I was ready to switch the pins on the Neo Geo RGB cable when I saw this:
There's only one cable shared by both, pin 3 and 7! As you can see in the image both pins are soldered. Is this normal? If I understood correctly, I must switch between pin 3 (Composite Video) and pin 7 (Composite Sync) but since there's only one cable and only need the composite sync, I guess by just unsoldering pin 3, this might work... Do you think this is the reason why the XRGB-3 shows those image distortions and blackouts?
Konsolkongen was correct in pretty much everything but the resistor's connection. For some reason, this one is connected to pin 4 (5 volt out):
What should I do with it? Does it affect the image quality at all if I keep it there or should I remove it?
To short the composite video and the composite sync pin is a safeguard, so the cable works on all NG revisions, but it also boosts the signal level, so this might very well be the reason why your XRGB behaves this way. If you have a soldering iron around, try the single pins. You have to check which pins works better. On some NGs it's the sync pin, on others it's the video pin.
On the Scart side: for running RGB into the XRGB no voltage signal is needed. I can't see to which pin it's running or how exactly it's wired, so leave it for the moment. Is this a japanese or european scart layout ?
Animaitor wrote:
Konsolkongen was correct in pretty much everything but the resistor's connection. For some reason, this one is connected to pin 4 (5 volt out):
The sync pin in the RGB cable is pin 20 in europe (pin 9 in a JAP cable). So just leave resistor in place.
/useless info:
Removing it won't do a thing since the XRGB-3 doesn't use the voltage in the cable (hurray!), but it might not work on a normal tv if you remove it.
I have no comment on the combined pin 3&7, but what Fudoh says makes sense to me
Problem solved... kinda >_<' Last night I resoldered the cable to only pin 7 (Composite Sync) first. Fired up the Neo Geo and no video. Back to soldering and changed it to pin 3 (Composite Video). No video. For the heck of it I changed the XRGB-3 setting from B1 to B0 and for my surprise the image came back! After this I disconnected the NG, changed back to B1 and AFC to level 5 and rebooted the XRGB-3. No video... but I waited and after 20 seconds or so, the XRGB was showing video again, this time with no distortions and no blackouts!! It's almost as if the XRGB was warming up. Weird. The test was made with Metal Slug 3 so just in case I switched cartridges. This time Blazing Star first and Pulstar later. Same thing. No video at the beginning and after 20~25 seconds (I believe it took a little longer on this games) the video came back, again with no bending or blackouts. I played around with the AFC and this time I could tell the image disappeared if I was going beyond level 6, having 5 the best image quality imho but not perfect. Some white thin lines have a tinny little flicker, almost not perceptible to tell you the truth and no visible when playing.
To tell you the truth, I have no idea what's going on and can't come up with a clear conclusion. Maybe having the cable on pin 7 was also fine because I didn't change the AFC setting... I know is not the best way to have this setup but there's nothing else I can do. I'm not too good soldering so I'll ask Markus how much will be for a NG RGB cable with the LM1881 chip and if is not too expensive I'll get that. He's already working on a 4BNC to RGB for my Emotia so I can save in shipping. Waiting 20 seconds on B1 is not that bad though... booting up my PC takes 3 times longer!
Konsolkongen, I'll leave the resistor then. Fudoh, the layout for the scart is Japanese. Thanks again for your comments and all your help!
Not really. If you read into how Soft 15khz works, you can add modeline 15khz video modes to your linux distribution as well. Don't ask me for details, but it should work fine. Soft 15khz does nothing more than to enable a few compatible modes in Windows. You can do the same on Linux.
Hey Akumoto, have you tried to tweak Mame's scanline overlay pattern? I didn't like the look of any of the settings available but Fudoh sared his on this post:
you can create your own or tweak the ones that come with Mame (little different depending on the version) with Photoshop. The one that gives me the best results is the one Fudoh posted (look at his first message) at the link I gave you before. It's hard to see but it's there! Save it to your Mame's folder and select it from the emulators options. I just rotate that png 90 degrees so the scanlines appear horizontally instead of vertically but you can also change that in Mame's properties I think.
It's actually a little bit more complicated. To get faithful scanlines you need to create a PNG based on your screen resolution (calculate the average scaling factor to determine the number of lines needed). If you play YOKO you need a different set for those games as the active resolution of the games changes.
(Well - using the same works of course, but it's not a near perfect 1 pixel = 1 scanline match....)
Hello All,
would getting an xrgb-3 only be necessary if you're playing on an LCD? I just started getting into shmups and have been playing ibara on my ps2 but it looks really ugly on my sony 34xbr960. So I was just wondering if getting something like an xrgb would make that much of a difference? would a dvdo iscan hd+ do the same thing? I could get one for like $200 but i don't know if that's a good deal. I've been reading all the stuff i can about all this but I just can't make sense of it. sorry if i'm making anyone upset with the questions. Thanks for any help I receive in advance.
I doubt the XRGB-3 can be hooked up to a CRT tv. Anyway it wouldn't do any difference. Ibara looked awful when i saw it at a friends CRT.
Many PS2 titles are covered in filters that makes them look blurry and smoother. It works pretty good with 3D games on CRT tvs but looks hideous on LCD tvs. Yakuza 1 and 2 is a good example.
I don't know exactly if thats the case with Ibara but the other Cave shooters i have seen on PS2 and CRT tvs all looked great.
EDIT: Remember to use S-Video or better RGB/ Component if your tv has those inputs. It will make a big difference from the standard cables.
Yeah, Ibara pretty much stays ugly whatever you do. The combination of a 240p-patched version plus a XRGB2/3 for added scalines helps though.
The question of XRGB vs. iScan HD+ is wether you're playing mainly 240p titles or 480i. The XRGB series has advantages when using 240p output, but the iScan is pretty nice for 480i material. If you can live without scanline emulation, I'd spend the $200 for the HD+, it's a good price.
wow. thanks for all the answers guys. fudoh, i read your "Deinterlacing classic videogame systems" and "Scanlines demystified" and i was just wanting to get the games to look as sweet as those pictures you had. i have my dreamcast running through vga but when i play street fighter III the characters are really pixilated. with my ps2, i'm also playing mushihimesama and espgaluda. would just getting a smaller crt and tating it give me better image with component cables?
Your 34" Sony is one sweet CRT. I would stick with it. Your Sony has component inputs, right ? We didn't have the progressive Sony tubes over here in Germany, but I guess yours can accept 480p as well, right ?
With large screens and low-res games it's basically either a blur filter (as many games have built in, but it's ugly as it gets), sharp, but pixelated sprites or a compensation with scanlines. The scanlines usually smooth out the blockiness and give a much nicer picture.
Mushihimesama PS2 is a botched conversion, but how do you like the picture of Galuda WHEN set to Tate (not Yoko and not Tatehose) ? ESP switches to 240p which should give clear (real) scanlines on your display.
How do you connect your DC ? Do you have a VGA to component transcoder ?
Hey Fudoh, yup. It has component inputs and can accept 480p. I just popped in ESP to try it in tate and it looked a lot nicer. I didn't notice any scanlines but the overall image was better. I have my DC hooped up via a vga box to a viewsonic G220fb. Games like pysvariar 2 and under defeat look great on it. i guess that's because they're not spites though.
Need some advise, should I get a 2+ or 3? I'm planning to get Samsung's 40" 530 Full HD LCD TV soon, and I'll hook up the following to the XRGB:
1. Saturn (RGB)
2. CDX (RGB)
3. DC (RGB)
4. PS1 (RGB)
5. SNES (RGB)
6. NGCDZ (RGB)
7. CMVS (S-Video)
8. N64 (S-Video, very tempted but no confident to do RGB mod)
9. Duo R (Composite)
And I'm not sure whether to connect PAL GC, PS2 and XBox (all via Component) directly to the TV or through the XRGB.
It's a matter of taste. If you want 480p output with scanlines only, you can use either one. If you want upscaling to SXGA or Full HD, get a 3. The 3 has the advantage that you can hook up the DC via VGA, PS2 and XBox via component and feed 480p into the XRGB as well.
No RF with any version of the XRBG series... There's a Displ-TV which is a RF version of the XRGB-2, but it's likely that it only works with japanese RF signals, not american ones.
Fudoh wrote:No RF with any version of the XRBG series... There's a Displ-TV which is a RF version of the XRGB-2, but it's likely that it only works with japanese RF signals, not american ones.
That's interesting. I'll pass that along, actually. Honestly I found the whole notion of an RF upscaler quite ludicrous.
The intention is different. The Displ-TV is a VGA Tuner box (RF input, integrated tuner, VGA output) which in addition has a built in RGB and component input for videogames. It's more of a multi-purpose box for small japanese flats, so people can use their VGA monitors for TV and videogames as well...
Hi, i am new to the XRGB-3 Scene, i just got mine a few weeks ago, and i have to tell you that at least my machine has absolutly NO problem to process PAL signals via the frontscart at all. The picture just has to be repositioned and there you go. The picture Quality is stunning, no artefacts, no shadows, no halos. Its important to use B0 mode with the LPF option turned off! I tested it with a Playstation 1 and some euro pal games. The results always were amazing. So, the XRGB-3 is _the_ game console scaler especially for vintage systems be they NTSC or PAL. All i miss is an english menu (who doesn't, hehe) and, more important, preset save locations. With Presets you would be able to save a certain setting to a save slot and then when you need it (at a console change) just recall it with a click on a button. That would be most convenient since really each singe console needs its own settings. With presets you wont have to fiddle around in the option menus each time you change the gaming system connected.
Q: The Preset System. How can it look, handled and used?
A: Most of us use more than just one gaming system with the XRGB-3. Each time you change the console connected you have to enter the XRGB's menus to re-edit the optimal settings for the specific console you use. You have to do this each time you change the console wich is really annoying. Lets say you have a preset system. So, you connect your first System, lets say a PC-Engine. Now you edit all the parameters in the XRGB menu to your liking. This can last several minutes! After that is done, you press the setting button (wich isnt existing, i know), then a new menu should appear on screen, you give the Setting a name (lets say "PC-Engine RGB/NTSC") and save it to slot 1. That would make preset #1. Now you connect the next console. Let's say a PSX PAL. Again you have to set the menu parameters to your liking (wich will be totally different to the previous setting for sure) and after that is done you save it to preset slot #2 giving it the name "PSX RGB/PAL" for example. And so you go through all the console you want to use with the XRGB. In the end you may have like 15 or 20 saved presets, all named with the consoles name. Now each time you change the console, you just enter the menu, select the desired (pre-edited) preset for the currently connected gaming console and within a second all parameters are loaded and activated. I guess that would be easy to implement, maybe just a 2 or 4k SRAM would be needed for that. With an feature like that the XRGB-3 would be PERFECT.
Last edited by CrackLtd on Wed May 20, 2009 9:18 am, edited 2 times in total.
(i'm on linux)