What with all the new console slagging...

[Acid King]

...here's a bit of interesting news.

"Eschewing its previous business ideas, Revolution will be online-friendly, and support a broadband gaming service similar to that of Microsoft's Xbox Live. Its most significant contribution to online gaming will be the ability to download Nintendo's entire catalog of NES, SNES, and Nintendo 64 console games."

http://www.gamespot.com/news/2005/05/17 ... 125078.htm

[iatneH]

I'm still wondering what "Nintendo's entire catalogue" means...
Is it just Nintendo's 1st party stuff?
_ENTIRE_ catalogue? Does that mean we'll be able to download stuff like Sin & Punishment and Bangai-O?

If they're somehow stored on the system's onboard memory, hopefully some hacker can find a way to put ROMs on it (the evil pirate in me speaks!)

[SheSaidDutch]

I should be jumping in excitment but I'm not

I wonder how It'll try out..

[TWITCHDOCTOR]

...here's a bit of interesting news.

"Eschewing its previous business ideas, Revolution will be online-friendly, and support a broadband gaming service similar to that of Microsoft's Xbox Live. Its most significant contribution to online gaming will be the ability to download Nintendo's entire catalog of NES, SNES, and Nintendo 64 console games."

http://www.gamespot.com/news/2005/05/17 ... 125078.htm

I guess thats cool and all, but I've been able to play all that Nintendo stuff on my Xbox for a couple of years already. Yea, I own the consoles too, and even though I own a 64, it pretty much blows...except for a few games.
Star Fox
Golden Eye
Wave Race
F-Zero X


Anyway, most people will feel the same way. I mean emulation through computers etc,etc. We don't need a new console just to play games that are 15 years old. PLus, I seriously doubt that those new controllers will be able to play anything "gamelike".

[TWITCHDOCTOR]

Slagging?
Well, personally, I don't even think new consoles are even necessary at this time, as the current consoles are as good as things are gonna get. (for now)
Even the new releases for these new consoles don't really look much "better" than whats currently out at the moment.

Then again, the new controllers appear to be more inclined for "virtual reality" type stuff, which I hope you realize aren't games.
So, there's not much to be getting "all wet" about.

Whats under that hunk of plastic is no concern of mine, as it all falls into the games. The games will carry the console, not the main CPU,etc.
In other words, I'll have to see some fun games for myself, as I refuse to read and watch the "Next Gen" hyped to all bloody hell.

[sethsez]

Even the new releases for these new consoles don't really look much "better" than whats currently out at the moment.

Huh?

Then again, the new controllers appear to be more inclined for "virtual reality" type stuff

Huh?

In any case, it's a stupid idea for a complete console, but it's a much better alternative to Jakks TV games or compilation discs.

[BrianC]

Twitchdoctor, you do know that alot of the stuff going around about the Revolution controllers is pure speculation and that the controllers haven't been revealed yet, right?

[Accutron]

I'm still wondering what "Nintendo's entire catalogue" means...
Is it just Nintendo's 1st party stuff?
_ENTIRE_ catalogue? Does that mean we'll be able to download stuff like Sin & Punishment and Bangai-O?

Certainly it will be only titles whose rights are held by Nintendo. We won't be seeing Sin & Punishment on the list.

[Vexorg]

It will be primarily Nintendo stuff, of course, but I imagine the major third parties will probably sign on as well. Even if this was to be limited to Nintendo stuff, I could still think of plenty of stuff to get for this.

[dave4shmups]

Even the new releases for these new consoles don't really look much "better" than whats currently out at the moment.

Huh?

Then again, the new controllers appear to be more inclined for "virtual reality" type stuff

Huh?

In any case, it's a stupid idea for a complete console, but it's a much better alternative to Jakks TV games or compilation discs.

Sethsez, have you seen any footage of 360 games?? They really DON'T look much better then current XBOX games. And with so many new XBOX games coming out in the next year, and the coming XBOX price drop, to hell with 360, I'd rather just get an XBOX.

[dave4shmups]

I'm still wondering what "Nintendo's entire catalogue" means...
Is it just Nintendo's 1st party stuff?
_ENTIRE_ catalogue? Does that mean we'll be able to download stuff like Sin & Punishment and Bangai-O?

If they're somehow stored on the system's onboard memory, hopefully some hacker can find a way to put ROMs on it (the evil pirate in me speaks!)

I'm wondering the same thing. IMO, it would be worth it if "Nintendo's Entire Catalog" includes 3rd party AND import games. Then I might consider getting a Revolution.

But right now, I'm just as excited about the 3 consoles that are currently out. And I doubt, BTW, that the Revolution will support the Game Boy Player; and that is a MAJOR selling point with me with the Cube, since I never play games unless I'm in front of my TV.

[TWITCHDOCTOR]

Even the new releases for these new consoles don't really look much "better" than whats currently out at the moment.

Huh?

Then again, the new controllers appear to be more inclined for "virtual reality" type stuff

Huh?

In any case, it's a stupid idea for a complete console, but it's a much better alternative to Jakks TV games or compilation discs.

Sethsez, have you seen any footage of 360 games?? They really DON'T look much better then current XBOX games. And with so many new XBOX games coming out in the next year, and the coming XBOX price drop, to hell with 360, I'd rather just get an XBOX.

Yea Dave...you tell em! I was gonna let him have it, but you ended up "owning" Seth instead!


Anyway, in any case, the controllers don't look like they'd be easy to play arcade style games.

[roushimsx]

That's always nice when they have to sell extreme backwards compatibility as a main selling point because there's not much else to show for the system or software support. It's also cute how there's no mention of pricing.

Let's see...given Nintendo's recent history with this sort of thing (NES Classics Series on GBA, which retailed for $20-$30), I think we can expect to pay at least $10 per game we want to play....if we're lucky.

Don't think I'll be supporting Nintendo in the next round of consoles. Hell, I don't know if I'm going to support anyone in the next round of consoles... I may just save my money and round out my Saturn and Playstation collections.

[dave4shmups]

That's always nice when they have to sell extreme backwards compatibility as a main selling point because there's not much else to show for the system or software support. It's also cute how there's no mention of pricing.

Let's see...given Nintendo's recent history with this sort of thing (NES Classics Series on GBA, which retailed for $20-$30), I think we can expect to pay at least $10 per game we want to play....if we're lucky.

Don't think I'll be supporting Nintendo in the next round of consoles. Hell, I don't know if I'm going to support anyone in the next round of consoles... I may just save my money and round out my Saturn and Playstation collections.

I agree, I think I'll just get a Cube and an XBOX, finish off my PS2 collection, MAYBE get one older cartridge-based console, and be done with it!

[sethsez]

Sethsez, have you seen any footage of 360 games??

Yes, I have. And aside from Perfect Dark Zero, which is a joke and never should have been shown, they look damned impressive, especially Oblivion and PGR3. Not up to the PS3 shots, but those are more than likely BS clips not running on anything approaching the final hardware.

Anyway, in any case, the controllers don't look like they'd be easy to play arcade style games.

How so? They're analog sticks, d-pads and buttons, same as they've been for a decade now. I really don't understand how they're suddenly "virtual reality oriented" unless you're going on the rumors for the Revolution, which are totally groundless thus far and (considering the system's big selling point seems to be emulation of old games) very unlikely.

[Acid King]

I guess thats cool and all, but I've been able to play all that Nintendo stuff on my Xbox for a couple of years already. Yea, I own the consoles too, and even though I own a 64, it pretty much blows...except for a few games.
Star Fox
Golden Eye
Wave Race
F-Zero X

Anyway, most people will feel the same way. I mean emulation through computers etc,etc. We don't need a new console just to play games that are 15 years old. PLus, I seriously doubt that those new controllers will be able to play anything "gamelike".

It's an interesting tactic for Nintendo to take. Now that it seems as though backwards compatability has become a mandatory function, it's like they're saying we're the most backwards compatible. Instead of pushing a revolutionary new online game, their main online draw is old games.

[TWITCHDOCTOR]

Sethsez, have you seen any footage of 360 games??

Yes, I have. And aside from Perfect Dark Zero, which is a joke and never should have been shown, they look damned impressive, especially Oblivion and PGR3. Not up to the PS3 shots, but those are more than likely BS clips not running on anything approaching the final hardware.

Anyway, in any case, the controllers don't look like they'd be easy to play arcade style games.

How so? They're analog sticks, d-pads and buttons, same as they've been for a decade now. I really don't understand how they're suddenly "virtual reality oriented" unless you're going on the rumors for the Revolution, which are totally groundless thus far and (considering the system's big selling point seems to be emulation of old games) very unlikely.

Ok Ace...calm down a bit. You tell me its going to be easier to play Contra with those new controllers, and I'll shut the fuck up!!??

[sethsez]

What's with this "calm down a bit" thing? I am calm. You're the one using phrases like "shut the fuck up" (even if it's not referring to me) and multiple exclamation points here. It's a discussion, nothing more.

Anyway, it won't be easier, but I don't see how it'll be any harder. The d-pad is on the left, the buttons are on the right. What major changes concern you?

And which controllers are we talking about? The Xbox 360 controller looks like pretty much the same thing as the Type-S (which was just fine for Metal Slug 3) except white this time, and nobody knows what's going on with the PS3 controller. It's not like 2D fans looked at it and went "oh shit" while 3D fans were jumping for joy... everyone is perplexed by that thing. However, I doubt it'll be better for 3D games and worse for 2D games. If there's a dip in quality, it's gonna be overall.

Finally, since the Revolution is apparantly heavily focused on allowing people to play older games, I doubt they'd release the system with a controller that wasn't actually capable of playing them.

[judesalmon]

The Killzone video was mighty impressive. If it comes to pass, I'll be happy.

The PS3 is the most powerful on paper, but no-one will really know what these consoles are capable of until they're released.

[sethsez]

Pretty much.

I really don't trust that Killzone video, though. It gives me a serious "Halo 2 at E3" vibe, except even moreso... methinks the final product won't be close to that in many respects.

[judesalmon]

I think the final Halo 2 looked better than that E3 video.

As for the Killzone video, I am pretty optimistic.

[TWITCHDOCTOR]

What's with this "calm down a bit" thing? I am calm. You're the one using phrases like "shut the fuck up" (even if it's not referring to me) and multiple exclamation points here. It's a discussion, nothing more.

Anyway, it won't be easier, but I don't see how it'll be any harder. The d-pad is on the left, the buttons are on the right. What major changes concern you?

And which controllers are we talking about? The Xbox 360 controller looks like pretty much the same thing as the Type-S (which was just fine for Metal Slug 3) except white this time, and nobody knows what's going on with the PS3 controller. It's not like 2D fans looked at it and went "oh shit" while 3D fans were jumping for joy... everyone is perplexed by that thing. However, I doubt it'll be better for 3D games and worse for 2D games. If there's a dip in quality, it's gonna be overall.

Finally, since the Revolution is apparantly heavily focused on allowing people to play older games, I doubt they'd release the system with a controller that wasn't actually capable of playing them.

Whoah!!!(multiple exclamations!!!) I said "I'll shut the fuck up!" Quote me correctly...!
Calm down as I said before..MAN! Yes, I'm telling you again.!!!1111oneelevenandstuff!!11

The controllers just don't seem as "user friendy" as the ones of the past.

Big deal...I disagree with you about the new controllers, and you blow a cow out of your ass....

[sethsez]

Big deal...I disagree with you about the new controllers, and you blow a cow out of your ass....

Okay, now I'm getting irritated. Where, exactly, did I "blow a cow out of my ass"? The first time you said that I replied with "huh?" And the second and third times I gave the reasons why I disagreed with you on these being more oriented to 3D games. I didn't insult you, I didn't fly off the handle (why would I? we're talking about game controllers)... I just gave the reasons why I disagreed. Why, exactly, are you trying to turn this into a fight?

[FatCobra]

What's so "Revolutionary" about a system that can download and play older games? Nintendo's doing it's milking thing again....$30 for each Mario Advance game when all three were on an SNES cart...$20 a pop for NES games...so um yeah...keep sucking money out of clueless gamers Nintendo.

[TWITCHDOCTOR]

I'm not turning this into a fight.
"Blowing a cow out your ass" was a joke. I even used those ghey emoticons to try and convey this to you. (I dislike using little smiley faces, but thats just me)
Also, all those "ones and elevens" should have hinted at me playing around a bit, as I'm not known to be retarded enough to use em on accident.

Anyway, calm down Ace.

Here's another example...I really don't think it will be "cool" at all playing a Metal Slug type game with the new PS3 controller. I haven't seen the new Microsoft pads, or the Nintendo ones. Still, I'm certain I will find the Nintendo ones to be weird, just like I dislike the Cube and 64 controllers.
Gyro's aren't getting me excited at all. Either is rubbing the controller itself.

[sethsez]

Fair enough.

Here's the MS pad:


To me, that looks like, at the very least, it'll be more comfortable than the DC pad (which was still fine for the likes of Mars Matrix and Bangaio). The d-pad looks a bit cheap, but all that matters is how it actually feels, which nobody knows yet. Compared to the Type-S, I think it looks better, and like I said, the Type-S was fine for Metal Slug 3 and plenty of MAMEd games.

The PS3 pad looks shitty, I agree. So does everyone, really. Nobody is sure what Sony's thinking, but who knows? It could work. I'm going to wait to try it out before I slag on it, just because I doubt they'd pour tons of money into developing something that's worse than the DS2. If it winds up sucking, though, expect third-party controllers to come out of nowhere with a million different designs. A Retrocon 2 wouldn't surprise me one bit.

The Revolution controller (and this is purely a guess) won't be hugely revolutionary, and if it is, it will still function just fine as a regular controller. Remember, one of the big selling points for the system is how it can play NES and SNES games. Even if there is a gyro or whatever, that still forces Nintendo to design a controller that'll play NES games well, too. My guess is that as far as button layout goes, it'll be Nintendo's most conservative controller in a decade just because of the realities of NES and SNES games. The gyro or whatever will be like the rumble feature in games today... there for games that use it, invisible for games that don't.

Edit: If that picture isn't showing up, it's on the Gear page on IGN.

[FRO]

I personally think the backwards compatibility is a MAJOR selling point, though this is coming from someone nearing 30 who played many of the NES and SNES games. My thing is, the PS2 was backwards compatible with PSX games. Hopefully PS3 will allow both to be used as well (since the controllers, despite the change in physical look) appear to have the same basic button configuration. The GBA had GB and GBC compatibility. The DS has GBA compatibility. I think if the Revolution has Cube compatibility and a hardware/firmware architecture that supports quality emulation of the classics (either in downloadable form or multi-game release discs like the Mega Man Anniversary pack), it will be an awesome feature.

[TWITCHDOCTOR]

All I want is a new console to be able to play Turbo Grafx-16, as well as Super CD-Rom games.
My US Duo won't last forever, and it would be nice to play Dracula X and Lords of Thunder with a gyro!!!(just kidding about the "gyro")

[judesalmon]

All I want is a new console to be able to play Turbo Grafx-16, as well as Super CD-Rom games.
My US Duo won't last forever, and it would be nice to play Dracula X and Lords of Thunder with a gyro!!!(just kidding about the "gyro")

Get a modded Xbox - the PC-Engine emulator can run games off the CD.

[azmun]

The controllers just don't seem as "user friendy" as the ones of the past.

The design of the xbox 360 controller is not bad at all. In fact, I actually like it (might be good for racing games) except that I hear it's going to be wireless. But if you're after playing games that utilize few buttons without analog functions, then you might be better off using some of the older pads (perhaps the saturn and snes ones?).

Well, personally, I don't even think new consoles are even necessary at this time, as the current consoles are as good as things are gonna get. (for now).

In general I agree with this and feel the industry is not ready for new systems. I can't think of an existing game or genre that could be significantly improved on the newer consoles.

But whether or not they are necessary really depends on who's perspective and one's objectives. That said, perhaps a reason for why we are entering a transition is because it has been determined over the years that each console generation has a cycle of about five years. If this was strictly followed, that should've taken place sometime back in 2003.

Also, the move towards releasing newer consoles gives an opportunity for other companies (reshuffling of the three dominant players) to have a shot at the number one spot. Or at the very least, it's an attempt to break Sony's current strong foothold of the market.