Save Windows XP?

Battlesmurf · Post by **Battlesmurf** » Mon Apr 14, 2008 9:57 pm

http://weblog.infoworld.com/save-xp/

Ex-Cyber · Post by **Ex-Cyber** » Mon Apr 14, 2008 11:45 pm

Just in case you wanted any more evidence that Vista was released to cater to Microsoft's needs rather than their customers' needs...

UnscathedFlyingObject · Tue Apr 15, 2008 12:02 am

I hope they get themselves owned with this latest move. Like everyone saying fuck you Microsoft and move to Linux or something.

Battlesmurf · Post by **Battlesmurf** » Tue Apr 15, 2008 12:07 am

Yeah- I'm on XP- and I've got a stable install going right now. I can run everything I want- the only thing holding me back is DX10 (heard there was a workaround) and hardware for the games. I dread the day I'll have to 'upgrade'.

GaijinPunch · Post by **GaijinPunch** » Tue Apr 15, 2008 12:16 am

Sits back and enjoys his Linux box.

(Evil Laugh)

Mikey · Post by **Mikey** » Tue Apr 15, 2008 12:32 am

GaijinPunch wrote:Sits back and enjoys his Linux box.

(Evil Laugh)

Two Evil Laughs.

Ed Oscuro · Post by **Ed Oscuro** » Tue Apr 15, 2008 12:45 am

Three evil...oh hell, I'm on Vista.

You know what? I found out a few days ago that SP1 wasn't installed. What the hell, worthless Windows Update (using the Update on the start menu, at that)!

Upside is that it's working noticably better after the update, and it was already doing pretty good.

It's funny to think how damn OLD XP is. Microsoft wasn't continuing to sell 95 seven years after its release, as far as I know.

ED-057 · Post by **ED-057** » Tue Apr 15, 2008 1:08 am

I'm using win2k on my main PC and win98 on my laptop. So get off my lawn!

It's kind of funny. For ten years I badmouthed Windows because of crashes, bloat, etc. Then when I started using win2k about five years ago I found that it was actually stable and maybe deserved a bit of respect. Then what's the next thing MS does? Release the steaming pile that is Vista.

Stormwatch · Post by **Stormwatch** » Tue Apr 15, 2008 3:33 am

I'm using Mac OS X, can I do the third evil laugh?

GaijinPunch · Post by **GaijinPunch** » Tue Apr 15, 2008 3:44 am

Ed Oscuro wrote: It's funny to think how damn OLD XP is. Microsoft wasn't continuing to sell 95 seven years after its release, as far as I know.

No, but a couple of years after 98 (something far more stable than Vista on release)? Yes. I'd like to see MS do a real feat: Tell large corporations they have to upgrade... something they traditionally do 2-3 years after something is released. Most large institutions probably just upgraded to XP.

Asherdude · Post by **Asherdude** » Tue Apr 15, 2008 4:36 am

I bought a iMac last month, so Microsoft's stupidity no longer affects me.

UnscathedFlyingObject · Tue Apr 15, 2008 4:52 am

If they'd just make a better OS that wasn't a resource hog, maybe people would upgrade. Or as things are, stop downgrading

. There's always people at my cousin's store wanting to get rid of Vista.

GaijinPunch · Post by **GaijinPunch** » Tue Apr 15, 2008 5:11 am

I'm in the market for a new laptop but Vista has me completely turned off. The problem at hand:
Microsoft: Shitty software
iBook: Shitty price

I don't really need much other than to play videos and DVDs. Mac has that whole Linux thing too, so I'm tempted. I don't know how they work though to be honest. If it breaks, I'm fucked.

Twiddle · Post by **Twiddle** » Tue Apr 15, 2008 5:18 am

Stormwatch wrote:I'm using Mac OS X, can I do the third evil laugh?

You can be laughed at, because pre-intel Macs are unbelievably shitty.

Ed Oscuro · Post by **Ed Oscuro** » Tue Apr 15, 2008 5:33 am

GaijinPunch wrote:No, but a couple of years after 98 (something far more stable than Vista on release)? Yes.

Are we talking about the same OS? The one which crashed on Gates at Comdex 98? Even completely patched, that original Windows 98 (non-SE) installation isn't so great. You can't officially upgrade to Windows 98 SE (not anymore - MS charged $20 for an update-only/non-clean install disc back in the day, which is incidentally a worse solution than the Alternate Media program they have in place today - if you qualify for that, that is); you have to find the garbage "unofficial" patch (a compilation of the updates in SE and some optional new stuff) which introduces a few new problems anyway.

Microsoft has fucked up before when revving their OS (Win ME was useless), that we can agree on. These improvements have been needed for a long, long time, however.

UnscathedFlyingObject wrote:If they'd just make a better OS that wasn't a resource hog

It's not a resource hog (turn off Aero, for one), and it is inherently a better OS: no more monster processes, better security features, the ability to use multiple partitions to save your data in the case you screw up your current installation, and so on. The customers at your cousin's store aren't wrong, but I wonder how many of them just heard that downgrading was the way to go and didn't spend a few minutes with the computer's settings and with Windows Update checking to see if they had all the updates.

Of course, that "I don't want to learn a new system" problem is part of the reason I've never felt the urge to take a jump into Linux (that, and I have nothing to run on it), and it's Microsoft's fault for making it feel different from XP just for the sake of it.

Here's the Blame Breakdown, in my view:

- Microsoft for rearranging shit again, making the Control Panel confusing in yet another release

- People for thinking that Microsoft's business model would remain viable if they would only release "the important updates" for XP (and that it could happen in the first place)

- People like me for not demanding more L/Unix-based apps

Twiddle wrote:
Stormwatch wrote:I'm using Mac OS X, can I do the third evil laugh? :P
You can be laughed at, because pre-intel Macs are unbelievably shitty.

Precisely. "Oh look at me, I just upgraded my G4 with a GeForce 6200 for only $110!"

TODAY.

Twiddle · Post by **Twiddle** » Tue Apr 15, 2008 5:41 am

Is there a hidden "don't treat me like a retard" mode in Vista because treating you like a retard is all what seems to be available

And why the fuck are there 6 SKUs when 2 would work (a third for business types)

Ed Oscuro · Post by **Ed Oscuro** » Tue Apr 15, 2008 5:48 am

Classic control panel and Classic mode for the OS are the two places to get started with that. I also completely disregard IE except when I need to turn off server certificate verification from IE so I can get back onto my campus internetz.

SKU abuse is one of my major current issues with Microsoft. They traditionally have had shit for research (aside from this Microsoft light table thing, what else have they done of value besides OSes? The Microsoft TV Photo Viewer, which shipped in 2001 but used 3.5 inch floppies?) so they're like "lol time to rev the ole OS."

p.s. Firefox crashed on me while typing up this post, but brought it back up within five seconds. lol

kengou · Post by **kengou** » Tue Apr 15, 2008 6:02 am

Yet another evil laugh from a Linux User here. I still have xp dual-booted for games but I doubt I'll ever get vista. If there's absolutely no choice when I buy my next PC, I might just convert to linux completely, because Vista is that shitty. Hardware requirements for games are almost double on vista compared to the same game on XP, that's just bull. In fact Wine probably runs some games better than Vista.

KBZ · Post by **KBZ** » Tue Apr 15, 2008 6:06 am

4 Evil Laughs

I left XP for Linux (opensuse)

Gaijin: did you mean to say DELL linux laptops? I've heard good things abotu them, but they haven't made them available to Canada. I'll get one when they do.

For now, I'm all about getting the 8.9" 20GB Asus EEEPC

I do have XP on a partition, but I haven't had a need to boot into it for months. Last time it was to play GGPO.

Ed Oscuro · Post by **Ed Oscuro** » Tue Apr 15, 2008 6:09 am

Kingbuzzo wrote:For now, I'm all about getting the 8.9" 20GB Asus EEEPC

No! Don't do it!

Edit: Well, maybe at THAT price...it comes with Linux so you won't have to worry about Vista's requirements. Looks like a good basic system.

GaijinPunch · Post by **GaijinPunch** » Tue Apr 15, 2008 6:13 am

Are we talking about the same OS? The one which crashed on Gates at Comdex 98? Even completely patched, that original Windows 98 (non-SE) installation isn't so great.

The beta version that crashed? Yes.

Fully patched, NO version of Windows is that great. But, each release has gotten less and less stable than the last. Win98 obviously had less "features" but it wasn't nearly as big of a nightmare as Vista.

I've never felt the urge to take a jump into Linux (that, and I have nothing to run on it),

Well, since 99% of the software is free, that shouldn't be too hard to remedy.

Gaijin: did you mean to say DELL linux laptops? I've heard good things abotu them, but they haven't made them available to Canada. I'll get one when they do.

I probably wouldn't buy a Linux laptop. I would buy a Mac or PC, then convert the one I have to Gentoo or something. Traditonally, one issue I've had with Linux is certain audio codecs (and a video one here and there). One main use of this machine would be video on the road (well, in the air, actually).

Ed Oscuro · Post by **Ed Oscuro** » Tue Apr 15, 2008 6:29 am

GaijinPunch wrote:Fully patched, NO version of Windows is that great. But, each release has gotten less and less stable than the last. Win98 obviously had less "features" but it wasn't nearly as big of a nightmare as Vista.

We didn't need the "anti-piracy" measures in Vista, certainly. Even so, the crashes in Vista so far are all software or driver related, and I haven't had much trouble with either since the system recovers so well from crashes. My most common crash is (probably "was," since I've gotten SP1 since) having the system decide to do something odd when put into hibernation.

Vista compares nicely to my XP system which sorely needs a clean installation; the thing holding me back from that is knowing that there's no easy way to save data currently on the hard drive. With Vista, all I'd need to do would be to reinstall Vista on the OS partition.

GaijinPunch wrote:Well, since 99% of the software is free, that shouldn't be too hard to remedy.

The software's free, but my time and reconfiguring a current PC won't be so simple. Again, if it doesn't run Windows applications there's not really much reason for me to get into it, I'm afraid. My core programs of MAME, Open Office, and Firefox are all available for Linux, but I'm not willing to sacrifice everything else.

Twiddle · Post by **Twiddle** » Tue Apr 15, 2008 6:38 am

GaijinPunch wrote:But, each release has gotten less and less stable than the last.

Actually, from Windows 95, (and ignoring Windows ME) the inverse was true until Vista.

Ed Oscuro · Post by **Ed Oscuro** » Tue Apr 15, 2008 6:43 am

Twiddle wrote:
GaijinPunch wrote:But, each release has gotten less and less stable than the last.
Actually, from Windows 95, (and ignoring Windows ME) the inverse was true until Vista.

Windows 2000 has a reputation for great stability, though, greater than XP.

Whether it's deserved, I dunno...I just installed a copy for somebody the year of release and used it intermittently since then on various computers since then, lol

GaijinPunch · Post by **GaijinPunch** » Tue Apr 15, 2008 7:28 am

if it doesn't run Windows applications there's not really much reason for me to get into it, I'm afraid.

You've actually just listed a few reasons.

Actually, from Windows 95, (and ignoring Windows ME) the inverse was true until Vista.

Win2k might be the exception, but they have all sucked at release, even XP. This is why only consumers migrate, while companies let the the shit flakes settle.

Post by **system11** » Tue Apr 15, 2008 9:15 am

Another Opensuse user here. To be honest the death of XP is good for computing, people will be unhappy with Vista. This may cause people to move to alternatives, or it may cause MS to actually improve their OS.

Either way - win/win for computing in general, even if some of the users get upset.

Ed Oscuro · Post by **Ed Oscuro** » Tue Apr 15, 2008 10:30 am

GaijinPunch: Touche, then! I admit I got burned off the stale old FPS genre months ago, and it'll be a while before I get back to it. Actually, the vast majority of stuff I've done on my laptop this week could've been done under Linux (and in 64-bit, too).

bloodflowers wrote:This may cause people to move to alternatives, or it may cause MS to actually improve their OS.

Hopefully it'll force Microsoft to listen to their users. I've already opined that Vista is improved over XP...but it's not improved in every area. DRM? Big negative, especially for soundcard / expensive hardware with now-banned output owners.

Lordstar · Post by **Lordstar** » Tue Apr 15, 2008 11:43 am

XP'n it since 06 and loving it.

Stormwatch · Post by **Stormwatch** » Tue Apr 15, 2008 5:08 pm

Twiddle wrote:
Stormwatch wrote:I'm using Mac OS X, can I do the third evil laugh?
You can be laughed at, because pre-intel Macs are unbelievably shitty.

Did I mention using Apple hardware?

Twiddle · Post by **Twiddle** » Tue Apr 15, 2008 6:04 pm

Good luck on having an OS that's good for nothing but

1) photo editing
2) video editing
3) non-technical schoolwork

XP or Ubuntu is the way to go for doing things that are actually interesting without wrestling