DS & MBL differences?

[Skykid]

Really sorry if this has been concisely addressed somewhere else, but I've been thread trawling and can't find the answers to a few queries I have about original Deathsmiles and Mega Black.

I've only played MBL - I've got the PCB on loan for a bit, and loving it. But it's so vastly more expensive than original, and I've also heard original DS is preferred by quite a few people.
If I plumped for the original (which I haven't properly played) what are the distinct differences - and in youse guys opinionz, which is the better game?

Some things I wanted to know:

I heard that the scoring system is different, but which is more fun?
Are both EX stages present in the original (Ice and canyon?)
Which is harder (MBL is very easy, even on rank 3's - did they tone it down even more?)
Is there a change in graphics (I heard whispers of this).
Are there added secrets/bonuses in MBL in terms of health/bombs etc?

Thanks for the help, interested in your views on the two. If there's a thread which answers all of these, please accept my apologies and feel free to post the link.

[CStarFlare]

http://www.cave-stg.com/forum/index.php?topic=490.0

[GaijinPunch]

I heard that the scoring system is different, but which is more fun?

Enter: Can of Worms

[Elixir]

DS:

Fun to play for score
Not fun to play for survival

DS MBL:

Fun to play for survival
Not fun to play for score

[GaijinPunch]

Not fun to play for score

Not the truth.

NOTE: See my previous post.

[Taylor]

DS:
Dragons don't have necks.
One mistake halves your potential score.

DS:MBL
Dragons have necks.
One mistake reduces your potential score by a hundredth.

[Elixir]

Not fun to play for score

Not the truth.

NOTE: See my previous post.

It's not fun to play for score because not only do you lose your survival run, but your multiplier as well. At least DS isn't so hard on deaths, but you have the recharging stuff to deal with at a lower success rate.

Oh, and in DS MBL, all the enemies have different colours and Sakura is playable. I guess this makes the Canyon more tolerable, but a few safespots have been removed and it's harder in general, ie. you can get hit by the volcano boss' head unlike in the regular DS, and the forest boss is no longer cool.

[Herr Schatten]

the forest boss is no longer cool.

Care to elaborate?

[Elixir]

The forest boss in MBL no longer has the safespot for the final attack (as it does in DS and 1.1), so assuming you don't bomb on any of the other bosses, it's now the hardest pre-Canyon boss.

I don't like being forced to bomb, but it's either that, or a ridiculous amount of effort for a stage 3 (or possibly stage 4) boss. Considering you have 3 bosses after that which aren't as difficult.

[Skykid]

Interesting stuff, thanks for your input.

Why is original DS no fun to play for survival? Currently I'm enjoying both playing for survival and score on MBL - although I'm not 100% sure on the best scoring methods yet (starting to get a feel for it though - must watch vids.)

Thanks for the help!

[Elixir]

Because there's really not much of a reward for surviving. There's really hit or miss moments where you either recharge or seriously damage your score, like the huge rock in the volcano.

MBL is easier to recharge with (as is 1.1), but one death and your score is ruined. Take your pick.

[Skykid]

Because there's really not much of a reward for surviving. There's really hit or miss moments where you either recharge or seriously damage your score, like the huge rock in the volcano.

MBL is easier to recharge with (as is 1.1), but one death and your score is ruined. Take your pick.

Ah I see, so for the best possible MBL scores a no miss run is a requirement? I see how that stringent rule would be offputting (it is a bit to me.)

Why did they shift the balance so much, just to make scoring harder?

[hermosaguy]

Damn Windia avatars

[jonny5]

sakura ftw

although my g/f is getting pretty good with follet

[Taylor]

Sakura makes Rosa look balanced.

The main differences are in how your two counters fill up. In DS it's more short-term - you fill your Power Counter, you enter Fever Mode, you fill your Score Counter to max so enemies drop Gold Crowns, and then try and end Fever Mode in a way that restocks your Power Counter again (lots of Gold Crowns on screen). Ending Fever Mode resets your Score Counter and so it begins again. To do this you kill enemies with the right type, let crowns break in Fever Mode (but not outside of it), and you memorise exactly where you can restock and where to activate Fever Mode so it deactivates around there (not firing slows Fever Mode drain whereas Focus and Bombs do the opposite).

In MBL you need t do that too but restocking 'normally' is easier whereas restocking with the trick can't be done for several perfect stages until your Score Counter maxes (it doesn't reset anymore, but maxes out much, much higher). You can activate Fever Mode at 500 (though for score there's maybe one place you would do this afaik). You can now restock by sticking your option in the boss and hit the buttons funny to recharge instead. They also fixed some safe spots and exploits like the aforementioned tree boss and point blanking the dragon by standing in his neck so he dies before he fires a bullet. Level 999 is fun when it's not kicking you in the balls and the Ice Palace is the best stage by a huge margin.

It’s hard to say which one is better. I kind of prefer DS because it’s simpler and shorter. I will no-doubt change my mind when I feel finished with it and migrate to MBL.

[Skykid]

Thanks for the info Taylor, very helpful! Is it the PCB you're playing (I'm sure you don't have the 360 version... do you? )

[Taylor]

Nah, 360

[Doctor Fugue]

Thanks for the information. I stopped playing regular Death Smiles because the recharge thing was annoying me; to be more specific, everything else about the game is so intuitive and a pleasure to play that this one element seems to be out of place. Add to that the fact of how much score is increased through this technique and I am beginning to think this game isn't for me.

Having never played MBL or 1.1, could someone enlighten me as to exactly why the recharge is less annoying (ie. easier) there? Is it simply because it takes much longer to max out the secondary counter in MBL (although it never resets) and you only recharge a couple of times in one run, or is it more because charging the primary counter happens much quicker (and fever mode can be entered more often), or is the actual timing of the recharge different, in that you have more frames to execute the recharge?

I suppose another question would be does 1.1 go further to reduce the annoying qualities of the recharge because you can powerup at 100 and the primary counter increases at a much greater rate?

[Ravid]

Recharge is easier in MBL because skulls are worth more. This also has the effect that it is always more profitable to let the big crowns break up before collecting, as opposed to just in power up mode like in vanilla. Dying does not 'ruin' your score as is often claimed, though it does damage it. The real problem is if a death messes up your powerup cycle, possibly leading to more deaths (which will decimate your score).

I don't like what they did with the forest boss. Otherwise I think MBL is a better game.

[Skykid]

Nah, 360

Traitor.