THE MGS4 SPEAK FREELY COS I'M FULLA SPOILERS THREAD!!

Skykid · Post by **Skykid** » Sat Jun 28, 2008 4:52 pm

As the title states, if you're not interested in SPOILERS on MGS4, don't come to this thread!

And in case you didn't get that, this thread contains SPOILERS!

lgb · Post by **lgb** » Sat Jun 28, 2008 4:59 pm

Where are the spoilers?

Skykid · Post by **Skykid** » Sat Jun 28, 2008 5:07 pm

Ok, just finished MGS4!

So much to talk about, and there's a plus point right there.
Off the bat, I'm going to say: it's not a masterpiece. That's too strong a word, and as close as Hideo got by drumming up a hell of a fanfare, it doesn't quite qualify for me.

The reason? Not sure - probably that overall, this MGS is the closest to movie/game hybrid ever imo, and because of that, there wasn't all that much 'game' in there.

That's not to say it wasn't an awesome ride - full of spine tingling moments and emotionally stirring stuff. I enoyed a lot more than I thought I would, and the cutscenes were very well done.

For me, the breakdown was like this:

HIGHLIGHTS:

-Very well done cutscenes
-Cutscene interactivity
-Fantastic graphics
-Diversity in levels (and freedom to try different things)
-Very replayable game due to richness of content and options
-New control scheme and rotational camera worked wonders
-Very nice implementation of combat, and much more freedom to use it
-Very nice implementation of stealth, but often only as a choice
-Extremely polished production
-Shitload of guns, but no emphasis to use them all. A weapon playground!
-Cool bosses
-Returning to Shadow Moses, a first-class touch
-Rounding off the story and characters (as best he possibly could.)
-Psycho Mantis fight was great
-Akiba's origins were a genius touch

LOWLIGHTS:

-Retaining of ridiculous melodrama
-Dialogue was still verbose at times and required serious editing
-Return of the kings ending was starting to drag (a big shame)
-The closing credits song was blooming awful! That girl doesn't sound like she can sing!
-Drebins 'stories' after felling each beast boss were terrible, and lacked imagination because they all followed the exact same pattern
-The story itself, while a lot more informing, still remains confusing. The Metal Gear Encyclopedia confirms this by offering a serious six days worth of study to try to mentally understand everything off the top of your head.
We'll accept that due to Hideo's Japanese origins, sometimes these things struggle in translation
-The end of act 4 was a bit of a letdown, flaws in the storytelling first arose here when Otacon starts crying over Naomi and Hideo gets a little ahead of himself
-Didn't revive the Harry Gregson Williams theme from MGS2, which is by far the most heroic and fitting theme.
-Opening sequence didn't touch MGS2's rainy bridge action.
-The finale was very easy to complete (but admittedly satisfying.)
-Meryl looked like a man in her wedding dress
-Raging Raven should have been a more satisfying fight, it was too cagey and very frustrating
-Controls, although light years better, occasionally suffered from PS2 syndrome, with camera's getting lost sometimes when felled by gunfire etc
-Psycho mantis couldn't move my controller because Sony are such a bunch of useless shits I had no rumble throughout the entire game

Now, discuss!

Strider77 · Post by **Strider77** » Sat Jun 28, 2008 6:18 pm

-Psycho mantis couldn't move my controller because Sony are such a bunch of useless shits I had no rumble throughout the entire game

LOL... he moved my controller.

I was glad snake didn't off himself.

Skykid · Post by **Skykid** » Sat Jun 28, 2008 11:54 pm

Yeah, well unfortunately the controller I had was an inferior replica of a thirteen year old pad. I thought it was quite funny actually, like Kojima was having a dig.

Mantis is like "Damn, you have no memory card, how techonology has advanced!"

And then, "But, no rumble?! My powers don't work, arrgh!"

Anyway, anyone agree or disagree with the highs and lows listed above?

I have a feeling this thread is going to be a little bare due to the majority who haven't yet played or finished the game.

junkeR · Post by **junkeR** » Sun Jun 29, 2008 1:00 pm

I agree with most of your highs and lows. I really enjoyed the shooting layout (like Gears of War has). I would still rate the game a 10/10 as I am a fanboy. It almost has me wanting to buy a 360 and Gears of War to experience the original. The encyclopedia came in very useful for understanding events and people throughout the entire series.

I wish they would remake the original Metal Gear and Metal Gear 2 in 3D. Metal Gear and Legend of Zelda are two series that are much better in 3D, imo.

Skykid · Post by **Skykid** » Sun Jun 29, 2008 6:15 pm

junkeR wrote:I agree with most of your highs and lows. I really enjoyed the shooting layout (like Gears of War has). I would still rate the game a 10/10 as I am a fanboy. It almost has me wanting to buy a 360 and Gears of War to experience the original. The encyclopedia came in very useful for understanding events and people throughout the entire series.

I wish they would remake the original Metal Gear and Metal Gear 2 in 3D. Metal Gear and Legend of Zelda are two series that are much better in 3D, imo.

I thought the control system changed the game so drastically, I wouldn't mind them remaking all the metal gears with the same camera/controls.

If you haven't played GOW, what are you doing dude! It's really terrific!

Strider77 · Post by **Strider77** » Mon Jun 30, 2008 2:05 pm

splinter cell kinda used that control scheme 1st... 3rd person dual analogue stick control.

Skykid... PLEASE give MGS3 a fair shot. It truly is one of my favorite games, don't go into it on the defense.

junkeR · Post by **junkeR** » Mon Jun 30, 2008 6:32 pm

I actually think that MGS3 is the best in the entire series.

Skykid · Post by **Skykid** » Mon Jun 30, 2008 7:10 pm

Strider77 wrote:splinter cell kinda used that control scheme 1st... 3rd person dual analogue stick control.

Skykid... PLEASE give MGS3 a fair shot. It truly is one of my favorite games, don't go into it on the defense.

How could I - I really enjoyed 4, so I'm going in quite the opposite. However, I did spend time with this in the past and it annoyed the shit out of me, so it's subsistence or bust.

Strider77 · Post by **Strider77** » Tue Jul 01, 2008 12:26 am

if you got no enjoyment from 3, I dunno if the camera will make it new for you.

Dremark · Post by **Dremark** » Tue Jul 01, 2008 3:47 am

Strider77 wrote:splinter cell kinda used that control scheme 1st... 3rd person dual analogue stick control.

Skykid... PLEASE give MGS3 a fair shot. It truly is one of my favorite games, don't go into it on the defense.

Am I the only one who viewed MGS3 as a total let down? The game play mechanics were practically the same as MGS2's with the only notable addition being CQC. Camo/Field Surgery didn't add anything except a way to slow the game down to a grinding halt IMO and eating was more of a hassle than anything else.

I'm guessing the people who are fans of it either liked it primarily for the storyline or didn't play MGS2. Granted it wasn't a bad game, it just lacked innovation and most of the new features didn't add anything more than mild annoyance.

Strider77 · Post by **Strider77** » Tue Jul 01, 2008 4:59 am

mmmm, I guess I'd have to say the visuals (graphix), 60s theme and story were really strong motivators for me.

The gameplay... I guess your right but when I was anticipating it and playing it through, the thought that the controls had stayed the same really never stood out in my mind. I never really guessed they would have been different honestly... I was probably to busy being happy to have a shotgun in MG, shotguns in games are one of my guilty pleasures.

I've enjoyed all the metal gear games... I enjoyed those style of games alot. It's not for everyone, it's alot of patience involved. I have friends who find them really boring or really aggravating b/c of that.

Skykid · Post by **Skykid** » Tue Jul 01, 2008 9:24 am

Look, it's GOT to be better than MGS2!

Nah, in all seriousness, I've had high reccommendations for 3. I think the new camera will increase the flow of things a lot.

Jon · Post by **Jon** » Tue Jul 01, 2008 8:07 pm

Well I am a bit late to the party but I did manage to finally finish the game last night. Pretty damn good overall although I also would hesitate to say its the best in the series (seriously Skykid, play Subsistence.

)

I am still not too clear on the whole Big Boss thing. Am I to understand he was in stasis somewhere or cobbled together from spare parts left over from Liquid and Solidus or what?

Eh, either way I liked the end when he finally dies and says something to the effect of "this is good, isn't it?" You see the cigar drop from his hand and the screen fades to black. Pretty cool way to go out despite how friggin long it took to get there.

On a final note I would also agree that Meryl's muscular, rippling back and shoulders were downright frightening.

Strider77 · Post by **Strider77** » Tue Jul 01, 2008 9:11 pm

that body that was burnt was solidus's (clone from MGS2) body... it was used to fix up the real big boss (from MGS3 ect).

junkeR · Post by **junkeR** » Tue Jul 01, 2008 9:38 pm

Strider77 wrote:that body that was burnt was solidus's (clone from MGS2) body... it was used to fix up the real big boss (from MGS3 ect).

Meryl still had a nice body. Solidus was one of my favorite characters and I was hoping he'd somehow make an awesome showing in MGS4. I was a little bummed out when I found out that he was that flaming skeleton.

Skykid · Post by **Skykid** » Tue Jul 01, 2008 9:54 pm

Fuck Solidus, I'm glad he burned! WA HA HAAA!

Sorry.

I agree that the ending was too long. Kojima really can't help himself. I've read some interesting reviews too in the magazines recently, that raise some good points.
Primarily they find the cutscenes a little TOO intrusive (10 minutes of game, 20 minutes of cutscene) and I'm inclined to agree.

Also, and this might be controversial, Play magazine felt the thrill diminished toward the end of the game, which I did feel. The variety and general pace started to fizzle by the end of act 4, like the imagination started to run out a bit. Capped by a seriously overlong and a little misguided end sequence, I felt that, while by no means poor, it left a little to be desired by the end.

What do you reckon, anyone else feel this way?

Dremark · Post by **Dremark** » Tue Jul 01, 2008 10:39 pm

junkeR wrote:
Strider77 wrote:that body that was burnt was solidus's (clone from MGS2) body... it was used to fix up the real big boss (from MGS3 ect).
Meryl still had a nice body. Solidus was one of my favorite characters and I was hoping he'd somehow make an awesome showing in MGS4. I was a little bummed out when I found out that he was that flaming skeleton.

I liked Soldius too, I didn't expect him to make an appearance in 4 though because it seemed pretty clear that he was killed off at the end of MGS2. Then again, I wasn't expecting Big Boss to be around in MGS4 either...

Turrican · Post by **Turrican** » Tue Jul 01, 2008 10:42 pm

junkeR wrote:
Strider77 wrote:that body that was burnt was solidus's (clone from MGS2) body... it was used to fix up the real big boss (from MGS3 ect).
Meryl still had a nice body. Solidus was one of my favorite characters and I was hoping he'd somehow make an awesome showing in MGS4. I was a little bummed out when I found out that he was that flaming skeleton.

But his memory carries on - His fears were justified (as David says, beginning of act two), Big Boss has good words for him, and Liquid basically in this episode does little more than a second attempt at Solidus' plan. Thankfully it succeeds this time.

In other words, while he might not had a great physical presence in the game, his spirit is all but forgotten especially in act 5.

Strider77 · Post by **Strider77** » Wed Jul 02, 2008 12:14 am

yeah well MGS4 fizzle is a hell of alot hotter than what most games never get to.

junkeR · Post by **junkeR** » Wed Jul 02, 2008 11:55 am

Strider77 wrote:yeah well MGS4 fizzle is a hell of alot hotter than what most games never get to.

Agreed. I'm a little thankful Kojima finally finished MGS4 as I would love to see what he's going to work on next. Hopefully something with Snatcher/Policenauts/or an entirely new game.

SuperPang · Post by **SuperPang** » Wed Jul 02, 2008 12:38 pm

Meryl looked like a man in her wedding dress

LOL. Did you read the (insanely long) credits? They actually employed a designer for that

Mr-Megalo · Post by **Mr-Megalo** » Wed Jul 02, 2008 2:24 pm

i'm on my fourth run through this game now, 3rd and 4th run have been all about skipping the cutscenes and finishing the game as quickly as possible

P.S - Hello pang

SuperPang · Post by **SuperPang** » Wed Jul 02, 2008 2:48 pm

Stalker

Mr-Megalo · Post by **Mr-Megalo** » Wed Jul 02, 2008 3:08 pm

you know it, and i'm stalking you while wearing a stealth suit

Skykid · Post by **Skykid** » Wed Jul 02, 2008 7:19 pm

SuperPang wrote:
Meryl looked like a man in her wedding dress
LOL. Did you read the (insanely long) credits? They actually employed a designer for that

Gok Wang.

(Only the UK will get that.)

scrilla4rella · Post by **scrilla4rella** » Fri Jul 04, 2008 12:17 pm

Just finished it the other day. Let me just say I'm a big fan of the series, I bought a gunmetal PS3 just for this game, and MGS3 is probably my favorite in the series next to MGS. My biggest gripe with the game was how episodic the games felt. In all of the other games you could go back and mess around in previous areas. MGS4 was WAY more linear. The variety of settings was good and maybe it was needed for the story but I wanted a little more time to fuck around. I guess that's what the next play-throughs are for...

Skykid · Post by **Skykid** » Fri Jul 04, 2008 12:30 pm

junkeR wrote: Meryl still had a nice body.

Hee hee.

neorichieb1971 · Post by **neorichieb1971** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 1:47 pm

This felt as far away from the MGS universe as you can get. I feel like I'm playing Gears of War with a shit load of storyline bolted on.

So far I am at the Meryl bit on chapter 1 and I can't even beat that bit. I'm surrounded by people that all look the same and until they start shooting at me I can't even tell if they are enemy or friendlies. My friends have beaten it two or three times so I have to just admit defeat. But with all games that have FPS controls, I suck. I can unload a whole magazine and barely hit anything.

Glad everyone is enjoying it, it just makes me pull my hair out.