Death Smiles: Countdown to North America Invasion

Jockel · Post by **Jockel** » Wed Sep 24, 2008 1:38 pm

yeah you SHOULD try it out, before getting the PCB.
because it's good, but i don't think it's worth the money it sells for. that's just my opinion, though.
i liked futari and muchi muchi pork better.

Necronom · Post by **Necronom** » Wed Sep 24, 2008 2:00 pm

GaijinPunch wrote:Internet: Where uneducated people tell corporations how to run their business.

...or come up with awkward generalizations

I'm sure all the people who forced EA to loosen their useless DRM measures were all just uneducated idiots, right?
Seriously, Cave's apparent decision to region code the 360 release is downright bizarre.

Kaspal · Post by **Kaspal** » Wed Sep 24, 2008 2:30 pm

Necronom wrote:
GaijinPunch wrote:Internet: Where uneducated people tell corporations how to run their business.
...or come up with awkward generalizations
I'm sure all the people who forced EA to loosen their useless DRM measures were all just uneducated idiots, right?
Seriously, Cave's apparent decision to region code the 360 release is downright bizarre.

im still tryin to figure out WHY they do it?... they intend to sell as many copies as they can, then why narrowing the potential customer base to a single region? dont they know that ppl that really want their stuff will import them if needed be?... anyway, that bothers me alot, but proly theres nothing i can do... sadly.

VorpalEdge · Post by **VorpalEdge** » Wed Sep 24, 2008 3:12 pm

Region coding is almost certainly free and they probably want to keep their options open in case they do decide to distribute in other regions. It's not like they'd make any money from un-region-locking it anyways - there's about ten additional people who would buy the game (I hate to say it, but we're insignificant) and the middleman would pocket most of the profit anyways.

OmniGLH · Post by **OmniGLH** » Wed Sep 24, 2008 3:31 pm

And it continues to amaze me how everyone continue to whine about these Japanese 360 games not being region free..

A) Pony up and get a Japanese Xbox 360 console and enjoy the NTSC-J titles

B) Pony up and get the PCB

C) Bitch, whine, complain that these games are not region free and that everyone sucks -- woe is me.

BryanM · Post by **BryanM** » Wed Sep 24, 2008 5:19 pm

D) Get a different hobby that isn't so retardedly expensive.

E) Do A and B and C, and then light your family and yourself on fire. They're all just going to starve to death anyways. Why bitch and moan about it?

Kaspal · Post by **Kaspal** » Wed Sep 24, 2008 5:20 pm

OmniGLH wrote:
And it continues to amaze me how everyone continue to whine about these Japanese 360 games not being region free..

A) Pony up and get a Japanese Xbox 360 console and enjoy the NTSC-J titles

B) Pony up and get the PCB

C) Bitch, whine, complain that these games are not region free and that everyone sucks -- woe is me.

how did you knwo that!? hehe...

i really thought on buyin a J-X360, but the cost of havin an Elite model of those at my doorstep would be somethin in the double the ammount i have to pay for an american Elite model (mine costed 500 dollars, and i had to go and count pennies to get it on my backpack!)... now, im not rich, and my incomes are not high enough to buy such thing... so for now, i have to settle with the american model, and maybe in a couple yeears i'll bite the bullet and buy a japanese model... but for now, at least for me, its a no-no situation.

Rai82 · Post by **Rai82** » Thu Sep 25, 2008 2:35 am

Nice faceplate made by the developer.

brokenhalo · Post by **brokenhalo** » Thu Sep 25, 2008 2:49 am

oh wow. that would make a nice pre-order item

Elixir · Post by **Elixir** » Thu Sep 25, 2008 3:14 am

I'd buy that in an instant.

orange · Post by **orange** » Thu Sep 25, 2008 3:43 am

brokenhalo wrote:oh wow. that would make a nice pre-order item

motherfucking this

OmniGLH · Post by **OmniGLH** » Thu Sep 25, 2008 3:47 am

Kaspal wrote: how did you knwo that!? hehe...

i really thought on buyin a J-X360, but the cost of havin an Elite model of those at my doorstep would be somethin in the double the ammount i have to pay for an american Elite model (mine costed 500 dollars, and i had to go and count pennies to get it on my backpack!)... now, im not rich, and my incomes are not high enough to buy such thing... so for now, i have to settle with the american model, and maybe in a couple yeears i'll bite the bullet and buy a japanese model... but for now, at least for me, its a no-no situation.

I guess I'm just complaining and whining about all the complainers and whiners.
For sure these times are hard right now in our economy, and we need to be frugal with our spending.

But at the same time, people here on these forums are quick to make a PCB purchase with out even thinking twice. Paying even more if it includes the feet in baggy and cardboard box.

I purchased my Japanese 360 right when Ketsui X and DDPDOJBLX were announced. At the time only Raiden Fighters Aces and Shikigami no Shiro III were available at retail.

In the long run, I think it is a more economical to have a Japanese 360 as opposed to getting all the PCB's

Raiden Fighters PCB = $100
Raiden Fighters 2 PCB = $100
Raiden Fighters Jet PCB = $150
Ketsui PCB = $800
DoDonPachi Daioujou BL PCB = $1000+?
Death Smiles PCB = $800
total cost is roughly $3000 *price are very rough estimates*

Japanese 360 = $400(shipped)
Raiden Fighters Aces = $70
Death Smiles = $70
Ketsui = $70
DDPDOJBLX = $70
total cost is roughly $700

$700 <<< $3000

Ah I am just frustrated with always seeing post with people complaining that these games will not be region free.

GaijinPunch · Post by **GaijinPunch** » Thu Sep 25, 2008 5:50 am

Jockel wrote:i thought you can select it before every level, but can't e.g. take always the easiest level?!
it got it quite mixed up, mostly 2, some 1, some 3.

Don't be such a pussy. Play everything on rank 3 and go to the Canyon. That puts it about in the middle in terms of difficulty. Mushi Futari Maniac, or so.

I'm sure all the people who forced EA to loosen their useless DRM measures were all just uneducated idiots, right?

Dunno. Did they spew nonsense out of their pie holes?

Seriously, Cave's apparent decision to region code the 360 release is downright bizarre.

Yes. A business wanting more money... truly bizarre.

Not.

moozooh · Post by **moozooh** » Thu Sep 25, 2008 7:07 am

OmniGLH wrote:But at the same time, people here on these forums are quick to make a PCB purchase with out even thinking twice. Paying even more if it includes the feet in baggy and cardboard box.

You might notice that this group pretty much never overlaps with those complaining about region locks and other arbitrarily enforced money eaters. It all comes together when you consider them completely separate from each other.

Necronom · Post by **Necronom** » Thu Sep 25, 2008 10:16 am

Yes. A business wanting more money... truly bizarre.

Assuming a western (full price?!) release in the near future is straight up outlandish.
I find it interesting how a developer like Treasure manages to communicate with its western fans while a company like Cave continues to ignore them.
This rather bizarre behaviour will surely piss off potential customers in the west. Maybe not the pcb collectors but most definitely some of those who bought the PS2 ports to play them on their chipped consoles and people who played their games via emulation and were looking forward to get Death Smiles for their already existing (western) 360.
Region coding the JP release will NOT result in "more money" from a potential western release because such a release won't happen.
Imo, a limited and region coded release was chosen in order to keep the RISK of Death Smiles pcb prices falling at a minimum.

joeboto · Post by **joeboto** » Thu Sep 25, 2008 10:46 am

Rai82 wrote:Nice faceplate made by the developer.

holy fck. DO WANT.

Jockel · Post by **Jockel** » Thu Sep 25, 2008 10:47 am

GaijinPunch wrote:
Jockel wrote:i thought you can select it before every level, but can't e.g. take always the easiest level?!
it got it quite mixed up, mostly 2, some 1, some 3.
Don't be such a pussy. Play everything on rank 3 and go to the Canyon. That puts it about in the middle in terms of difficulty. Mushi Futari Maniac, or so.

^^"
i am not exactly what you could call a good player.

antares · Post by **antares** » Thu Sep 25, 2008 11:25 am

The faceplate is really nice. I hope it will be available at Playasia soon

Necronom wrote: Imo, a limited and region coded release was chosen in order to keep the RISK of Death Smiles pcb prices falling at a minimum.

Why should Cave be interested in second hand PCB prices? If they would care about that they would never have given the licence for DDP DOJ Black Label to 5PB.

Etrian · Post by **Etrian** » Thu Sep 25, 2008 11:53 am

GaijinPunch wrote:Yes. A business wanting more money... truly bizarre

I don't think them region locking the games is done for profit.. Cave receive no profit from Japanese Xbox 360s sold and there would only be a small number of people willing to buy one just to play their games. If anything, they should make their games region free, because they would turn more profit for them in the long run (demand + region free = more copies sold to export stores = profit for Cave)

cody · Post by **cody** » Thu Sep 25, 2008 1:14 pm

JESUS FUCKING CHRIST HOW MANY TIMES DO PEOPLE HAVE TO EXPLAIN WHY REGION CODING EXISTS?

I don't like it either. . . but if you still don't understand that cave stands to make more money from licensing their IP to a western publisher than they would from retail sales to the tens of people who are willing to import . . . PLEASE STFU

GaijinPunch · Post by **GaijinPunch** » Thu Sep 25, 2008 1:14 pm

I find it interesting how a developer like Treasure manages to communicate with its western fans while a company like Cave continues to ignore them.

Yes... all 50 of them.

region free, because they would turn more profit for them in the long run

The more white people that buy the NTSC-J release, the fewer people will by the US version. If they are thinking big (even *possibly* big) region coding is the smarter thing to do. Regardless of whether they have any plan to or not, they have the option to.

Necronom · Post by **Necronom** » Thu Sep 25, 2008 2:46 pm

GaijinPunch wrote:
I find it interesting how a developer like Treasure manages to communicate with its western fans while a company like Cave continues to ignore them.
Yes... all 50 of them.

region free, because they would turn more profit for them in the long run
The more white people that buy the NTSC-J release, the fewer people will by the US version. If they are thinking big (even *possibly* big) region coding is the smarter thing to do. Regardless of whether they have any plan to or not, they have the option to.

Unfortunately the option you're talking about depends more on actually finding a western publisher crazy enough to publish a danmaku shooter at full price in America than on allmighty Cave's decision to bring one of their games to the western market.
I also like the funny contradiction in your post - if there are only so few western fans (you know it's more than 50, don't kid yourself...) how can they possibly think big in such a situation?!
Cave (and to a certain degree G-Rev) are the last two shmup developers who have to walk the thin line between not upsetting their pcb buyers (mostly arcade operators) and potential new customers outside of the arcade business (until now served by Arika). They are not interested in a bigger (=not region coded) release right now. They do want to keep it JP only at the moment.

@cody
Why don't you just take one of those chill-pills, cowboy? You're acting like you're running this forum. There is no western publisher.

cody · Post by **cody** » Thu Sep 25, 2008 4:39 pm

number of westerners who would import < number of westerners who would buy a normal retail release

This is NOT a contradiction, its common sense. There are going to be at least some non-fans, who have never heard of play-asia much less cave, who will buy a game from gamestop because it has a goth lolita on the cover.

number of westerners who would import * cave's cut of the sales of each JP disc < %chance of a western publisher * cave's licensing fee

Note that cave can shift much of the risk to the publisher by charging a flat licensing fee up front. It doesn't matter whether there is a western publisher currently, even a very small chance of having one outweighs the $1,000 or so they'd get from region free sales.

p.s. cowboy hahahahhahahaha

jpj · Post by **jpj** » Thu Sep 25, 2008 5:33 pm

cody speaks the truth. you can bet g.rev were glad senko no ronde was region locked

dmauro · Post by **dmauro** » Thu Sep 25, 2008 6:00 pm

They could still sell it to a western publisher even if it's region free. And anyways, I would think money in hand now (export sales) would be more tempting than possible deals later.

honorless · Post by **honorless** » Thu Sep 25, 2008 6:40 pm

Rai82 wrote:Nice faceplate made by the developer.

Seems like something they'd make part of the LE. (worked for Tales of Vesperia)
I might actually spring for it if this is included. Looks pretty classy!

...yeah I'm getting pretty tired of hearing people go on incessantly about region coding. It sucks, the justifications for it are bullshit from a consumer perspective, it's always been a pain in the ass for importers and always will be until it's abolished (if that ever happens), blah blah blah text vomit that's taken up 9000 pages in various threads about the 360 ports already

Everyone who isn't an idiot already knows this. But right now, shit being region locked is pretty much an inevitability.

Import, or pester a localizer and hope. These are the two choices anyone who wants to play this game has.

E. Randy Dupre · Post by **E. Randy Dupre** » Thu Sep 25, 2008 7:58 pm

dmauro wrote:They could still sell it to a western publisher even if it's region free.

Pointless, no? Everybody in the US and Europe who's interested in getting it would then buy the region-free JPN release and no publisher would even contemplate buying it up for official release in those territories because all the potential buyers would already own it.

GaijinPunch · Post by **GaijinPunch** » Fri Sep 26, 2008 12:59 am

Unfortunately the option you're talking about depends more on actually finding a western publisher crazy enough to publish a danmaku shooter

It's not really a danmaku (only at the end of the game on max rank). It has more of a chance of a western release than any of Cave's games. I'm still not talking about the likelihood of it. I'm talking about from the business perspective, allowing yourself to have it localized by someone else is the smartest business decision. My 19-month old knows that. Nobody here seems to though.

at full price

Also a moot point.

I would think money in hand now (export sales) would be more tempting than possible deals later.

You've obviously never worked for a company that has to explain things to an entity called "the share holders".

Taylor · Post by **Taylor** » Fri Sep 26, 2008 1:17 am

If the import sales are negligible to Cave they would be negligible to a publisher as well. If what was being argued was the case then all US 360 games would be region locked like their JP 360 counterparts.

I still wager JP 360 games are locked because it simplifies part of the approval process. If so, it’s not worth the effort getting around it if their imports will be insurmountable and/or they have an international release.

Ultimately it doesn’t matter why this is the case, but that this is the case. We’re going to have to suck it up and buy JP 360’s or not play Death Smiles. Considering until now the only option available was a rather expensive PCB I’m not going to complain too much when I grab mine next year.

brokenhalo · Post by **brokenhalo** » Fri Sep 26, 2008 2:48 am

the only reason i can see american releases not being region locked is because, to my knowledge, there hasn't been a single usa-only release for xbox 360. even madden gets released in japan (although no one buys it). no point for other countries to import our games when they get their own region release.