Annual Top 10 of the Less Experienced - Results Thread

[unsane]

Top 10 of the Less Experienced (through 2007)

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 Rank  Game                                          Score 
    1  Dodonpachi                                    3.538 
    2  Ikaruga                                       2.692 
    3  Radiant Silvergun                             2.551 
    4  Gradius V                                     2.064 
    5  Battle Garegga                                1.833 
    6  Dodonpachi Daioujou                           1.795 
    7  ESPGaluda                                     1.667 
    8  Armed Police Batrider                         1.423 
    8  Mushihimesama                                 1.423 
   10  Batsugun / Batsugun Special Version           1.103 

Breakdown by Developer

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                        Top 10
Cave                    4
Treasure                3
Raizing                 2
Toaplan                 1

Breakdown by Original Platform

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System                  Top 10
Arcade                  9
PlayStation 2           1

Miscellaneous Stats:

• Number of Actual Voters: 78
• Number of Games Voted For: 176
• Games Supported by at least half of voters: 1
• Games Supported by at least 1/4 of voters: 7
• Top 10 Score Spread: 1.103 - 3.538
• Total Score Spread: 0.013 - 3.538

Other:

• The discussion thread for this year's poll.
• This year's voting thread.
• Vote weights used: 1st=10, 2nd=9, 3rd=8, 4th=7, 5th=6, 6th=5, 7th=4, 8th=3, 9th=2, 10th=1.
• Raw data: html - ods - xls - txt.
• Top 25 Shmups of All Time - Results (through 2006).

[unsane]

The complete list:

Code: Select all

 Rank  Game                                          Score 
    1  Dodonpachi                                    3.538 
    2  Ikaruga                                       2.692 
    3  Radiant Silvergun                             2.551 
    4  Gradius V                                     2.064 
    5  Battle Garegga                                1.833 
    6  Dodonpachi Daioujou                           1.795 
    7  ESPGaluda                                     1.667 
    8  Armed Police Batrider                         1.423 
    8  Mushihimesama                                 1.423 
   10  Batsugun / Batsugun Special Version           1.103 

   11  Raiden Fighters Jet                           1.090 
   12  Strikers 1945 II                              0.962 
   13  Progear no Arashi                             0.949 
   13  Shikigami no Shiro 2 / Castle Shikigami 2     0.949 
   15  Giga Wing                                     0.885 
   15  R-Type                                        0.885 
   17  Rayforce / Layer Section (et al)              0.859 
   18  Perfect Cherry Blossom                        0.846 
   19  Soukyugurentai                                0.833 
   20  Raiden DX                                     0.821 
   21  G.Darius                                      0.782 
   22  ESPRade                                       0.744 
   23  Gradius Gaiden                                0.692 
   24  Dragon Blaze                                  0.679 
   25  Gunbird 2                                     0.667 
   26  Under Defeat                                  0.654 
   27  Battle Bakraid                                0.628 
   28  Ketsui                                        0.603 
   29  Blue Wish Resurrection                        0.577 
   30  Dangun Feveron                                0.564 
   31  Guwange                                       0.551 
   31  R-Type Delta                                  0.551 
   33  Darius Gaiden                                 0.526 
   34  Mars Matrix                                   0.500 
   35  Twinkle Star Sprites                          0.474 
   36  ESPGaluda II                                  0.462 
   37  Border Down                                   0.449 
   38  Shoot the Bullet                              0.410 
   38  Thunderforce IV / Lightning Force             0.410 
   40  Strikers 1945                                 0.385 
   41  Galaga                                        0.372 
   41  Ibara / Ibara Black Label                     0.372 
   43  Donpachi                                      0.359 
   44  Twin Cobra / Kyukyoku Tiger                   0.333 
   45  Fire Shark / Same! Same! Same!                0.308 
   46  Axelay                                        0.282 
   46  Gradius / Nemesis                             0.282 
   46  Gradius II: Gofer no Yabou / Vulcan Venture   0.282 
   46  Psyvariar 2                                   0.282 
   46  Raiden III                                    0.282 
   46  rRootage                                      0.282 
   52  Soldier Blade                                 0.269 
   52  Zanac (NES) / Zanac EX                        0.269 
   54  Imperishable Night                            0.256 
   55  Einhänder                                     0.244 
   55  Mushihimesama Futari                          0.244 
   55  Raiden Fighters 2                             0.244 
   58  Giga Wing 2                                   0.231 
   58  Senko no Ronde                                0.231 
   60  Thunderforce III                              0.218 
   61  Pulstar                                       0.205 
   61  RayStorm                                      0.205 
   63  Triggerheart Exelica                          0.192 
   64  Homura                                        0.179 
   64  Judgement Silversword                         0.179 
   64  Mountain of Faith                             0.179 
   64  Raiden II                                     0.179 
   64  Truxton / Tatsujin                            0.179 
   64  Zanac Neo                                     0.179 
   70  R-Type Final                                  0.167 
   71  Gun Nac                                       0.154 
   71  Lords of Thunder / Winds of Thunder           0.154 
   73  Gradius III AC                                0.141 
   73  Trizeal                                       0.141 
   75  Aleste / Power Strike                         0.128 
   75  Captain Planet                                0.128 
   75  Gradius Galaxies/Generation/Advance           0.128 
   75  La Soeur de Barrage                           0.128 
   75  Raiden                                        0.128 
   75  Salamander (MSX)                              0.128 
   75  Salamander 2                                  0.128 
   75  Sky Shark / Flying Shark / Hishouzame         0.128 
   75  Vasara                                        0.128 
   84  Apidya                                        0.115 
   84  Blazing Lazers / Gunhed                       0.115 
   84  Death Smiles                                  0.115 
   84  Gradius 2 MSX / Nemesis '90 Kai               0.115 
   84  HellSinker                                    0.115 
   84  Out Zone                                      0.115 
   84  Override                                      0.115 
   84  Sol Divide                                    0.115 
   84  Twinkle Star Sprites: La Petite Princesse     0.115 
   84  Vulgus                                        0.115 
   94  D-Force / Dimensional Force                   0.103 
   94  Robotron 2084                                 0.103 
   94  Salamander (ARC) / Salamander (PCE)           0.103 
   94  Z-Out                                         0.103 
   94  Zero Gunner 2                                 0.103 
   99  Dragon Breed                                  0.090 
   99  Gokujyo Parodius                              0.090 
   99  Power Strike II (SMS)                         0.090 
   99  R-Type II                                     0.090 
   99  R-Type Leo                                    0.090 
   99  Super Star Soldier                            0.090 
   99  Thunder Force AC                              0.090 
   99  Thunderforce V                                0.090 
   99  Warning Forever                               0.090 
   99  Xevious                                       0.090 
  109  Elemental Master                              0.077 
  109  Gynoug / Wings of Wor                         0.077 
  109  Hyper Duel                                    0.077 
  109  Kamui                                         0.077 
  109  Raptor: Call of the Shadows                   0.077 
  109  Shienryu                                      0.077 
  115  Aldynes                                       0.064 
  115  Blast Wind                                    0.064 
  115  Cyvern                                        0.064 
  115  Image Fight                                   0.064 
  115  Last Resort                                   0.064 
  115  Prehistoric Isle 2                            0.064 
  115  Robo Aleste                                   0.064 
  115  Sengoku Blade / Tengai                        0.064 
  115  Shippu Mahou Daisakusen / Kingdom Grandprix   0.064 
  115  Sispri Gauntlet                               0.064 
  115  The Guardian Legend                           0.064 
  126  Airrade Air                                   0.051 
  126  Captain Skyhawk                               0.051 
  126  Ether Vapor                                   0.051 
  126  In the Hunt                                   0.051 
  126  Musha Aleste / M.U.S.H.A.                     0.051 
  126  P-47 Aces                                     0.051 
  126  Pocky & Rocky                                 0.051 
  126  Radirgy                                       0.051 
  126  Super Aleste / Space Megaforce                0.051 
  126  Titanion                                      0.051 
  126  Twin Bee Yahhoo!                              0.051 
  126  Viewpoint                                     0.051 
  126  Viper Phase 1                                 0.051 
  139  Flew Fighter                                  0.038 
  139  Gate of Thunder                               0.038 
  139  Gunbird                                       0.038 
  139  Nemesis II (GB/GBC)                           0.038 
  139  Pink Sweets                                   0.038 
  139  Prehistoric Isle                              0.038 
  139  Sonic Sisters                                 0.038 
  139  Sonic Wings Special                           0.038 
  139  Tenmado                                       0.038 
  139  Tiger Heli                                    0.038 
  139  Tyrian                                        0.038 
  150  Change Air Blade                              0.026 
  150  Cyber Core                                    0.026 
  150  DS4: Experimental Shooter                     0.026 
  150  Geometry Wars Galaxies                        0.026 
  150  Gunsmoke                                      0.026 
  150  Hellfire                                      0.026 
  150  Pop 'n Twinbee                                0.026 
  150  sdmkun                                        0.026 
  150  Space Invaders                                0.026 
  150  X-Multiply                                    0.026 
  160  1942                                          0.013 
  160  Biometal                                      0.013 
  160  Blazing Star                                  0.013 
  160  Boogie Wings                                  0.013 
  160  Defender                                      0.013 
  160  Dimahoo / Great Mahou Daisakusen              0.013 
  160  Final Soldier                                 0.013 
  160  Game Tengoku                                  0.013 
  160  Guardian Force                                0.013 
  160  Psyvariar / Psyvariar Revision                0.013 
  160  Raiden Fighters                               0.013 
  160  Scramble                                      0.013 
  160  Shienryu Explosion                            0.013 
  160  Solar Striker                                 0.013 
  160  Steel Empire                                  0.013 
  160  Varth                                         0.013 
  160  Warmachine Overload                           0.013 

[unsane]

Debugging / Extras

1) Please let me know of any mistakes.

2) When people didn't specify the platform for ambiguous titles, i generally assumed Arcade. Here's a few of the more blatant ones that weren't clear-cut:

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Vote               Assumed                                        Who
GG Aleste          Aleste / Power Strike                          dave4shmups
Gradius II         Gradius II: Gofer no Yabou / Vulcan Venture    bsidwell, kozo, Octopod
Gradius 3          Gradius III AC                                 Macaw, Octopod, stanski
Power Strike II    Power Strike II (SMS)                          dave4shmups
Salamander         Salamander (ARC) / Salamander (PCE)            Bloodreign, Sly Cherry Chunks
Zanac              Zanac (NES) / Zanac EX                         professor ganson, Rob, ROBOTRON

3) I'm unfamiliar with many games so let me know if any are supposed to be merged instead of split, or vice-versa.

4) I don't know how Honorable Mentions work in the annual Top 25, so if someone can fill me in, i could easily add that.

[Rob]

It's like the top 25 with higher Mushihimesama and Darius Gaiden over Mars Matrix. I'm surprised R-Type Final isn't in the top 10.

[Ed Oscuro]

Looks like three of us voted for Nemesis II

At first glance I couldn't really believe that was is a weighted list. I point to the facts that games tended to get the exact number of points (especially down the list) and that they also are ranked alphabetically Obviously, the bottom ranks for many games were getting only one vote, so Scramble (which I put at #10) got 1/3 (roughly) the score of Nemesis II (GB/GBC), which I put at 8 and apparently was the only vote for.

Interesting thread, thanks! Later I'll look through the thread to see who voted for some of these games, in particular Raptor: Call of the Shadows. Haven't thought about that one in a while. Makes me feel guilty for not putting in Major Stryker.

[jpj]

probably the most accurate top 10 i've seen

[Ed Oscuro]

Accurate as per predictions, yes...

[jpj]

i don't bother with these things usually, i just mean 8/10 of the stuff i voted for is in there, and the other two likely aren't because they aren't ported or emulated. but it's nice to see that the most vocal members don't always represent the common consensus

[Ceph]

Interesting to see who considered themselves less experienced and therefore participated. This will certainly be a welcome source of enjoyment and help make a case in future shmup-related discussions.

[moozooh]

Heh, less experienced top-10 = most popular/hyped titles. Funny though, only about a half of the voters were "less experienced", if not less.

[Ceph]

only about a half of the voters were "less experienced", if not less.

You seem to misunderstand. By definition anyone who participated is "less experienced".

[bsidwell]

Of course it was the arcade version. Why would I vote for any of the other ones?

[Octopod]

Gradius 3 arcade.


And man, my list was sweet and not a single game i voted for made it.Ofcourse, i am super unexperienced...but still ..not a single Irem game made it?LAME

[Mortificator]

It's a good thing these voters had their own poll so they wouldn't influence the regular Top 25 list.

[Ganelon]

It'd be interesting to see how the current top 25 compares, considering how remarkably similar this poll turned out to last year's top 25. Once again, R-Type looks so out of place compared to the rest of the top 40...

[The Coop]

How in the bloody blue fist fuck did D-Force finish above R-Type II, Power Strike II and two Thunder Force games (among others)?

[iatneH]

It just occurred to me that this could be a list from the "shooter community common peoples". Different from "general gaming community common peoples" but it's apparent we have not had the opportunity to play some of the more exclusive titles.

Actually I missed moozooh's post, but I agree about it looking very much like the top 10 most popular/hyped.

Still, thanks for your effort o unsane one.

[Michaelm]

It's a good thing these voters had their own poll so they wouldn't influence the regular Top 25 list.

I'm gonna vote in the regular one too

[jp]

Interesting to see who considered themselves less experienced and therefore participated. This will certainly be a welcome source of enjoyment and help make a case in future shmup-related discussions.

You know, I just voted for the hell of it.


Ah well, *is less experienced*

[unsane]

How in the bloody blue fist fuck did D-Force finish above R-Type II, Power Strike II and two Thunder Force games (among others)?

IMO at most the top ~75 are meaningfully ordered, due to sample size. Below that you start getting mainly games that only got 1 vote and not even given first place.

[FIL]

Dragonblaze at #24? shame on you guys.

[charlie chong]

well i've been playing shooters for 20 + years but i've never delved into the world of pc engine and stuff like amiga and other home computer shooters.. so i am less experienced but that doesn't make my opinions invalid.. i'm sure i play shooters a lot better than ceph anyways

[Arvandor]

only about a half of the voters were "less experienced", if not less.

You seem to misunderstand. By definition anyone who participated is "less experienced".

I'll taint the top 25 shmups with my noobish Cave fanboyism anyways! BWAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

[God]

Wow, DDP won by a wide margin. Didn't expect that considering it essentially tied with Gradius 5 last time. Thought a treasure game would take the top spot for sure.

I'm surprised R-Type Final isn't in the top 10.

I'm the only one who gave it higher than a 2.

probably the most accurate top 10 i've seen

With fewer participants and less data per participant it must be the least accurate ever. Also, the inexperience.

Heh, less experienced top-10 = most popular/hyped titles.

A vote like this is always going to be a popularity contest.

..not a single Irem game made it?LAME

They didn't even get a "where did they go wrong" thread...


The raw data section is very nice. Some things I noticed:

-Silvergun got the most perfect 10s
-Guwange got the most 1s
-Galaga got a near perfect average (10,10,9)
-RType is the lowest ranking game to get many 10s
-Strikers 1945 II is the highest ranking game to get none.

[jpj]

probably the most accurate top 10 i've seen

With fewer participants and less data per participant it must be the least accurate ever.

sorry, i think you missed the point. i meant that the list is 80% correct in relation to my opinion. another way i could have worded it: this list is the least disagreeable.

[Arvandor]

I agree, it's a very solid list, and of all the top 10 shmup lists I've seen over the past few years, this is the one I have the fewest qualms with.

Who's to say how accurate it is or isn't though? There are so many things to consider. Like how many people in the top 25 vote are trying to be cool by voting for obscure stuff? How many of the people who vote in the top 25 are elitists who won't list games by a certain developer, now matter how good, whether it be from Cave, Psikyo, Raizing, etc. How many of those people voted in the noob thread? More? Less?

Also, with the inexperienced voters, you have to take into consideration that they're probably playing mostly what everyone else (ie the veterens) recommends. So inexperienced people are perhaps more likely to vote for games with more widespread appeal (as it's all they've played). For example, with how often ESPgaluda gets recommened to people new to the genre, and how much everyone seems to love it (look at the traffic in the high score thread versus say, Dodonpachi), you'd think it'd be much higher on the top 25 list. Why isn't it? Are people afraid to vote for the game they love because it's considered Cave's easy mode noob game?

These lists are always terribly subjective, and could change drastically depending on what group of people votes in it. I like the results of this one though =) I'd knock Radiant and Gradius down a few notches (Gradius a few more than RSG), but that's just me.

[jpj]

Like how many people in the top 25 vote are trying to be cool by voting for obscure stuff? How many of the people who vote in the top 25 are elitists who won't list games by a certain developer, now matter how good, whether it be from Cave, Psikyo, Raizing, etc.

it's a good point, and it's very obvious who these people are. another thing i find sad is when someone starts a thinly-veiled thread slagging off a particular game (that usually places highly) during (or just before) the voting period. come on, get a life.

[Rob]

I agree, it's a very solid list, and of all the top 10 shmup lists I've seen over the past few years, this is the one I have the fewest qualms with.

Yikes.

As a person's top 10 list it would be OK because I don't expect people to play anything but their favorite one or two types of game, but as a collective and representation of the genre as a whole it is bordering on poor. Not as bad as lists from clueless sites, but still pretty bad.

DDP, DOJ, ESPGaluda, Mushi <-- three of these are redundant, pick them.

2 Raizing, 3 Treasure, 4 Cave and 1 proto-Cave game. Cue "perfect!"

[jpj]

as a collective and representation of the genre as a whole

is that what we're voting for?

it is bordering on poor

that's your opinion

DDP, DOJ, ESPGaluda, Mushi <-- three of these are redundant

says who?

[FIL]

Its almost identical to the "real" top 10. If this is poor, then that is poor too.