Proto-shmups: Variable rate of fire

[Minzoku]

Hi, everyone.

I bought and started playing the Atari Anniversary collection for GBA at work, because Centipede is one of my first video game loves. The one issue I still have after all this time is something that occurs only[?] in the early shooters: variable rate of fire.

That is, only one bullet I shoot can ever be on the screen at one time, so I shoot faster when something's immediately in front of me but slow as hell when there's nothing directly in my path. I've lost so many lives because I've targeted something but there was still a stray bullet on-screen, resulting in untimely collision [usually with a spider].

If it's a programming thing, fine, but logically it doesn't make sense. How do the bullets know that there's still another bullet out there? I should just be able to shoot 4 bullets/second or some such standard rate, and it's aggravating that I can't.

If this was an old topic I missed, sorry.

[raiden]

it IS a programming issue (each shot requires coordinates to be stored in memory), but it also makes sense in terms of gameplay, because you get rewarded for being brave and closing in on the enemy, or in Centipede´s case, you still have a chance to defend yourself against enemies that came down to your area.
And it hasn´t disappeared with newer games completely. Most Psikyo, Seibu and even Cave games let your weapon be stronger when you´re close to the enemy, although it isn´t necessarily shown with the number of sprites.

[EddyMRA]

I've seen this limitation on number of player bullets on screen at one time in shmups made up to the late 90's. I think one reason is because of hardware limitations (i.e. only so many sprites that can be on-screen at once). Another reason I can think of is weapon design; some subweapons are purposely limited to the number on-screen you can spawn at any one time (power vs. rate of fire). Some weapons would become too powerful and over-the-top if they didn't have a limitation to the amount on-screen. Look at Raiden's Red Spread Vulcan at full power. If that weapon was a constant stream, then you have Batsugun's insane weaponry without the adjustment in damage.

[sffan]

This "one bullet on screen at a time" rule encourages you to place your shots carefully and aim. Modern shooters' machine-gun fire and guided missiles effectively eliminates aiming at individual enemies.

[Ghegs]

And it hasn´t disappeared with newer games completely. Most Psikyo, Seibu and even Cave games let your weapon be stronger when you´re close to the enemy, although it isn´t necessarily shown with the number of sprites.

Trizeal does this, too. I actually like it, since it encourages to get up close 'n personal with the enemies instead of just hanging around in the back. Only in newer shmups of course, it's annoying as hell in Minzoku's case where it's a hardware limitation instead of a deliberate mechanism.

[it290]

I dunno, that's an essential gameplay mechanic for games like Space Invaders, Galaga, and Centipede. It rewards the player for being accurate, so as long as your shots are hitting you can take down enemies quickly, but if you miss there's a time penalty. It also requires leading, something not often seen in modern shmups. And finally, it increases the tension level as enemies get closer to the bottom of the screen.

Deluxe Galaga even capitalized on this mechanic by giving the player 'extra bullet' power-ups, allowing one to have more than one volley on-screen at a time.

[Minzoku]

I figured it was a programming issue. It seems like a vague "reward" as such, though, particularly vs. in Galaga [I think?] where there's specifically a bonus for getting a high percentage of bullets that hit.

Damn, now I want to play Galaga

[alpha5099]

I'm pretty sure Galaga actually lets you have 2 bullets on screen. I distinctly remember reading the manual for my Galaga/Galaxian GameBoy game when I was a little kid, and it made the distinction between the shot styles of each, as Galaxian only allowed a single bullet on screen.

[SheSaidDutch]

Sorry to hijack your thread Minzoku but all this talk about these classic games got me thinking

btw are most shmups without scrolling called protoshmups?

I've played these, anymore that you all can reccomend?

Defender
Exerion
Galaga
Gaplus
Galaxian- This is the one I played on an old computer while in primary school,I was 11 at the time. I finished my work just to play this and also breaktimes
Space Invaders
Juno Fist
Phoenix
Uni Wars
Centipede
Tempest
Gyruss

[alpha5099]

I don't think there's any real consensus on what counts as a protoshmup. Largely because there's no real point where you can say, this game was a protoshmup, but this game released a week later, this was the first true shmup.

The non-scrolling thing is a little subjective. I mean, Galaga does scroll, the stars move behind you. The more common term I've found for games like Galaga, Space Invaders, Centipede etc etc are single screen shooters.

Then you have tube shooters, like Tempest or Gyruss. Lots of controversy over where they fit, they weren't allowed in the Top 25 vote while singe screeners were.

Defender's a sticky subject too. Is it any less of a shmup than Fantasy Zone? No, not particularly, although it'll probably be lumped in with the proto-shmups.

Then there's stuff like Robotron 2084, which is more of a predeccesor to the arena shooter than the shmup.

It's a bullshit phrase, and only the people with sticks up their bums would really be bothered by discussing them amidst "proper" shmups.

[Minzoku]

Hijack away It's not as though there's a lot of ground to cover on-topic...

See, that's what I have to wonder about, too, since Galaga/Galaxian has the scrolling background but effectively the enemies are just hovering around in one spot until they charge at you. Like, the whole cube puzzle stage boss of Shikigami no Shiro II, that section effectively works as a "single screen," but because that is only one section out of many, SNS2 is a shmup... which means the distinction comes more from how the enemies/boundaries act relative to your character. Galagaxian [whatever] has no effective boundaries, so it's a single screen = protoshmup.

I think.

[sffan]

Sorry to hijack your thread Minzoku but all this talk about these classic games got me thinking

btw are most shmups without scrolling called protoshmups?

I've played these, anymore that you all can reccomend?

Defender
Exerion
Galaga
Gaplus
Galaxian- This is the one I played on an old computer while in primary school,I was 11 at the time. I finished my work just to play this and also breaktimes
Space Invaders
Juno Fist
Phoenix
Uni Wars
Centipede
Tempest
Gyruss

Yes! Try Scramble, Time Pilot, Sinistar

[SheSaidDutch]

Hijack away It's not as though there's a lot of ground to cover on-topic...

See, that's what I have to wonder about, too, since Galaga/Galaxian has the scrolling background but effectively the enemies are just hovering around in one spot until they charge at you. Like, the whole cube puzzle stage boss of Shikigami no Shiro II, that section effectively works as a "single screen," but because that is only one section out of many, SNS2 is a shmup... which means the distinction comes more from how the enemies/boundaries act relative to your character. Galagaxian [whatever] has no effective boundaries, so it's a single screen = protoshmup.

I think.

Yeah thats the classification I would say myself.

[CMoon]

I think I may be guilty of coining the proto-shmup term (not like it's genius or anything...)

Anyway, when it came up last, I was using it to mean games that 1) were created before the existance of 'true shmups', 2) were clearly the predecessors to shmups and 3) were in almost everyway like a shmup minus one or two key characteristics...
(yes, I'm a science teacher)

The most common deviations were:
-movement only along the x plane
-non-forced scrolling (you can run away from bullets)
-probably other things I can't recall...

Thus, Galaga is a proto-shmup because it existed before true shmups, is clearly an early development in the train of thought that led to shmups (it has most of the major characteristics) but lacks movement in the Y axis.

I find this useful to designate a more diverse group of early shmup like games versus the more tight-knit group of games we'd easily identify as true shmups.

Some people don't like this because Galaga is a shmup goddamnit!

This became a point of heavy argument because some feel that proto-shmups 1) don't belong in the main forum and/or 2) shouldn't be on the top-25. I DO think they belong here, but think they should be correctly classified as proto-shmups (because I am a NERD).

[alpha5099]

It's a bullshit phrase, and only the people with sticks up their bums would really be bothered by discussing them amidst "proper" shmups - alpha5099

Hooray! I've been sigged. Rock on.

Sorry, it's been a long day.

CMoon, I think you're right about coining the term, although I wouldn't call it genius. It's a great phrase. I don't remember anyone saying "whazzit?!" when it first came up, everyone understands what it means.

[CMoon]

I think I may be guilty of coining the proto-shmup term (not like it's genius or anything...)

CMoon, I think you're right about coining the term, although I wouldn't call it genius. It's a great phrase. I don't remember anyone saying "whazzit?!" when it first came up, everyone understands what it means.

Maybe I misunderstand you, or you misunderstand me, or we misunderstand each other (or perhaps secretly we are saying exactly the same thing). I meant in my innitial post that while I may have coined the phrase, it IS NOT genius, it is just calling a spade a spade. Pure chance I said it first (if I did).