What is the novelty behind Virtua Fighter series?

jpj · Post by **jpj** » Fri Nov 28, 2008 6:27 pm

maybe he meant playing it on an emulator?

Lordstar · Post by **Lordstar** » Fri Nov 28, 2008 7:54 pm

GaijinPunch wrote:If you stay away from the arcades. I was pretty formidable w/ all the VF4's. Went to play some 5R and got my ass handed to me. Won 1 out of 20 or so matches.

your just getting old dude

Rupert H · Post by **Rupert H** » Sat Nov 29, 2008 5:01 pm

Skykid wrote:Where's Rupert H?

Yeah, I would have replied sooner but everybody seems to have given the appropriate response already. Suffice to say, VF is the most complex fighting game ever made and requires an insane amount of knowledge, skill, reflexes and dedication. If anything I would say that its complexity is probably its biggest flaw. It demands so much from you if you actually want to be good at it.

Pixel_Outlaw · Post by **Pixel_Outlaw** » Sat Nov 29, 2008 6:45 pm

Just collecting opinions.

Character design is weak but as everyone else said it is a solid series.

szycag · Post by **szycag** » Sat Nov 29, 2008 10:48 pm

Your character design is weak.

Sorry there's no ripped guy with giant robot arm or boxing kangaroo.

Matsunaga · Post by **Matsunaga** » Sat Nov 29, 2008 11:10 pm

Tekken is better. By better I mean much more fun to play. And button-mashers have no shot against anyone with even mediocre talent.

GaijinPunch · Post by **GaijinPunch** » Sun Nov 30, 2008 8:32 am

It demands so much from you

...namely money.

Rupert H · Post by **Rupert H** » Sun Nov 30, 2008 12:22 pm

GaijinPunch wrote:
It demands so much from you
...namely money.

Yeah, I guess you could say we're lucky here in the UK. Without a single VF5 R machine on the horizon our wallets remain weighty with unused change.

Diabollokus · Post by **Diabollokus** » Sun Nov 30, 2008 4:16 pm

Anyone here is more than welcome to challenge my 'Brad' on XBL, haven't played in awhile but I was technically awesome in my prime. I used Jacky for about 6 years, might use Pai from now on.

VF series > any other 3D fighter.

Sergei Dragunov is the only reason to play Tekken.

The n00b · Post by **The n00b** » Sun Nov 30, 2008 4:38 pm

Matsunaga wrote:Tekken is better. By better I mean much more fun to play. And button-mashers have no shot against anyone with even mediocre talent.

I'd put the Soul Calibur series(especially 2 and 4) over any in the Tekken series. It's a far more technical fighter when given the chance and it allows for more playing styles.

zaphod · Post by **zaphod** » Sun Nov 30, 2008 5:19 pm

Matsunaga wrote:Tekken is better. By better I mean much more fun to play. And button-mashers have no shot against anyone with even mediocre talent.

Umm. Eddy Anyone?

Seriously, it is well known that button mashing Eddy players win against more skilled opponents an annoying amount of the time. The trash talk faq explains this pretty well. ("You just lost to a psychotic crack addicted button mashing Eddy player and you feel it is your duty to comment on that brand of playstyle.") The way everything just chains together with him, and the fact that most of his attacks can't be reversed together make it very difficult to use simple tactics that would beat him if the player were trying it with any other character.

Post by **Icarus** » Sun Nov 30, 2008 5:24 pm

The n00b wrote:I'd put the Soul Calibur series(especially 2 and 4) over any in the Tekken series. It's a far more technical fighter when given the chance and it allows for more playing styles.

QFT. Also: swords.

TLB · Post by **TLB** » Sun Nov 30, 2008 5:52 pm

zaphod wrote:
Matsunaga wrote:Tekken is better. By better I mean much more fun to play. And button-mashers have no shot against anyone with even mediocre talent.
Umm. Eddy Anyone?

Seriously, it is well known that button mashing Eddy players win against more skilled opponents an annoying amount of the time. The trash talk faq explains this pretty well. ("You just lost to a psychotic crack addicted button mashing Eddy player and you feel it is your duty to comment on that brand of playstyle.") The way everything just chains together with him, and the fact that most of his attacks can't be reversed together make it very difficult to use simple tactics that would beat him if the player were trying it with any other character.

I thought you meant Guilty Gear when I first glanced at that =) Guilty Gear and King of Fighters are my faves.

In terms of 3D fighters, though...I loved Heihachi and Kilik in SCII...Rafael, too. Tekken doesn't trip my trigger...VF4Evo was a hell of a lot of fun. Hmm...Nothing else is coming to mind.

Taylor · Post by **Taylor** » Sun Nov 30, 2008 6:00 pm

D wrote:SFIIHDREMIX is out and this is what we're discussing......................... :roll:

Only for the 360 here because the Europe PS3 store is rubbish. I think I'm at something like 1-15, it's impossible to play any charge character on that POS joypad, all that game has done so far is raise my blood pressure.

They actually released a limited edition controller with a "fixed d-pad" and its exactly the same, it just supports 16-directions instead of 8... which I don't want and nobody will support because it's limited edition. Cool.

Matsunaga · Post by **Matsunaga** » Mon Dec 01, 2008 12:10 am

zaphod wrote:
Matsunaga wrote:Tekken is better. By better I mean much more fun to play. And button-mashers have no shot against anyone with even mediocre talent.
Umm. Eddy Anyone?

Seriously, it is well known that button mashing Eddy players win against more skilled opponents an annoying amount of the time. The trash talk faq explains this pretty well. ("You just lost to a psychotic crack addicted button mashing Eddy player and you feel it is your duty to comment on that brand of playstyle.") The way everything just chains together with him, and the fact that most of his attacks can't be reversed together make it very difficult to use simple tactics that would beat him if the player were trying it with any other character.

Eddy never gave me any problems. I laugh when someone picks him against me.

Ganelon · Post by **Ganelon** » Mon Dec 01, 2008 6:57 am

zaphod wrote:
Matsunaga wrote:Tekken is better. By better I mean much more fun to play. And button-mashers have no shot against anyone with even mediocre talent.
Umm. Eddy Anyone?

Seriously, it is well known that button mashing Eddy players win against more skilled opponents an annoying amount of the time. The trash talk faq explains this pretty well. ("You just lost to a psychotic crack addicted button mashing Eddy player and you feel it is your duty to comment on that brand of playstyle.") The way everything just chains together with him, and the fact that most of his attacks can't be reversed together make it very difficult to use simple tactics that would beat him if the player were trying it with any other character.

It's equally well known that this is a longtime scrub misconception. A mashing Eddy stands no chance at all against a mediocre opponent (say, someone who has practiced smartly for 50+ hours). If by more skilled, you mean folks who basically just went through story mode, unlocked everybody, and tried practice mode a few times, then sure; those folks won't really know how to play the game either so despite their few hours more practice.

Eddy has never been top tier in any game and his mashable moves don't trip up anyone who has played the game a fair amount and knows how to react to them. The closest shooter analogy I can think of would be the lightning weapon in Shienryu. It's very effective for much of the game but come endgame time, you want to ditch it because it's not at all optimal at that point. It's the same with as Eddy, who can easily kill newbies, but isn't a highly viable competitor in serious Tekken play (any of them).

jpj · Post by **jpj** » Mon Dec 01, 2008 6:06 pm

ganelon, when we having a claw mirror match on ggpo?

Ganelon · Post by **Ganelon** » Tue Dec 02, 2008 4:12 am

Heh, I think that's one of my specialty matches. Anyway, I haven't played on GGPO since STHD came out last week (which I feel sorry for all you Europeans if it's not importable).

It seems we're never on GGPO at the same time, jpj, so if you have a date and time in mind (either after 9pm EST on weekdays or on any Saturday but this one), I'd be happy to get on GGPO and duke it out with ya in some ST.

jonny5 · Post by **jonny5** » Tue Dec 02, 2008 4:57 am

hmmmm..well...my g/f likes soul calibur.....nuff said there

she likes tekken as well......her 'hit all the buttons at once' combo is mighty

i dont really like any fighting game where you can hit 2 buttons together and do a special/combo.....too noob friendly

never been a big fan of the VF series either for some reason.....played it back in the day for teh 3d wow factor(early 90's....come on) but it didnt hold up over time for me......and the newer installments never really drew me in...

then again....i dont play fighters like i used too......

neorichieb1971 · Post by **neorichieb1971** » Tue Dec 02, 2008 9:59 am

VF is hard to get into if you want flash stuff happening on screen. The SFX are usually ush ush ush or a tinny sound.

It sounds to me like you either love it or hate it (Gameplay wise).

jpj · Post by **jpj** » Tue Dec 02, 2008 8:26 pm

Ganelon wrote:Heh, I think that's one of my specialty matches. Anyway, I haven't played on GGPO since STHD came out last week (which I feel sorry for all you Europeans if it's not importable).

It seems we're never on GGPO at the same time, jpj, so if you have a date and time in mind (either after 9pm EST on weekdays or on any Saturday but this one), I'd be happy to get on GGPO and duke it out with ya in some ST.

i do fairly well in mirror-matches, but it's usually a case of getting the first big knockdown. and yeah, HD:R seems to have killed it off a bit. before that, there were 1 or 2 new UK people each week. these days, i'm the only UK guy there whenever i pop in

EST is about 6 hours behind GMT, i believe. this monday coming up, if you're on about 9pm EST, i'll try and stay up till 3am for a few games

saturdays would be better though. maybe next week if i played you at say 8pm here/2pm EST ?

Zuhzuhzombie!! · Post by **Zuhzuhzombie!!** » Tue Dec 02, 2008 8:46 pm

The difference between VF and most fighting games is like the difference between 1CCing a Cave game, and then just credit feeding it.

Quorthon · Post by **Quorthon** » Tue Dec 02, 2008 8:48 pm

I remember when Virtua Fighter was new to arcades. That was a one sweet game. It's smoother-than-anything-else animation and real 3-D fighting were what set it apart and first created the appeal. At the time, there were no 3-D fighters, and none had realistic movement. I think it was the first to do everything with realism in mind. Proportional characters. Realistic attacks and moves, realistic movement (for the time). The controls seemed simple, but at the same time, they felt complex. I remember laughing the first time I realized that P-P-P was a combo. Using the moves, though, revealed a deeper game.

It was tons of fun.

But, I'm not so familiar with the newer games in the series, mostly with the first two. Wasn't Virtua Fighter 4 about the highest rated fighting game ever?

Ganelon · Post by **Ganelon** » Tue Dec 02, 2008 11:59 pm

jpj wrote: saturdays would be better though. maybe next week if i played you at say 8pm here/2pm EST ?

Alright, sounds like a date, no homo. That should allow us to get some more matches in.

kengou · Post by **kengou** » Wed Dec 03, 2008 12:47 am

Quorthon wrote: But, I'm not so familiar with the newer games in the series, mostly with the first two. Wasn't Virtua Fighter 4 about the highest rated fighting game ever?

I'm pretty sure that honor falls to Soul Calibur (1), if we're talking about highest rated by the gaming press. IMO VF4evo is the best 3D fighter out there, but that's just me. And I haven't yet played VF5, which could be better.

GaijinPunch · Post by **GaijinPunch** » Wed Dec 03, 2008 1:12 am

if we're talking about highest rated by the gaming press.

We're definitely not, since we know they are complete dipshits.

jpj · Post by **jpj** » Wed Dec 03, 2008 6:38 pm

Ganelon wrote:
jpj wrote: saturdays would be better though. maybe next week if i played you at say 8pm here/2pm EST ?
Alright, sounds like a date, no homo. That should allow us to get some more matches in.

awesome. i'll pm you closer to the day just to see if you're still available (no homo)

gameoverDude · Post by **gameoverDude** » Fri Dec 05, 2008 4:52 am

The Overheat system in Fighters Impact (Taito, PS1) is nice, IMO. Repeating a move in a combo will freeze you for a moment, causing a combo break.

Some Tekken combos are too damaging for their simplicity. Law can just do low punch-flipkick to start a juggle, and then repeat that to get another couple hits easily. This 4-hitter takes off quite a bit of life. Yawn. I've gotten tired of using the older characters, so I've mainly been using Lili & Dragunov in T5DR.

I hate in Tekken 5 how the ground "heals" when it gets broken in another spot. The floor needs to remain wrecked throughout the match, similar to Kaiser Knuckle- a 2D game which is one of the first I've seen to have destructible stages.

You don't need to be an expert to have some fun with VF, but most players probably won't use all the moves for a given character. That does give some room for players to use different styles. While good, VF is a series few people fully appreciate and understand.

Namco apparently just wants Tekken to be more "accessible", like ESPGaluda 1 compared to DDPDOJ.

neorichieb1971 wrote: So the perfect fighter would be :

1) That detects same move, and punishes you for it
2) Learning in depth moves rewards you
3) Combination moves should be hard to pull off, especially if they force your opponent to block consistently.
4) Lets see some real world graphics, with cracks in the pavement, some grit and dirt. This ain't Pixar mofo.

If Namco or Sega got most of these right. It would easily be the best fighter ever. It must be harder than we think, since they don't bother to balance their games fairly.

Personally, I would put fighters into categories, and only have a fighter able to fight another character from the same category. Having a laser shooting demon against a puncher is hardly fair is it?

Well thats my views on fighters.

DT · Post by DT » Sun Dec 07, 2008 7:25 am

Just picking off a few things that caught my eye, too lazy to use the quote feature and put who put what.

"Some Tekken combos are too damaging for their simplicity. Law can just do low punch-flipkick to start a juggle, and then repeat that to get another couple hits easily. This 4-hitter takes off quite a bit of life. Yawn. I've gotten tired of using the older characters, so I've mainly been using Lili & Dragunov in T5DR."

Law's d+2,3 (or down+right punch, left kick) is extremely unsafe if blocked, if blocked, the opponent can do any launcher really that they want. Bait their move, punish them for it.

"Umm. Eddy Anyone?

Seriously, it is well known that button mashing Eddy players win against more skilled opponents an annoying amount of the time. The trash talk faq explains this pretty well. ("You just lost to a psychotic crack addicted button mashing Eddy player and you feel it is your duty to comment on that brand of playstyle.") The way everything just chains together with him, and the fact that most of his attacks can't be reversed together make it very difficult to use simple tactics that would beat him if the player were trying it with any other character."

What? You can now low parry ANY low (couple exceptions in tekken 6, like Lei's BT d+1) that isn't a knee (like Marduk's d+4) or something along those lines. You see eddy "chaining" those moves together, low parry and punish, or you could block them and hit him back. Or just back dash and wait for him to whiff his mashing moves. Unless both opponents really have no idea what they're doing, then yes I guess Eddy will do more than say...Heihachi.

"It's the same with as Eddy, who can easily kill newbies, but isn't a highly viable competitor in serious Tekken play (any of them)."

Not true, there have been many tournaments won by Eddy players. A player named Slips is probably the first to come to mind. He'll tear many people up with eddy, and it doesn't involve mashing.

"Eddy never gave me any problems. I laugh when someone picks him against me."

lol

Anyway, just pointed out the posts of tekken since I know a lot more about tekken than VF. Either way, VF is much deeper than Tekken. I find Tekken much more fun (more competition for it here in America for the most part) but you can't deny how crazy deep that game is, also how stupid the announcer/characters are.

zaphod · Post by **zaphod** » Wed Nov 30, 2011 7:45 pm

I wouldn't be surprised if eddy was made easier to deal with in later games, but if you remember back in the days of Tekken 3, his attacks really weren't reversible. Sure, not all of his moves are safe if blocked, but what you can do after is highly dependent on what the player decides to follow them up with, and if he's just randomly mashing buttons you have no idea what's going to happen, because he doesn't either.

With most characters just thrashing about randomly leaves you wide open and destroyed quickly. With eddy you can get away with it a surprising amount of time, because he has more combo possibilities to luck into than the other characters. He's supposed to win by being unpredictable, and a button masher does that for free. A master eddy player can be just as unpredictable without button mashing,of course, and they are the ones you truly have to fear, but a button masher can randomly do the exact same thing the master would have done some of the time, and he doesn't have to pull it off that often because it causes very good damage when he gets it.

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What is the novelty behind Virtua Fighter series?

Re: What is the novelty behind Virtua Fighter series?