Pulsewidth wrote:
The "smile curve" EQ is the same type of problem as low dynamic range - it's trading long term listenability for short term impact. Like dynamic compression, raised highs and lows makes the music more tiring to listen to.
It doesn't have to be a drastic smile curve .. the thing is, by themselves, many recordings will be much flatter than you're anticipating here. An important step in mastering is EQing. You don't need the recording to sound like it's exploding out of the speakers, but it also shouldn't be so flat that nothing pops.
Ex-Cyber wrote:There's no way that the pre-SH3 games are playing a fully prerecorded soundtrack. The ROMs are simply not big enough to contain a full soundtrack in any format that the hardware could play back in real time without sounding terrible.
IIRC, It is actually compressed audio. Each stage music in Dangun and DDP are about 1-minute loops, and there are only three different main stage songs. I think it is ADPCM, because I remember digging through the ROM and was able to hear something that sounded vaguely music-like. I can revisit it if you want.
That seems like a stretch (unless I'm screwing up my math), but I can't rule it out. It seems I was confused about what bitrates are necessary to make ADPCM not sound like crap, although I don't think 3 minutes could fit with the "typical" values I've seen mentioned.
Ex-Cyber wrote:It seems I was confused about what bitrates are necessary to make ADPCM not sound like crap, although I don't think 3 minutes could fit with the "typical" values I've seen mentioned.
Ok, let's say the music is at 16khz.. every ADPCM sample is 4-bit. ~480k then gets you a minute of audio. Dangun is 17MB total, and so I think this wouldn't be unreasonable. It really is fairly bad sounding quality-wise too.
Ex-Cyber wrote:It seems I was confused about what bitrates are necessary to make ADPCM not sound like crap, although I don't think 3 minutes could fit with the "typical" values I've seen mentioned.
Ok, let's say the music is at 16khz.. every ADPCM sample is 4-bit. ~480k then gets you a minute of audio. Dangun is 17MB total, and so I think this wouldn't be unreasonable. It really is fairly bad sounding quality-wise too.
That seems to fit; in fact it could also be a higher sample rate if it's mono; the sound chip can do 4-bit ADPCM and the sample ROM is 4MB.
Pulsewidth wrote:More SAW 85-92 fan than Aphex Twin fan in general.
Actually, that is very relevant - the original release is indeed brilliant, but poorly mastered
The newer remixed version (I got both) sounds a lot more crisp, as in, the tracks are better defined, there's more headroom. And incidentally, the track 'Pulsewidth' would have to be one of the best examples.
Namiki stated in a interview that the music in Caves PGM games are indeed made in a Mod-format.
Looking at the Mame source code, the PGM seems to have a fixed sample rate of 11025Hz / 8 bit mono. That illustrates why the technical sound quality of PGM games are like crap. It's even a lot below the low NEO GEOs standard of 18500kz / 16bit stereo / 4-bit adpcm.
But as you can barely hear anything in Asian arcades anyway it's just consequent from a business perspective. As a PCB collector myself, it's very disappointing though...
THE wrote:Looking at the Mame source code, the PGM seems to have a fixed sample rate of 11025Hz / 8 bit mono.
It's not fixed; someone probably just did a copy/paste/edit job on the ROM definitions. S.V.G. has some at 22050Hz and some at 11050Hz, and it appears that the hardware can handle all the way up to CD quality (16-bit/44100Hz). As for mono vs. stereo, mono samples don't imply mono output.
THE wrote:Namiki stated in a interview that the music in Caves PGM games are indeed made in a Mod-format.
Anyone have the interview handy? I wonder if MOD is used as a kind of catch-all, the way people casually use FM, MIDI and mode 7 as generic terms.
Also, I know there used to be MOD ripper programs, but they probably can't handle a huge file.. maybe we should try to rip the module data from the two PGM games I found which have the 8CHN string embedded in the sound rom.
on the topic of gear, I really like the FM sound in old games and found that a Yamaha TX81Z synth (rackmount) is pretty similar to the FM capabilities of a Sega Genesis, so I picked one up a couple years ago for cheap and program it from my PC with this guys utility http://the-all.org/tx81z/programmer.html
kemical wrote:on the topic of gear, I really like the FM sound in old games and found that a Yamaha TX81Z synth (rackmount) is pretty similar to the FM capabilities of a Sega Genesis, so I picked one up a couple years ago for cheap and program it from my PC with this guys utility http://the-all.org/tx81z/programmer.html
It's similar, but a bit more capable. It has a lot of different waveforms where the Genesis only had sine, and has detuning capabilities that the Genesis can't do either. I've got the FB-01 collecting dust on my desk over here, which is the TX81z minus the extra waves. I think it might even be sysex-compatible.. I wrote a utility which rips instruments from GYM files and can save them as a sysex dump for the FB-01. It's compiled for Mac so far but not Windows or Linux, but I might be able to do that if you'd like to give it a try and are comfortable with the command-line.
kemical wrote:on the topic of gear, I really like the FM sound in old games and found that a Yamaha TX81Z synth (rackmount) is pretty similar to the FM capabilities of a Sega Genesis, so I picked one up a couple years ago for cheap and program it from my PC with this guys utility http://the-all.org/tx81z/programmer.html
It's similar, but a bit more capable. It has a lot of different waveforms where the Genesis only had sine, and has detuning capabilities that the Genesis can't do either. I've got the FB-01 collecting dust on my desk over here, which is the TX81z minus the extra waves. I think it might even be sysex-compatible.. I wrote a utility which rips instruments from GYM files and can save them as a sysex dump for the FB-01. It's compiled for Mac so far but not Windows or Linux, but I might be able to do that if you'd like to give it a try and are comfortable with the command-line.
That would be awesome if you could see about a windows binary, I've messed with dumping instruments before but it was always to vopm or y12 format I think, I don't know how different those are to sysex
kemical wrote:on the topic of gear, I really like the FM sound in old games and found that a Yamaha TX81Z synth (rackmount) is pretty similar to the FM capabilities of a Sega Genesis, so I picked one up a couple years ago for cheap and program it from my PC with this guys utility http://the-all.org/tx81z/programmer.html
It's similar, but a bit more capable. It has a lot of different waveforms where the Genesis only had sine, and has detuning capabilities that the Genesis can't do either. I've got the FB-01 collecting dust on my desk over here, which is the TX81z minus the extra waves. I think it might even be sysex-compatible.. I wrote a utility which rips instruments from GYM files and can save them as a sysex dump for the FB-01. It's compiled for Mac so far but not Windows or Linux, but I might be able to do that if you'd like to give it a try and are comfortable with the command-line.
Hi im new here and i am fasinated you have actally figured out how to use instrument dumps on 4op fm hardware,
where can i find this tool as this would make my dreams come true.
