Most cheap deaths on a shmup

[Shatterhand]

What's the shmup with the biggest amount of cheap deaths?

There's an arcade close to where I work and it's on the same street where my girlfriend works... sometimes I go get her when she leaves work, and sometimes she has to do some overtime there, so I just hangout on the arcade.

I usually play either KoF XI or CVS, but they have Macross Plus there (I even told the story about finding it out in another topic). It's funny, as the cab stays hidden at a corner of the arcade, behind a virtua striker 2006 cab.... I don't like to play it too much, because I tried it once, and I lost all my lives for stupid cheap deaths...

Yesterday someone actually played the game while I was hanging there... after watching him playing, I felt like giving it another go..

I actually played 3 credits there... one of the funny things is that the game is configured to play with 4 lives... and goddamn hell, the game does throw EVERY cheap shot it can at you.

First, if you stay alive for more than 1 minute the rank goes apeshit.

ANd then, the games does everthing to kill you at the most unfair ways... ships who shoot at you while they are about to leave the screen, no enemy has any shame about point-blanking you, enemies that shoot at you being out of the screen (the game has a horizontal span) - even more annoying when they shoot at you off the screen AND at the same Y position of you, the shot comes straight from your side. Enemies that come from both sides of screen, move straight down and when they are at the same level of you, they home at you with no chance to dodging (And they will also point-blank you).

Goddamn, I lost 12 lives on the game (3 credits X 4 lives), I felt only 2 were actually fair, every other death was completely unfair, and there was no way I could dodge those attacks without prior knowing what was coming, or in case of point-blanking, by sheer luck.

And this is a 1996 game....

[moozooh]

I can't say which of them I played was the cheapest in that sense, but the one that sure left such an impression was Gunbird 2. There's quite a number of attacks close to impossible to evade if you don't know about them beforehand (especially with the two slowest characters).

[ROBOTRON]

Off the top of my head I'd say "Tempest".

Once you get past the first zone (blue) you get these things called Pulsars that can destroy you from the bottom of the screen before they even come into view. Its hard enough battling crap at the top of the screen without having to worry about stuff you can't even see yet. The only warning you really have is an electric "pulse" sound, but by the time you hear it, your electrocuted. I had like ten ships left and lost them all in succession right away.

Its infuriating, but the game still rocks.

[Spazicon]

Seconding Tempest.

And holy shit, ROBOTRON! It's kairi (Tagmonkey). <3 How's Detroit?

[P_HAT]

Most of Psikyo...

[Kaiser]

Strikers 1945 III
Sonic wings (Arcade) on twin black plane boss

[shoe-sama]

any memorizer

GBA version of R-Type III has crappy hit detection on top of all that memorization crap

[BIL]

Gradius II Arcade's Gun Wall restart point comes to mind... the one that parks your factory-standard Vic in the middle of Ceiling Tile Hell. Particularly if you're on the left-middle side of the screen when the boss fight starts, in which case you'll get instant-killed by the GW core as it flies in. Not a cheap game overall by any means, but unless I'm missing something there's no way out of that checkpoint.

[kengou]

Most of Psikyo...

I'd also like to throw in an honorary mention for Raizing because of the damn invisible gray bullets in half their games.

[Krooze L-Roy]

I'd also like to throw in an honorary mention for Raizing because of the damn invisible gray bullets in half their games.

Yeah I was just about to mention Battle Garegga's camouflaged bullets.

And that midboss in Strikers 1945 2 always gets me with his laser. I never see it coming. The game always goes downhill after that too; breaks my mojo.

[P_HAT]

Most of Psikyo...

I'd also like to throw in an honorary mention for Raizing because of the damn invisible gray bullets in half their games.

+1

Also, Gradius 3 boobles

[JJG]

The Game Paradise!

[Zebra Airforce]

Yeah I was just about to mention Battle Garegga's camouflaged bullets.

That's a great over-exaggeration.

[zero.otaku]

Yeah I was just about to mention Battle Garegga's camouflaged bullets.

After I played this game maybe ten times, I *never* have this problem anymore. I guess you just have to like it enough to keep playing it until your eyes adjust.

The Game Paradise!

Agreed.

[Krooze L-Roy]

Yeah I was just about to mention Battle Garegga's camouflaged bullets.

That's a great over-exaggeration.

Yeah, I tend to do that. Honestly, I'm sure I could get used to spotting those 100% invisible bullets, but it would take a bit of work.

[ROBOTRON]

Seconding Tempest.

And holy shit, ROBOTRON! It's kairi (Tagmonkey). <3 How's Detroit?

Detroit's lovely...a murder in every pot.

Sup? <3

[Erinu]

Ikaruga, as the game is 100% memorization of patterns, and everything must be premeditated otherwise you're going to wind up dying due to lack of knowledge.

[viniciusvbf]

There's a Raiden 2 cab in an arcade i go sometimes.
The first time i saw it, i tought "OMG RAIDEN 2, I MUST PLAY IT NOW!"
The fact that it isn't emulated just made wanna play this even more
I tried my first credit... game over in the 1st stage
I tought "well, it was my first try, the next can't be that bad"
Second credit, game over in the 2nd boss
The game is just too cheap, if you don't know the game you WILL die, there's nothing you can do.

[kengou]

Ikaruga, as the game is 100% memorization of patterns, and everything must be premeditated otherwise you're going to wind up dying due to lack of knowledge.

I completely disagree. Yes, the game relies a lot on memorization if you want to score at all, and the game plays almost identically every play through including enemy positions and shots. But even if you've never played before, the game isn't really unfair. You can do well even if you've never played before; it's not like R-Type, where if you take the wrong path you'll just die. Everything in the game gives you a pretty fair chance to survive, I think.

[Erinu]

Ikaruga, as the game is 100% memorization of patterns, and everything must be premeditated otherwise you're going to wind up dying due to lack of knowledge.

I completely disagree. Yes, the game relies a lot on memorization if you want to score at all, and the game plays almost identically every play through including enemy positions and shots. But even if you've never played before, the game isn't really unfair. You can do well even if you've never played before; it's not like R-Type, where if you take the wrong path you'll just die. Everything in the game gives you a pretty fair chance to survive, I think.

The problem with Ikaruga is that you can't simply sit there and dodge bullets. You need to constantly absorb bullets while being in the right positions and killing the right enemies at the right time if you wish to chain. All of that is memorization, and I don't imagine many newbies getting past the middle or even any of Chapter 2 because of it.

I guess it's a good game if you love memorization but it's a strange concept when i comes to shooters, and I don't really see why it's even considered one. It's more of a puzzle game. "Easy when you know how."

[Aquas]

Also, Gradius 3 boobles

AHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! SO TRUE. Those damned bubbles are demon spawn.

I'm going to propose Silver Surfer because of the huge hitbox, and because the Angry Video Game Nerd reviewed it.

http://www.gametrailers.com/player/2030 ... 0&type=mov

[worstplayer]

Steel Saviour is unfair.
Right in first level you have some obstacle. You can go over or under it. There are tons of enemies flying over. You have absolutely no chance of killing them all so you'll of course go under. But oops, the path just ends there. How the fuck i'm supposed to know that?
Then just before the first boss there's some kind of minelayer. There's just enough space to fly over it... if the screen didn't start scrolling down for no apparent reason (of course, just at the moment when you can't return). And it goes on and on.
Every single enemy tries to ram you, your weapons are a joke, hitbox is actually bigger than your ship etc. And that's 2005 game.

[kengou]

Ikaruga, as the game is 100% memorization of patterns, and everything must be premeditated otherwise you're going to wind up dying due to lack of knowledge.

I completely disagree. Yes, the game relies a lot on memorization if you want to score at all, and the game plays almost identically every play through including enemy positions and shots. But even if you've never played before, the game isn't really unfair. You can do well even if you've never played before; it's not like R-Type, where if you take the wrong path you'll just die. Everything in the game gives you a pretty fair chance to survive, I think.

The problem with Ikaruga is that you can't simply sit there and dodge bullets. You need to constantly absorb bullets while being in the right positions and killing the right enemies at the right time if you wish to chain. All of that is memorization, and I don't imagine many newbies getting past the middle or even any of Chapter 2 because of it.

I guess it's a good game if you love memorization but it's a strange concept when i comes to shooters, and I don't really see why it's even considered one. It's more of a puzzle game. "Easy when you know how."

I don't want to get into an unrelated argument in this thread, but let me explain my position a bit. To simply play the game for survival, shooting stuff and dodging shots, you don't need to memorize anything. It helps to do so, just like in any other shmup, but it isn't necessary. The chaining, that is all memorization, I'll agree there wholeheartedly. I personally enjoy that aspect but some people might not. Chaining is in no way necessary to beat the game, though, if you're good enough at dodging. Ignoring the chaining completely, the game is quite playable without memorization and I don't think it is in any way unfair.

[spadgy]

I completely disagree. Yes, the game relies a lot on memorization if you want to score at all, and the game plays almost identically every play through including enemy positions and shots. But even if you've never played before, the game isn't really unfair. You can do well even if you've never played before; it's not like R-Type, where if you take the wrong path you'll just die. Everything in the game gives you a pretty fair chance to survive, I think.

The problem with Ikaruga is that you can't simply sit there and dodge bullets. You need to constantly absorb bullets while being in the right positions and killing the right enemies at the right time if you wish to chain. All of that is memorization, and I don't imagine many newbies getting past the middle or even any of Chapter 2 because of it.

I guess it's a good game if you love memorization but it's a strange concept when i comes to shooters, and I don't really see why it's even considered one. It's more of a puzzle game. "Easy when you know how."

I don't want to get into an unrelated argument in this thread, but let me explain my position a bit. To simply play the game for survival, shooting stuff and dodging shots, you don't need to memorize anything. It helps to do so, just like in any other shmup, but it isn't necessary. The chaining, that is all memorization, I'll agree there wholeheartedly. I personally enjoy that aspect but some people might not. Chaining is in no way necessary to beat the game, though, if you're good enough at dodging. Ignoring the chaining completely, the game is quite playable without memorization and I don't think it is in any way unfair.

Kengou's dead right. I agree 100%. There's two games in there; survival and scoring. And if a shmup is only about memory, thats just it's dynamic. Different courses for different horses I guess

[tviks]

Gradius II Arcade's Gun Wall restart point comes to mind... the one that parks your factory-standard Vic in the middle of Ceiling Tile Hell. Particularly if you're on the left-middle side of the screen when the boss fight starts, in which case you'll get instant-killed by the GW core as it flies in. Not a cheap game overall by any means, but unless I'm missing something there's no way out of that checkpoint.

There is always a way out of every checkpoint in any Gradius.

[captain ahar]

zing zing zap was mentioned on some other thread. certainly earned the right to pop up here as well.

[ROBOTRON]

I died many a cheap death on "Last Hope" too.

[Kaede]

The Dreamcast has nearly been thrown out the window on more than one occasion whilst playing Under Defeat. Fucking point blanking helicopters.

[P_HAT]

Fucking point blanking helicopters.

And big, big, big hitbox

[Kaede]

Fucking point blanking helicopters.

And big, big, big hitbox

And shitty stage three boss.



I still love the game though.