XBL-CG f-ed up thing.

[Kaspal]

So, i've been expending some money on games lately, specially in the XBLA and XBL-CG, for my X360.

what was my surprise, when yesterday i wanted to play some of the community games on my console, and it asked me to go online to start up the game.

when you wanna play XBLA games, that doesnt happens, but how come they force you to go online just to play an offline game, of which you already have a license to play the full version?...

i sent a mail to MS support, and this was their answer:

(warning, a lil wall of text incomming)...

Code: Select all

Thank you for contacting Microsoft online support for XBOX. I am Kody and I will be helping you today with this issue.

 

As I understand it, you are unable to play an Xbox Live community games offline and that you may also receive an error message or when you try to start an Xbox LIVE Community Game from your Xbox 360 console, you receive the following message:

 

You must be connected to Xbox LIVE to play this game

 

I know how frustrating the issue might have been for you and please let me try my best to help you resolve the problem.

 

This message is by design. There is no workaround for this issue. To play Xbox LIVE Community Games titles, you must be connected to Xbox LIVE to start the game title. After the game starts and loads, you can disconnect from Xbox LIVE if you want to.

 

[b]You must be connected to Xbox LIVE to start an Xbox LIVE Community Games title as part of our continued effort to provide family-safe content through the Community Games site. When the game starts, the Xbox LIVE service determines whether content was removed and blocked from play because it was determined to be inappropriate. If a title is removed and blocked from play because of offensive content, Microsoft will contact users who purchased the content, and will issue these users a refund for the purchase. [/b]

my question is, why do they do such stupid things?... i mean, for you to release a game thru XBL-CG, you must undergo some testing and shit, so why come with such silly excuses afterwards?... and, why dont they wanr the user about that before buying the games?

i find that annoying, because, i keep my console offline most of the time, and like to play my games offline... i dont think i'll be getting a gold account any time soon, simply not interested.

what if for some reason i wind up without connection to the internet for a long period of time? i'll have a ton of games sitting on my console to be played but unable to do so, because of a shitty policy?... c'mon! gimme a break!.

im asking for a refund... i really dont think that policy is any good. they cant force me to go online to play an OFFLINE game.

what really saddens me, is that i bought some really good games from the community, and knowing that Duality ZF will come thru that service, means i wont be able to paly it EVER. cuz again, im not going online just to play something that is supposed to be played offline most of the time.

[Specineff]

The Xbox reports a log of EVERYTHING you've played offline (even burns) everytime you connect to Live. Basically, they are asking you to report to them so they can do a full body search before letting you play your original games, because you, just like everybody else, could become a pirate and threaten their oh-so-precious and sacred business model. Even if you lack the means to do so.

[Kaspal]

The Xbox reports a log of EVERYTHING you've played offline (even burns) everytime you connect to Live. Basically, they are asking you to report to them so they can do a full body search before letting you play your original games, because you, just like everybody else, could become a pirate and threaten their oh-so-precious and sacred business model. Even if you lack the means to do so.

and i know that... i dont mind to go online from time to time, beause there are additional content for some games and shit... but, what bothers e is the fact that i HAVE to go online, to play a game that is SUPPOSED TO BE PLAYED OFFLINE!!!...

like i said before, what happens then, when, lets say, i go with MY console (i bought it, so its MINE, not theirs) to a place where theres no way to access the internet, and wanna play my XBL games?... i wont be able to paly'em because of that policy man!

only thing that we need now is that they force you to do the same with the retail games...

[Aru-san]

Our world is doomed when the time comes where internet is required to breathe.

[UnscathedFlyingObject]

Only thing you can do is give Ms the middle finger and stop buying their shit. I personally boycott digitally distributed games because I can't do whatever I want with them and when shit hits the fan, you're fucked. Let's go through the basics:

- One point of failure. If your HD dies, your whole game library goes down the drain.

- Can't lend, sell, or give my games to anyone.

- Can't play the game whenever I want to. Like when my internet is down and I have nothing better to do than play my games.

- No physical nothing and therefore no proof that you owned anything if your HD dies or your friends fuck up your copy of the game. Therefore, you're not entitled to have your backups anymore.

- Have to go through shit like creating web accounts for offline games.

- You're being spied through your console or computer.

- Need to pay a subscription fee for playing your game online.

- A hassle just to do something like playing your games at a friend's house and god forbid you have more than one.

- They have you by the balls because you don't own your games anymore. You're just allowed to play them as long as they want you to.

I know I'm forgetting something, but I'll be back when it occurs to me.

[Kaspal]

Only thing you can do is give Ms the middle finger and stop buying their shit. I personally boycott digitally distributed games because I can't do whatever I want with them and when shit hits the fan, you're fucked. Let's go through the basics:

- One point of failure. If your HD dies, your whole game library goes down the drain.

- Can't lend, sell, or give my games to anyone.

- Can't play the game whenever I want to. Like when my internet is down and I have nothing better to do than play my games.

- No physical nothing and therefore no proof that you owned anything if your HD dies or your friends fuck up your copy of the game. Therefore, you're not entitled to have your backups anymore.

- Have to go through shit like creating web accounts for offline games.

- You're being spied through your console or computer.

- They have you by the balls because you don't own your games anymore. You're just allowed to play them as long as they want you to.

I know I'm forgetting something, but I'll be back when it occurs to me.

i agree with all you said... specially the back up part, and the part where you cnt play your games while offline whenever you want (just my case here).

im waiting for them to reply me back, to ask them "nicely" to gimme my money back... lets see what happens... but i really REALLY regret now buying those... pretty cool games, but such policies kilss the purpose.

[szycag]

The licensing for the community games is crap and is a different license than official Xbox Live Arcade stuff where you have to be online to use it, as you have found out. If enough people complain maybe they will change it but I think it's there to ensure that Microsoft can monitor usage of the service.

Some of the stuff UFO says isn't true though insofar as Microsoft's service and excluding community games, namely the 1st 3rd and 4th points. Microsoft has a master list of everything you've ever bought so you can always redownload your stuff on a different hard drive, and you can now transfer your rights to the games from one system/hard drive setup to another using the rights management thing on xbox.com (the offline rights, which I'll explain in a second)

With Microsoft's server keeping track of everything you've bought, you would only have to worry about Microsoft's server ever crashing and losing all that data on who's bought what. In addition you get two licenses whenever you buy something, a license to your hard drive and system combination (for offline use) AND a license to your Live account. This is why you can log in at a friend's house, buy a game on your profile, and then your friend will have the offline license to it on their console but you can still play it at your house as long as you are online with your profile.

Agreed though, they've got you by the balls in a lot of ways.

[UnscathedFlyingObject]

That's as long as Microsoft wants you to be able to do that stuff. Fast forward 5 years from now, which is when your HD is likely to die on you and I can guarantee you that 1) your games won't available for download in their servers anymore and 2) they won't give a crap about you. All this stuff is policy-based and who's to say that they won't do the same they're doing with Live Arcade games as they're doing now with Community games?

At the end of the day though, no matter how you slice it, I feel like Ms and co. are trying to make us all their little bitches and hand them total control over our property. They can all go f themselves.

Edit: also want to mention that their online Right Management system sounds like a pain in the ass and that passing along physical copies is a zillion times better.

[Specineff]

I am so glad Sony lets you backup your PS3 HDD, no questions asked.

[UnscathedFlyingObject]

I am so glad Sony lets you backup your PS3 HDD, no questions asked.

How easy is that to do? I'm suspecting it involves digging pretty deep into underground forums and doing it homebrew-style instead of select an option in the XMB and watch the magic happen.

[Kaspal]

I am so glad Sony lets you backup your PS3 HDD, no questions asked.

actually, you can do that too with the X360 HDD... but its all explained in shady forums, thru shady methods.

im a lover of physical copies of my stuff, but sadly i fell in their trap, when they started to release sstuff i wanted to play... thru their online store.

now, i dont mind them tryin to find out what i do with my console, since all i do with it is play games... no modding, no shady stuff. but i understand why ppl complain about that... some kinda privacy invasion.

but again, squeezin' your balls, and force you to go online JUST TO PLAY?... they ca really go and fuck themselves.

[Specineff]

I am so glad Sony lets you backup your PS3 HDD, no questions asked.

How easy is that to do? I'm suspecting it involves digging pretty deep into underground forums and doing it homebrew-style instead of select an option in the XMB and watch the magic happen.

Connect USB HDD or flash drive to USB port on PS3.

Use Backup utility.

Live a happy life with REAL ULTIMATE POWER!

[lgb]

because you, just like everybody else, are a pirate and you threaten their oh-so-precious and sacred business model

Fixed.

[Kaspal]

because you, just like everybody else, are a pirate and you threaten their oh-so-precious and sacred business model

Fixed.

hehe... word.

i wish some ppl wasnt like the tipical sheep... and actually knew whai goin on, and act accordingly... so that way we could force them to NOT treat us the way they do, after all, they're keeping their "sacred bizz model" afloat in part, because of us.

[kengou]

Only thing you can do is give Ms the middle finger and stop buying their shit. I personally boycott digitally distributed games because I can't do whatever I want with them and when shit hits the fan, you're fucked. Let's go through the basics:

- One point of failure. If your HD dies, your whole game library goes down the drain.

- Can't lend, sell, or give my games to anyone.

- Can't play the game whenever I want to. Like when my internet is down and I have nothing better to do than play my games.

- No physical nothing and therefore no proof that you owned anything if your HD dies or your friends fuck up your copy of the game. Therefore, you're not entitled to have your backups anymore.

- Have to go through shit like creating web accounts for offline games.

- You're being spied through your console or computer.

- Need to pay a subscription fee for playing your game online.

- A hassle just to do something like playing your games at a friend's house and god forbid you have more than one.

- They have you by the balls because you don't own your games anymore. You're just allowed to play them as long as they want you to.

I know I'm forgetting something, but I'll be back when it occurs to me.

I'd just like to point out that none of almost none of this is true for Steam. No subscription fees, can run Steam in offline mode and play any game you've already downloaded without being online, can backup any of your games to CDs or your hard drive, can re-download any game as many times as you like with no cost to any computer on which you can log into Steam, you get receipts for each purchase as proof of ownership, and if Valve ever goes under they've said they'll unlock all games you own. The only thing that's true about Steam is 'can't lend, sell, or give games to anyone' which is a valid complaint

[Kaspal]

Only thing you can do is give Ms the middle finger and stop buying their shit. I personally boycott digitally distributed games because I can't do whatever I want with them and when shit hits the fan, you're fucked. Let's go through the basics:

- One point of failure. If your HD dies, your whole game library goes down the drain.

- Can't lend, sell, or give my games to anyone.

- Can't play the game whenever I want to. Like when my internet is down and I have nothing better to do than play my games.

- No physical nothing and therefore no proof that you owned anything if your HD dies or your friends fuck up your copy of the game. Therefore, you're not entitled to have your backups anymore.

- Have to go through shit like creating web accounts for offline games.

- You're being spied through your console or computer.

- Need to pay a subscription fee for playing your game online.

- A hassle just to do something like playing your games at a friend's house and god forbid you have more than one.

- They have you by the balls because you don't own your games anymore. You're just allowed to play them as long as they want you to.

I know I'm forgetting something, but I'll be back when it occurs to me.

I'd just like to point out that none of almost none of this is true for Steam. No subscription fees, can run Steam in offline mode and play any game you've already downloaded without being online, can backup any of your games to CDs or your hard drive, can re-download any game as many times as you like with no cost to any computer on which you can log into Steam, you get receipts for each purchase as proof of ownership, and if Valve ever goes under they've said they'll unlock all games you own. The only thing that's true about Steam is 'can't lend, sell, or give games to anyone' which is a valid complaint

too bad Steam is not XBL.

i just called the fuckin bastards... and after expending 15 minutes on that stupid call, the god damned representative hung the fucking phne up!....

called again like 3 times, and the call didnt go thru... im SO PISSED!!!!... i regret more and more to have bought this console now.... i think im gonna put it up for sale with the games and gamertag (since i still have some MSPs left to expend).

[neorichieb1971]

After having a PS3 I don't see myself going XB360 anytime soon. The consoles price has dived to the point where something half its power is worth more

I suppose its alright if your just buying now. But if I had bought a 360 3 years ago i'd see my investment drop at an alarming rate. I envisage MS send out a 360 trash man every week. Every street should have a RROD wheelie bin from the council.

Rampant piracy and a heavy bias towards western shooters to the point where anything else doesn't sell means they are doing something wrong. By the end of its lifespan the 360 is set to have more FPS games than the Neo Geo had fighters

I'm glad the 360 exists for competition regions and I know its online gaming worlds are probably the best out there. Maybe one day I will find out.. one day!

[Observer]

what really saddens me, is that i bought some really good games from the community, and knowing that Duality ZF will come thru that service, means i wont be able to paly it EVER. cuz again, im not going online just to play something that is supposed to be played offline most of the time.

Just a little interruption in the middle of the storm:

Don't despair or feel sad... yet.

Duality will also have a PC port (now where is my Raiden IV PC...?), which I hope won't need you to be online 100% of the time and might probably be a blast on multiplayer if set up properly.

[Ghegs]

(List of negative things about DLC)

Many of those are non-issues with GOG.com as well. You can re-download anything you've bought as many times you want and since the files are completely DRM-free you can slap them to a DVD-R, external harddrive or whatever and keep them safe AND play them on whichever computer you want. And they don't require an online activation, subscription fee or anything either.

[UnscathedFlyingObject]

Yeah, but GOG is for a bunch of really old games the majority of which none of us care much about. I want to play MegaMan 9, Contra Rebirth, Gradius Rebirth and others, not Colin Mcrae 2005.

[Ghegs]

Yeah, but GOG is for a bunch of really old games the majority of which none of us care much about. I want to play MegaMan 9, Contra Rebirth, Gradius Rebirth and others, not Colin Mcrae 2005.

Or you could actually look at the good games on the site, like the Fallout games, Freespace series, Arx Fatalis, Jagged Alliance 2, Beyond Good and Evil, Painkiller...

[Specineff]

^^^ Which also saves you from having to deal with shady dealers on ebay, if you are looking to play those games now. (I haven't played BG&E)

[UnscathedFlyingObject]

Yeah, but GOG is for a bunch of really old games the majority of which none of us care much about. I want to play MegaMan 9, Contra Rebirth, Gradius Rebirth and others, not Colin Mcrae 2005.

Or you could actually look at the good games on the site, like the Fallout games, Freespace series, Arx Fatalis, Jagged Alliance 2, Beyond Good and Evil, Painkiller...

If I'm a fan of those games, I'd already played them. I want me some MM9.