu right now that is dated 2004, crazy.

[jonny5]

slims never had it....probably eliminating it so they dont have to worry about different firmware updates for the different models down the line

meh....frees up some more drive space for movies (pretty much all i use my ps3 for)

[lilmanjs]

Sony hates the homebrew community and it sucks. they release updates just so nobody can have any fun.

[kernow]

They don't hate the homebrew community, its just homebrew always leads to piracy. The removal of the disk partitioning tool is trivial also because it was only used for the Linux install.

The Linux support was initially for home development, or homebrew as you will and also cheap CELLBBE development, hence why it never had or needed RSX support. I guess in some ways the Linux support was also added to deter hacking the XMB but they obviously underestimated teh hackers.

If you were a company trying to make money I imagine you'd probably do the same thing, I mean they are being very cautious since its still impossible to load copied blu ray software on a retail system due to not knowing either software or hardware encryption keys. It was going to happen eventually though. I did potter around with it for a while, but in the end I was glad to get my 10GB back really. Cell development was beyond me despite trying.

In short, yeah it sucks its gone but if you never used it in the first place, no big deal.

[Elixir]

Sony hates the homebrew community and it sucks. they release updates just so nobody can have any fun.

If Sony didn't keep updating, everyone would pirate PSP and PSN games. They wouldn't make any money. The PSP would end up pulling a Dreamcast all over again, having developers not want to create stuff for the PSP, and instead aim for working together with a different console.

[UnscathedFlyingObject]

They should make up for the removal of Linux support with PS2 game support.

Now, that's a deal.

[antron]

del

[Skykid]

They should make up for the removal of Linux support with PS2 game support.

This. I still consider the early removal of backwards compatibility to be a serious error on Sony's part.

If Sony didn't keep updating, everyone would pirate PSP and PSN games. They wouldn't make any money. The PSP would end up pulling a Dreamcast all over again, having developers not want to create stuff for the PSP, and instead aim for working together with a different console.

?

But the PSP has been hacked to shit regardless of the updates. It must be the most hacked console ever, the homebrew community have practically turned it into an entirely new machine!

[Specineff]

And I myself have done the right thing and bought the actual games on UMD to support the developers. I do rip them to the memstick to avoid wearing down the drive, but I've already paid for the discs.

Being able to play CPS1, Neo Geo, Genesis and NES games on the go has been a blessing made available only through custom firmware.

[CMoon]

Am I the only one wondering how Skykid got a copy of Lost Planet 2 three weeks before street date?

[Elixir]

But the PSP has been hacked to shit regardless of the updates. It must be the most hacked console ever, the homebrew community have practically turned it into an entirely new machine!

So you think Sony will stop updating one of their online-compatible devices because people keep hacking it?

[Skykid]

Am I the only one wondering how Skykid got a copy of Lost Planet 2 three weeks before street date?

Magic.

I'm quite enjoying it too, although I have a few reservations about the way the campaign has been designed.

[Taylor]

But the PSP has been hacked to shit regardless of the updates. It must be the most hacked console ever, the homebrew community have practically turned it into an entirely new machine!

Which is exactly why Sony reacted like this when people started finding exploits for the PS3.

[kernow]

The wii has been busted open pretty much too. Not that anyone erm cares.

[UnscathedFlyingObject]

What saves Nintendo's ass is that the Wii audience tends to be clueless people.

[Ex-Cyber]

But the PSP has been hacked to shit regardless of the updates. It must be the most hacked console ever, the homebrew community have practically turned it into an entirely new machine!

Which is exactly why Sony reacted like this when people started finding exploits for the PS3.

The reaction doesn't actually make any sense, though. The removal of Other OS doesn't actually stop anyone from hacking the system. The people who want to do hardcore hacking will simply not install any new firmware, just like 360 hackers when the Free60 team announced the JTAG hack and its corresponding patch. Furthermore, since the whole point of the exploit is that it exploits the hypervisor itself by fiddling with the hardware, the ability to run user code under Linux is not central to the vulnerability. There's no reason to think that the vulnerability is actually gone even in PS3s that are running 3.21; the easiest generally known method of triggering it has been disabled, but that doesn't mean that there aren't harder ways to do it.

[zaphod]

When the PS3 first came out, it has a lot of featured added in specifically to stop people from hacking it by giving them carrots.

OtherOS was created to let the homebrew people do something without needing custom firmware.

Regional restrictions were removed to stop the importers from needing to use modchips.

And so the homebrew people limited their hacking efforts to responsible hacking.

Then Sony goes and removes OtherOS from the slims.

At this point, the homebrew hackers go "Oh, it's ON!" and decide that Sony violated the agreement, and started hacking.

[Taylor]

The people who want to do hardcore hacking will simply not install any new firmware, just like 360 hackers when the Free60 team announced the JTAG hack and its corresponding patch.

But the vast majority of people have updated, so when they do find something that allows piracy everyone else has moved.

The PSP was ruined (for Sony) because of hackers, they're not going to let the same thing happen to the PS3. I'd prefer they took the stance of "okay, that was a warning, but if you try that shit again it's going" rather than lancing it immediately, but you can understand if their stance was a little bit more hardcore.