Ibara PS2 vs PCB (DOJBLEX thread derailment)

[bcass]

This threads resident snob is missing the point (just like he did the first time round).

What troubles him more than the PS2 port of Ibara being imperfect is the fact that anyone dare gage any sort of enjoyment from anything other than a game printed on a PCB.

[Dave_K.]

With how much hype the original PCB is generating in this thread, I'm tempted to pick one up over the port. I'll be disappointed if the removal of the blur effect is the only difference though

You shouldn't be buying the PCB if all you care about are the graphical differences from the port. You should be buying the PCB because its a seriously undervalued Cave/Raizing game! We are talking about a modern Garegga here! Compare this to any other Cave SH3 PCB, or even the original Garegga PCB (currently trading at ~$400).

[Shelcoof]

for some reason I want the PCB now too

[Elixir]

Can't I go one night without people lusting over my rock hard, uncensored truth? BY THE WAY I'M NOT SERIOUS, HERE LET ME ADD A SMILEY SO YOU KNOW THAT I'M NOT SERIOUS

Commence dissecting.

Yes people paying $100+ for the PS2 Ibara are stupid.

Yes

But those paying $200+ for a PCB are perfectly intelligent, right?

Yes

Seriously, stating people are stupid for paying obscene prices in a hobby this expensive doesn't carry much weight.

Sure, with that logic, cars are expensive because car collectors are willing to pay absurd prices on them, and thus it influences the rest of the car buyers out there. I mean, no.

(Enough weight to make you respond and have a thread split out of it～♪)

Weren't you the guy that said you would keep buying 360's as long as they keep breaking?

I said I'd buy another JP 360 if mine broke, which it did, and I did. It's worth it, considering how strong the shmup library for it is becoming, and the promising future it has. What does this have to do with overpriced PS2 games? Nothing.

To sum up, I bought a Batsugun board and the Special eprom because I don't own a Japanese Saturn, the game, or have a spare step-down transformer to deal with the Saturn's 110v internal power supply. It was a cost-effective manner of wanting to play the game. Or I could have purchased a Saturn with all that, but this is just easier.

Now, while I do have a JP PS2, I have no incentive to purchase a horrifyingly bad port (that has been shunned multiple times on this forum so I need not get into why it's bad) for $100+ USD during an economic crisis. The PS2 version has risen in price and, really, there's no justifiable reason as to why. You had people back when it was released claiming that it wasn't worth the import price of $60, or whatever it was at the time. Same thing is going on here.

You're basically advocating that spending half the price of the PCB on an inferior port is perfectly fine.

In my situation, I have both my PS2 and Supergun hooked up to my CRT monitor. Why would I purchase a PS2 port for $100~125 when I can get the arcade board for $200~250 and not have to worry about my PS2 suffering from coronary artery disease? I'm not even all that wealthy, it's just common sense (providing you already have a supergun, or cab). I've been recently selling off stuff and mentioning that a lot of the current shit I do own, I don't really need (as per this entry in my blog a few days ago).

[Jockel]

One thing to add: the port has an awesome arrange mode!
I wouldn't exactly call the port crap, but yeah the PCB is much better.
However i like the arrange so much that it's kinda hard to decide ^^

[Raizen1984]

(Enough weight to make you respond and have a thread split out of it～♪)

[emphatic]

1. What was the price of the PS2 port when it was released?
2. What was the price of the PCB when it was released?

If the PS2 version of the game (with all it's faults) costs more than on release, and the PCB (with all it's glory) costs less than on release, which one is the one to get? I'm confused.

[kernow]

[charlie chong]

i just wish i'd bought it when the brand new kits were £100 @ fujita

[Elixir]

i just wish i'd bought it when the brand new kits were £100 @ fujita

Maybe you could use the remaining money to have someone professionally design an *actually accurate* signature for you.

Anywho, since this thread spawned out of something I originally said (and since the person doesn't seem to have a valid response) I'd like to request a lock. This really isn't going anywhere.

[charlie chong]

i would have liked to copy and paste the bit about you having no friends but i had to stick within the word limit. i'll try harder next time

xxx

[Elixir]

If only you put as much effort into your posts as you did your signature.

Ah well, it beats throwing a tantrum and getting the bad laws and haggis everywhere.

[Obiwanshinobi]

And I thought I was the sad individual.
Although I've never played Ibara on the real thing, the PS2 port looks strikingly WRONG (yet still breathtaking) to me. Reminds me of playing low-res PC games on an LCD monitor. NeoGeo games (Metal Slug, Garou...) I saw on the PS2 don't suck that badly (guess Cave machine's native resolution is more of a bitch to scale properly).
Still, people who spend (or would like to spend) that much money on such expensive toys (be it those rare console ports or arcade machine guts) keep calling each other stupid because of this. Talk about being childish. I'm not picking on anyone in particular; it's just... wow.

[Elixir]

I don't remember saying that anyone was indirectly stupid for purchasing "expensive toys" for $100+. But since you're asking for it: People who purchase Ibara for over $100 are stupid. You must remember that this is a title which can be easily pirated, that the majority of people interested in have already purchased it on release day/ages ago, and most people buying it today are "game collectors" or "(french) sealed game collectors" who will play it once, then shelf it until they need some cash and hope that it's risen in price from the time they've purchased it.

The guy who spawned this thread didn't even come back with a proper reason as to why Ibara for $100+ is worthwhile. It just isn't. The sad thing is that you could probably make a low-end budget Supergun and buy the board, and it would cost around the same or slightly over the price of an imported Japanese console and the cost of Ibara on eBay now.

Actually I think CStarFlare did this.

[Obiwanshinobi]

I don't remember saying that anyone was indirectly stupid for purchasing "expensive toys" for $100+. But since you're asking for it: People who purchase Ibara for over $100 are stupid.

Meh, they are just collectors (not quite unlike people who collect PCBs). Owning such things turns them on and I don't have a problem with that. The problem begins when one kind of collectors throws the shit at the other kind out of so called inferiority complex.

You must remember that this is a title which can be easily pirated, that the majority of people interested in have already purchased it on release day/ages ago, and most people buying it today are "game collectors" or "(french) sealed game collectors" who will play it once, then shelf it until they need some cash and hope that it's risen in price from the time they've purchased it.

I'm pretty sure many of them are gonna keep it, like, "forever". Personally I'm not that much of a collector, but if I already owned a nifty collection of rare/expensive console games (not neccessarily shmup-oriented), Ibara for the PS2 could look like a hotter deal than a PCB. On the other hand, "shmups expert" should by all means choose the original board, as the port is obviously not that perfect. Both attitudes are okay, provided you guys feel good with yours. Apparently some of you don't, though.

The guy who spawned this thread didn't even come back with a proper reason as to why Ibara for $100+ is worthwhile. It just isn't. The sad thing is that you could probably make a low-end budget Supergun and buy the board, and it would cost around the same or slightly over the price of an imported Japanese console and the cost of Ibara on eBay now.

Actually I think CStarFlare did this.

Then again, importing a PS2 instead of chipping has more to do with collecting stuff rather than being thrifty, and that's fine too. I just don't believe in the objective pricing of "collector's items".

[captpain]

I really don't think it's snobbish to say that the graphics are atrocious to the point where it's understandable that they might be a major distraction on the PS2 version.

[Elixir]

I don't remember saying that anyone was indirectly stupid for purchasing "expensive toys" for $100+. But since you're asking for it: People who purchase Ibara for over $100 are stupid.

Meh, they are just collectors (not quite unlike people who collect PCBs). Owning such things turns them on and I don't have a problem with that. The problem begins when one kind of collectors throws the shit at the other kind out of so called inferiority complex.

I'm not a collector. Yes, I have a library of JP 360 and PS2 games, and yes, I have a few Limited Editions as well, but I do not actively seek them out (any more). I prune my collection constantly because I don't want Mc Donalds Super Happy Fun Disc sitting besides Daioujou. In my life I have had a grand total of 3 PCBs, and now I'm down to Batsugun Special as I've recently sold Futari. It isn't even about console games being "inferior" - I'm not jonny5. It's about looking at it financially.

This isn't about which side of the fence you're on. But like I said, I'm on both sides, and if you have access to using PCBs, go for the arcade board. I don't have a stellar education, nor great life experience, nor am I Einstein, but I'm smart enough to know that if something's half the price of something else, and it is significantly inferior to it, it's better to save your money for something you really want, instead of purchasing what you can right now, and possibly being disappointed due to your own impatience. It doesn't matter what it is.

If you chipped a PS2 you could probably just pirate the damn game. You can't really say that comparing an arcade board to modding a PS2 and burning the game is a fair comparison. But I can say this: have fun burning Ibara and getting a PS2 to read it.

[kernow]

People still burn ps2 discs? wow

[jonny5]

lolz...its not a matter of 'console games' being inferior....its a matter of ports of arcade hardware being inferior to the original....

as earth shattering as that seems thats all there is to it

im not arguing that people who dont have access to PCB's arent better off playing ports than nothing, but for me personally i want to experience games in their original form

the money isnt an issue.....especially with cave titles they dont devalue much...so its essentially like money in the bank.....except you can play it

sure you have to pay out a fair bit for some....but if you have to re-sell you will usually re-coup most if not all the funds originally spent on it

[kernow]

lolz...its not a matter of 'console games' being inferior....its a matter of ports of arcade hardware being inferior to the original....

as earth shattering as that seems thats all there is to it

KOF XII, SF4 and Battle Fantasia would like to speak to you

(the ports are better than the expensive originals)

[jonny5]

lolz...its not a matter of 'console games' being inferior....its a matter of ports of arcade hardware being inferior to the original....

as earth shattering as that seems thats all there is to it

KOF XII, SF4 and Battle Fantasia would like to speak to you

(the ports are better than the expensive originals)

i was referring to ports of lo-res games.....its not that hard to out-do five year old PC hardware, and the fact that its the same resolution in the arcade as the ports

[Raizen1984]

lolz...its not a matter of 'console games' being inferior....its a matter of ports of arcade hardware being inferior to the original....

as earth shattering as that seems thats all there is to it

Death Smiles?

[jonny5]

lolz...its not a matter of 'console games' being inferior....its a matter of ports of arcade hardware being inferior to the original....

as earth shattering as that seems thats all there is to it

Death Smiles?

if you are comparing deathsmiles arcade mode from the port to the PCB, the PCB is better.....

but obviously the port has other modes and stuff that make up for it......especially if using HDTV's

that said, i still think the PCB is better if you want to experience the original game the way it was meant to be.....especially if you want lo-res

you guys are grasping at straws now....you know what i am talking about....

[Elixir]

Death Smiles' port is great. The difference here is the price of a Death Smiles board is still $500+, while the port is $65. Thing is, the port also features 1.1, which is awesome. Then there's MBL, and... yeah, too many things about it tend to invalidate the purpose of owning the board.

Galuda and DOJ's ports invalidate most reasons to own their respective boards. Same applies to Death Smiles, since the port is really well done. Same applies to Shooting Love 200X, Otomedius, Raiden 4, and probably Futari, Galuda 2, and Ketsui if all goes according to plan. DOJBLEX is horrible, so buying a DOJBL board is understandable, but the prices on their pcbs took a fall to around 70k yen after the port was released.

BlazBlue is also a really good port, as is Senko no Ronde. The whole "true form" thing I can understand, but really, this is the reason why I sold my Futari board. I'm trying to cut down on having excess money shoved into merchandise that I don't really need; I don't want to worry about ports and "if my board will drop in price" in the future. It might be reasonable if you live in Japan or the US where the currency tends to fluctuate bit balance out (like it is, currently, and like it was, a year ago) but not in NZ, that's for sure.

But Ibara's case is special because the port is horrendous. Same could be said for DOJBLEX.

[Raizen1984]

edit: nevermind. i agree with elixir

[nZero]

Anywho, since this thread spawned out of something I originally said (and since the person doesn't seem to have a valid response) I'd like to request a lock. This really isn't going anywhere.

Request denied. It went from Ibara to Deathsmiles! Besides, I haven't finished my popcorn yet.

Also.....I don't think jonny5 has met his period quota yet either.....!

[jonny5]

Anywho, since this thread spawned out of something I originally said (and since the person doesn't seem to have a valid response) I'd like to request a lock. This really isn't going anywhere.

Request denied. It went from Ibara to Deathsmiles! Besides, I haven't finished my popcorn yet.

Also.....I don't think jonny5 has met his period quota yet either.....!

lolz.........................................................................................

only thing left to add....DS port may be $65....but if you dont have an NTSC-J 360 already once you add that into the cost its not much cheaper than a PCB....although you do get MBL as well.....and 1.1(but i havent played that mode at all so i dunno if its any good)

obviously there are other games on 360 you can buy then too....and future cave ports

i guess i am just in the minority when it comes to preferring the original hardware over ports...to each there own

can we get another split ...it would be hilarious to have a split off thread from a thread that was split off

oh ya....ibara is ugly, case anybody missed that

[Jockel]

People still burn ps2 discs? wow

Why shouldn't they?
If you burn games that are long out of print anyway, who cares?
You won't support CAVE by paying a greedy collector 200$ for a sealed copy.

[jonny5]

People still burn ps2 discs? wow

Why shouldn't they?
If you burn games that are long out of print anyway, who cares?
You won't support CAVE by paying a greedy collector 200$ for a sealed copy.

i think he was referring to the use of HDD loaders...burning discs for use with PS2's is outdated really

[Matsunaga]

The first thing I thought when I loaded up Ibara PS2 for the first time was, "Damn, that's ugly". Add the loading screens, and you have a total package of shit. I tried to patch it, and it looked a little better, but the load times got longer for some reason. This is why the game collects dust on my shelf. Definitely not worth $100.