New to this site and shmups in general

[BelmontHeir]

Hey folks. If you'll be so kind as to welcome in a relative newb to shmups. I've always admired the genre from afar, but was turned off by the blistering difficulty levels. Since I own a Wii and have access to all the games on the Virtual Console, I recently decided to dip my toe into the genre. I started with Air Zonk, which was pretty cool, and Life Force, a game I could appreciate but didn't exactly enjoy.

Then the other day I finally made a deeper commitment and bought Gate of Thunder and MUSHA. I've put more time into GoT but they're both excellent. Gate of Thunder seems like the perfect introduction to the genre. Beautiful graphics, a killer soundtrack, great level design, and a fair challenge. So far I've made it to the boss of Stage 5, but I'm having trouble because the boss of Stage 4 always kills me, robbing me of my power-ups before Stage 5.

I'm also playing a few shmup-inspired games right now, like Every Extend Extra (PSP) and Big Bang Mini (DS). They're both fun and quirky.

I have a fairly lengthy wishlist of the next shmups I plan to get off the Virtual Console. Here's a tentative order in which I plan to get them, though if you have one in particular you think would be a good follow-up to Gate of Thunder, I'd appreciate the feedback.

Blazing Lasers
Soldier Blade
Gley Lancer
Star Parodier
Final Soldier
Axelay
Lords of Thunder
Detana!! Twinbee

Also, I've heard a lot of great things about R-Type Delta, which is available on the Playstation Network for cheap. But I figure it's a game that trades fairly heavily in R-Type lore and nostalgia, so I'm wondering if I should play the first 2 games in the series first. Would you guys recommend R-Types, which features arcade ports of the first two games, or would it be best to just jump ahead to Delta? I know R-Type is notoriously difficult but I believe R-Types gives you options for unlimited lives if I just want to play through the game to enjoy it.

I apologize if this post was jam-packed with information. o_O Thanks for reading it all if you did. I'm looking forward to experiencing all these games I've missed out on over the years.

[KMM]

Do you own a 360? R-TYPE Dimensions consists of enhanced remakes of R-TYPE and R-TYPE II and is $15. Also, R-TYPE III: The Third Lightning is on the Virtual Console for $8.

[AraraSPAMWitch]

BUY GLEY LANCER NOW

Or emulate it, I don't care. You should play it--it's a fast-paced hori with fun weapons, a bitchin' soundtrack, and it's pretty easy, so if you're just getting into the genre it won't make you cry. The game hands out extends liberally, and although it uses a checkpoint system, it doesn't take long to get back to full power after deaths. It's a good gateway shooter, in my opinion.

Other suggestions: I'd do some research before getting Axelay or any of the games with "soldier" in the title. A lot of people like Axelay, but I feel it has not aged well at all in the new millennium. The game heavily relies on Mode 7 effects and a bizarre isometric view that, for me, make it almost unplayable. It was a SNES attempt at making a shooter with 3D stage effects, but if I want to play a shooter with 3D stage effects I'm not touching my SNES, that's for sure. And the Star Soldier games, they look and sound great even today, but the odd powerup system never appealed to me. Most don't seem bothered by that, so make of my advice what you will.

And since you have a Wii, you might as well pick up the Castle Shikigami III port. It's a good time and by far the best Wii shmup in a box, and will give you a good excuse to flip your TV on its side. (great way to impress the ladies...) It's a tad more modern than these games, with more ships (or characters in this case), more bullets, more scoring options, and fewer environmental hazards, but you can just go through it guns a blazing and enjoy yourself.

Final note: R-Type Delta is a shooting game. You shoot things that move, and try not to bump into anything that isn't a powerup. You don't need previous R-Type experience to enjoy it, just blast away. That's one of the things I enjoy about the genre, grab a controller and you're set. Last note: infinite lives? Grow a pair, man! Living on the edge of defeat and being sent back to stage 1 is what makes this genre fun as hell. I used to credit feed all day long, then a friend of mine took me aside and said, "Son, we need to have a motherfuckin' talk." I haven't looked back since...

[crithit5000]

Wise man once said-

Go play Mars Matrix.

[BIL]

Also, I've heard a lot of great things about R-Type Delta, which is available on the Playstation Network for cheap. But I figure it's a game that trades fairly heavily in R-Type lore and nostalgia, so I'm wondering if I should play the first 2 games in the series first. Would you guys recommend R-Types, which features arcade ports of the first two games, or would it be best to just jump ahead to Delta? I know R-Type is notoriously difficult but I believe R-Types gives you options for unlimited lives if I just want to play through the game to enjoy it.

Delta does make its nods to the other games (mostly through classic boss cameos), but it's also one of the most atmospherically vivid shooters you'll find. The bleak and occasionally outright creepy settings stand entirely on their own. It's also much more beginner-friendly than I & II; you can adjust speed on the fly, you have a recharging bomb, and walls can be bumped without danger (the highest difficulty and various bonus challenges will certainly test you, though). If anything Delta might be a better starting point for newcomers, and it's a hell of an entertaining shooter in its own right.

[BelmontHeir]

Awesome. I'll probably pick up R-Type Delta this weekend then. It's nice that you can play PS1 Classics on your PS3 or PSP. How awesome would it be if you could play VC games on your DS? I'd love a portable Gate of Thunder to be able to hone my skills...

Another question for you shmup experts. I was eyeing Taito Legends 2 for PS2 because it has several arcade shmups on it, including ones like G-Darius and RayStorm that later saw PS1 ports. I've heard conflicting reports, however. Some people seem to think that the Darius series is pretty much the only decent arcade schmup that Taito has done; meanwhile, the PS1 RayStorm has an Arrange mode and arranged soundtrack. But the arcade ports on Taito Legends 2 shouldn't have any slowdown.

I guess it's almost a mute point when Taito Legends 2 retails for about $5 at GameStop, so I might as well pick it up. But it'd be encouraging if someone said that the comp was actually pretty solid.

[TrevHead (TVR)]

Ive got both taito legends 1 & 2 and they r great for shmups and platformers(ihave the PC versions which has 3 or 4 tittles different to the console versions) I also recommend u try out some PC shmups as there are some great freeware and doujin titles which are suited for noobs to improve their game. I would suggest doujin games by siter skain (kamui & reflex), orange juice(flying red wine barrel), astro port (migilo the whichborg) and shanghia alice (touhou). The titles i play atm are freeware parsec47 and rrootage (great practice shmups) by ABA games. X.X games make free cave like shmups which have options with make it more forgiving of noobs, Blue wish resurrection is mine and many others fav.

[KMM]

Both Taito Legends packs are quite good (especially considering you're getting almost eighty games for $10 if you buy both), but buy them on PC so that you can then zip up the files for each game and throw them into MAME, removing the need for the game disc to be in the drive.

Unfortunately, the DS can't properly handle emulation of some VC games, or else I'd agree on that point.

[captpain]

The Darius Gaiden on those collections does not include autofire, FYI.

[neorichieb1971]

Personally, I feel you've got too many games on your hands already. If you were not downloading the titles i'd put you in "Collectors" already.

Find something you like in the genre, then ask about games around the same difficulty and cut your list to 3. Otherwise your just going to end up spending lots of money on things that you'll hardly ever play.


Just my 2c.

[BelmontHeir]

I see your point, but it's basically in my nature to have a huge backlog (60+ games I need to beat)...I'll get around to all the games someday, I promise.

Besides I wasn't planning to dl all of them this weekend, it's mostly just to plan ahead for the future and, well, talk with fellow gamers about shmups.

[Herr Schatten]

With Gate of Thunder and Musha Aleste you've already got two very nice beginner shmups. I'll add comments to the rest of your list (sorted from 'must have' to 'avoid'):


Soldier Blade
- Probably the best of the Soldier games. It's very original and tons of fun. Plus it's challenging without being frustrating. Get this before Blazing Lazers and all other Soldier games.
Lords of Thunder
- Another good game. Highly recommended. Avoid only if you hate butt rock.
Star Parodier
- Another super-easy game. Thankfully, it's still fun. Get this if you want a quick 1cc, probably with a smile on your face.
Final Soldier
- I'ts the weakest of the PCE Soldier games, and it has its quirks. It's still good, though. Get this if you've already completed Soldier Blade and Super Star Soldier and you yearn for more of the same.
Gley Lancer
- A very pretty game, yet far too easy. I'm glad it's out on the VC, because it sure as hell isn't worth the ridiculous prices the original cart fetches. It's quite nice, but it's really not something very special.
Blazing Lazers
- It's alright. As much as I like Compile, I have to admit it's not as impressive as it was when it came out, though, and it has some checkpoints later in the game that are practically impassable if you happen to lose your weapons there. Overall, it's not too difficult, though.
Detana!! Twinbee
- I never really got into this. For a game this quirky and colourful, it feels strangely bland. If you like bombing ground targets a lot, you may like it. Otherwise, better invest in something else.
Axelay
- I'd say stay away from it. It has aged really badly. The mode 7 stages are a mess. The other stages are fine, but (quite similar to Gleylancer) they don't do anything that hasn't been done better elsewhere.


Do you already have Super Star Soldier? It's absence from your list strikes me as a bit odd.
In addition to the titles on your list, I'd like to recommend Bio Hazard Battle. It's a great and unique game with plenty of cool ideas in it. It's very playable, too. I'd get this before anything on your list except maybe Soldier Blade.
If you're not opposed to downloading WiiWare content, you should also get Gradius Rebirth. For a Gradius game it's short and easy, so it would be a perfect introduction to the series for you.

[jefflev13]

I would second the disc of Castle of Shikigami III for the Wii, which is also selling for cheap these days ($17 US new on amazon). Perfectly solid, very fun game. A version of Gradius is also probably an essential (over the other virtual console titles you listed).

[BelmontHeir]

Really now, that's interesting you say that about Super Star Soldier, because I'd heard that Soldier Blade and Final Soldier were preferable titles...

As far as Gradius goes, I was planning to eventually pick up Gradius Collection for the PSP when I needed a Gradius fix. I've heard a lot of great things about Gradius Gaiden, which is on there.

[PC Engine Fan X!]

If Hudson Soft and Compile had given the PC Engine/TurboGrafx-16 Hu-Card game of Soldier Blade the Super CD-Rom2 special treatment, I'm sure the extra bonus goodies and lavish BGM tunes worthy of listening to in redbook audio format would've been awesome. ^_~

PC Engine Fan X! ^_~

[MathU]

I'd like to point out, since a lot of people don't know, that Taito Legends 2 has a PC version. You can get around the Starforce DRM and run all the games on it right through MAME for a much better emulation experience than the PS2 version provides. The only downside is it doesn't have G-Darius or Raystorm. But it does have Rayforce as an exclusive.

[TrevHead (TVR)]

Ive never used mame tbh. Will i bable to get rid of the horizontal streaching of many off the vert shooters if i use it?

[Mortificator]

Sure. The ports with GUIs like MAME Plus and WolfMAME are pretty easy to set up, too. You should give it a try.

I'd like to point out, since a lot of people don't know, that Taito Legends 2 has a PC version. You can get around the Starforce DRM and run all the games on it right through MAME for a much better emulation experience than the PS2 version provides.

The zips have that same filenames and everything? I wonder if Empire just downloaded some MAME sets to save themselves the trouble of dumping the boards.

[KMM]

As I said in my post, you have to zip the filesets up yourself - but yeah, it almost seems like they just downloaded the ROMs for the two packs. The folders have names matching with the proper ROMs - the folder for Bubble Bobble is "bublbobl," for example.

[cools]

I see your point, but it's basically in my nature to have a huge backlog (60+ games I need to beat)...I'll get around to all the games someday, I promise.

Besides I wasn't planning to dl all of them this weekend, it's mostly just to plan ahead for the future and, well, talk with fellow gamers about shmups.

This isn't a genre where beating the game is the end of it. Hell, the 1CC on most titles is extremely tough to get, and can't be expected to be achieved within a weeks play like the majority of modern games.

[Herr Schatten]

Really now, that's interesting you say that about Super Star Soldier, because I'd heard that Soldier Blade and Final Soldier were preferable titles...

Not really. It's more like this: Soldier Blade > Super Star Soldier > Soldier Blade.
You might want to read Postman's reviews of the games here:
http://www.shmups.com/reviews/soldierblade/index.html
http://www.shmups.com/reviews/superstar ... index.html
http://www.shmups.com/reviews/finalsoldier/index.html
I also recommend PlasmaBLOOD's superplay of the Soldier games. Download them from superplay.co.uk. They are worth watching.

SSS and SB lack the weird bio-enemies and the weapon customization of FS, but they are better games overall. As I said before, that doesn't make FS a bad game. It's still very fine and you can have loads of fun with it, but the other two games are just that little bit better.

As far as Gradius goes, I was planning to eventually pick up Gradius Collection for the PSP when I needed a Gradius fix. I've heard a lot of great things about Gradius Gaiden, which is on there.

Gaiden is by far the best Gradius bar none. The Gradius collection is good value for money, but be aware that you may find the first game a little primitive (it's good, though), while Gradius III and IV are, as far as Gradius goes, uninspired run-of-the-mill games, which add little to the series, but are terribly unbalanced and have stupid difficulty spikes. I, for one, got little enjoyment out of either of them, and I like the series in general quite a bit. So with the collection you get two fantastic games (II and Gaiden) and one decent one (Gradius I). You'll have to decide if that's worth the asking price for you. If you are completely new to the series, it can't hurt to test the waters with Rebirth, that's all I'm saying.