Really Quick Question

[HeLGeN-X]

Can someone please answer me why Cave doesn't make games for PC?

At first, I thought it'd be a money issue (from pirates ETC,) that will never really end, but I figured they'd not need so much money to port them, or get a team of publishers (or developers? Not too familiar with that in depth game lingo) to port the games to PC, get a few of the hard core players to test them out, you know, give them some items from the game, shirts, credit ETC, boom. They can sell them on PC.

I also thought it was because they wanted to keep them rare, so they'd be limited... But how can everyone fully enjoy something that is never even going to be made any more? What if all of the copies of something literally sold... We'd just be assed out? That doesn't sound too good. At least it'd be ok if we could pay a lot for it, at least we'd know there's still a way to to obtain one.

Please let me know why, I'm sure somebody knows the true reason here, because I swear... This is Ketsui's fault. I don't have enough for the arcade version, fucking Xbox 360 is a piece of shit system (only because I've heard it breaks down a lot,) I literally fucking scavengered Tokyo and Nagano for a copy of KBL with NO LUCK, I even scavengered one day (took a break from clubbing) to actually find an arcade machine of Ketsui (which I happily found in Game Mikado in Kabukicho outskirt.)

Ketsui This is your fault!

No, why won't they make them?

[Aru-san]

Shin Megami Tensei: Imagine would like to have a word with you. It may not be a shmup, but it's made for PC.

[EPS21]

For being a really quick question, there's not an easy answer I'd think. Since it sounds like you're in Japan, why don't you go knock on Caves door and ask Ikeda himself

These games are arcade games first and foremost, that is where most of the profit should be coming from. Porting games is just a nice bonus when a title gets older and isn't making as much anymore from arcades around Japan. As for why not the PC as well, you might have already answered your own question with the pirating issue maybe, but I doubt that'd be all. I don't know too much about the hardware these games run on, but I imagine if it differs from x86 architecture of PC's, as well as getting it to run on Winblows and all the various hardware people have in their PC (unlike a console thats the same for all who own it), might take way more effort than what its worth to them.

[jpj]

i don't know why people bother making games for pc full stop

[kengou]

My guess is because they don't have enough developers for something like that. Developing games for the PC isn't that easy. They have experience making arcade PCBs, which is a very closed platform. They know exactly what the hardware is they're developing for. Same thing with consoles, there's really only the one platform for everybody if they want to port to a console. Now, to port/develop a game for PC, they need to take into account everybody's different hardware. You need experienced PC developers. The other factor is most likely that there's not enough profit in it for the amount of effort required to port games to the PC. I hate to say it because I am a PC gamer, but right now there's just more profit in developing a game for consoles compared to the PC, and Cave isn't a massive mega-rich company. They can't pull an EA and port a game to every console plus the PC, because they don't have the developers and the time, and getting those developers and making that time would cut into their other projects without enough profit to make it worth their while.

And then there's the simpler reason that shmups are a simpler genre that play better with controllers and are just better played on consoles than the PC. It's like asking for a PC port of a major fighter (SFIV not withstanding). Fighters are just arcade/console games, not really PC games.

Of course I play shmups and fighters and everything else on my PC as well, but some games and genres are definitely better on consoles or in arcades.

[Ex-Cyber]

Isn't Death Smiles 2 a PC game?

[neorichieb1971]

The hardware isn't the problem. Most people have duo core 2's now and I find it hard to believe that a Cave game can't run on that hardware or better.

15khz might be a problem since 31khz alters the look of the game completely. I am not sure how 360 copes with line doubling.

The main reason I can think of is that PC's are not very Japanesey. Do ANY games in Japan get released on PC?

[Leeram]

i don't know why people bother making games for pc full stop

Because there are hundreds of thousands of us that buy for the PC, and there are some games you need the resources of a PC to create. Most people who play FPS play PC because of (I would imagine) better frame rates and mouse and keyboard controls. Gamepads suck for RTS, FPS, etc.

Cheers

Lee

[Danbo]

The PC just isn't very popular as a gaming platform in Japan apart from doujinsoft, so they figure they'll have more success porting stuff to the current console.

Developing for PC is way easier than doing so for consoles.

[Obiwanshinobi]

i don't know why people bother making games for pc full stop

People tend to make games for just about every hardware out there capable of running them, like cell phones (not to mention Atari 2006 or Dreamcast) for example. That's Obiwanshinobi's law for ya.

And then there's the simpler reason that shmups are a simpler genre that play better with controllers and are just better played on consoles than the PC. It's like asking for a PC port of a major fighter (SFIV not withstanding). Fighters are just arcade/console games, not really PC games.

Fighting games and shmups used to be ported to (and made for) the PC almost since the very dawn of the PC as a gaming platform. Back then joysticks used to be quite common PC gamers' controllers of choice. Currently joypads (or even arcade sticks) for the PC are anything uncommon. Moreover, some of those ports are considered the best available for any home platform (the first Mortal Kombat, Raiden III, Street Fighter IV).

The main reason I can think of is that PC's are not very Japanesey. Do ANY games in Japan get released on PC?

Raiden II, Raiden III (reportedly arcade-perfect port; I can tell it's very good indeed), Shikigami no Shiro I&II, Touhou Project (since The Embodiment of Scarlet Devil), Guilty Gear (X, XX, XX #Reload, Isuka), Melty Blood (actually this one got ported FROM the PC to the arcade and the PS2 respectively, although the PC version of Act Cadenza is the ultimate one thanks to the homebrew online multiplayer mode, arguably the most flawless - in terms of gaming experience - within the realm of fighting games)...

Most people who play FPS play PC because of (I would imagine) better frame rates and mouse and keyboard controls.

Funnily enough, it does not seem to be true anymore. Many people on the internet claim to play PC first person shooters with joypads these days.

Developing for PC is way easier than doing so for consoles.

No, it isn't. It is, however, easier to release crappy code for the PC and get away with it.

[lgb]

lots and lots of homebrew games

also Shikigami no Shiro III has a PC port

[EPS21]

Funnily enough, it does not seem to be true anymore. Many people on the internet claim to play PC first person shooters with joypads these days.

And yet they will never compete against the superiority of a mouse+kb It's probably just the kiddos who's first FPS was halo and grew up playing it that way

[THE]

1. PC games are dirty
2. PC games in Japan are irrelevant
3. Only 1000 Doujin gamers worldwide would buy a Cave PC shmup all others would download it
4. Arcade>Consoles>PC

[Danbo]

No, it isn't. It is, however, easier to release crappy code for the PC and get away with it.

sounds like thatd suit cave just fine

[emphatic]

Because the don't want their games' slowdown "flaws" "exposed" when people run them with overclocking patches.

[Danbo]

Say what you will about piracy, a few PC ports of the newer games would make their games way more accessible to westerners. Put them on Steam/etc at a reasonable price and they'd sell.

[Obiwanshinobi]

PC games in Japan are irrelevant

Explain to me then, how come Melty Blood - a doujin fighting game with antiseptic backdrops and pixellated sprites - got ported to the arcade and PS2, and - last but not least - was a platform at Tougeki three years in a row (2006, 2007, 2008)?

Only 1000 Doujin gamers worldwide would buy a Cave PC shmup all others would download it

Depends on the price methinks. Some proffesional (i.e. doing this 4 life) developers manage to make both ends meet by online self-distribution. They are still plagued by piracy, but at least don't need to obey Microsoft, Nintendo, Sony, EA...
Admittedly, PC games in Japan aren't of much relevance, but "quick blast", arcadey games for the PC are still universally welcome and paid for.

Funnily enough, it does not seem to be true anymore. Many people on the internet claim to play PC first person shooters with joypads these days.

And yet they will never compete against the superiority of a mouse+kb It's probably just the kiddos who's first FPS was halo and grew up playing it that way

It's not that easy I'm afraid. We'll probably see more and more first person shooters with k&m controls intentionally broken for the sake of forcing joypads down people's throats (provided it's not just another conspiracy theory).
http://forums.2kgames.com/forums/showth ... 84f&t=7697

No, it isn't. It is, however, easier to release crappy code for the PC and get away with it.

sounds like thatd suit cave just fine

Played Shin MegaTen: Imagine open beta a bit (I am sad like that), and it was technically well done. Nothing spectacular, but obviously competent job.

[Raizen1984]

PC games in Japan are irrelevant

Explain to me then, how come Melty Blood - a doujin fighting game with antiseptic backdrops and pixellated sprites - got ported to the arcade and PS2, and - last but not least - was a platform at Tougeki three years in a row (2006, 2007, 2008)?

Also, I believe Trouble Witches was originally a PC doujin shmup that got ported to arcade. The PC platform is also home to a ton of hentai games.

Hardly irrelevant.

[Ex-Cyber]

One reason people develop for PC is that there's no authority really controlling it. You might not be able to get into Wal-Mart without a big publisher, but you can at least release a game without getting your company approved as a development licensee, then paying tons of money for a special devkit, then getting your project approved, then getting the build approved, then paying royalties on every copy.

[THE]

PC games in Japan are irrelevant

Explain to me then, how come Melty Blood - a doujin fighting game with antiseptic backdrops and pixellated sprites - got ported to the arcade and PS2, and - last but not least - was a platform at Tougeki three years in a row (2006, 2007, 2008)?

The arcade market is nearly dead from the perspective of big companies. We currently see a shift towards small independent companies and doujin developers for the arcade.
Examples are Melty Blood, Trouble Witches, Triangleservice, Milestone, G.Rev and the future NG:DEV.TEAM releases.

Even Cave noticed the signs of time and switched their development staff for Death Smiles 2 against Doujin developers

[Elixir]

That wasn't a quick question, it was so long that I didn't even read all of it.

[Obiwanshinobi]

Plenty of PC games and pseudo-games get made and released in Japan. Surely somebody out there play those games. Looks like a market, complete with manga & anime adaptations and console ports. Reportedly Japanese people in general get bored of home consoles, major releases etc. (handhelds, on the other hand, are doing better than ever before out there). Some obscure forms of PC gaming are well established in Japan. I wouldn't be surprised if developers like Cave tried to drain that market.

Trouble Witches

I like the name.

[Kaspal]

Trouble Witches

I like the name.

i like the game...

i get the impression that most ppl here think of doujin shmup as mere and pure garbage, but from my POV, there are a lot of good games (all for PC, ofcourse), and they keep on making them every year... so, maybe we dont get the same impression of japanese ppl using the pc for gaming as we, westerners do, but im SURE they do use it a LOT for gaming... and i mean, A LOT.

[cj iwakura]

Speaking from an SMT fan's perspective, Cave did a very good job of recreating the universe, especially the Gaian/Messian conflict.

And I love the music.