Cave VS Doujin Shooter

elfhentaifan · Post by **elfhentaifan** » Wed Dec 26, 2007 10:21 pm

I often thought about it.
Since x.x has his own cave-like style (Blue Wish Resurrection, Edens Edge, Edends Aegis) i wondered if he really makes worse danmaku games than cave itself does.
That guy is going crazy with awesome patterns, hidden difficulties, smooth chain systems and superbosses.
WE WANT MOOOORE!

So check the poll..

P_HAT · Post by **P_HAT** » Wed Dec 26, 2007 10:25 pm

Mushihimesama MANIAC - Normal
Blue Wish Resurrection ACCEL - Easy/Normal
Edens Edge HELL - Easy
Ketsui - Hell. Hi 2nd loop.

GaijinPunch · Post by **GaijinPunch** » Wed Dec 26, 2007 11:54 pm

Mushihime-sama Maniac really isn't that hard. It's nowhere near as hard as Ketsui.

LUNardei · Post by **LUNardei** » Thu Dec 27, 2007 3:10 am

There's something called depth in any Cave game. Something you can feel the lack of while playing a doujin, if you ask me.

shoe-sama · Post by **shoe-sama** » Thu Dec 27, 2007 3:29 am

EWWWWWWWWWW AUTOGUARD

kengou · Post by **kengou** » Thu Dec 27, 2007 4:55 am

shoe-sama wrote:EWWWWWWWWWW AUTOGUARD

Also takes about 2 seconds to disable it in the option screen.

I'm Alec · Post by **I'm Alec** » Thu Dec 27, 2007 5:00 am

doujin...lol...ketsui for sure.

shoe-sama · Post by **shoe-sama** » Thu Dec 27, 2007 5:02 am

kengou wrote:
shoe-sama wrote:EWWWWWWWWWW AUTOGUARD
Also takes about 2 seconds to disable it in the option screen.

why the hell would you do that lol

Violent Ken · Post by **Violent Ken** » Thu Dec 27, 2007 5:06 am

Ketsui for sure...

elfhentaifan · Post by **elfhentaifan** » Thu Dec 27, 2007 2:45 pm

i think people underestimate the difficulty and deepness in doujin shmups (i am just referring to the x.x games), of course you have to consider the fact, that a doujin is mostly a one-man creation "real" shmups used to be more elaborated.

And wtf BWR Accel mode is a pain to 1cc (even if Hell mode is still tougher)

moozooh · Post by **moozooh** » Thu Dec 27, 2007 3:22 pm

I find Mushihime-sama Original/Maniac difficulty somewhat similar to Extra stages of Touhou games, in that surviving in them usually takes three simple distinct steps: figuring out a good level route before the boss, studying boss's patterns, and repeating it until it's done. Similarity is further increased by the fact that Mushihime's challenge comes from complex patterns and weird trajectories that make you panic at first but are, in fact, solved by figuring out safe spots and moving as little as possible (compared to, say, DDP's relentless assault of aimed bullets that make you wiggle from one side of the screen to another, and no-safe-spot spam). Ultra mode is, of course, different story.

However, x.x games aren't deep in regards to scoring because there's basically one "perfect" way of scoring, which makes the whole system rigid. BWR was good in regards to risk/reward, but then again, that's thanks to Ketsui's heritage rather than x.x himself.

Davey · Post by **Davey** » Thu Dec 27, 2007 11:50 pm

elfhentaifan wrote:And wtf BWR Accel mode is a pain to 1cc (even if Hell mode is still tougher)

It's not too bad if you keep autoguard turned on and play at 60 fps. It takes some practice, but it's nothing like 1CCing a Cave game.

FIL · Post by **FIL** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 12:50 am

Autoguard is a pain in BWR it drops a bomb even if your hitbox hasn't been touched.

elfhentaifan · Post by **elfhentaifan** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 12:52 am

the disadvantage in autobombs is the fact, that they drop your chain counter. your score will be fucked up hard

moozooh · Post by **moozooh** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 2:39 am

Playing for score and playing for survival are two completely different things, though.

shoe-sama · Post by **shoe-sama** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 3:08 am

end of game bonus for extra lives >>>> end of stage gold count

Post by **spadgy** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 12:13 pm

Isn't there a chance a Cave game will win this poll as more people have played Cave games than Doujin shooters? Perhaps I'm wrong, and am basing that idea on my own lack of Doujin experience...

elfhentaifan · Post by **elfhentaifan** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 5:34 pm

spadgy wrote:Isn't there a chance a Cave game will win this poll as more people have played Cave games than Doujin shooters? Perhaps I'm wrong, and am basing that idea on my own lack of Doujin experience...

well then i suggest, leech the doujins, make youself an imagination of it, and then decide.
Its a miracle that such awesome doujins are freeware

Post by **spadgy** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 5:57 pm

You're right of course, and I must get round to exploring Doujin. But there are so many shmups to play on so many formats!

I'm actually a bloody Mac owner, and have explored most of the Doujin-style stuff on that.

Still, I'm fairly sure more people have played Cave than Doujin - ironic considering the price of Cave compared to the freeness/cheapness of free/shareware.

Perhaps I'm wrong?

Davey · Post by **Davey** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 10:38 pm

spadgy wrote:Still, I'm fairly sure more people have played Cave than Doujin - ironic considering the price of Cave compared to the freeness/cheapness of free/shareware.

Perhaps I'm wrong?

Ever heard the quote "Linux is only free if your time has no value?" The same could be said about doujins. Some of my favorite shmups are doujins, but I only play the ones that get a lot of buzz on this board. There are a lot of shitty doujins out there, and I don't want to be the one that sifts through them to find the occasional gem.

Post by **spadgy** » Sat Dec 29, 2007 1:52 pm

Davey wrote:
spadgy wrote:Still, I'm fairly sure more people have played Cave than Doujin - ironic considering the price of Cave compared to the freeness/cheapness of free/shareware.

Perhaps I'm wrong?
Ever heard the quote "Linux is only free if your time has no value?" The same could be said about doujins. Some of my favorite shmups are doujins, but I only play the ones that get a lot of buzz on this board. There are a lot of shitty doujins out there, and I don't want to be the one that sifts through them to find the occasional gem.

I haven't heard the quote but I like it and it fits here perfect...

Nuke · Post by **Nuke** » Sat Dec 29, 2007 4:12 pm

Warning Forever FTW!

shoe-sama · Post by **shoe-sama** » Sat Dec 29, 2007 6:32 pm

incorrect

elfhentaifan · Post by **elfhentaifan** » Sat Dec 29, 2007 6:56 pm

P_HAT wrote: Ketsui - Hell. Hi 2nd loop.

we're talking about the 1st loop only of course

Gungriffon Geona · Post by **Gungriffon Geona** » Sat Dec 29, 2007 8:42 pm

shoe-sama wrote:incorrect

incorrect

Dale · Post by **Dale** » Sat Dec 29, 2007 8:46 pm

I think Auto-guard is a great idea. I would mess up so bad with out it.

X.X may be a poor man's Cave but they still have allot of good idea's. Their level design and bullet patterns are good too.

shoe-sama · Post by **shoe-sama** » Sat Dec 29, 2007 9:15 pm

Gungriffon Geona wrote:
shoe-sama wrote:incorrect
incorrect

-Bridget- · Post by **-Bridget-** » Sun Dec 30, 2007 12:02 pm

I'll agree that Mushi's Maniac isnt that hard..... that game's difficulty iis mostly wedged in Ultra (HATE SECOND BOSS).

Playing BWR on Hell seemed similarly hard to Ultra....

....but what is "Accel" mode? I dont recall something like that....

elfhentaifan · Post by **elfhentaifan** » Sun Dec 30, 2007 12:31 pm

The Accel mode is a hidden difficulty in the game.
To unlock it you first have to find and also unlock the hidden extend in stage 3.
Then in Mode select screen a hidden option below "HELL" will be available.
Very fun

shmups.system11.org

Cave VS Doujin Shooter

Which Game (-mode) is the toughest?

Cave VS Doujin Shooter