Hardware tips for Classic game players.

[Pixel_Outlaw]

Here are some little cheats that I have found for various consoles and such to make them a bit more affordable. Please share your own, include things that help you stick it to the man.

1. When using component video you can substitute *any* well made RCA cables for the special Red,Green and Blue. This means that you can use the old red and white cables normally for sound even! The only difference between standard RCA cables and the overpriced component cables is that the component cables may offer a bit more shielding. If your player is 3 feet from the TV however, this may not be a problem. Remember the longer the cord the more interference you may pick up. Recycling your old RCA cables IS an option just try to keep the distance at a minimum. You can use ANY color RCA cable inplace of the costly component cables, just be sure you match the inputs to the outputs. Those 6 dollar RCA cables do the same thing as the 30 dollar component cables, they just might be less shielded.

is the same as

2. If you need to hook up your NES or Atari 2600 or other system to a modern TV try using an old VCR. Many older VCRs had the screw on F connector to accept cable. This means that you can connect your old NES to that and then use the component or composite output from the VCR to connect to your television. The VCR may have an "RF Modulator" which will convert your old F connector signal into composite or maybe even S Video. Converting a low quality signal to a higher quality signal will now raise the quality but it will let you get that old Atari 2600 onto your new flat screen. Using the modulator in a vcr you own might be cheaper than purchasing a dedicated RF modulator.

Here you can hook in your Atari 2600 and output to a more supported signal (S Video or Composite)


3. Look for AV cables that support multiple systems. Since you will only be playing one console at a time if you want to save money you can purchase cables that connect to multiple consoles and also put out different kinds of video. If you go over to a friends house you will be prepared to use either composite or S Video if they have it. Some of my friends only have composite video connections, so I have a cable that outputs to multiple video types.



Systems with like plugs
SNES, N64, Gamecube (If you get a cable with one of these plugs you can use all these when needed)
PS1,PS2,PS3 (if you get this plug on your cable you can use all these)

*Note* The NES does not require special plugs, you simply connect it with RCA cords.

4. If you would like to play your MAME games on a large screen TV but don't have an HDMI output on your laptop you can purchase a device that will let you go from VGA to composite and S Video. These little devices will only output up to 800x600 which is plenty considering the lower resolution MAME games play in. If you pari a laptop computer with a few USB controllers you can get a PORTABLE MAME device to take to a friends house. If you need a USB controller you can buy multiple adapters that will convert your ps1/ps2/N64 controllers for use with a computer. They work very very well.

Here is a link to my hacked together MAME laptop, complete with adapters for video and controllers.
http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=2 ... 7910bfc3f1


5. Keep all your systems hooked up at once if you like. This is not really a money saving tip but it is nice to have 4 or more systems hooked to the TV at once. If you are a classic game enthusiast like myself it gets frustrating to hook up consoles each time you want to play them. I only have 1 set of RCA sockets in my TV so I connect all my consoles to a switch box and just hit the button to select what console I want to play. If you only want to connect 3 systems via composite video you can get a Chinese switch on eBay for about 6 dollars. I've seen them in 2.3.4.5 and 8 port varieties.




6. Visit local pawnshops and thrift stores for cables if need be. I have gotten a fair amount of A?V equipment for a song. Buying cables second hand is a great option to save money. Thrift stores are usually filled with A/V cords that they want to get rid of. Call a few pawn shops and thrift stores before shelling out money for products that do the same thing.

I know that some of this is well known but some of it is very useful. Please feel free to share your own money saving tips for gaming if need be.

[PC Engine Fan X!]

The pic with the various video outputs including both composite video & S-Video looks like the back of a Sony S-Video VCR, right?

Interesting that Atari Corp. would endow it's Atari VCS (aka th e 2600) with RF box setup and not a dedicated composite video output. This same RF Box output are in found in the 5200, 7800 & XE consoles as well.

Even NEC included an RF Box with it's TurboGrafx-16 console. You had to buy an optional NEC Turbo Booster/Turbo Booster Plus accessory if you wanted to upgrade to composite video with stereo L&R outputs.

Some of the older dedicated DVD recorder machines like the ones from Sony have the option of upconverting S-Video signal to component video output in 480p instead of 480i.

PC Engine Fan X! ^_~

[iatneH]

To take things one (admittedly large) step further, hack a common A/V pinout (or even plain S+RCA jacks) onto all your consoles.

[PC Engine Fan X!]

Interesting to see how an Amiga 1080 monitor can accept S-Video but it has to be broken into two seperate video inputs (circa January of 1986): Chroma and Lumina. It wasn't until a bit later that it was all merged into one single S-Video input jack for easy & convienence with the emergence of the S-VHS type of VCRs and S-Video capable TV monitors.

I recall seeing the prices for a single blank S-VHS tape (about $14-$16 each) and thinking that they were too expensive compared to a regular blank VHS tape.

PC Engine Fan X! ^_~

[Pixel_Outlaw]

The pic with the various video outputs including both composite video & S-Video looks like the back of a Sony S-Video VCR, right?

PC Engine Fan X! ^_~

It is an image I found. I might replace it with a better one. I just know that many people became frusterated when they tried to play the old Atari 2600 console on modern displays such as projectors that had no RF connector. The 2600 sends out an RF signal but it requires an RCA plug. Most devices that accept this type of signal require the screw on type.

You can use one of these to get the video from the Atari 2600 to RF then go from that into a VCR with video in/out to get to S Video or Composite.

[PC Engine Fan X!]

Thanks for that handy tip, pixel outlaw. I'll have to head on down to my local Radio Shack and see if they carry that cool RF signal to Video output convertor plug.

Ah, but that brings up another issue...how do you get sound extracted as well (considering that the 2600/5200/7800/XE were all mono sound-output to begin with)? It was both video and sound going through the RF Box anyways. Sounds like a hack is in order to get both composite video and sound outputs at the PCB level with the classic Atari gaming consoles.

I have to assume that most CRT-based TV monitors sold back in the late-1970s/early-1980s had the single RF input so that is why Atari Corp. went with the RF Switchbox setup for it's early gaming consoles. It wasn't until the early 1980s that the more expensive dedicated CRT-based TV monitors came with the RCA composite video input/output jacks.

You might recall when the 1st-gen PSX console came out, it used a specialized Sony made RF Box adapter that was powered internally by 5v (which converted both composite video and mono sound output to RF signal format). The 2nd-gen Sony PSX RF switchbox adapter did away with the 5v input and plugged into the PSX's A/V port instead.

PC Engine Fan X! ^_~

[Ex-Cyber]

I have to assume that most CRT-based TV monitors sold back in the late-1970s/early-1980s had the single RF input so that is why Atari Corp. went with the RF Switchbox setup for it's early gaming consoles. It wasn't until the early 1980s that the more expensive dedicated CRT-based TV monitors came with the RCA composite video input/output jacks.

That seems right. The oldest game console I know of with a composite output jack is the NES, and I don't think the jacks were very common on new sets until the late 1980s / early 1990s, so even systems like Genesis and SNES shipped with an RF switch as the standard output method since most people still had RF-only TVs. If memory serves, even the Neo-Geo AES shipped with one.

[Pixel_Outlaw]

Ah, but that brings up another issue...how do you get sound extracted as well (considering that the 2600/5200/7800/XE were all mono sound-output to begin with)? It was both video and sound going through the RF Box anyways. Sounds like a hack is in order to get both composite video and sound outputs at the PCB level with the classic Atari console.

Correct. The little hack divides the RC signal coming out of the 2600 into 2 parts, the sound and the video. The Atari 2600 does not come with the standard RF connector. Therefore you need the little metal fitting to connect it to the standard RF coaxial cable. Once you connect it to the cable you use a VCR or other device as your converter box. In this way I can connect the Atari 2600 to a device that would not normally accept the coaxial RF plug. This is a way to extend the versatility of your old RF only systems. I will have to use this in a few days to connect my Atari 2600 to the college's video projector so we can play a HUGE game of Atari Olympics on the wall. The projector only accepts S Video and Composite video, and of course the RCA sound jacks. Using a VCR, the metal adapter and some RCA cables I can get that Atari 2600 playing on a system that was not designed to take it.

Here is a video. Mark shows how to connect the 2600 a bit further in.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=38os4_ama08

[sjewkestheloon]

Interesting and well intentioned thread, thanks! Unfortunately I don't really have anything to add.

[Fudoh]

Short comment about your very first comparison above:

I'm last one to defend any kind of expensive video equipment, but with using audio RCA cables for video you can get into serious trouble. Audio cables are non coax cables rated at 50 ohm while video is ideally coax rated at 75 ohm. All the video connections inside your TVs (and VCRs and DVD players etc) are expecting 75 ohm coax cables. When using audio RCA cables over more than a short distance you get ghosting and visible picture degradation on your picture which is caused this difference electrical resistance.

I advice STRONGLY against buying expensive video cables as well: getting a roll of RG59 industry cable (less than $1 per meter) plus the RCA or BNC connectors you need and you have the best cable available. A 50 feet run with those is easy and nothing to worry about. BUT saying a non coax audio RCA cable should be used for video is plain out wrong, sorry about that. You might not notice the difference right away over 3 feet and with a SD signal, but try 10 feet and 480p picture and you get nothing but a blurry mess.

[handsome_rakshas]

Haha your setup must look a lot like mine, S-Video extravaganza!

[ROBOTRON]

wow!

Thank you for the tips...I have almost every classic system all the way to the Atari 2600.

[PC Engine Fan X!]

I use Monster Cable/Monster Game A/V, HDMI & Toslink cables with my gaming consoles. Only if they made Japanese or Euro Scart cables, they'd be 24k gold plated and heavily shielded from electromagnetic interference along with the trademarked thick Monster Cable cable sleeving. I suppose if enough demand for it is met, they'd make 'em -- of course, it'd be speciality RGB/Scart cables for the hard-core gaming connosieurs.

They even made a purple colored Gamecube Monster Game A/V cable with both composite video and S-Video outputs along with the obligatory L&R stereo phono jacks...has the usual 24k gold plated connectors in place. Is quite thick as well. On the A/V input interface of where it connects to the GC's A/V port, it's got 24k gold plated contacts.

Even just using a simple MC branded composite video cable on the TG-16 with optional A/V Turbo Booster accessory, I noticed a bit of extra visual detail and clarity compared to using low grade cheap-ass composite video cable. You definitely do get what you pay for.

SCEI got smart by releasing it's SCHP-10130 PS2 A/V adapter with both composite video and S-Video outputs, which they should've done with the original PSX A/V adapter which only had composite video output at best.

PC Engine Fan X! ^_~

[Ex-Cyber]

Monster cables aren't bad by any means, but they're a rip-off. Like Fudoh says, crimping an RCA connector onto RG-59 (or RG-6 if you really want to splurge and can find compatible connectors*) will get you top quality for well under $1/foot. Watch a cable/satellite installer sometime; they'll happily hand-crimp non-gold-plated F connectors (albeit ones mechanically built much better than the connectors you'd find on bargain-basement antenna cables) onto hand-stripped RG-6, and that connection will successfully carry much more signal over a much longer distance than any wire between your console and your TV set.

For digital cables, Monster and similar "premium" brands are bordering on fraud. For digital signals, the cable is either good enough for the signal being sent or it isn't; the precise analog properties are irrelevant unless you're examining the signal on a scope or otherwise doing rather exotic things.



*: (There exists an even higher grade of 75-ohm coax, RG-11, but the difference between it and RG-6 is usually negligible unless you're doing really long runs, and even RG-6 is really tremendous overkill for short-run baseband use)

saying a non coax audio RCA cable should be used for video is plain out wrong

It's certainly not ideal/correct, but it works in a pinch. Whenever I've done this I've put the Y signal on the "video" connector, which I assume helps keep the worst artifacts at bay.

[Pixel_Outlaw]

Use the original controller hardware to make a portable MAME console.

I've invested in different controller adaptors too. For the MAME player on the go I present a sort of "MAME Console". In this way you can take your game saves with you and also use your controllers. This basic design includes a 4 GB flash stick to store the emulators and roms on and also supports up to 3 players. You can now transport all your scores and saves to anyone's house with the controllers being the bulk of the system. No need to install files and roms, everything stays on the USB drive. Make sure you use USB 2.0, I have no idea how USB 1.0 will act. This system runs at full speed on all computers I have tested. The great thing about this system is that all the game and game setting data is self contained. If your friend has the controllers you simply bring the console and the adapters as I do. In this case the computer acts as a "TV" for your console.

I've seen the following USB controller adapters.
1. NES, Sega Genesis, SNES (Untested)
2. PS1/PS2 (Tested both of my wacky Chinese brands work perfectly, also they offer models that take two controllers and attach to a single USB)
3. N64 (Tested with my N64/PS1/2 combo) If you connect a N64 controller you will need to redefine the analog stick limits under windows.
4. XBOX (Tested, for the toothless redneck game player it is a wonderful solution.)

The nice thing about these adapters is that they let you use a real game device without having to ruin it for computer use.


Here is my setup for the portable MAME console. Add to a laptop for the whole shooting match.

[DC906270]

where did you get your little VGA---> Video out converter?

[Pixel_Outlaw]

where did you get your little VGA---> Video out converter?

eBay. Be VERY careful!
Converting VGA to TV video requires an ACTIVE conversion. You cannot just go from one cable to another. It requires a converter box, don't fall for false cables that have the VGA plug on one end and the TV Video plug on the other.

Here is an auction for one to show you.
http://cgi.ebay.com/VGA-PC-to-VIDEO-S-V ... 3a59555046

My little silver box outputs both S Video and Composite video. It supports both PAL and NTSC video through two small dip switches on the side of the unit.
It is going to be slightly blurry but that is the nature of this conversion. It is passable but do realize that you are not going to get a pixel perfect result.

[speedlolita]

Or just RGB SCART everything you can if you're in europe.

[Pixel_Outlaw]

Here is another little gem.

If you are interested in purchasing an Atari 2600 you do not need the special power brick nor the controller.
The controller can be a Sega Genesis controller, with the C button acting as the action button. I prefer the Sega Genesis controller actually so that is what I use when playing 2600.
Look for a multi head universal power adapter. These things are great for all consoles, just be very careful that you know how to read the diagram on your console power supply. For the Atari 2600 you are looking for the 3.5 mm audio pin style head.

Actually purchasing a multi head adaptor is a great idea. For around 15 dollars you will be able to get many "incomplete" systems for cheaper on eBay. The seller will probably knock a few bucks off since he doesn't have power adapter. The nice thing about the Atari 2600 is that all the cords can be easily substituted all you need to do is get the main console.

You can even power an original GameBoy with a multi-head power adapter.

Here is a picture, be careful when setting the tip polarity.
http://www.axemail.com/images/fullsizeimages/gycpsu.jpg

Speaking of power, you can shave down a ps1 or ps2 cord to fit the Xbox, it is a fix that works. I bought a second hand Ps1/2 cable for 50 cents and was able to easily get an old Xbox up and running.

This brings me to another idea. Suppose you are using a piece of electronics that uses the "twin lead" connector. Twin lead connection consists of two little flat c shaped clips that screw down to the display device. Older television used this. Well what if you want to play your TI 99 computer or Atari 2600 (with twin lead adapter) on your one billion inch plasma tv? The answer lies in a small converter that will convert twin lead connection to the cable coaxial connector. From there you can connect it to the television and set it to channel 3 or 4. Ah but what if your television only has RCA? Well then you use the old VCR trick. You screw the coaxial connection into the VCR input and output through composite RCA A/V cables. To do this your VCR or DVD player needs to have an "RF Modulator". Most recorder types do.

No need to throw away old electronics because of odd (twin lead) style connectors!

Sorry for a bit of a bump but I felt these topics were worth covering. More as I find em...I guess.

[PC Engine Fan X!]

The above AC adpter trick won't work with said Atari 7800 ProSystem console as it takes a certain AC adapter with a small blue-colored plug interface. I've gotten a PAL region "32 in 1" Atari 2600 multi-cart to work on my NTSC 7800 console. You just have to use one of those old-school CRT-based TV monitor that only have RF coxial input. Then it'd be doable. The really odd-ball thing is that you have to keep powering the 7800 or 2600 down and powering it back up to play a different game on this peculiar PAL multi-cart setup though.

There was talk/rumors about Atari Corp. releasing the 16-bit Panther console with a cart port to play Atari Lynx games on the "big screen" TV monitor setup (but it got scrapped in favor of the 64-bit powered Atari Jaguar console) according to a 1991 Computers & Video Games magazine news snippet. A Jag console outputs in Japanese RGB & Euro Scart formats quite beautifully.

PC Engine Fan X! ^_~

[Specineff]

[Ed Oscuro]

SUPER ED IN WITH SUPER TIPS FOR ALL THE HARDCORE COMPUTERS PLAYER

TIP #1: ONLY BUY GOLD PLATED CONTROLLERS PINS BECAUSE THEY LOSE LESS OF THE MOVESQ@! MONSTER CABLES SALES THESE

TIP #2: COOL DUDES GET A KYRO, YOU DON'T WANT TO BE A nVIDIA nLUSER DO YOU?

BUT THE BEST TIP OF THE DAY IS LAST: PUT CLASSIC GAMEBOY SCREENS IN EGSHELS AND THEN IN YOUR EYES FOR SUPER STERO-SCOPIC VISION! NO RED-GREEN GLASSES REQUIRE

TAHNSK PIXEL STUFF MAN FOR THE FORUM!!! TO TALK ABOUT THIS COOL TIPS

[KBZ]

thanks for the link to the VGA->NTSC converter. Just ordered one to hook my netbook up to the tele

[Schrodinger's cat]

I have the Gamestop cable which is almost the same as the one in the OP, but it has component connectors instead of S-video. It worked fine for about a year or so, but then HD Xbox 360 games started to display a faint line of noise that would scroll across the screen slowly and SD games would just look slightly blurrier than when using the cable that came with the system. It's not a huge deal, but it's getting annoying.

Do any of you cable experts know what the problem is? Could it be bad cable shielding or a loose solder connection, and is there anything I can do about this without having to buy new cables?

[Specineff]

I have that same cable and gives me horrible picture compared to a monster cable I picked up for cheap. Bad quality, just that.

[Pixel_Outlaw]

I have that same cable and gives me horrible picture compared to a monster cable I picked up for cheap. Bad quality, just that.

That may be the case, mine is not branded and may not be that actual model. Again, I'm sure that a modern TV makes quite a bit of difference but I'm still in CRT land so all my light gun games work.

This is something I threw together today, I'll await the collective facepalm.
(No idea how much the quality is going to suffer with this.)

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=3 ... 1534433814

[KBZ]

another neat vga to 15khz converter, but more for arcade stuff.

http://excellentcom.net/catalog.asp?cat ... atid=52159