Getting back into the Genesis...

[Turrican]

Eliminate Down (the best shmup on the system, bar none. Too bad it will cost you your first born to acquire)

Honestly... I think I'm gonna get flamed for this but... I really think those games (Eliminate Down, but also Gleylancer for that matter) are rarer than they are good. Mind you, they're good, okay, no doubt on that. But they're also pretty clichè, and the genesis is overflowing with games like those. Do like me, grab a Super Fantasy Zone for $5.

I'm getting really annoyed by the "Rondo of Blood" syndrome lately, it seems to have spawned to dozen of titles. Like, the thread about best platformers: the one who started it warned us that he had not played yet masterworks like Little Ralph or Umihara...

Men, these are games are good in perspective, that is, it was good to discover that a much hated sony system that was all fifa, basketball, lara and hockey games had some hidden gems, if you were willing to import. It was cool to see there was a decent 2d platform, ok. But that (and the fact that like, 3 people in the world played it) alone doesn't make it the best thing in the world.

But, seriously... This thing of the rarity really spoils and degenerates our view at games. A Super Mario Bros 3 cart is clearly better, but no one cares, as it's found for $1.

It's the Rondo syndrome, clearly. When a game is harder to obtain, some self-proclaimed experts (=guys with enough cash to afford it before others) will claim that Rondo is the best in the series, and that you haven't seen anything of CV yet if you haven't played it. And it doesn't matter that the claim can be a legitimate one (as Rondo rocks), because the only reason for they to say this will be the rarity.

Luckily, the trend seemed to slow down in the internet age, where anyone with some cash and looking in the right places can find what he wants, and emulation can give a good idea of any game.

Radiant Silvergun is not rare at all, but it sells at a high price because of constant demand. But Eliminate Down? Sapphire? These games are rare, stop. I really fail to see what makes Eliminate Down something special, besides the ridiculous price. Had it been one of the few shmups on the system, I'd understand. But no. You can get all the Thunderforces for 1/5 of that price. Heck, I'm sure all my genesis shmups costed me less than that cart, and playing the rom I was like "wtf?, the most generic dull thing been there saw that a million times!".

I understand shmups collectors will have to fill their holes and will want to have them all someday: I'm like that too. But please, keep perspective: you're buying generic shmups that happen to be incredibly rare, not all-time masterworks.

[Turrican]

Normally I'd warn someone about the perils of spending $100 (probably $150 or more for Eliminate Down...) on an old game, but you're the guy who is/was thinking about spending $600 or more on a virtually non-playable Saturn game. I think you of all people could get his money's worth out of Gleylancer and ED.

Yeah, my above post is useless, I know. I just felt like writing something.

[raiden]

Honestly... I think I'm gonna get flamed for this but... I really think those games (Eliminate Down, but also Gleylancer for that matter) are rarer than they are good. Mind you, they're good, okay, no doubt on that. But they're also pretty clichè, and the genesis is overflowing with games like those. Do like me, grab a Super Fantasy Zone for $5.

I'm getting really annoyed by the "Rondo of Blood" syndrome lately, it seems to have spawned to dozen of titles. Like, the thread about best platformers: the one who started it warned us that he had not played yet masterworks like Little Ralph or Umihara...

Men, these are games are good in perspective, that is, it was good to discover that a much hated sony system that was all fifa, basketball, lara and hockey games had some hidden gems, if you were willing to import. It was cool to see there was a decent 2d platform, ok. But that (and the fact that like, 3 people in the world played it) alone doesn't make it the best thing in the world.

But, seriously... This thing of the rarity really spoils and degenerates our view at games. A Super Mario Bros 3 cart is clearly better, but no one cares, as it's found for $1.

It's the Rondo syndrome, clearly. When a game is harder to obtain, some self-proclaimed experts (=guys with enough cash to afford it before others) will claim that Rondo is the best in the series, and that you haven't seen anything of CV yet if you haven't played it. And it doesn't matter that the claim can be a legitimate one (as Rondo rocks), because the only reason for they to say this will be the rarity.

Luckily, the trend seemed to slow down in the internet age, where anyone with some cash and looking in the right places can find what he wants, and emulation can give a good idea of any game.

Radiant Silvergun is not rare at all, but it sells at a high price because of constant demand. But Eliminate Down? Sapphire? These games are rare, stop. I really fail to see what makes Eliminate Down something special, besides the ridiculous price. Had it been one of the few shmups on the system, I'd understand. But no. You can get all the Thunderforces for 1/5 of that price. Heck, I'm sure all my genesis shmups costed me less than that cart, and playing the rom I was like "wtf?, the most generic dull thing been there saw that a million times!".

I understand shmups collectors will have to fill their holes and will want to have them all someday: I'm like that too. But please, keep perspective: you're buying generic shmups that happen to be incredibly rare, not all-time masterworks.

couldn´t have said it better. I agree completely.

[Marc]

Shit, some goddamn common sense, finally.

Eliminate Down is pretty cool IMO. But $100+ worth of cool? Nah.
Gimme Gynoug, Thinderforce III and IV, Bio-Hazard Battle, Aero Blasters and I'll keep the change.[/quote]

[BrianC]

Eliminate Down (the best shmup on the system, bar none. Too bad it will cost you your first born to acquire)

Honestly... I think I'm gonna get flamed for this but... I really think those games (Eliminate Down, but also Gleylancer for that matter) are rarer than they are good. Mind you, they're good, okay, no doubt on that. But they're also pretty clichè, and the genesis is overflowing with games like those. Do like me, grab a Super Fantasy Zone for $5.

I'm getting really annoyed by the "Rondo of Blood" syndrome lately, it seems to have spawned to dozen of titles. Like, the thread about best platformers: the one who started it warned us that he had not played yet masterworks like Little Ralph or Umihara...

Men, these are games are good in perspective, that is, it was good to discover that a much hated sony system that was all fifa, basketball, lara and hockey games had some hidden gems, if you were willing to import. It was cool to see there was a decent 2d platform, ok. But that (and the fact that like, 3 people in the world played it) alone doesn't make it the best thing in the world.

But, seriously... This thing of the rarity really spoils and degenerates our view at games. A Super Mario Bros 3 cart is clearly better, but no one cares, as it's found for $1.

It's the Rondo syndrome, clearly. When a game is harder to obtain, some self-proclaimed experts (=guys with enough cash to afford it before others) will claim that Rondo is the best in the series, and that you haven't seen anything of CV yet if you haven't played it. And it doesn't matter that the claim can be a legitimate one (as Rondo rocks), because the only reason for they to say this will be the rarity.

Luckily, the trend seemed to slow down in the internet age, where anyone with some cash and looking in the right places can find what he wants, and emulation can give a good idea of any game.

Radiant Silvergun is not rare at all, but it sells at a high price because of constant demand. But Eliminate Down? Sapphire? These games are rare, stop. I really fail to see what makes Eliminate Down something special, besides the ridiculous price. Had it been one of the few shmups on the system, I'd understand. But no. You can get all the Thunderforces for 1/5 of that price. Heck, I'm sure all my genesis shmups costed me less than that cart, and playing the rom I was like "wtf?, the most generic dull thing been there saw that a million times!".

I understand shmups collectors will have to fill their holes and will want to have them all someday: I'm like that too. But please, keep perspective: you're buying generic shmups that happen to be incredibly rare, not all-time masterworks.

Very well said. There are a ton of great games on the Genesis that won't hurt the wallet. Not just shmups either. Some great games like Dynamite Headdy, Rocket Knight Adventures, and Mega Turrican can be found for cheap too.

Now, about Super Fantasy Zone. I have been thinking of getting it. I heard that the European version works very well on NTSC systems. Is this true?

[raiden]

Now, about Super Fantasy Zone. I have been thinking of getting it. I heard that the European version works very well on NTSC systems. Is this true?

well, I have a Pal system modded, and switched into 60hz, this should be identical in behaviour to an Ntsc system. I can just say that Super Fantasy Zone (Pal version) works flawlessly in 60hz.

[Bar81]

Eliminate Down (the best shmup on the system, bar none. Too bad it will cost you your first born to acquire)

Honestly... I think I'm gonna get flamed for this but... I really think those games (Eliminate Down, but also Gleylancer for that matter) are rarer than they are good. Mind you, they're good, okay, no doubt on that. But they're also pretty clichè, and the genesis is overflowing with games like those. Do like me, grab a Super Fantasy Zone for $5.

I'm getting really annoyed by the "Rondo of Blood" syndrome lately, it seems to have spawned to dozen of titles. Like, the thread about best platformers: the one who started it warned us that he had not played yet masterworks like Little Ralph or Umihara...

Men, these are games are good in perspective, that is, it was good to discover that a much hated sony system that was all fifa, basketball, lara and hockey games had some hidden gems, if you were willing to import. It was cool to see there was a decent 2d platform, ok. But that (and the fact that like, 3 people in the world played it) alone doesn't make it the best thing in the world.

But, seriously... This thing of the rarity really spoils and degenerates our view at games. A Super Mario Bros 3 cart is clearly better, but no one cares, as it's found for $1.

It's the Rondo syndrome, clearly. When a game is harder to obtain, some self-proclaimed experts (=guys with enough cash to afford it before others) will claim that Rondo is the best in the series, and that you haven't seen anything of CV yet if you haven't played it. And it doesn't matter that the claim can be a legitimate one (as Rondo rocks), because the only reason for they to say this will be the rarity.

Luckily, the trend seemed to slow down in the internet age, where anyone with some cash and looking in the right places can find what he wants, and emulation can give a good idea of any game.

Radiant Silvergun is not rare at all, but it sells at a high price because of constant demand. But Eliminate Down? Sapphire? These games are rare, stop. I really fail to see what makes Eliminate Down something special, besides the ridiculous price. Had it been one of the few shmups on the system, I'd understand. But no. You can get all the Thunderforces for 1/5 of that price. Heck, I'm sure all my genesis shmups costed me less than that cart, and playing the rom I was like "wtf?, the most generic dull thing been there saw that a million times!".

I understand shmups collectors will have to fill their holes and will want to have them all someday: I'm like that too. But please, keep perspective: you're buying generic shmups that happen to be incredibly rare, not all-time masterworks.

Your theory is great and all except you're just pulling things out of your ass. SOME people may like a game more because it's rare and valuable but I like it because it's the best shmup on the system, bar none. Price and rarity don't mean anything to me. If a game is expensive and just doesn't cut it then I slam it as should be done. For example, Divine Sealing which is probably rarer than ED and worth about what Rondo is, is pure garbage, the fact that it's rare and expensive has nothing to do with the fact that it's crap.

In fact, I think that you don't have a clue what you're talking about. It's those of us that have enough cash to buy everything and not care about the price that are the best suited to make unbiased informed judgments as rarity and price don't matter to us since we can afford it all. A $1 cart means the same to me as a $200 cart. If the game is good, it's good. I'm not doing a price/pleasure ratio analysis.

In fact, if you noticed something, MOST of the games I recommend are quite cheap while many expensive games are not recommended.

I think this whole bitterness about not being able to afford or find games is pretty weak. To slam people because they are fortunate enough to have actually played games and then make a judgment based on first hand experience is probably the saddest thing I have seen on these forums yet.

[PaCrappa]

I'm not doing a price/pleasure ratio analysis.

In fact, if you noticed something, MOST of the games I recommend are quite cheap while many expensive games are not recommended.

+1

So Turdican, should I not spend the $90 on Kyoro Chan no Prikura Daisakusen then? I'd hate for people to think I was merely a 'self proclaimed expert' (=guy with enough to cash to afford it before others) even though it came out six years ago and any gamer that gives a shit about 2D platformers could have done the research and tracked it down himself in 1999 for $30. Just like Rondo of Blood in 1993.

Aw fuck it. The following paragraph in particular is some bitchass shit and it makes me want to smack your face off:

"It's the Rondo syndrome, clearly. When a game is harder to obtain, some self-proclaimed experts (=guys with enough cash to afford it before others) will claim that Rondo is the best in the series, and that you haven't seen anything of CV yet if you haven't played it. And it doesn't matter that the claim can be a legitimate one (as Rondo rocks), because the only reason for they to say this will be the rarity. "

I work my ass off to play what games I like (amongst other things that people do with their paychecks) and now there's some joker on the internet gonna say that people like me must have some 'syndrome' to like what we like. What the fuck is that? Get a job.

Pa

[Andi]

Because it seems everyone forgot: Yo, JP, go get Task Force Harrier. It's fun and pretty cheap.

Plus, you can die and not get fucked. Yay!

[Dartagnan1083]

A games price is determined by "Rarity", noteriety, and most of all: demand. Quality and noteriety contribute to the demand, but not always together. But Demand will drive the prices up.
Radiant Silvergun won't drop by too much since pretty much every seller on the web knows that people WILL pay $150-$200 for it.

Zero: The Kamikazee Squirel is considered one of the rarest domestic 16-bit titles for both the SNES and Genesis in the states.
Yet it never really goes for any high prices and few people really remember it. I snagged a complete MINT copy for $20...yet it's supposedly VERY rare.
Demand is low, so the prices are usuallly low.


I will say that Gleylancer is a quality game that I had to own.
The ROM was excellent, and the hard copy is even better (for expected reasons.
Sure, I could have stayed with the ROM, but It was good enough to get me to burn money for a Hard-Copy.


Besides.
Battlemania 2 is twice as expensive.

[Turrican]

Your theory is great and all except you're just pulling things out of your ass. SOME people may like a game more because it's rare and valuable but I like it because it's the best shmup on the system, bar none. Price and rarity don't mean anything to me. If a game is expensive and just doesn't cut it then I slam it as should be done. For example, Divine Sealing which is probably rarer than ED and worth about what Rondo is, is pure garbage, the fact that it's rare and expensive has nothing to do with the fact that it's crap.

I didn't make your name once. I just quoted your phrase to develop my statements, that were not direct to you at all. I have no doubt that you like ED regardless of its rarity. Quite honestly, I doubt I'd ever find a gamer in the whole world that would reply the opposite "Yes, I like it because it's rare". Doesn't work like that.

In fact, I think that you don't have a clue what you're talking about. It's those of us that have enough cash to buy everything and not care about the price that are the best suited to make unbiased informed judgments as rarity and price don't matter to us since we can afford it all.

Could be. Or could be that having too much money lower one's critic view.

In fact, if you noticed something, MOST of the games I recommend are quite cheap while many expensive games are not recommended.

I quite like your list, btw.

I think this whole bitterness about not being able to afford or find games is pretty weak. To slam people because they are fortunate enough to have actually played games and then make a judgment based on first hand experience is probably the saddest thing I have seen on these forums yet.

I wasn't bitter, but you are. I'm sorry I have hit your nerves.

[Bar81]

Your theory is great and all except you're just pulling things out of your ass. SOME people may like a game more because it's rare and valuable but I like it because it's the best shmup on the system, bar none. Price and rarity don't mean anything to me. If a game is expensive and just doesn't cut it then I slam it as should be done. For example, Divine Sealing which is probably rarer than ED and worth about what Rondo is, is pure garbage, the fact that it's rare and expensive has nothing to do with the fact that it's crap.

I didn't make your name once. I just quoted your phrase to develop my statements, that were not direct to you at all. I have no doubt that you like ED regardless of its rarity. Quite honestly, I doubt I'd ever find a gamer in the whole world that would reply the opposite "Yes, I like it because it's rare". Doesn't work like that.

In fact, I think that you don't have a clue what you're talking about. It's those of us that have enough cash to buy everything and not care about the price that are the best suited to make unbiased informed judgments as rarity and price don't matter to us since we can afford it all.

Could be. Or could be that having too much money lower one's critic view.

In fact, if you noticed something, MOST of the games I recommend are quite cheap while many expensive games are not recommended.

I quite like your list, btw.

I think this whole bitterness about not being able to afford or find games is pretty weak. To slam people because they are fortunate enough to have actually played games and then make a judgment based on first hand experience is probably the saddest thing I have seen on these forums yet.

I wasn't bitter, but you are. I'm sorry I have hit your nerves.

Dude, please. Your argument is silly. It's the have nots crying again and it's tired. Seriously, like Pa said, get a job and quit whining.

btw just to point out how silly the argument is, then by that same token, if you think ED is the best shooter on the MD because it's so expensive and rare then by your swisscheese logic you would also think that Sapphire on the PCE is the best Duo shooter because it's also the most expensive and rare.

Similarly, if I have two games, game A and game B. Game A is good and costs $5 while game B costs $500 but is excellent, then game B is the better game. PERIOD. Put another way, price has NO relevance to the excellence of a game.


Scenario 3. If I have two games, game C and game D. Game C is good but fairly common at a print run of 10,000 while game D had a print run of 1,000 copies and is rare but excellent, then somehow game D can't be the better game because it's *too* rare?!? WRONG. The better game is the better game. That's all there is too it.


Let me try getting you to understand that by flipping it around. By judging a game taking into account the price and rarity you are not properly judging the game on its merits, rather you are incorporating inconsequential external factors which have nothing whatsoever to do with how good a game is in relation to other games. As I said before, you are doing a PRICE/PLEASURE analysis which has NOTHING to do with what game is the BEST game in a genre on a system.

Homeless and poor people should not be allowed to vote for best game on any console/system.

I'm done

[Turrican]

Dude, please. Your argument is silly. It's the have nots crying again and it's tired. Seriously, like Pa said, get a job and quit whining.

btw just to point out how silly the argument is, then by that same token, if you think ED is the best shooter on the MD because it's so expensive and rare then by your swisscheese logic you would also think that Sapphire on the PCE is the best Duo shooter because it's also the most expensive and rare.

Similarly, if I have two games, game A and game B. Game A is good and costs $5 while game B costs $500 but is excellent, then game B is the better game. PERIOD. Put another way, price has NO relevance to the excellence of a game.


Scenario 3. If I have two games, game C and game D. Game C is good but fairly common at a print run of 10,000 while game D had a print run of 1,000 copies and is rare but excellent, then somehow game D can't be the better game because it's *too* rare?!? WRONG. The better game is the better game. That's all there is too it.


Let me try getting you to understand that by flipping it around. By judging a game taking into account the price and rarity you are not properly judging the game on its merits, rather you are incorporating inconsequential external factors which have nothing whatsoever to do with how good a game is in relation to other games. As I said before, you are doing a PRICE/PLEASURE analysis which has NOTHING to do with what game is the BEST game in a genre on a system.

Homeless and poor people should not be allowed to vote for best game on any console/system.

I'm done

I wonder if you really understood what I wrote above. Your reply makes no sense. I never questioned what you're saying. I never said a game's excellence depends on its price. Learn to read.

P.S. Pa*crap*pa vs Turd*ican would make a nice fight But seriously, you both missed my point entirely. Glad to see someone else understood what I meant above.

[PepsimanVsJoe]

Whether it's $1, $10, or $1000 it's not something worth arguing over.

[jp]

Once my financial situation evens out (my hours got cut drastically at work, I ran out of stuff to do, so now I'm confined to scheduled hours, and we aren't open that much during the summer... but I am getting a new job at a cell phone place next week), I may check out Gleylancer and Eliminate Down.

Normally I'd warn someone about the perils of spending $100 (probably $150 or more for Eliminate Down...) on an old game, but you're the guy who is/was thinking about spending $600 or more on a virtually non-playable Saturn game. I think you of all people could get his money's worth out of Gleylancer and ED.

Speaking that... what did you find out?

[jp]

Ooook... here we go:

Today I went back to Rhino and picked up 6 more games. I got:
Twin Cobra
Ranger X
Chiki Chiki Boys
Revenge of Shinobi
Shadow Dancer

And something else, but I forget.

Some great games like Dynamite Headdy, Rocket Knight Adventures, and Mega Turrican can be found for cheap too.

I've got all of those! And I agree! They rock!

Eliminate Down is pretty cool IMO. But $100+ worth of cool? Nah.
Gimme Gynoug, Thinderforce III and IV, Bio-Hazard Battle, Aero Blasters and I'll keep the change.

Trying to order Gynoug online right now actually. Own Thunder Force III on Saturn and IV on Genny. Also have Bio-Hazard Battle. Gotta find that copy of Aero Blasters again though...

Do like me, grab a Super Fantasy Zone for $5.

Soon as I find it bro!



Now, I guess I should address this whole "rarity/quality/price" issue:

Personally, I don't care how rare or pricey a game is. I have a damn fine job, I'm a college student, I have minimal bills, and I'm about to pick up a second job. Before the second job, my gaming budget per month is $600. After the second job, well, shit, it could be past $1000 in theory. heh. I may be buying Kizuna Encounter EU soon (I kid I kid, I'm not that desperate for a bigger internet penis).


Now, I would like to go back and address this:

Normally I'd warn someone about the perils of spending $100 (probably $150 or more for Eliminate Down...) on an old game, but you're the guy who is/was thinking about spending $600 or more on a virtually non-playable Saturn game. I think you of all people could get his money's worth out of Gleylancer and ED.

Note: What I'm about to type is a Saturn rant and has nothing to do with anything, read at your own risk.
This is VERY true. But, thats the Saturn. See, the thing is, with the Saturn, I'm not all there. You're talking about a person who will throw however much money he can scrounge together at anything he sees that he's never heard of on the Saturn. Thats how I roll. The Saturn was the first console I became a "fanboy" of, and someone once told me to be the best at anything I do, and thus, with the Saturn, my goal is to become to the Saturn what shawn of neo-geo.com is to the Neo-Geo. Plain and simple. Once the collection breaches 500 (which could happen soon) and I have all the shmups, yeah, expect the biggest Saturn website ever to pop up in the following 6 months.

But yes, my goal with the Saturn has long ceased being "find good games" (which it was shortly prior to the shmup crusade), as much as it has become "become the biggest collector!" I don't know how reasonable that goal is, but I know of two people who own more Saturn games than me, but on both accounts they're mostly Japanese games, and both only have like, 4 consoles. Me? I own 28 Sega Saturns, every model ever concieved (Brazilian Tec Toy see through green? Check! Hitachi Navi GPS HiSaturn? Check!), every peripheral concieved (Floppy Disk Drive? Check! Bomberman multitap? Check!), almost 500 games spread out amongst US/JP/PAL, and I own every rare/pricey game I know of (including the dumb hentai games like Haunted Casino, and the randomly rare PAL versions of games like Discworld, Swagman, etc.) aside from the Sucky Trinity (Derisoba, Eyeful Home, Heim Waltz). So I keep thinking that maybe once I get those three I'll reach my goal... or one of them, but for the time being, I just want to kick back, not collect, and have fun. Which brings us out of my rant and into...

</psychotic Saturn rant>


... I already own a lot of the stuff thats being posted here. If Gleylancer and Eliminate Down are decent shmups, I'm willing to check them out, because I just want to play good games. I know we're all tired of the "anti-next-gen" debates, but personally I don't enjoy next-gen titles, so I'll scrounge up whatever I can on past consoles and hold on to them for dear life. Half of you hate Taromaru, but I love it. Mind you, I only paid $80 for it, but that doesn't change anything. I paid almost $150 for my copy of Crows, and I don't care much for it. I had to buy Hyper Duel TWICE, bringing that total up to $260+, and I still love it to death. Same goes for Radiant Silvergun (though a bit less on the final cost), and I still cherish it as my favorite game ever.

My point is this:
Rarity, price, and all of that don't matter that much to me. On the Saturn, yes, it matters, because as far as the Saturn goes I'm way past the deep end. Everything else? Hells no. I'm never going to buy Darius Alpha. Why? Because the only reason I don't care much for Darius is because of the retardedly long boss fights. But I did buy Sapphire, because a couple of people here highly recommended it and said it was an amazing achievement on the PC-Engine. GREAT! I'd love to see it. Same goes for Sylphia. Bar81 said it was good and highly recommended it (as did PaCrappa), thus, I'll give it a shot because I want to experience as many great non-Cave/Psikyo shmups as I can.

To me, once a rare game is bought, its no longer a "super expensive rare game". Its just something else in the stack that gets played just as much as my Astal, NiGHTS, Splatterhouse 2, Shinobi III, etc., it just happens to be in a plastic baggy is all.

Because it seems everyone forgot: Yo, JP, go get Task Force Harrier. It's fun and pretty cheap.

Plus, you can die and not get fucked. Yay!

Awesome! I saw it at Rhino earlier I think. I'll definitely pick it up.

[raiden]

Similarly, if I have two games, game A and game B. Game A is good and costs $5 while game B costs $500 but is excellent, then game B is the better game. PERIOD. Put another way, price has NO relevance to the excellence of a game.

well, that depends. It´s possible to compare the amount of time a game entertains you with the amount of time you need to work to buy it. Now, if you happen to be someone with an inheritance so big you don´t need to work at all, this might not apply to you, but it applies to a majority of people who have to work for their money.
And just because a game is supposed to be the best shmup on a system, that doesn´t say anything about what you could get for the same price on another system. What we´re dealing with here is selection, the whole point of threads like this one.

Homeless and poor people should not be allowed to vote for best game on any console/system.

Personally, I tend to rather trust people who played a game extensively than those who have the most games. Because with all the money in the world you can´t buy yourself time, and that´s why the more games you have, the less you know about each of them.

Personally, I don't care how rare or pricey a game is. I have a damn fine job, I'm a college student, I have minimal bills, and I'm about to pick up a second job. Before the second job, my gaming budget per month is $600. After the second job, well, shit, it could be past $1000 in theory. heh. I may be buying Kizuna Encounter EU soon (I kid I kid, I'm not that desperate for a bigger internet penis).

I´ll just let the contradiction speak for itself.

[sethsez]

Bar81, you somehow managed to completely miss what Turrican said, and all the vitriol in the world doesn't cover that up.

Because I like analogies, here's one: Turrican is not talking about the person who just spent a fortune on a Porsche 911. He's talking about the person who just spent a fortune on a Honda Civic because it's a rare model and then insists up and down that it's really a Porsche in disguise.

[jp]

Personally, I don't care how rare or pricey a game is. I have a damn fine job, I'm a college student, I have minimal bills, and I'm about to pick up a second job. Before the second job, my gaming budget per month is $600. After the second job, well, shit, it could be past $1000 in theory. heh. I may be buying Kizuna Encounter EU soon (I kid I kid, I'm not that desperate for a bigger internet penis).

I´ll just let the contradiction speak for itself.

What "contradiction"? All of my games added together probably aren't worth $12K. I'm sorry if you're stuck playing bargain bin games only or whatever it is that has this whole "rare game issue" up your ass, but you really need to chill on being so... whiney... about rare games and the people who play them/collectors.

At any rate, here's me thoughts on me new games:
Twin Cobra - I hate helicopter shmups. I think I said this earlier, but fuck it, it needed to be said. Twin Cobra is no exception. I just hate it. I'll probably take it back tomorrow.

Revenge of Shinobi - Once again, I don't care much for it. I remembered liking it back when it came out, but after playing Shinobi III its just like "But why?"

Shadow Dancer - Nope. Didn't like this one either. Too slow and boring for me. Shall be going back tomorrow as well!

Ranger X - This game sucks. Like. Bad. Like, Wolf Fang. Actually, this game is like a shittier version of Wolf Fang. Thus, its like... a shittier version of a shitty game. Bleh.

Chiki Chiki Boys - I love it so. Kinda hard at first, but I'm getting the hang of it. Damn fun game, and great colorful graphics to boot!!

Castlevania: Bloodlines - Pretty damn cool. Though it does remind me as to of why I don't really like traditional Castlevania games in that:
A. Jumping sucks.
B. Getting hit sends you flying back half the screen(and generally, into a hole).
But hey, its still good fun. I don't understand while a Belmont isn't in the game, but I guess if I watched the intro I would.


I'll see what I can scrounge up tomorrow when I take out the garbage and hopefully get some stuff worth playing.

[jp]

Personally, I tend to rather trust people who played a game extensively than those who have the most games. Because with all the money in the world you can´t buy yourself time, and that´s why the more games you have, the less you know about each of them.

*Looks at 1CC list (thats totally missing tons of platformers and 2D fighters)*

*looks at every high score thread I'm in*


Yeah, you're right. Darn, I wish I had time to master more games.

[sethsez]

jp, once again, it's not an issue of being able to afford the games. Some people just think it's stupid to pay hundreds of dollars for games like Sapphire or Darius Alpha simply because they're rare. I also feel the same way about the NeoGeo nuts who paid hundreds for Metal Slug 4 when it came out, despite it being a pretty bad game that was bested by Contra III which could be found for pocket change.

It's kind of like when people were astounded that someone paid thousands of dollars for a grilled cheese sandwich that supposedly had the image of the Virgin Mary burned on it. Nobody was shocked because thousands of dollars were spent, they were shocked because it was spent on an old grilled cheese sandwich.

If someone's going to spend over a hundred for Radiant Silvergun, alright. It's a damn good game, though not my cup of tea. Rondo of Blood is fantastic, too, and for some is probably worth triple digits. But Darius Alpha, Sapphire, etc. are just middle of the road games that are no better than most of what you find in the bargain bin. So why pay hundreds for them? Just because you can spend the money doesn't mean you should.

I guess I just don't get that mentality.

[jp]

sethsez,

I understand where you're coming from, definitely. You and Turrican have a valid point, and I can definitely see it. I spent money on Sapphire because some people on the site recommended it. If I don't like it, I may sell it. If I do like it, hurray for me. Like I said, I love Taromaru and Radiant Silvergun, and if for some reason I lost access to both in the future, I would gladly pay whatever fee to replace them. I love those two games that much.

I want to buy Derisoba, Eyeful Home, and Heim Waltz eventually just because I have a silly goal. Its a fucking hobby though, and I have the money, so why not? Its fun, and I enjoy hunting down rare Saturn stuff. I assume Neo-Geo collectors are the same way, only some of them are apparently millionaires (the 2 that bought Kizuna Encounter PAL for $10K). To them, it really isn't so much about playing games, as it is collecting. Kind of like buying art or rare cars or stamps or whatever. Some people just like to spend money, so they find something to spend money on.

I'm KIND of like that. As far as I'm concerned, my whole "collector" thing will die out with the completion of my Saturn collection. I'm never going to buy Darius Alpha, or over half of the Neo-Geo games, why? Because they don't look fun. Once the Satty collection is done, I'll personally probably just buy whatever looks interesting. If that turns out to be Paranoia for $5 or Sylphia for $300, it really doesn't matter to me.

Like I said, I understand you and Turrican's points. Buying crappy games or protos for tons of dough because they're rare seems silly, but you're looking at it from a gamer's point of view and not a collector's.

[sethsez]

Like I said, I understand you and Turrican's points. Buying crappy games or protos for tons of dough because they're rare seems silly, but you're looking at it from a gamer's point of view and not a collector's.

Oh, I know. The main thing I'm trying to say at this point is that I'm not looking at it from a "poor person's perspective," like Bar81 said and you implied with "stuck playing bargain basement games."

[BulletMagnet]

Homeless and poor people should not be allowed to vote for best game on any console/system.

I'm really not sure WHAT to say in response to this.

[Marc]

Revenge of Shinobi - Once again, I don't care much for it. I remembered liking it back when it came out, but after playing Shinobi III its just like "But why?"

Dude, I read your posts above and enjoyed them. I admire your Saturn collection, your gameplaying ability, and the way you can express yourself regarding your collector's mentality so eloquently. But with that one statement above, you have just shit in my cereal.

Shinobi III isn't fit to lick the boots of Revenge. Revenge is an utter masterpiece. III... meh. There are a million reasons why, but I'm hung over and way too tired to list them. But seriously... anyone else have an opinion? Please tell me I'm not the only one utterly shocked by this view? Fuck, people will be trying to tell me that CV: Bloodlines in better than CV IV next

[Turrican]

Shinobi III isn't fit to lick the boots of Revenge. Revenge is an utter masterpiece. III... meh. There are a million reasons why, but I'm hung over and way too tired to list them. But seriously... anyone else have an opinion? Please tell me I'm not the only one utterly shocked by this view? Fuck, people will be trying to tell me that CV: Bloodlines in better than CV IV next

I agree: Revenge is a masterwork, truly one of Genesis' best. Shinobi III is still a great game, but perhaps not the sequel it should have been. It clearly isn't in the same league as its ancestor. In 1993 it felt a bit tired, and it doesn't even feature Koshiro Yuzo's music.

Yowza, jp, you don't like Ranger X? That's frickin' AWESOME. Wolf Fang is mediocre but I don't see many similarities between the two. Hmm, could it be that you're not enjoying Ex Ranza to the fullest because you lack a six buttons pad?

[Diabollokus]

28 saturns????

Thats incredible.

So then JP, will your website have detailed reviews of every shmup for the saturn?

[Cthulhu]

JP's new system threads never seem to die out. The PCE one went for nearly 300 posts.

I bought my Japanese Mega Drive 2 just so I could play Alien Solider and Twinkle Tale on it. I tried out AS emulated first to make sure it'd be worth the money (as with most Treasure games, everyone either says it's the BESTEST THING EVAR or that it's n0t l33t cuz it sUx0rz) and I fell in love with it. I'm on the "bestest evar" side of that one for sure. At any rate, I totally feel that I got my $120 of value out of AS for just -owning- it. I rarely play the game on the actual system (my emulator is always at hand, the system is packed away) but just having a physical copy of it makes me happy. I like the game that much. That's the way I feel about a lot of my collectable games, really. I own them because I like the game enough to feel that it's worth spending money on it to add it to my collection. People collect things for different reasons, and that's mine...

Oh yeah, JP, check yer mailbox... ^_^

[jp]

Shinobi III isn't fit to lick the boots of Revenge. Revenge is an utter masterpiece. III... meh. There are a million reasons why, but I'm hung over and way too tired to list them. But seriously... anyone else have an opinion? Please tell me I'm not the only one utterly shocked by this view? Fuck, people will be trying to tell me that CV: Bloodlines in better than CV IV next.

You're absolutely right. I played some more Revenge last night and once I got past the lesser graphics, lack of a jump kick, and lack of dashing I started having a blast! I think it was just my initial view since I had 1CC'd Shinobi III the day before, and thus I was still stuck in a Shinobi III mindset. But yes, I'm starting to see Revenge as a much better game now that I've played it for more than 10 minutes!

So then JP, will your website have detailed reviews of every shmup for the saturn?

Detailed reviews, movies, and screenshots of every 2D based english accessible game there is. I don't really want to try to review the dating sims/JRPGs because I'm not fluent in that language, and thus, I would come off as an idiot.

The main thing I'm trying to say at this point is that I'm not looking at it from a "poor person's perspective," like Bar81 said and you implied with "stuck playing bargain basement games."

My remark was aimed solely at raiden who freaks out against collectors and rare games. Not you and Turrican and whoever else.

Yowza, jp, you don't like Ranger X? That's frickin' AWESOME.

Maybe so...

JP's new system threads never seem to die out. The PCE one went for nearly 300 posts.

I bought my Japanese Mega Drive 2 just so I could play Alien Solider and Twinkle Tale on it. I tried out AS emulated first to make sure it'd be worth the money (as with most Treasure games, everyone either says it's the BESTEST THING EVAR or that it's n0t l33t cuz it sUx0rz) and I fell in love with it. I'm on the "bestest evar" side of that one for sure. At any rate, I totally feel that I got my $120 of value out of AS for just -owning- it. I rarely play the game on the actual system (my emulator is always at hand, the system is packed away) but just having a physical copy of it makes me happy. I like the game that much. That's the way I feel about a lot of my collectable games, really. I own them because I like the game enough to feel that it's worth spending money on it to add it to my collection. People collect things for different reasons, and that's mine...

Oh yeah, JP, check yer mailbox... ^_^

The PC-Engine one isn't dead yet. I just haven't had a working one for 3 weeks, so I haven't had much to post. Soon as I get my replacement it'll return. It really sucks though because I have Alzadick, Sapphire, and Star Parodier just sitting there... not being played... ARGH!

I love Alien Soldier too! It was my first "Genesis" game technically (my Grandad bought me a JP Mega Drive and Alien Soldier for Christmas when I asked for a Genesis. Too bad I couldn't get any other games to work on it! )

Oh, and I replied. Like I said, I'm getting a second job... so mehbe...

[Recap]

One of the best first-years MD games is Kaneko's Wani Wani World. Initially not too promising, but it's actually a very clever Lode Runner clone once you know its secrets.

Nice to see some love for Wonder Boy V here, by the way. It's one of the best and most overlooked games in the whole MD catalogue, in my opinion. Those interested in a mini-review may want to check the one I wrote for Postback recently.