Why is the picture quality on HDTVs so bad?(I'm not kidding)

[indstr]

TV stores often split one signal into dozens, and hence look like shit.

Sad thing is though, the particularly crap quality Bluray advertisement I saw was NOT split between dozens of TV's... It was just playing on a single standalone TV away from the wall of TV's, closer to the checkout counter in the electronics.

I have a question too...

What the hell is up with HDTV's stretching a 4:3 image to fit the 16:9 aspect ratio of TV's? Do they all do that automatically? Or is there a way to set them to "Pillarbox"?

[Ayanami]

I do know one reason why broadcast TV does not look no where near as sharp as say a blue ray disc is because of lower bit rates. Plus most TV broadcast is in 1080i which is not optimal.

[system11]

What the hell is up with HDTV's stretching a 4:3 image to fit the 16:9 aspect ratio of TV's? Do they all do that automatically? Or is there a way to set them to "Pillarbox"?

"smart" is usually the default aspect setting, and that tends to do a side-stretch on 4:3 pictures so the middle area is the correct aspect, and it stretches towards the sides. I find it quite disconcerting, I've not seen a single set so far that didn't let you just flick it to 4:3, 16:9 etc.

[PC Engine Fan X!]

I do know one reason why broadcast TV does not look no where near as sharp as say a blue ray disc is because of lower bit rates. Plus most TV broadcast is in 1080i which is not optimal.

Some HD off-the-air content is displayed in 720p besides the usual 1080i format (at least for the USA anyways).

PC Engine Fan X! ^_~

[indstr]

"smart" is usually the default aspect setting, and that tends to do a side-stretch on 4:3 pictures so the middle area is the correct aspect, and it stretches towards the sides. I find it quite disconcerting, I've not seen a single set so far that didn't let you just flick it to 4:3, 16:9 etc.

That's fucked up... Because on my PSP, if I am playing emulation, I ALWAYS have it at 4:3. Stretching sssuuuccckkksssss.....

[jonny5]

What the hell is up with HDTV's stretching a 4:3 image to fit the 16:9 aspect ratio of TV's? Do they all do that automatically? Or is there a way to set them to "Pillarbox"?

"smart" is usually the default aspect setting, and that tends to do a side-stretch on 4:3 pictures so the middle area is the correct aspect, and it stretches towards the sides. I find it quite disconcerting, I've not seen a single set so far that didn't let you just flick it to 4:3, 16:9 etc.

mine has this option....i can display 4:3 normally, stretched(full picture stretched), and zoomed

when being fed a 4:3 signal it defaults to 4:3....not stretched....

and agreed...stretching is bad

[indstr]

planned obsolescence -- the practice of businesses to design products that you purchase more and more frequently before you really need a new one. Whether it's by using inferior materials to intentionally make the products break prematurely, or the practice of psychological obsolescence -- i.e. things going out of style, and you feel pressured to buy a new one, otherwise you will feel "ashamed" because you are not up to date.

Out of those two methods of obsolescence, I actually find psychological obsolescence more disturbing. I think when I finish this book, I'm gonna read a couple others, and then start crusading to open peoples' eyes about these issues.

We're all just puppets. Makes me sick.

I'm disappointed that nobody wanted to engage me on this subject. But trust me, it's not the last you will hear from me about it.

[moozooh]

The psychological obsolescence has been here in various amount since about the Industrial Revolution of the 18th century. If you care about wearing clothes that hasn't gone out of style, you know it's there. You can't possibly prevent it from happening, you don't have to be sick about it. You also can't prevent natural cataclysms and world hunger (which is going to happen any decade now), which are of much greater importance, anyway.

[indstr]

The psychological obsolescence has been here in various amount since about the Industrial Revolution of the 18th century. If you care about wearing clothes that hasn't gone out of style, you know it's there. You can't possibly prevent it from happening, you don't have to be sick about it. You also can't prevent natural cataclysms and world hunger (which is going to happen any decade now), which are of much greater importance, anyway.

But yet for some reason I feel more passionate about the issue of Obsolescence. It's probably because I know somebody else is going to take care of the world hunger issue. It will be required. However obsolescence will go largely ignored and I would like to raise awareness about it.

[moozooh]

And what are you going to do about it? The machine has been in action for decades, it's a part of our life by now. You're either reaping its rewards driving your own life cycles faster and spending harder, or go against it and receive the drawback of getting looked upon like a total doofus. I suffer the latter fate a lot because of that, and it really changes nothing in the long run. Basically, I just spend less and become less social. If that's your goal, go ahead.

[Specineff]

"smart" is usually the default aspect setting, and that tends to do a side-stretch on 4:3 pictures so the middle area is the correct aspect, and it stretches towards the sides. I find it quite disconcerting, I've not seen a single set so far that didn't let you just flick it to 4:3, 16:9 etc.

That's fucked up... Because on my PSP, if I am playing emulation, I ALWAYS have it at 4:3. Stretching sssuuuccckkksssss.....

My Sharp does that. Vizios do that. My mom's Panasonic Plasma does that. You can always leave it at 4:3 with gray or black bars on the sides, so unless I misunderstood, the manufacturers who don't let you keep an unstretched 4:3 pic are in the minority.

[neorichieb1971]

I have a PS3 and Sony Bravia HDTV 1080p/24 set up and it blows the shit out of everything i've seen on a CRT. I would only put the Pioneer Kuro range in a higher league.

I wouldn't buy into a shop set up. They are ridiculous. Block noise as you put it is more down to the power of the signal and the quality of the cable.

I think one of the other posters is referring to grain. Which is only absent when the original material is shot on HD cameras (crank, speed racer) or rendered (Wall-E).

[indstr]

And what are you going to do about it? The machine has been in action for decades, it's a part of our life by now. You're either reaping its rewards driving your own life cycles faster and spending harder, or go against it and receive the drawback of getting looked upon like a total doofus. I suffer the latter fate a lot because of that, and it really changes nothing in the long run. Basically, I just spend less and become less social. If that's your goal, go ahead.

I don't know what I'm going to do. Pamphlets or a book or going out on the street yelling at people. I don't know yet. But there is a huge environmental crisis looming with all the waste from the products that are a result of our massive consumerism and throwaway society.. part of which is driven by and the fault of the advertising industry and corporations which use obsolescence as a method of getting us to consume more, quicker.

So fuck that shit. I've never felt the need to be "in style" or keep up with the joneses. And I think more people need to realize they are being manipulated on a whole bunch of levels. And that it is wrong and they need to fight back somehow. By doing things like: ignoring advertising, buying more well made products that last, and eliminating the pride they feel when they own new/stylish things. If you can eliminate that pride, you will no longer feel shame for having things that are out of date.

Old stuff pride!

P.S.. The idea of feeling like a doofus for being out of style is so fucked up. Basically the advertising/psychological obsolescence has been so successful, that it now enforces itself. People tell each other when they are out of style instead of the industry having to rely completely on advertising.

My theory is that the whole thing plays on peoples' basic humanity -- the need to feel a sense of belonging, and the tendency of people to learn by imitation. People are affected at such a core level, it is going to take a strong shake to get them to come to their senses.

My goal is to help provide that shake.

[moozooh]

My theory is that the whole thing plays on peoples' basic humanity -- the need to feel a sense of belonging, and the tendency of people to learn by imitation. People are affected at such a core level, it is going to take a strong shake to get them to come to their senses.

Have you ever seen movies like Fight Club? It actually shows the things you're talking about. Try it now, I believe it's going to be a personal favorite of yours if things go this way. :P

On another note, try to come up with a solution that will seamlessly incorporate with the present day's need of receiving money that you actually need for useful things like food, etc.

[indstr]

Have you ever seen movies like Fight Club? It actually shows the things you're talking about. Try it now, I believe it's going to be a personal favorite of yours if things go this way.

On another note, try to come up with a solution that will seamlessly incorporate with the present day's need of receiving money that you actually need for useful things like food, etc.

Am I that predictable? Yeah, I saw Fight Club when it first came out and it resonated with me deeply. It's remained one of my favourite movies to this day.

Your suggestion is duly noted, although I'm not talking about creating some kind of moneyless utopia. That sounds too much like communism which obviously didn't work on a large scale. I have no idea about the solutions yet, I am still just figuring out what the problems are.

[moozooh]

I think the problem (one in all) is that people are being conscious way less than they should. Questioning oneself is becoming a more and more daunting and frightful task. This perfectly sets the stage up for every social problem known through history.

I think the best thing you can do at this point is helping people hit the F5 in their head.

[indstr]

I think the problem (one in all) is that people are being conscious way less than they should. Questioning oneself is becoming a more and more daunting and frightful task. This perfectly sets the stage up for every social problem known through history.

I think the best thing you can do at this point is helping people hit the F5 in their head.

I like the way you think. We should talk more in email sometime

P.S... I just noticed you are Russian and I was talking about communism. So you have first hand experience with a system that doesn't work

[jonny5]

i havent bought new clothes in like 5 years.... ...all i wear are work pants and t-shirts/hoodies.....

but i have spent $1000's on PCB's this year alone

i need pants tho cuz ive put on a couple pounds and some of them dont fit me very well anymore

maybe next year

[jpj]

you're forgetting about the first people who buy these products though. in PR speak, we call them "early adopters". by that we mean "giant fucking dork who obsesses over technology like that mustache twat at the end of napoleon dynamite". the type of people who upgrade their PCs on a regular basis. got stung with a 1080i piece of shite because they bum their sexbox and creamed their pants over HD. the 18-35 year old male, who has more AC adaptors than real friends.

i love technology, always and forever

[Turrican]

P.S... I just noticed you are Russian and I was talking about communism. So you have first hand experience with a system that doesn't work

Yeah, that system being autocracy, though.

[Ed Oscuro]

Thanks for dusting off the old crystal ball for us, O Magnificent Carnac. Smellovision's going to be a failure, huh?

I tend to agree that it's a good idea to hold onto an old-fashioned tube, the best that can be found. Won't last forever but hopefully it'll last long enough. Probably the future holds expensive upscalers for most of us, I'm afraid.

There's no need to be magicians, after all. It's a predictable reaction coming from any gamer who's in love with the videogames of his youth.

I have no idea what you're talking about. Are you referring to yourself in the third person? I didn't have a video game system as a kid (up until about 16 that is, PSX and N64 that is).

On the subject of planned obsolescence - ain't nothing immoral about replacing a 100+ watt device with a 10 watter. Of course lots of people went to huge ass plasmas and other things which use as much power as the most power-hungry devices from the past.

[Lloyd Mangram]

But yet for some reason I feel more passionate about the issue of Obsolescence.

If if makes you feel any better, my current haircut is from around 1930*. Obsolescence be damned!


* My barber decided to give me a Depression-era haircut to go with the current recession. Thanks Mr Barber!

[Turrican]

I have no idea what you're talking about. Are you referring to yourself in the third person? I didn't have a video game system as a kid (up until about 16 that is, PSX and N64 that is).

Those are both old systems which give their best on SDTVs, and you run a friggin' Contra webpage - face it, you're an old geezer.

[Ceph]

I think the best thing you can do at this point is helping people hit the F5 in their head.

Every time I do that people call me an ass. Which means I'm doing it right.

[D]

What the hell is up with HDTV's stretching a 4:3 image to fit the 16:9 aspect ratio of TV's? Do they all do that automatically? Or is there a way to set them to "Pillarbox"?

"smart" is usually the default aspect setting, and that tends to do a side-stretch on 4:3 pictures so the middle area is the correct aspect, and it stretches towards the sides. I find it quite disconcerting, I've not seen a single set so far that didn't let you just flick it to 4:3, 16:9 etc.

Indeed! Never ever select this setting ever. In Dutch it is called "Juist" which means correct, but it is far from correct.

Broadcasters can along with a broadcasting image send a code along with the image that tells your tv what the aspect is. 4:3 or 16:9. Some boradcasters might not broadcast this code along with the bradcast or send the wrong code. They broadcast 16:9, but the code they send along with it states 4:3.

Tip* I'm not sure if this will work on every set but let us all try this.
Put your tv on 4:3! If you zap to a channel that broadcasts 16:9 it will switch to 16:9 (This is called zoom in my case) automatically, when it's a normal 4:3 broadcast it will just go back to 4:3! Then there are some channels who broadcast 16:9, but still broadcast the 4:3 code, for this if you really want to watch, you can temporarily set it to "zoom" and after set it back.

[Strider77]

I love my HD sony CRT..... with an XRGB it looks incredibly close to my sony rgb (pvm) monitor and that's saying alot. RGB/component all the way....

plus I get to see what these new systems are really pushing out with their jump in resolution via rgb/component. along with all the VGA480p last gen stuff.

I would never go back to my old sony trinitron tv... it doesn't even compare. A pvm does for low res but it can't do HD or VGA/480p ect.

The below pic looks great and that is after being taken with a cam and posted online threw whatever monitor you are using.



You can't judge a TV by a floor demo, especially in wall mart. Every TV I've owned I've had to calibrate the settings after I bought it to get it to look decent, even my low res TVs. Those defaulty setting are way to bright and have their colors all over the place. I have seen quite a few Wal marts piping a composite signal threw a HDTV and that is just worhtless..... it will look like a leap BEHIND HD with that sort of hooking up ect. It's unfortunate that you need a scaler for low res stuff but the results are amazing afterwards.

[Elixir]

Entire thread is *plugs composite into HDTV, expects HDMI blu-ray quality*

[neorichieb1971]

I agree with the throwaway society bit. In the UK we have tidy tips and the amount of good CRT's that are practically just thrown away is ridiculous.

But, new TV's are also space saving, can hang on the wall and the screen size is huge. So what do you do?


Computers are the same. The amount of CRT's and towers getting thrown away is ridiculous.

But its the economy that is to blame. If you don't buy shit nobody benefits at all.

[Ex-Cyber]

Part of the problem is that stuff breaks and it's just not worth it to repair it anymore - slim margins, high complexity, high integration, proprietary components, and manufacturers who don't dare ship schematics are the norm these days.

[moozooh]

We should talk more in email sometime

Sure. I exist at gmail as moozooh (avoiding spam here), so feel free to shoot me a letter.