What are you talking about?
The basic Genesis couldn't produce any more than 64 colours on screen without utilizing any special technics or add-ons!
Are these games good purchases?
The SNES had a much larger & varied library of quality of games than the Genesis & PCE put together.
Also the SNES killed the Genesis in world-wide sales (double figure difference)
Games just looked & played so much better on the SNES compared to Genesis.
Just a few Examples:
CastlaVania 4 & X (SNES) looked better than CastleVania Blood lines (Genesis)
Super Turrican 1 & 2 Vs Mega Turrican
Super Contra III Vs Contra Hard Corps
Super Ghouls & Ghosts completely overwhelms Genesis Ghouls & Ghosts.
Gunstar Heroes, Vectorman & Contra Hard Corps is nothing a SNES can’t handle.
Mega Man X looks much better than those.
The SNES version of EarthwormJim 1-2, had much better graphics, with cool lens-flairs effects than the Genesis version.
Donkey Kong country looked astounding, much better than anything the 32X had, even without any special chips & Mega Man X3 looked as good on the SNES as it did on the Saturn & PSX.
SNES Final Fight looks & plays better than the SEGA CD version.
Ninja Warriors Again has arcade quality graphics, huge sprites, sound & cool gameplay only dreamed of on the Genesis. Same for King of Dragons, Knights of the Round Table, Captain Commando, etc…
Parodius Series on the SNES, are arcade perfect conversions, that easily compare to Saturn & PSX versions (Graphics, Sound & Game Play)
PCE Parodius is also a very faithful conversion, even better than SNES in some areas.
Gradius III – Arcade perfect.
Axelay – can easily be compared to 32bit shmups. No way could the Genesis handle something like this.
Also compare TMNT (SNES) to the Genesis version (Both perspective & 1-on-1 beat em ups) looks much better on the SNES)
Eternal Champions for SEGA CD is supposed to use 256 colours on-screen, but I doubt it as it still looks like shit & blocky.
StarOcean, Bahamut Lagoon, Terranigma, Chrono Trigger, Secret of Ever More, Zelda 3, etc… were light years ahead of their time & anything the Genesis could offer in the RPG genre.
Also games that were released on both PCE & Genesis looked worse on the Genesis (fewer colours)
Example:
After Burner II
Daisenpu – Tiger Shark
Ninja Warriors
Raiden
Steet Fighter II (PCE) kills Genesis SF2 in the Graphics department!
Truxton
Twin Cobra
As for the PCE CD, well also it beat the SEGA CD.
The PCE could display parallax scrolling backgrounds:
One example that comes to mind at the moment is Air Zonk.
But my opinion is that the PCE/Duo had fewer games worth owning than the SNES & Genesis.
The Genesis had some awesome games that the SNES didn’t though:
Sonic 1 & 2
Thunder Force III
Gynoug
Gaiares
Streets of Rage series
etc...
Actually the Genesis did very poor sales in Japan compared to SNES & PCE.
SNES was 1st, PCE was 2nd & Genesis was 4rd after the NES. Even GB beat the Genesis in sales.
http://www.lik-sang.com/list.php?category=159&
Best-selling consoles in video games history:
• Gameboy Series, Nintendo, 110million
• Playstation, Sony, 74million
• NES, Nintendo, 62million
• SNES, Nintendo, 49million
• N64, Nintendo, 28million
• Atari VCS, Atari, 26million
• Mega Drive, Sega, 23million
• Master System, Sega, 10million
The double sale figures are referring to world-wide sales, not Japan only.
So over all the SNES is the better console imo.
But I love all 3 consoles for their unique & excusive titles & cool gameplay.
Also the SNES killed the Genesis in world-wide sales (double figure difference)
Games just looked & played so much better on the SNES compared to Genesis.
Just a few Examples:
CastlaVania 4 & X (SNES) looked better than CastleVania Blood lines (Genesis)
Super Turrican 1 & 2 Vs Mega Turrican
Super Contra III Vs Contra Hard Corps
Super Ghouls & Ghosts completely overwhelms Genesis Ghouls & Ghosts.
Gunstar Heroes, Vectorman & Contra Hard Corps is nothing a SNES can’t handle.
Mega Man X looks much better than those.
The SNES version of EarthwormJim 1-2, had much better graphics, with cool lens-flairs effects than the Genesis version.
Donkey Kong country looked astounding, much better than anything the 32X had, even without any special chips & Mega Man X3 looked as good on the SNES as it did on the Saturn & PSX.
SNES Final Fight looks & plays better than the SEGA CD version.
Ninja Warriors Again has arcade quality graphics, huge sprites, sound & cool gameplay only dreamed of on the Genesis. Same for King of Dragons, Knights of the Round Table, Captain Commando, etc…
Parodius Series on the SNES, are arcade perfect conversions, that easily compare to Saturn & PSX versions (Graphics, Sound & Game Play)
PCE Parodius is also a very faithful conversion, even better than SNES in some areas.
Gradius III – Arcade perfect.
Axelay – can easily be compared to 32bit shmups. No way could the Genesis handle something like this.
Also compare TMNT (SNES) to the Genesis version (Both perspective & 1-on-1 beat em ups) looks much better on the SNES)
Eternal Champions for SEGA CD is supposed to use 256 colours on-screen, but I doubt it as it still looks like shit & blocky.
StarOcean, Bahamut Lagoon, Terranigma, Chrono Trigger, Secret of Ever More, Zelda 3, etc… were light years ahead of their time & anything the Genesis could offer in the RPG genre.
Also games that were released on both PCE & Genesis looked worse on the Genesis (fewer colours)
Example:
After Burner II
Daisenpu – Tiger Shark
Ninja Warriors
Raiden
Steet Fighter II (PCE) kills Genesis SF2 in the Graphics department!
Truxton
Twin Cobra
As for the PCE CD, well also it beat the SEGA CD.
The PCE could display parallax scrolling backgrounds:
One example that comes to mind at the moment is Air Zonk.
But my opinion is that the PCE/Duo had fewer games worth owning than the SNES & Genesis.
The Genesis had some awesome games that the SNES didn’t though:
Sonic 1 & 2
Thunder Force III
Gynoug
Gaiares
Streets of Rage series
etc...
Actually the Genesis did very poor sales in Japan compared to SNES & PCE.
SNES was 1st, PCE was 2nd & Genesis was 4rd after the NES. Even GB beat the Genesis in sales.
http://www.lik-sang.com/list.php?category=159&
Best-selling consoles in video games history:
• Gameboy Series, Nintendo, 110million
• Playstation, Sony, 74million
• NES, Nintendo, 62million
• SNES, Nintendo, 49million
• N64, Nintendo, 28million
• Atari VCS, Atari, 26million
• Mega Drive, Sega, 23million
• Master System, Sega, 10million
The double sale figures are referring to world-wide sales, not Japan only.
So over all the SNES is the better console imo.
But I love all 3 consoles for their unique & excusive titles & cool gameplay.
No, it's not.Gradius III – Arcade perfect.
Genesis can pretty much approximate sprite scaling, mode 7, and shit, check out space harrier 2. Even NES and master system could fake it to an extent.Axelay – can easily be compared to 32bit shmups. No way could the Genesis handle something like this.
One thing you all are forgetting is that Genesis has several polygonal games, neither the turbo or the SNES could do them without expansions to the system (Starfox uses a special chip, Sapphire is an Arcade Card game, etc).
Gradius III was better than the SP-2 port & had much better music & gameplay than the original Arcade version
Space Harrier II isn't true hardware scalling & rotation. The only Genesis game that I've seen using scalling & rotation is F1 Circus on the SEGA CD.
But even that wasn't that great compared to other SNES games.
Sonic CD used nice scalling & Rotation, but that was only in a bonus stage.
I've yet to see a GENESIS/CD games that is all done in that manner.
There were 3D FPS games for the SNES that didn't use special chips. The only one I can think of right no is Noah's Ark.
Most The Games on the SNES,Genesis & PCE I compred on the previous post, didn't use any special chips on any of the 3 consoles & they looked worse on the Genesis.
Space Harrier II isn't true hardware scalling & rotation. The only Genesis game that I've seen using scalling & rotation is F1 Circus on the SEGA CD.
But even that wasn't that great compared to other SNES games.
Sonic CD used nice scalling & Rotation, but that was only in a bonus stage.
I've yet to see a GENESIS/CD games that is all done in that manner.
There were 3D FPS games for the SNES that didn't use special chips. The only one I can think of right no is Noah's Ark.
Most The Games on the SNES,Genesis & PCE I compred on the previous post, didn't use any special chips on any of the 3 consoles & they looked worse on the Genesis.
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Guest
If you're talking about Virtua Racing, I must interject, that game also recruited an external chip contained in the game itself, the VRC chip.One thing you all are forgetting is that Genesis has several polygonal games, neither the turbo or the SNES could do them without expansions to the system (Starfox uses a special chip, Sapphire is an Arcade Card game, etc).
Anyway, I don't see anything wrong with a game system recruiting an external chip to enhance the effects in the game. The japanese version of Castelvania 3 also contained expansion chips which enabled it to do things the Famicom could not do on its own. Gradius 2 also did, if I remember correctly. Either way I don't think it can be considered anything more than an innovative expansion feature.
I am agreeing with most of the things you said, ST, though your list of good games for PCE CD/Turbo Duo is a bit short. Allow me to add these titles...
Ys 1&2
Exile
Last Alert
Shape Shifter
I also have a question...I've never played the PCE version of Street Fighter 2 CE, how does it manage to keep good controls when the Turbo only had two action buttons? If there's only one button for punch and one button for kick, it could not even come close to being compared to the SNES and Genesis 6-button versions.
And do you really like Altered Beast? Nice graphics, but I think the game sucks otherwise.
I think most everyone here would agree that SNES games looked better than anything on the Genesis, but as far as the games PLAYING better? That's pure opinion, as hardware capabilities have little if nothing to do with how playable a game is; that all rests on the shoulders of the developers.ST Dragon wrote:Games just looked & played so much better on the SNES compared to Genesis.
Graphics and sound-wise, yes, as far as gameplay, I'd have to disagree. Super Ghouls & Ghosts is another game filled with slowdown, and Ghouls & Ghosts controlled much better. Why exactly was the ability to shoot vertically taken out of SG&G?Super Ghouls & Ghosts completely overwhelms Genesis Ghouls & Ghosts.
No one can say for sure, but the SNES most likely wouldn't have been able to run Gunstar Heroes or Contra Hard Corps without slowdown popping up here and there.Gunstar Heroes, Vectorman & Contra Hard Corps is nothing a SNES can’t handle.
True, but the SNES version of Earthworm Jim was still missing a level and a handful of sound samples.The SNES version of EarthwormJim 1-2, had much better graphics, with cool lens-flairs effects than the Genesis version.
Well, considering that the PS1 and Saturn versions of Mega Man X3 were just ports of the SNES version, there really isn't much to argue here.Mega Man X3 looked as good on the SNES as it did on the Saturn & PSX.
You realise that Final Fight for the SNES was missing a ton of content from the arcade original, right? Most importantly, Guy as a playable character and 2-player simulataneous play. A whole level is missing as well.SNES Final Fight looks & plays better than the SEGA CD version.
Even Radiant Silvergun? No way.Axelay – can easily be compared to 32bit shmups.
So do I, but seeing as how each one offered distinctly different types of libraries, I couldn't pick one over the other.But I love all 3 consoles for their unique & excusive titles & cool gameplay.
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TWITCHDOCTOR
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ryosnk wrote:Just to let you all know, I received both games in the mail and both thunder spirits and dairus twin and they are both enjoyable and thats what matters to me. Stop the debating and play your shmups
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THANK YOU!!!! The first intelligent post in this entire thread. Debating about consoles is the most geek-iest things one can do...well, its right up there with wearing short sleeve dress shirts with pocket protectors!!
Gentleman, please! It's getting hot in here...
Here's my take. Genesis sound processor vs. SNES sound processor is not a fair comparison, like apples vs. oranges. I like sound on both systems equally. I like the 'bassy' sound of the Genesis (evidenced by quite a few Genny games having great music that I have recorded and play on my PC or stereo regularly). I also like the SNES sound chip and what it's capable of. There are some games that have awesome music/sound on the SNEs. However, I think the processor itself (like dark saibot mentioned) is not the issue, it's what you do w/ it. Both systems can sound great when the programmers know what to do with it. Both systems can also sound really awful. Is the SNES sound hardware more powerful than the Genesis? Perhaps. Who cares? I certainly don't. There's simply no need to resurrect the 16-bit hardware wars that took place with a TurboGrafx vs. Genesis v. SNES mentality.
Each system has it's strengths - the programmers used them or not, sometimes to great effect, sometimes not. The bottom line is that both systems are quite capable and had good game libraries. Personal tastes dictate which game library is going to be more to one's liking.
As for ThunderSpirits, it's a conversion of ThunderForce AC, which was an arcade-only conversion of Thunderforce 3 with some changes (i.e. removing level select) and levels switched around. ThunderSpirits was a poor conversion of ThunderForce AC (probably because Sega already had rights to TF3 and Nintendo wanted something unique/different from TF3 to attract shmup fans to their systems). So you have a poor conversion of a second-rate arcade copy of a console game. That is why ThunderSpirits kinda sucks. It's not the worst shmup I've ever played, but it's certainly not even average in my book. But, for what you paid for it, I certainly wouldn't be hanging my head in shame. If you're a collector, it's probably worth the money.
I rather liked Darius Twin. I am probably a little biased because I have enjoyed all the games in the Darius series (unlike some who prefer either the earlier titles or the later titles only). I find it to be different enough from the other Darius games to make it worth playing. It's not the best in the series, but it doesn't suck IMO.
Here's my take. Genesis sound processor vs. SNES sound processor is not a fair comparison, like apples vs. oranges. I like sound on both systems equally. I like the 'bassy' sound of the Genesis (evidenced by quite a few Genny games having great music that I have recorded and play on my PC or stereo regularly). I also like the SNES sound chip and what it's capable of. There are some games that have awesome music/sound on the SNEs. However, I think the processor itself (like dark saibot mentioned) is not the issue, it's what you do w/ it. Both systems can sound great when the programmers know what to do with it. Both systems can also sound really awful. Is the SNES sound hardware more powerful than the Genesis? Perhaps. Who cares? I certainly don't. There's simply no need to resurrect the 16-bit hardware wars that took place with a TurboGrafx vs. Genesis v. SNES mentality.
Each system has it's strengths - the programmers used them or not, sometimes to great effect, sometimes not. The bottom line is that both systems are quite capable and had good game libraries. Personal tastes dictate which game library is going to be more to one's liking.
As for ThunderSpirits, it's a conversion of ThunderForce AC, which was an arcade-only conversion of Thunderforce 3 with some changes (i.e. removing level select) and levels switched around. ThunderSpirits was a poor conversion of ThunderForce AC (probably because Sega already had rights to TF3 and Nintendo wanted something unique/different from TF3 to attract shmup fans to their systems). So you have a poor conversion of a second-rate arcade copy of a console game. That is why ThunderSpirits kinda sucks. It's not the worst shmup I've ever played, but it's certainly not even average in my book. But, for what you paid for it, I certainly wouldn't be hanging my head in shame. If you're a collector, it's probably worth the money.
I rather liked Darius Twin. I am probably a little biased because I have enjoyed all the games in the Darius series (unlike some who prefer either the earlier titles or the later titles only). I find it to be different enough from the other Darius games to make it worth playing. It's not the best in the series, but it doesn't suck IMO.
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Guest
This brings back memories from 5th grade, when 16-bit systems were the craze, and SNES vs. Genesis arguments would lead to fist fights and bloody noses on the playground. Ah, the memories. I see that times have changed. Some of us will be 80 years old, sitting there in our power chairs, having our drool wiped from our faces by our residential assistants, and still be arguing whether or not SNES was better than Genesis through the three teeth we have left. I'll probably be one of them...
I too am also very partial to the Darius games. Whether or not you actually like the Darius games, you do have to admit that they do have their own unique style and personality.
I too am also very partial to the Darius games. Whether or not you actually like the Darius games, you do have to admit that they do have their own unique style and personality.
Dark Saibot wrote:
o_O
What prompts this random insult? If you're going to insult me, at least provide a reason to back it up, rather than just posting a message that consists of a single line with poor punctuation where all you do is insult somebody, you just make yourself look like a n00b.
here you go.
i havent read something this dumb in ages.Dark Saibot wrote:Whew, a good old fashioned SNES vs. Genesis debate. This brings back memories.
Only four good games for the SNES. Yeah...anyway, you list Contra Hard Corps for Genesis as a good game, then you don't list Contra 3 for SNES as a good game. Contra Hard Corps is a weak, watered down Contra game that exists for the sole reason that the Genesis could not handle Contra 3.Hmm, I'm almost of the exact opposite opinion. Love the Genesis 'wacky bass' sound. Anyways, here's a list of the titles for it I find to be worth playing:
Alien Soldier (here's an example of teh good graphicz00rz, btw)
Contra Hard Corps
Devil Crash
Elemental Master
Eliminate Down
Fire Shark
Ghouls n Ghosts
Gunstar Heroes
Kunio-kun Soccer
Mega Turrican
Outrun
Raiden Trad (better than the SNES version)
Road Rash 3
Rockman Megaworld
Sensible Soccer
Twin Hawk
Thunderforce 4 (See, Genesis can have good music. See Daser stage)
Wardner
Now here's the list of SNES games I'd find worth playing:
Megaman X (soon it'll be on PS2)
Super Mario Kart
Umihara Kawase (sequels on PSX are better)
Maybe a bunch of RPG's if you're into that crap.
And yeah, that's about it.
Here's just a small sample of the list of SNES games I consider to be quality titles:
Super Mario World(The first one only)
Contra 3
Donkey Kong Country(the first one only)
Castlevania 4
Darius Twin
Super Nova
Gradius 3
Star Fox
Mega Man 7
Mega Man X
Street Fighter 2, Turbo, Super, etc.
Mortal Kombat 1-3
Super Double Dragon
Killer Instinct
Art of Fighting
TMNT Tournament Fighters
Robocop vs. Terminator
Final Fight 1-3
Raiden Trad(Haven't played the Genesis version)
X-Men Mutant Apocalypse
Jurassic Park 1-2
Here's what's good for Genesis
Sonic 1
Sonic 2
Sonic 3...
Sonic&Knuckles......
Sonic Spinball............
X-Men(!)
X-Men 2
Can't think of anything else. Sagaia is OKAY but somewhat weak compared to the two SNES Darius games. I'm not a huge RPG person, I prefer games with more solid action and gameplay than games with story and characters and all that.
Why is it that almost every game that was ported to both systems was inferior in all 3 categories(graphics, sound, and gameplay) on the Genesis.-SNES fans seem to have a thing for supperior Graphics and sound, not really caring if gameplay is identical, or inferior.
The Genesis had a faster CPU speed than the SNES. Does that make anybody happy to hear me say that? What matters most at the end of the day is the number of quality titles for each system, and I think the SNES squashed the Genesis in that category.Don't try to say that a console trounced another in Every single way, because that's simply NEVER true (unless Atari Hardware is in question).
The Genesis having more good games than the NES and SNES put together...man I've heard some great ones in my day, but that one just about takes the cake.I find a lot more of my fave games on the Genesis rather than on the NES and SNES.
You really can't box up my opinion into either category. I said that the SNES blew Genesis out of the water because of the number of quality titles, and have said little or nothing about graphics or specifications carrying alot of weight. Genesis had virtually all the same top developers making games on their system(Konami, Capcom, etc.) yet why is it that it seemed like every time the Genesis 'version' was a weak, crappy, watered down game in comparison to the excellent SNES version. Maybe companies like Konami are just guilty of platform favoritism, always going the extra mile to make sure the SNES version was top notch and always falling short a mile in making the Genesis version as good or better. I'll try out those games you mention but I'm not going to change my mind just like that.Man, decide. Either the Snes blows out the Genesis because of its superior hardware OR specifications don't mean anything. If you want my advice, I would go with the latter.
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Guest
