I found Lunar Legend a few weeks ago, and I've been dicking around in it a little bit, but I'm not too impressed. I hope that this isn't the Lunar series I've heard so much praise for, that LL is a watered-down port that doesn't do the name Lunar justice.
I don't have a Sega CD, but I've been considering getting one, largely for the Lunar games. But I do have a Saturn, and I'm interested in the ports to that system. I've heard gripes that there were gameplay changes made, but I've never seen any specifics. Aside from aesthetics, what's the difference between the Sega CD and Saturn Lunars?
And what of MPEG card requiring Lunar Silver Star Story Complete? Is it actually worth it, is there anything else I'd ever use the card for? And is there any difference between that version and the Lunar Silver Star Story Complete that appeared on the PSX?
And what's the deal with Magic School Lunar?
Questions about the Lunar games
There were major plot changes between the Sega CD, Saturn/PS, and GBA versions of the original game. It's generally assumed that the Sega CD version is the best, the Saturn/PS version is slightly inferior, and the GBA game is just a Cliff's Notes rehash. However, I personally think the PS version is the best out of all of them (there's no real difference between it and the Saturn version, but the PS version has far better packaging and is actually available in english, so with everything else being equal the Saturn version is rather pointless).
Eternal Blue is pretty much the same in all formats barring some very minor changes. Go with the PS version on that since it doesn't have the annoying save system the Sega CD version has.
And yeah, the GBA version is pretty much only fun for people who already know the story. It certainly doesn't hold up well on its own, though just to warn you, Lunar isn't some huge epic that people love for its intricate plot. People love it because it's simple and charming with some very well-developed characters. The epic plot is almost secondary.
Eternal Blue is pretty much the same in all formats barring some very minor changes. Go with the PS version on that since it doesn't have the annoying save system the Sega CD version has.
And yeah, the GBA version is pretty much only fun for people who already know the story. It certainly doesn't hold up well on its own, though just to warn you, Lunar isn't some huge epic that people love for its intricate plot. People love it because it's simple and charming with some very well-developed characters. The epic plot is almost secondary.
Lunar is easily my favorite RPG series. I've just played the PS and Sega CD versions of both. Lunar Legend is crap and has nothing on the original. My thoughts:
-The difference between Sega CD Lunar and the remake is far greater than the Lunar 2s.
-I'd take the remake of 1 over the original and the original over the remake of 2. Lunar 1 original has random battles everywhere, which is bad. Sega CD 2 has less spoken dialogue, which is good because there's some really bad shit in it. The ending in the PS version is nearly unbearable. The dungeons have a much different design style, while the PS version's feel either dumbed down or annoying (kamikaze bombs). The soundtrack is not as good as the original. And when it comes down to it, there's an appeal to playing a game so advanced on the Genesis/SCD, and of course that's lost in the transition to remake.
Why would anyone want the Saturn versions??
-The difference between Sega CD Lunar and the remake is far greater than the Lunar 2s.
-I'd take the remake of 1 over the original and the original over the remake of 2. Lunar 1 original has random battles everywhere, which is bad. Sega CD 2 has less spoken dialogue, which is good because there's some really bad shit in it. The ending in the PS version is nearly unbearable. The dungeons have a much different design style, while the PS version's feel either dumbed down or annoying (kamikaze bombs). The soundtrack is not as good as the original. And when it comes down to it, there's an appeal to playing a game so advanced on the Genesis/SCD, and of course that's lost in the transition to remake.
Why would anyone want the Saturn versions??
I honestly don't remember many changes (certainly none as drastic as SSSC), but in all fairness it's been years since I played the SCD version. However, I'll never forget how terrible the save system was... the PS version wins for that alone IMO.Nemo wrote:Lunar EB Sega CD >x10 Lunar EBC PS
Tons of plot changes, level changes, difficulty changes, all for the worse.
I never had any trouble with Lunar 2's save system on the Sega CD. While it is a stupid idea, the game isn't difficult enough that you need to worry about saving all the time.
Lunar 2 on the SCD was more fun than the PS, IMO. Probably a lot of it has to do with Rob's aforementioned "wow factor". Playing a 16-bit game that was advanced for its time is much more exciting than playing a 32-bit game that was designed on an old systen.
Lunar 2 on the SCD was more fun than the PS, IMO. Probably a lot of it has to do with Rob's aforementioned "wow factor". Playing a 16-bit game that was advanced for its time is much more exciting than playing a 32-bit game that was designed on an old systen.
*Spoilerz Alert*sethsez wrote:I honestly don't remember many changes (certainly none as drastic as SSSC), but in all fairness it's been years since I played the SCD version. However, I'll never forget how terrible the save system was... the PS version wins for that alone IMO.Nemo wrote:Lunar EB Sega CD >x10 Lunar EBC PS
Tons of plot changes, level changes, difficulty changes, all for the worse.
-
-
-
-
-
The only thing that stood out to me in SSSC in terms of changes for the worse was Ghaleon doesn't kill the white dragon like he did in SSS, which I thought detracted from the plot. There were some other minor tweaks like the battle system, but nothing deplorable and the nice thing about SSSC was that it fleshed out a lot of events which enhanced the overall story, so more content was added without changing much in the process. On the flipside Lunar EBC actually subtracted and changed so many things that I wouldn't even know where to start. Some of the main things off the top of my head include: Dumbifying Leo, changing the scene at the Cathedral, removing the boss who ambushes you on the mountain, removing the challenge from the Borgan fight, and worse of all, getting rid of all the awesome dungeons. Lunar EB had awesome puzzles to the dungeons, Lunar EBC did away with all of them. The last dunegon in Lunar Blue SCD was so epic, the music, the design, the puzzles, all of it. The last dungeon in EBC freakin' sucks, as does the whole game quite frankly.
Also, as others have said, the save situation in EB SCD is a non-issue after the first 15 minutes.
I'll toss in my two cents... I think Lunar 1 is actually better on the PS. Yeah, they made a few negative changes - it's easier and a few minor plot issues have been altered, but the game flows more smoothly overall, the characters are a bit more fleshed out, the dialogue has been re-written, and the font is easier on the eyes. The font means a lot in an RPG since you're reading non-stop. I haven't played the GBA version, but I've heard an awful lot of bad things about it...
I may not be fully qualified to discuss this topic due to the direction it's going, but for my money, the PSX games (Lunar: SSSC & Lunar 2: EB) are the way to go. Keep in mind that I HAVE NOT played the SCD originals, as they are far too expensive and I didn't have the SCD at the time to have purchased them.
The only video games I have become emotionally involved with while playing have been Lunar 1 & 2, as well as FF7. I thought Lunar was a masterpiece when I played it, and Lunar 2 exceeded my expectations as well (though I have yet to complete the epilogue; enemies get brutally hard at that point!).
My point is, for the amount of money you'll spend on the games, the PSX revisions are the least expensive and most feature-rich versions out there (at least in the US). I think the plot changes are probably something that if I had played the original would upset me, but I'm guessing those changes were made by the original staff, not by Working Designs. They made some dialogue changes (in the localization) that some find to be rather stupid, but I personally enjoy the dialogue in the game.
The only video games I have become emotionally involved with while playing have been Lunar 1 & 2, as well as FF7. I thought Lunar was a masterpiece when I played it, and Lunar 2 exceeded my expectations as well (though I have yet to complete the epilogue; enemies get brutally hard at that point!).
My point is, for the amount of money you'll spend on the games, the PSX revisions are the least expensive and most feature-rich versions out there (at least in the US). I think the plot changes are probably something that if I had played the original would upset me, but I'm guessing those changes were made by the original staff, not by Working Designs. They made some dialogue changes (in the localization) that some find to be rather stupid, but I personally enjoy the dialogue in the game.
I'm a little confused by people claiming that the PSX version is the cheapest way to go. I just checked eBay. The highest any of the Lunar games for the Sega CD were going for was about 15 bucks. Maybe the price will go up with some more bids as the auction nears its close, but there was definitely a lot more competition for the PSX versions, a lot of which seem to be in the 30 dollar range.
And could someone explain this save system in Eternal Blue?
Because the Saturn is the only one of the systems Lunar is on I own (except the GBA). And I'm a Saturn fanboy who wants an impractically large number of Saturn games.Rob wrote:Why would anyone want the Saturn versions??
And could someone explain this save system in Eternal Blue?
Sega CD versions. I've played through the SCD and Saturn versions, and they killed Lunar Silver Story Story in the remake. What they take out towards the beginning involving a certain character being playable and a white dragon is completely inexcusable, as that was one of the most "get you pumped to whip some ass" moments I've ever witnessed in all of gaming. Few more things they screwed up in the SS remake...
As for Eternal Blue... not even half the game it was...
As for Eternal Blue... not even half the game it was...
RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE!!!!!!
-
Dartagnan1083
- Posts: 226
- Joined: Tue Apr 26, 2005 5:49 pm
- Location: Escaping to the Freedom
In Eternal Blue, you gather "Magic Experience" appart from your regular experience. You use it to manually level up Elemental and Healing Spells for all the characters. They still have their own special magics that level up with the character.
The save system involved using just as much Magic Exp for a Magic lvl-up depending on the level of the main character.
It's an annoyance that ensures you take care of lots of important annoying crap before ever saving on your next playthroughs.
Now for the PSX/SAT rant;
I'm with the others on the comparison of EB SCD to EBC/EB Remix.
While the deeper plot and improved Cutscenes are really nice for the story, the removal of dungeons, monsters, and the neutering of bosses was not for the better.
They also butchered the battle and item systems beyond any forgiveable level.
I remember it being damn near perfect in the original.
Equiping special armours and rings that gave the characters spells outside their normal list was really cool.
using your weapons as items to cast miscellaneous spells was also great.
Also, the magics were more spectacular on the SCD than they were on the saturn or PSX.
Removal of spells like Gale Vortex, and other such 'third set' elemental spells for all the characters is a huge dissapointment.
While SSSC was very nice, that was because they made the original more like EB.
The save system involved using just as much Magic Exp for a Magic lvl-up depending on the level of the main character.
It's an annoyance that ensures you take care of lots of important annoying crap before ever saving on your next playthroughs.
Now for the PSX/SAT rant;
I'm with the others on the comparison of EB SCD to EBC/EB Remix.
While the deeper plot and improved Cutscenes are really nice for the story, the removal of dungeons, monsters, and the neutering of bosses was not for the better.
They also butchered the battle and item systems beyond any forgiveable level.
I remember it being damn near perfect in the original.
Equiping special armours and rings that gave the characters spells outside their normal list was really cool.
using your weapons as items to cast miscellaneous spells was also great.
Also, the magics were more spectacular on the SCD than they were on the saturn or PSX.
Removal of spells like Gale Vortex, and other such 'third set' elemental spells for all the characters is a huge dissapointment.
While SSSC was very nice, that was because they made the original more like EB.
currently collecting a crapload of coasters, carts, controllers, and consoles
Track my "Progress"
Track my "Progress"
-
judesalmon
- Posts: 504
- Joined: Mon Jan 31, 2005 6:46 pm
- Location: Rule Britannia, Britannia Rules The Waves
Regardless of the SegaCD versions, SSSC and EB2 are excellent games, which I really enjoyed. I would recommend them to anyone.
Be attitude for gains:
1) Be praying...
2) Be praying...
3) Be praying...
And a shameless plug for the stuff I'm selling on eBay, if you're into that sort of thing.
1) Be praying...
2) Be praying...
3) Be praying...
And a shameless plug for the stuff I'm selling on eBay, if you're into that sort of thing.
The PSX Lunars are phenomenal! SSSC and EB2 are both top-notch. I found them better than the Sega CD versions but then again I played them in the reverse order. I like how the "making of" CD (nice touch by Working Designs who really packed a ton of bonus stuff into the PSX Lunars including making of CDs, audio CDs, trinkets, etc) has the developers saying that the story is as it always was, but it depends on who is telling the story as to how "accurate" it is. They liken the Sega CD, Saturn and PSX as being storytellers - all telling the same story but the Sega CD is a bit old and doesn't remember everything so well... and gets some of the details wrong while the PSX is a more enthusiastic storyteller with a better memory and gets more of the details of the story right. Heh! Weird japanese game designers! In any event, according to their own words on the included CD, the developers feel that the PSX version is the "complete" and most-accurate Lunar story.
The Sega CD versions are also quite good. I've not played the Saturn versions (they are only in Japanese, right? maybe I'll have to get them too!).
The Sega CD versions are also quite good. I've not played the Saturn versions (they are only in Japanese, right? maybe I'll have to get them too!).
llabnip - DaveB
Once more the light shines brightly in sector 2814.
Once more the light shines brightly in sector 2814.
-
OmegaFlareX
- Posts: 890
- Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 10:15 pm
- Location: Virginia, USA
I don't understand why everyone hates random encounters... to me thats world's better than seeing an enemy and feeling compelled to hunt down and kill every... single... enemy... in a dungeon. I'd much rather have random encounters so I can power level a bit between each boss fight.
Oh well... go play your Final Fantasy: Mystic Quest then.
Oh well... go play your Final Fantasy: Mystic Quest then.
RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE!!!!!!
"Game X has feature Y.jp wrote:I don't understand why everyone hates random encounters... to me thats world's better than seeing an enemy and feeling compelled to hunt down and kill every... single... enemy... in a dungeon. I'd much rather have random encounters so I can power level a bit between each boss fight.
Oh well... go play your Final Fantasy: Mystic Quest then.
Game X sucks.
Therefore, feature Y must suck!"
Random encounters suck because there's no strategy in preparing for a fight or entering one. Besides, you can still power level with enemies on the map. Leave an area and re-enter.
Can you read Japanese? If not, the game will suck. Impracticality at its best!alpha5099 wrote:Because the Saturn is the only one of the systems Lunar is on I own (except the GBA). And I'm a Saturn fanboy who wants an impractically large number of Saturn games.
Plus, the movies look better on the PSX.
If anything, though, the Saturn versions are pretty cheap (and for good reason).
I've spent a few years in Japan, I know all the kana and a bunch of characters. And next year when I start college, I'll be taking Japanese. I was hoping to use some Japanese RPGs to sharpen my skills. Granted, it'll probably be a while before I'm at a level where an RPG is really practical.matt wrote:Can you read Japanese? If not, the game will suck. Impracticality at its best!alpha5099 wrote:Because the Saturn is the only one of the systems Lunar is on I own (except the GBA). And I'm a Saturn fanboy who wants an impractically large number of Saturn games.
I'm not sure everyone hates random encounters per se, but for some reason after playing the Lunar PSX remakes, I'd have to say that the viewable enemies (for me) make those particular games enjoyable. There are some times when if there weren't viewable enemies I'd be having to start over a lot. Not so in a game like FF7 or Phantasy Star II where there are so many enemy fights that you level up quickly and it's not as easy to become overwhelmed. Of course, I'm not an RPG expert; I only own 4 or 5 in the genre. But that's how I felt after I found out that the Lunar games (on PSX) have viewable enemies.jp wrote:I don't understand why everyone hates random encounters... to me thats world's better than seeing an enemy and feeling compelled to hunt down and kill every... single... enemy... in a dungeon. I'd much rather have random encounters so I can power level a bit between each boss fight.
Oh well... go play your Final Fantasy: Mystic Quest then.