Two (or multi) player shmups?

[cfalcon]

I never considered myself a big fan of Shoot'em ups... until they pretty much dissappeared from the world, and what I thought was a "balanced" set of genres in my collection began leaving out things that used to be fundamental. Sports (because I disliked all the new sports games, most of which had discovered that the trick was to make you feel like you were watching the game or coaching it while still being interactive, instead of playing it) and Shoot'em Ups were the big ones lacking, and "shmups" weren't lacking because I didn't like the new ones- there were just very few of them.

Anyway, my reason for registering and posting is, of course, a selfish question: What are good multiplayer shmups? Playing a game with one person is usually a very, very different experience than playing with two. I've never seen someone doing well in a game just up and quit- but it's not uncommon if someone is playing with a friend who perishes.

Currently, the multiplayer shmups that I like are:
Ikaruga (GC)
LifeForce (NES)
Aero Fighters (SNES)
FirePower 2000 (SNES)

Darius Twin (SNES) I'm not a huge fan of. Stinger (NES) is ok, but a little bit loony for my tastes.

(Incidentally, the review of AeroFighters on this site is a real bummer: the game is actually all about picking a nation, and each nation has two ships which work together in different ways (for eight ships, not counting bonus ones). A game as Japan has P1 carrying the big guns that turn on instantly and protect you while P2 has a powerful time-stop device, while a game as the offense-heavy defense-light USA is very different, etc.)


I lack the Gameboy DS, but have the rest of Nintendo's hardware lineup (I'm an N fanboy). My GCN and N64 are ok to go with import games. I also have a Genesis and a PS2, but neither is modded. What good multiplayer shmups am I missing for my systems? I'm willing to go and out and get my PS2 modded, or get another "obsolete" system (TurboGrafx, Saturn) if one of them has a treasure trove of games, but I can't afford (money or space) to run out and buy them all.



Suggestions from the experts?

[alpha5099]

Lots of games offer two player, but more is far rarer. There was some V Systems game with flying cars that was 3 players. And GigaWing 2 has 4 player.

Neither the GC or N64 have a whole lot of shmups, I think the N64's only one is Star Soldier Vanishing Earth, which isn't well regarded. Both the Saturn and the PC Engine (TG16) have lots of shmups. The PCE has more, lots more, but the Saturn won't short change you. It might depend on what kind of shmups are up your ally, and what else you'd want to play on the system.

[zinger]

You might want to try Twinkle Star Sprites (NG, SS, DC and is now being remade for PS2) which is a 'versus shooter' with puzzle elements.
I'm too lazy to explain the gameplay any further, but as you can see on the image below, the screen is divided into two parts and you battle each other out, a bit like in Puyo Puyo.

It's a fun game, but you should probably give it a try in an emulator first.

I think both the Saturn and DC ports are good (but the SS port has an exclusive and quite bizarre anime FMV intro). PS2 screens look awful.

[Ghegs]

You might want to try Twinkle Star Sprites (NG, SS, DC and is now being remade for PS2) which is a 'versus shooter' with puzzle elements.

The PS2 game isn't a remake, it's a sequel.

[zinger]

You might want to try Twinkle Star Sprites (NG, SS, DC and is now being remade for PS2) which is a 'versus shooter' with puzzle elements.

The PS2 game isn't a remake, it's a sequel.

My bad, doesn't look any better though

[cfalcon]

Well, lots of games have two player, but many don't. I guess I should be specific and say two player simultaneous. I like a lot of shmups that *aren't* two player, but a list of those is pretty easy to come by (Axelay and friends for SNES, the renowned Radiant Silvergun for YetAnotherConsoleIDoNotHave, etc.). What I'm looking for is games that I can play with the couple friends I have that like shoot'em ups. I also like the games that are difficult single player and become much easier with two (Aero Fighters is close, not that it's difficult, but it gets easier with a friend). Those games are good because then the game is interesting for me, but also can be picked up by someone who doesn't own it and we can play it. Then you get to have conversations about emergent concepts that are normally stored in your head and don't need language to express them, like "parity" (most of Ikaruga has high parity, Firepower 2000 has very low parity) and short stupid names for things, like "juice" (what you get when you bullet eat in Ikaruga).


A friend of mine in college was big into Twinkle Star Sprites. If I end up with a Neo (unlikely), or a DC (much more probable), I'll definitely grab it. Or SS, assuming that's Sega Saturn. Is the Saturn version worse than the DC version, then?

Did I miss any good two players on the SNES, though? There was a time a couple years ago when I would go down to Rhino a couple times a month, and if I saw a shmup that looked ok and was cheap I'd grab it. About 40% of the time, I was impressed. The rest of the time... well, I wasn't always impressed.


Mostly, I'm bugged because out of all my systems, I only have a couple games that represent the 2 player coop shmup genre, and the concept is so fun that even games that are crappy get a lot of play (FirePower 2000, or, Gods help us, the NES Silkworm). I mean, when a friend of mine stopped in town last year, we busted out LifeForce and played it for hours. If I wanted like, ten games like this, I doubt they don't exist.


I just don't know their names, or what systems they were out on.

[Nemo]

You might want to try Twinkle Star Sprites (NG, SS, DC and is now being remade for PS2) which is a 'versus shooter' with puzzle elements.

The PS2 game isn't a remake, it's a sequel.

Are you sure? I hadn't heard that.

Anyways, I'd recommend most Gradii games, espcially Gaiden, or some Cave joints like Dodonpachi.

[devlkore]

This may not be much help to you, but if you really really want access to the most shooters on a console, a modded Xbox is the only way to go, the Cave/Toaplan/NeoGeo/CPS1/CPS2 shooters alone make it worth it, but then you can play Megadrive, PC Engine, SNES shooters too.

Anyway, I'd recommend Bio Hazard Battle on Megadrive. Amazing soundtrrack (needs good BASS from your TV/speakers), interesting enemies and environments and most importantly, it's really fun.

BYEEEEE!!

[cfalcon]

Well, a modded Xbox + emus is at some point in my future. It's a pain and expensive, and I have too many other projects (like my house looks like crap) to go for the full solution, which that is. I think it'll be tons cheaper in Feb. or so, once the kids start swapping in their Xboxen for shiny new Xbox360....en.

For now, I'm looking for just regular carts and games, and maybe a used system that can be had for not so much money. I ordered Biohazard Battle at the cost of five minutes and seven dollars, so the big drama there will be remembering which box the Genesis is in (you said Megadrive: is the Jp version different than the US one?). Maybe I'll need a second controller too, I dunno if I have two still. If it's at all good, then it's worth way more than that in hours of play. Thanks for the advice!

I was always pissed that UN Squadron wasn't 2 Players on SNES. Does XBox solve that problem too? Well, I'm assuming that I remember the arcade as two players. What can the Xbox not emulate?



Anyway, how many people here play with two players? I was blown away by how different of a game Ikaruga reallly was with a friend in tow.

[Nemo]

This may not be much help to you, but if you really really want access to the most shooters on a console, a modded Xbox is the only way to go, the Cave/Toaplan/NeoGeo/CPS1/CPS2 shooters alone make it worth it, but then you can play Megadrive, PC Engine, SNES shooters too.

And if you really want access to the most money, go rob a bank.

[GaijinPunch]

It is a sequel. Looks totally different. High res graphics. "Better" or not, nobody can say. Surely new blood would think it looks better.

[UnscathedFlyingObject]

My favorite co-op shmups--friends tested:

G-Darius (High impact shmup thanks to the laser duels)
Gradius Gaiden (A beginner shmup until you get near the end)
Shienryu (Very pretty and easy vert)
Gradius V (Purty 3D graphics to the masses)

I wouldn't recommend manic stuff for co-op. I myself find them scary; mainstreamers would too if they get over seeing your TV on its side.

[cfalcon]

Ok, searching teh in-tar-web for these, I find that I would need the following:

G-Darius [nothing, just the game]
Gradius Gaiden [modded PS2]
Shienryu [Saturn]
Gradius V [nothing, just the game]

Obviously, I'll go hunting for Gradius V tonight at the malls and such (for some reason I didn't think it was two player), and maybe they'll have G-Darius as well. Either way, those are cheap and easily hunted down. Would I need a modded Saturn, or just a regular Saturn, to play Shienryu? I don't know squat about that system, except that it had shooters and RPGs and my finicky friends all loved it or hated it.

Gradius Gaiden will go on my "eventual" list, as it seems somewhat uncommon, a touch expensive, and requires more effort.



Thanks a lot!

[Acid King]

You can get Shienryu, elsewise known as Gekioh Shooting King for the US PS1 for less than ten bucks.

[marril159]

There's also the Salamander Deluxe Pack (Arcade ports of Salamanders 1 & 2, plus the Japanese version of Life Force) for PS1 or SS. However, the game is somewhat rare, so it might be expensive, and you'd have to do some modding or purchase a JP system.

If you wanted to, you could emulate them to see if you think the effort is worth it.

[UnscathedFlyingObject]

Ok, searching teh in-tar-web for these, I find that I would need the following:

G-Darius [nothing, just the game]
Gradius Gaiden [modded PS2]
Shienryu [Saturn]
Gradius V [nothing, just the game]

Obviously, I'll go hunting for Gradius V tonight at the malls and such (for some reason I didn't think it was two player), and maybe they'll have G-Darius as well. Either way, those are cheap and easily hunted down. Would I need a modded Saturn, or just a regular Saturn, to play Shienryu? I don't know squat about that system, except that it had shooters and RPGs and my finicky friends all loved it or hated it.

Gradius Gaiden will go on my "eventual" list, as it seems somewhat uncommon, a touch expensive, and requires more effort.



Thanks a lot!

You can use an Action Replay to play Saturn Shienryu. If you can TATE, you'll probably want the SAT version since the PSX one doesn't have TATE mode. As for Gradius Gaiden, it's more common and cheaper than either G-Darius or Gradius V since it has been rereleased. BTW, don't use the word "rare" unless you absolutely know what you're talking about since it drives up prices.

http://www.play-asia.com/paOS-13-71-5o- ... 0-2q6.html

But hmmm if you look for stuff in the "wild", almost any import is "rare."

[Rob]

For Genesis, try Forgotten Worlds. It's got unique 2p properties. For PS2, try Strikers 1945 (II) for the original PS. Simple, fast game with various strategies for two players, and since you liked Aero Fighters.

[alpha5099]

Well, lots of games have two player, but many don't. I guess I should be specific and say two player simultaneous. I like a lot of shmups that *aren't* two player, but a list of those is pretty easy to come by (Axelay and friends for SNES, the renowned Radiant Silvergun for YetAnotherConsoleIDoNotHave, etc.).

I haven't played it, but I'm almost certain Radiant Silvergun has two player. Unless the spinecard lies.

[BulletMagnet]

I haven't played it, but I'm almost certain Radiant Silvergun has two player. Unless the spinecard lies.

Indeed it does.

Another option for Shienryu would be to get the "Double Shienryu" PS2 compilation, as it has both the new "Shienryu Explosion" (does that one have 2 player?) and the original one on it.

[Capt. Takehiko]

Anyway, how many people here play with two players?

I play with my brother all the time. I'm kind of training him.

[D]

That car themed V-System 3-player shmup is pretty cool.

Played it in MAME the other day.

If you can get past the car theme, which is a challenge all by itself you'll find a remarkable shmup.

Is it even possible to play with three players in MAME? What would be needed? 3 joystick/usb ports? IS MAME ready for this?

[cfalcon]

Well, I stand corrected on Radiant Silvergun. It's certainly on my "play eventually" list already, but finding it native seems to be expensive beyond normal. I've done some crazy purchasing decisions with video games over the years, but now isn't the time.

Whatever, I'm in no rush.


I grabbed Gradius III and am very impressed with that. Can't reallly get over having the Options sweep death in a circle. Haven't had a shot to play with a friend yet, but I've been busy cleaning up dog poop today- the figurative kind, where my machine is hinting that it's going to eat another hard drive so I'm scrambling to put stuff on another drive and make it bootable, and literally, as a friend dropped his dog off for the weekend, and the normally well behaved dog has crapped the hell out of three rooms already.

I also picked up R-Type final with Gradius III, and was sort of underwhelmed there, but that's a side note. It's not really my style of shmup, but for fifteen bucks, how could I say no?

Strikers 1945 is now on my list along with Forgotten Worlds, and at this point I should be good for a while. I'd really like to thank you all, as it seems stupid but just googling for this kind of thing gives you a bunch of vague reviews and misses most of the old stuff. If a game is two-player, most folks don't mention it.

UFO: I didn't use the word "rare" someone else did. I used the highly qualified "somewhat uncommon", which yes, I would say applies to *any* import (an import that is a year old is online for a moderate discount, a ported game will be used for virtually nothing after some kid played it and took it back to trade for the latest Point-The-Screen game).

That said, I'll obviously grab Gradius Gaiden soon too.

I can't TATE yet, not for months. I'll need a different monitor and such, or I'll just get experimental with a TV sometime. I'll grab the PS version for now, as that doesn't push me into a system decision yet.

I'm going to look around locally to see if the going price for Saturns or Turbografx(es?) are super cheap or something.

As far as MAME goes, that's mad drama to get a multiplayer game going, and not just for technical reasons. I'm not really setup as a gaming rig beyond keyboard / mouse one player stuff. It needs to hook to a TV to be casual enough for my friends to play it, sadly. Preferably it needs to be able to travel, since I'm only at my place a fraction of the time I'm hanging out. Back in college this wouldn't have been a problem, but even though much of my social circle is the exact same people, no one ever wants to "hang out and play video games" anymore. Booo!

Anyway, I did get MAME set up and running on my machine (all this talk of Aerofighters made me want to experience it the way it was when I first came across it, at a stop plaza on the Florida turnpike), and I'll see what other emus I can get running to help me with purchasing decisions. I'll try this odd 3-player game.

And no, I have no idea what the button mappings for that are. But the system can do ninja turtles, right?

Again, thanks all.

[japtor]

only played it on snes, but gradius III didnt have simultaneous 2 player. i think V and life force are the only ones to have that (not sure about salamanders).

if you like aerofighters, youd probably be comfortable with the strikers series. ps2 has a few 2 game psikyo packs in japan. and all the sh-2 hardware based ones are in mame otherwise.

dc and ps2 have a bunch of good import releases. zero gunner 2 (dc) is awesome. ps2 has most of the new cave games (older ones are in mame). manics can be confusing 2 player, but if you can get past that theyre fun (tate helps definitely too).

i personally think ikaruga is one of the better 2 player games just because you have to work together, or else you have a good chance of inadvertantly killing one another.

[Zweihander]

Another option for Shienryu would be to get the "Double Shienryu" PS2 compilation, as it has both the new "Shienryu Explosion" (does that one have 2 player?) and the original one on it.

Yeah, Shienryu Explosion has 2-player. I swear though, that's gotta be THE easiest shmup to 1CC. I think I'll set it on Hard mode next time I play it and hope for a challenge. ^^;

Also, Trizeal would be good for 2 players, since once you're fully powered-up, further power-up grabbing is only for score; with 2 people, they'd actually serve a purpose.

[ST Dragon]

I never considered myself a big fan of Shoot'em ups... until they pretty much dissappeared from the world, and what I thought was a "balanced" set of genres in my collection began leaving out things that used to be fundamental. Sports (because I disliked all the new sports games, most of which had discovered that the trick was to make you feel like you were watching the game or coaching it while still being interactive, instead of playing it) and Shoot'em Ups were the big ones lacking, and "shmups" weren't lacking because I didn't like the new ones- there were just very few of them.

Anyway, my reason for registering and posting is, of course, a selfish question: What are good multiplayer shmups? Playing a game with one person is usually a very, very different experience than playing with two. I've never seen someone doing well in a game just up and quit- but it's not uncommon if someone is playing with a friend who perishes.

Currently, the multiplayer shmups that I like are:
Ikaruga (GC)
LifeForce (NES)
Aero Fighters (SNES)
FirePower 2000 (SNES)

Darius Twin (SNES) I'm not a huge fan of. Stinger (NES) is ok, but a little bit loony for my tastes.

(Incidentally, the review of AeroFighters on this site is a real bummer: the game is actually all about picking a nation, and each nation has two ships which work together in different ways (for eight ships, not counting bonus ones). A game as Japan has P1 carrying the big guns that turn on instantly and protect you while P2 has a powerful time-stop device, while a game as the offense-heavy defense-light USA is very different, etc.)


I lack the Gameboy DS, but have the rest of Nintendo's hardware lineup (I'm an N fanboy). My GCN and N64 are ok to go with import games. I also have a Genesis and a PS2, but neither is modded. What good multiplayer shmups am I missing for my systems? I'm willing to go and out and get my PS2 modded, or get another "obsolete" system (TurboGrafx, Saturn) if one of them has a treasure trove of games, but I can't afford (money or space) to run out and buy them all.



Suggestions from the experts?

Well...
You can't go wrong with these 2P shmups:

1945 Strikers II (Arcades)
Aero Fighter II (Sonic Wings II) (Arcades)
Carrier Air Wing (Arcades)
Gradius II (NES)
Raiden Project (PS-1)
Truxton II (Arcades)
Parodius Series (SNES/PS-1/Saturn) - Addictive as Crack!
Twin Bee (SNES)

[Darkcomet72]

Zero gunner 2 is a excellent and easy shmup for two players. As someone else on the board said, you can utilize the full screen for complex play.

[Nemo]

It is a sequel. Looks totally different. High res graphics. "Better" or not, nobody can say. Surely new blood would think it looks better.

Remakes usually have new graphics. As quoted from P-Asia: Twinkle Star Spirits: La Petite Princesse is a classical shooting game ported from the Neo Geo. Not that they're the divine source of info, but until I hear something concrete otherwise, this is just a port with ugly blockygons.

[BulletMagnet]

Here's the official site...

http://www.snkplaymore.jp/official/twinkle_star/

Check out the character list, for one thing, and I think it'll be pretty obvious that it's not a port of the original TSS: most of the chars are new, though a few of the old ones are still there. I'm not sure how different from the original (if at all) the gameplay is, of course, but it seems pretty obvious that this is definitely not just a 3-D-ized port of the original.

There is a small Story page there too...maybe someone who knows Japanese could try translating it?

[Shatterhand]

No one mentioned that... I have a friend who likes to play Raystorm with me

Raystorm is for the PS1, and I think it was released in West at some point. So, it may run in your PS2, and it's a pretty cool game.

He doesn't even like shmups , he is very mainstream, but for some reason he enjoys Raystorm (Maybe it's the coll gfx).

Gradius Gaiden is a very good choice too. The game is IMO easier in 2p mode, as you have instant respawn instead of checkpoints. 2 player + credit feed = easy finish