Are these games good purchases?

ryosnk · Post by **ryosnk** » Mon May 02, 2005 5:45 pm

Darius Twin and thunder spirits (both for the snes) are on the ebgames.com website and I got them for $7 total shipped. Are they good games, versions, and did I get a good deal?

Rob · Post by **Rob** » Mon May 02, 2005 5:49 pm

No, they aren't good.

http://forum.shmups.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1796

iatneH · Post by **iatneH** » Mon May 02, 2005 6:26 pm

I got Thunder Spirits from ebgames also. That inclined me to go and get Thunderforce III on the Genesis as well. The Genesis version renders the SNES version damn near unplayable by comparison. Plus having autofire & stage select are nice.

Accutron · Post by **Accutron** » Mon May 02, 2005 6:34 pm

Neither are very good examples of their respective series. Can't really go wrong with $7 though.

BrianC · Post by **BrianC** » Mon May 02, 2005 7:02 pm

You would probably be better off getting Darius Force/Super Nova for your SNES Darius fix. It's much more intense than Darius Twin. Thunder Spirits sounds lackluster, but I would like to know the exact reasons why not many seem to like it. Most of what I see are comments comparing it to Thunder Force III and very little about the actual game.

ryosnk · Post by **ryosnk** » Mon May 02, 2005 7:28 pm

Well for $7 in total, its not to bad to just try them.

The Bullet Dodger · Post by **The Bullet Dodger** » Mon May 02, 2005 7:41 pm

Thunder Spirits, which is the SNES port for Thunder Force III, is by far the worst horizontal shmup in my entire library. It isn't even worth the $4 I spent on it. Pure crap! Trust me.

Darius Twin, on the other hand, is a gem compared to Thunder Spirits. It deserves a try.

BrianC · Post by **BrianC** » Mon May 02, 2005 7:58 pm

The Bullet Dodger wrote:Thunder Spirits, which is the SNES port for Thunder Force III, is by far the worst horizontal shmup in my entire library. It isn't even worth the $4 I spent on it. Pure crap! Trust me.

Darius Twin, on the other hand, is a gem compared to Thunder Spirits. It deserves a try.

Why is it "pure crap"? How can I trust you when you haven't told me any actual information about the game?

The Bullet Dodger · Post by **The Bullet Dodger** » Mon May 02, 2005 8:09 pm

lol

Listen, knowing that it IS a port of TF III for the SNES should be enough for anyone to at least have it in their library. But when you play it, you'll know why I think it's pure crap. The graphics don't even compare to the Genesis version. There's no life in the backrounds at all. There's no rapid fire. The music sucks balls. I just think it's a very poor, and dissapointing excuse for a TF port, especially for the SNES, which has alot of great shmups, IMO.

Just think of Raiden Trad for example. The Genesis version is good. The SNES version sucks. Same thing here.

Rob · Post by **Rob** » Mon May 02, 2005 8:12 pm

You can't help comparing Thunder Spirits to TF3 since it's basically the same thing a few times removed and much worse for the wear. TF3 plays smoothly and TS is a choppy wreck. There is rapidfire (although you have to select it manually, right?), but this is one of those games where you can induce slowdown by just using your weapon. Hit fire and watch the screen slow by a quarter or a third. Graphics look nasty, soundtrack is ruined. Basically any reason I would play TF3 is dumped on (smooth control, nice graphics and soundtrack). It's been SNES-ified.

Dartagnan1083 · Post by **Dartagnan1083** » Mon May 02, 2005 8:12 pm

They're comparing Thunder Spirits to TF3 because Thunder Spirits IS A PORT of Thunder Force III.
While there are some differences, they are similar enough for direct comparison.

Essentially, Thunder Spirits is a bad version of TF3.
Thusly the complaints. Similar to the Atari2600 version of the original Pac-man. Essentially the same...but complete schlock.

EDIT: Holy Shnikies...a trifecta of explanations for the Suckage of Spirits.
I sure feel silly

SheSaidDutch · Post by **SheSaidDutch** » Mon May 02, 2005 8:14 pm

ryosnk wrote:Darius Twin and thunder spirits (both for the snes) are on the ebgames.com website and I got them for $7 total shipped. Are they good games, versions, and did I get a good deal?

Just play and spend some time on these games, Thats what you need to do, sure it's nice to have some opinions onthe games but you need to try them yourself

maybe you'll like them maybe you wont

The Bullet Dodger · Post by **The Bullet Dodger** » Mon May 02, 2005 8:14 pm

Dartagnan1083 wrote:They're comparing Thunder Spirits to TF3 because Thunder Spirits IS A PORT of Thunder Force III.
While there are some differences, they are similar enough for direct comparison.

Essentially, Thunder Spirits is a bad version of TF3.
Thusly the complaints. Similar to the Atari2600 version of the original Pac-man. Essentially the same...but complete schlock.

Thank you!

Rob · Post by **Rob** » Mon May 02, 2005 8:15 pm

Three consecutive posts saying the same thing, except differently. It's kind of like TF3, AC and Thunder Spirits.

BrianC · Post by **BrianC** » Mon May 02, 2005 8:19 pm

Dartagnan1083 wrote:They're comparing Thunder Spirits to TF3 because Thunder Spirits IS A PORT of Thunder Force III.
While there are some differences, they are similar enough for direct comparison.

Well, I know that already, but basically I just heard comparisons without info like how much slowdown it has, what makes it a bad port, etc. Thanks for filling me in with more info, but please don't talk to me like I'm brain dead. I guess I worded my earlier post poorly. I meant that I kept seeing posts that said Thunder Spirits isn't as good as Thunder Force III without saying WHY it isn't as good as Thunder Force III.

TWITCHDOCTOR · Post by **TWITCHDOCTOR** » Mon May 02, 2005 8:22 pm

Thunder Spirits is a poor port, with lots of slowdown.

Darius Twin suffers from nothing...meaning its actually good, just that its not the "best" Darius game. I was quite impressed when I first played it roughly 15 years ago.

The Bullet Dodger · Post by **The Bullet Dodger** » Mon May 02, 2005 8:29 pm

BrianC wrote:
Dartagnan1083 wrote:They're comparing Thunder Spirits to TF3 because Thunder Spirits IS A PORT of Thunder Force III.
While there are some differences, they are similar enough for direct comparison.
Well, I know that already, but basically I just heard comparisons without info like how much slowdown it has, what makes it a bad port, etc. Thanks for filling me in with more info, but please don't talk to me like I'm brain dead. I guess I worded my earlier post poorly. I meant that I kept seeing posts that said Thunder Spirits isn't as good as Thunder Force III without saying WHY it isn't as good as Thunder Force III.

Everything I post is my opinion only. There was no intention of talking down on you. Sorry if you got that impression.

BrianC · Post by **BrianC** » Mon May 02, 2005 8:40 pm

The Bullet Dodger wrote:
BrianC wrote:
Dartagnan1083 wrote:They're comparing Thunder Spirits to TF3 because Thunder Spirits IS A PORT of Thunder Force III.
While there are some differences, they are similar enough for direct comparison.
Well, I know that already, but basically I just heard comparisons without info like how much slowdown it has, what makes it a bad port, etc. Thanks for filling me in with more info, but please don't talk to me like I'm brain dead. I guess I worded my earlier post poorly. I meant that I kept seeing posts that said Thunder Spirits isn't as good as Thunder Force III without saying WHY it isn't as good as Thunder Force III.

Everything I post is my opinion only. There was no intention of talking down on you. Sorry if you got that impression.

I understand, but I was referring to another poster with that one comment. It's common knowledge that Thunder Spirits is a port of TFIII. It definatly sounds like a bad port, but I think Golden Axe PS2 probably 1ups it in terms of bad portiness.

The Bullet Dodger · Post by **The Bullet Dodger** » Mon May 02, 2005 8:48 pm

cool shit.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Tue May 03, 2005 12:30 am

I don't really care what anybody else says, I think Darius Twin is an excellent game. I love the soundtrack, backgrounds, bosses, power-up system, everything about it. It's at least better than Gradius 3, as it doesn't suffer from the worst slowdown in video game history. When I see the reasons people give for saying that Darius Twin sucks, I don't see any that really carry alot of weight or significance. The only thing that could have been improved about the game is that it's a bit on the easy side, though honestly, it's not THAT easy, the last few levels can really throw you for a loop.

I also recommend that you get Darius Force/Super Nova, if you don't have it already. It's a great follow-up to Twin, with an advanced challenge factor, improved graphics, a more creepy, atmospheric feel to it, and a unique power-up system.

Did somebody honestly say that there's a game that faired better on Genesis when it was ported to both SNES and Genesis.

Either way, you know about 99% of the games that were ported to both the SNES and Genesis sucked balls on the Genesis. Let's face it the SNES dominated the Genesis in every way, shape, and form. If any game looked better on Genesis it was not because the Genesis was superior, rather, because the programmers didn't give a crap about what they were doing.

Turrican · Post by **Turrican** » Tue May 03, 2005 12:46 am

@Dark Saibot: simply untrue. The megadrive clock speed is double than the Snes. This specific alone should be enough to understand why at least for shmups the MD is a more inclined hardware.

That said, I find Rob's comment "It's been SNES-ified" quite racist, as the whole Snes library was of choppy and broken games. Super Aleste would be a "genesisified" game by that logic.

Ganelon · Post by **Ganelon** » Tue May 03, 2005 12:58 am

Dark Saibot wrote: Did somebody honestly say that there's a game that faired better on Genesis when it was ported to both SNES and Genesis.

Well, pretty much every EA Sports game played far smoother on the Genesis and ranged from mediocre to sucked like crap on the SNES. The SNES is certainly the better system technology-wise except for clock speed but with the more than double clock speed, the Genesis could really move motion-heavy games in ways that the SNES couldn't.

TWITCHDOCTOR · Post by **TWITCHDOCTOR** » Tue May 03, 2005 1:08 am

^Its all about the "clock speed", or main CPU. The Genny ran at around 7.5M whereas the SNES ran at a way cool 3.5M (RPG's were common in Japan, so they didn't need that fast shit) I'm surprised U.N Squadron,Darius Twin, and Space MegaForce ran as well as they did on the SNES.

Yes its true, ThunderForce III runs circles around the SNES version Thunder Spirits(not to mention a poor ass port). Also, even John Madden Football played smoother on the Genesis. The SNES was know to be "choppy" from day one...trust me, I know, I've been there and done that. Still do in fact!

The SNES could feature better looking graphics, but then again, gwafix aren't everything y'know.

Rob · Post by **Rob** » Tue May 03, 2005 1:15 am

Turrican wrote:Super Aleste would be a "genesisified" game by that logic.

Bio Metal is closer to Genefication.

BrianC · Post by **BrianC** » Tue May 03, 2005 1:35 am

Pop 'n Twinbee, Axelay, Cotton 100%, the Parodius games, Super Aleste, Darius Force, UN Squadron, R-Type III, and Macross Scramble Valkyrie aren't choppy or broken IMO. I also like Gradius 3, though that game is full of slowdown. Isn't Biometal choppy and full of slowdown?

BTW, some of those Madden games and other SNES games were just victims of bad ports. It got much better with Madden '94 SNES when they decided to make the game an SNES original rather than a port. However, some EA games after that were lacking compared to the Genesis versions. However, some of the lacking features seemed more due to laziness than due to the inferior hardware.

Rob · Post by **Rob** » Tue May 03, 2005 1:48 am

No more than any other SNES game, I'd guess. The difference is that it's fast paced to begin with. The system doesn't have many examples of fast paced action. It strikes me as unusual.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Tue May 03, 2005 1:50 am

@Dark Saibot: simply untrue. The megadrive clock speed is double than the Snes. This specific alone should be enough to understand why at least for shmups the MD is a more inclined hardware.

I have a real hard time swallowing that one, since I have seen little or no games that indicate the Genesis runs twice as fast as the SNES. Having a high clock speed doesn't really mean much of anything, if none of the games really showed it. If it is true, then that would likely mean that some of the dumbest programmers on the face of the Earth worked on the Genesis if they managed to make so many games that sucked ass when they were working with a system that ran twice as fast as the SNES.

I never even mentioned graphics. Still, the SNES not only surpassed the Genesis in terms of graphics, and quality game library, it also killed the Genesis in terms of sound/music. Sega has an awful sound chip, the music in any game sounded like crap on Genesis compared to the SNES SPC. That made a huge difference in the quality of the games, at least from my perspective.

Well, pretty much every EA Sports game played far smoother on the Genesis and ranged from mediocre to sucked like crap on the SNES. The SNES is certainly the better system technology-wise except for clock speed but with the more than double clock speed, the Genesis could really move motion-heavy games in ways that the SNES couldn't.

Has the discussion come down to sports games? All sports games suck ass as far as I'm concerned. The unwanted pieces of crap, piled to the ceiling in discount bins at gamestop for $1.00 each.

As far as motion, would it really have made a huge difference if Nintendo had Mario spin around through cool loop things going really fast and collect coins. I don't think it would. A game that plays faster certainly doesn't mean that it's better. I don't mind a game that plays slightly slower, provided it makes up for it in other ways, which is more than true in the SNES case.

Rob · Post by **Rob** » Tue May 03, 2005 2:02 am

Dark Saibot wrote:Having a high clock speed doesn't really mean much of anything, if none of the games really showed it.

Thunder Force III -> Thunder Spirits. Have you ever played El Viento?

BrianC · Post by **BrianC** » Tue May 03, 2005 2:10 am

Rob wrote:
Dark Saibot wrote:Having a high clock speed doesn't really mean much of anything, if none of the games really showed it.
Thunder Force III -> Thunder Spirits. Have you ever played El Viento?

I tried the game out, but I don't own it. I want to get it bad, though. The heroine of the game rocks! The Genesis handled Street Fighter 2 Turbo with more detail from the arcade in the background than the SNES version.

Melf · Post by **Melf** » Tue May 03, 2005 2:17 am

Comparing Thunder Spirits directly to TF3 is kind of unfair. If you're going to compare it to something, compare it to the arcade game it's ported from. That was mediocre to begin with, so...

Hey, look! A Game that's better on the Genesis than the SNES!

shmups.system11.org

Are these games good purchases?

Are these games good purchases?

Re: Are these games good purchases?