Classic games you don't like.

[roushimsx]

In fairness, though, most everyone else seems to love Mario World 2: Yoshi's Island; I never understood why. I like the visual style (it was especially unique back in the day) and some of the gameplay ideas, but the control simply felt "off" to me...in most other Mario games, you could make him either "walk" or "run" depending on the situation; with Yoshi, you're stuck at one speed, and the only platforming advantage you've really got in return is the limited "float" ability. And on top of that, despite all my problems with it, it's still easy enough for me to have twice had a perfect game on it. Not up to its pedigree.

Oh lord do I ever hate Yoshi's Island.

[LoneSage]

Metroid anything and Kid Icarus.

Yoshi's Island, oh how I long to actually enjoy you.

[Andi]

Shadowrun (SNES) - Let's see... let's mix a bad sci fi Sierra adventure game with Ultima 8 and see what we can come up with. The only reason people remember this game so fondly is because of the graphics (which look beautiful, and much like Ultima 8, they really do go a long way in hiding the shittiness of the underlying game from people just glancing at screenshots). Outside of the early Fed Ex Simulator and the lackluster graphics, the Genesis version trounced all over the grossly inferior SNES version.

While the SNES version is FAR INFERIOR to the Genny version. The SNES version has a lot going for it. The character advancement system is better than most other SNES RPG's with more options (even though it doesn't follow the SR tabletop rules at all). The story is relatively interesting (compared to typical RPG fare). The game also has a very good moody atmosphere (assisted by the graphics, certainly).

[Darkcomet72]

Heh. It was inevitable.

Blaster master was a very annoying game.

[sethsez]

You know, I used to LOVE Blaster Master way back when.

Then I went back and played it recently.

I still love the side-scrolling parts (the tank's physics feel better than just about anything else on the NES), but the overhead areas are awful.

[jp]

Vay - See Lunar and then multiply it a few times.

Vay was just someone trying to make an impossibly hard RPG. I swear, I power level like a madman in every RPG I play, and even I was getting my ass handed to me by early bosses. I think I was 10 levels higher than I normally would be at one point and the boss was STILL impossibly difficult. And its not like the game has much in the way of strategy...



At any rate:
Gradius - If you don't 1-life it... you probably won't win. Its so damn annoying to play a game for 30 minutes, die, and then just be fucked. I can't bring myself to play any Gradius game more than once a week.

Darius - When the boss fights are longer than the levels jp gets bored.

R-Type - GREAT enemy/level design. Everything else is just... meh... IMO anyways.

Any Final Fantasy after 6 (I assume this includes Mystic Quest) - The characters get gayer and the storylines get dumber. *Sigh* I used to be a huge Square fanboy myself...

194X series - Barring 19XX (I think?), I just don't get these games. Why a shmup should have 30 levels is beyond me.

Harmful Park - Played it on my DC, boringly easy and just not that fun...

[Darkcomet72]

I'm starting to hate meh more than lol.
meh sounds like a stupid grunt that gets no point across, lol is only disliked because of the broken unfluid nature of computer lingo altogether.

Also, Yoshi's island was meant to be speedrun. Sure, speedruns of other games might be faster, but these are far more complex and require much more strategy.

[jp]

"meh" is used when something isn't even worth of an indepth description of its mediocrity.

[Capt. Takehiko]

SNK fighting games pretty much all stink.

When you give an opinion you must back it up with a reason. I'd also be interested to see which ones you do not think "stink".

[Herr Schatten]

I don't like any of the sonic games. Personally I just found them dull and totally devoid of any skillfull gameplay mechanics. Give me the plumber any day!

Toss me on this pile. Every Sonic game I've ever played was far too "gimmicky" for me; it was more about finding spots where you could hold the "right" button down and watch him zoom through half the stage, than anything else. Precision platforming? He just wasn't built for it.

Exactly as I feel about the MD Sonic games. The stages are just too long and too repetitive. And I absolutely HATE the underwater stages in every single Sonic game on the MD.

If you want to play a GOOD Sonic game, you'll have to try the Sega Master System version of Sonic 1. I don't get tired of recommending it, but most people just seem to write it off as a dumbed down port of the original, WHICH IT IS NOT. It's totally different.
Obviously the creators knew they couldn't recreate the speed of the original, so they just threw it overboard and put in precision platforming and very original stage designs. Great stuff!



As for classics I dislike, in addition to chiming in with the Treasure-hating crowd (their games are just overambitious - less is more, guys) I'll have to add:

Darius - I love big mechanical fish as much as the next guy, but the levels in the first two games (I haven't played any of the later ones) are just incredibly dull. Dull, dull, dull. And to be honest, the bosses, as cool as they look, aren't much better either.

Giga Wing and Mars Matrix - Before Rob and Rando jump on me because I don't like their favourites: Yes, I got the hang of the reflect force system, it's not that hard to master. And, no, I don't just suck at those games. I could get pretty far in them if I bothered.
I guess it's because I don't particularly enjoy playing for score that I dislike them. If you play for survival alone the games pretty much break down to simply memorizing when to use the reflect force and when to dodge normally. While I don't mind the memorization present in R-Type style games, it annoys the hell out of me in Takumi's outputs. I can see how those games appeal to some people, I can even see that they are finely crafted quality games, but they're certainly not for everyone. They are not for me, that's for sure.

Oh yes, and I think Mars Matrix is ugly as hell. Why its graphics are praised so much is far beyond me.

[sethsez]

Darius - I love big mechanical fish as much as the next guy, but the levels in the first two games (I haven't played any of the later ones) are just incredibly dull. Dull, dull, dull. And to be honest, the bosses, as cool as they look, aren't much better either.

If you're not anti-MAME, try Darius Gaiden. Although I enjoy the first two games in the series as well, there's a GIGANTIC leap from II to Gaiden in terms of playability. It also has some of the best level and boss design of any shmup out there, which... well, isn't something I'd say about the first two. It'd be a shame to miss Gaiden because the original sucks.

[ST Dragon]

R-Type Series – Those annoying checkpoints, the high-memorization & the fact that you lose all your weapons at death is one very frustrating experience indeed.

Gradius IV – Same as R-Type…

Mortal Kombat Series – Nice graphics & fatalities, but that doesn’t make a great game..

Final Fantasy Series – Turned based RPGs bore me to death.

Dangun Feveron - I Just don't like the red dominated graphics, the gameplay nor the music.

[system11]

R-Type Series – Those annoying checkpoints, the high-memorization & the fact that you lose all your weapons at death is one very frustrating experience indeed.

Kind of funny seeing R-Type come up so often due to memorisation. Most modern shmups demand absolute positioning memorisation to a higher degree. Example chaining, attack waves that can only be survived one way, bullet spreads that you have to know about and can't react to.

[Herr Schatten]

R-Type Series – Those annoying checkpoints, the high-memorization & the fact that you lose all your weapons at death is one very frustrating experience indeed.

Kind of funny seeing R-Type come up so often due to memorisation. Most modern shmups demand absolute positioning memorisation to a higher degree. Example chaining, attack waves that can only be survived one way, bullet spreads that you have to know about and can't react to.

My thoughts exactly.

[DEL]

^I'll second and third that.

Memorisation is part and parcel of all shoot'em ups. I'm not keen on people who just want to switch their brains off when playing one.
The Japanese don't design them that way.


Oh....and back on topic; Treasure shooters (not counting Sin & Punishment).

[Bishamon]

Darius - I love big mechanical fish as much as the next guy, but the levels in the first two games (I haven't played any of the later ones) are just incredibly dull. Dull, dull, dull. And to be honest, the bosses, as cool as they look, aren't much better either.

Giga Wing and Mars Matrix - Before Rob and Rando jump on me because I don't like their favourites: Yes, I got the hang of the reflect force system, it's not that hard to master. And, no, I don't just suck at those games.

/agree

Though my only exposure to the Darius series has been Darius Gaiden on Saturn, I found it to be quite boring.

Giga Wing was just okay for me (and I never purchased the sequel), but I really didn't enjoy Mars Matrix at all. Maybe I should go back and play it again, as I didn't really give it much chance. I can't really tell you exactly why I didn't like it, but this...

Oh yes, and I think Mars Matrix is ugly as hell. Why its graphics are praised so much is far beyond me.

...is definitely part of the reason. Also, to me, it just felt as if it was thrown together by someone who was trying to make a decent shooter, but had no idea what they were doing. I probably sucked at it, too, which wouldn't have helped. It's been a long while since I played it, and it's become so highly regarded, maybe I should give it another go.

[Sly Cherry Chunks]

R-Type is generally a slow paced and sombre affair. Mistakes in modern shmups are usually punished with a lost life or a poorer score. A mistake in R-Type is punished with Absolute Irreversible Death - back to the start of the game, basically.

I absolutely adore the R-Type series but I can see why the gameplay would grate with some.

Classic games I dislike -

Mario - Visually repellent. The gameplay could well be sublime, I'll never know as I cannot stomach the characters for more than half an hour. The fact that the fanart boards I frequent are completely saturated with sub-par Mario artwork only serves to fuel my Irrational Hatred.

Zelda - Link To The Past was cute. The story and characters didnt exactly grab my interest so I think I abandoned this one half way - that's not to say it's a bad game. Sadly, I found the Universally Acclaimed 'Ocanaria of Time' to be little more than a 3D rehash of the previous title. Couple this with the amount of fanwanking the series gets and you can see why my Unholy Rage burns as it does.

Mortal Kombat - Once the blood novelty wears off, you realise that this game and it's sequels have no depth. Why is this series still going? WHY??

Rainbow Islands - Never got on with this game. I always felt like I had little control over the main character, especially his jumps. The fact that this was once heralded as the Greatest Amiga Game Of All Time over the infinitely superior Turrican causes my Anger to swell to an Immeasurable Intensity. I tried spending some more time with this game as it was included on a Bubble Bobble compilation for PSX. Its just not something I want to put the effort into though.

[raiden]

Kind of funny seeing R-Type come up so often due to memorisation. Most modern shmups demand absolute positioning memorisation to a higher degree. Example chaining, attack waves that can only be survived one way, bullet spreads that you have to know about and can't react to.

it´s not the memorization I don´t like, because I agree that is necessary for almost any shmup - no, it´s the claustrophobic feeling of being forced to move my ship in tiny, preset areas and nowhere else. On the one hand, this isn´t terribly funny, on the other, once you get the hang of it, the challenge level drops to boredom.
Modern shmups tend to nudge you softly into one directions to create certain effects with their bullet patterns, but they don´t use solid, impenetrable lasers. They use things like bullet streams which CAN be dodged through, even if it is hard to achieve, and complying is usually the easier choice.

[FatCobra]

Ok, even though I like classic videogames more than current ones, that doesn't mean I like all classic videogames. Here we go:

Metroid (NES) - I found the other Metroids past Super fantastic, but this one leaves me stone cold. As other people said, buggy gameplay and somewhat lame graphics. Super Metroid though is excellent.

Metroid 2 (GB) - Even though this was my first Metroid game, when I played it recently, it didn't age well at all. Way too easy to get lost for hours and I hated the ambient music. The overworld theme rocked though. I do not hate all Metroids though, Super and Prime are awesome.

Zelda 2 (NES) - I love Zelda, but I can't love this title for some reason. Maybe the Zelda series were not supposed to be side-scrolling RPGs. Black sheep of the series in my opinion. (Let's leave the CD-i games out of the equation here).


Mario Party (N64) - Just found it boring and stupid. The voices were obnoxious.

Final Fantasy Anthology and Chronicles (PS1) - The long loading times ruined some prefectly good RPGs. FF4 was okay, but I'm not really fond of that FF anymore.

Final Fantasy II USA (SNES) - I loved it as a kid, but now, the linear party and storyline bore me to tears. Which is funny, considering that I love Earthbound to death and that has linear storyline and characters too. I guess the quirkiness saves Earthbound. FF4 really bored me I guess due to lack of character customization and boring medival story.

Contra series - I guess I'm spoiled by Metal Slug, but the gameplay never really clicked with me and I found it really dumb that you can die by simply bumping into an enemy soldier. Where as in Metal Slug, you can knife the bastard before he knifes you.

[BulletMagnet]

Mistakes in modern shmups are usually punished with a lost life or a poorer score. A mistake in R-Type is punished with Absolute Irreversible Death - back to the start of the game, basically.

I've always found Gradius games much more guilty of this than R-Type games, in general...not to say that R-Type never does this, of course.

[judesalmon]

The problem is you are playing the wrong Slug.
Everyone knows that Metalslug 2 is the best slug, and on mvs of course..not roms..

Regardless of the other games in the series, could you explain to me in what way Metal Slug 2 is better than Metal Slug X, seeing as Metal Slug X is the same game, but without all the slowdown?

[BUHA]

I can't get into Compile games. And what's the deal with Space Megaforce? Those levels are soooo long. And i heard somewhere that there's something like 12 stages in it? WTF

I hate how Nintendo fanboys totally ignore how good a game is and just decide to like it if it has their favorite characters in it. Why ANYBODY would want to waste their time playing Zelda 2 for the NES is totally beyond me. What a piece of shit, AWFUL game. And the little Nintendo fanboys will tell you it's the best game EVER. Somehow, they enjoyed it, and i think it's because it says Zelda on it. If you don't believe me, check out forums.nintendo.com and see for yourself on the "legacy systems" message board. A truly depressing little place.

I agree with Donkey Kong Country. So much for variety in a game.

Mortal Kombat. Everybody knows that we only played the originals because they had a bunch of blood in it and when we were little that was cool. But it's just button mashing. I swear the best move in the MKII is the jump kick. I'd play at the arcade and that's all anybody did.

I also agree with what has been said about Blaster Master, and Defender! SO MANY BUTTONS. that game can kiss my ass.

EDIT: just remembered. Earthbound. It seems like everybody likes it, but to me it's just a terribly boring game. The Dragon Warrior style battles really didn't help, either.

[sethsez]

In all fairness, Zelda II is hated by many people and is defintiely the black sheep of the series. I think the Zelda name hurt the game more than it helped (you don't really see all this venom directed at Faxanadu, which is extremely similar).

Still duller than dirt, though.

[jp]

Mistakes in modern shmups are usually punished with a lost life or a poorer score. A mistake in R-Type is punished with Absolute Irreversible Death - back to the start of the game, basically.

I've always found Gradius games much more guilty of this than R-Type games, in general...not to say that R-Type never does this, of course.

If you die at the Maoi head boss in Gradius II, its over. All that work for nothing.

[Neon]

The problem is you are playing the wrong Slug.
Everyone knows that Metalslug 2 is the best slug, and on mvs of course..not roms..

Regardless of the other games in the series, could you explain to me in what way Metal Slug 2 is better than Metal Slug X, seeing as Metal Slug X is the same game, but without all the slowdown?

Not quite. There are a few other differences between the two, the most important of which being that 2 doesn't have rocket lawnchairs

And yes, anything by Compile and almost anything by Nintendo can be skipped.

[MSZ]

Mistakes in modern shmups are usually punished with a lost life or a poorer score. A mistake in R-Type is punished with Absolute Irreversible Death - back to the start of the game, basically.

I've always found Gradius games much more guilty of this than R-Type games, in general...not to say that R-Type never does this, of course.

If you die at the Maoi head boss in Gradius II, its over. All that work for nothing.

Serious? Its one of the easiest Moai stage to recover in the series. If you die at the Moai stage in arcade GIII its really over.

[jp]

The boss part of the Moai stage? With the three heads, one on the bottom, one of the top, and one in front of you?


Maybe Gradius II and Gradius II Gofer are two different games... but with 4 lives left I couldn't kill those damn heads after they got a lucky shot off for the life of me.

[roushimsx]

(you don't really see all this venom directed at Faxanadu, which is extremely similar).

Well Faxanadu was a little different from Zelda II in some key areas:
1) The graphics were better
2) The control was better
3) The level designs were a mega-shit-ton-load better
4) The music was better
5) The character was much more customizable

IMO Nintendo should have just licensed Faxanadu, changed the name, and called it Zelda II. Hide some triangles around the game, give the main character a hat, and rewrite the text to suit the license and wham..instant Zelda game. Hell, if they were willing to do it with Mario 2...

[sethsez]

Well, I hate Faxanadu so I disagree on most of those points, and I don't even like Zelda II.

[roushimsx]

Well, I hate Faxanadu so I disagree on most of those points, and I don't even like Zelda II.

Fair enough