What do you want from a shmup in 2007?

Kron · Post by **Kron** » Fri Apr 13, 2007 1:23 pm

Just thought it might be interesting to see what people want/expect from the genre.

rockaroller · Post by **rockaroller** » Fri Apr 13, 2007 1:28 pm

- Graphics/sound compatible with today standards
- More well-balanced dificulty
- Innovative gameplay mechanics (but not too innovative)

Just what I think will be the "standard" expectations.

EDIT: typo fixed.

neorichieb1971 · Post by **neorichieb1971** » Fri Apr 13, 2007 1:39 pm

A cave port done right.
Something with a disco beat soundtrack
A shmup that has unlockable levels based on your progress
A shmup which has unique characters for different levels
A shmup that shouts idiocy like "BOOOOM their not gonna like that one" when you drop a bomb.

Just simple stuff like that.

DJ Incompetent · Post by **DJ Incompetent** » Fri Apr 13, 2007 1:40 pm

-A insanely polished engine with future stage downloads via microtransactions released on a regular basis.

-Excess players can pick up any extra controllers at anytime and signon or off [Secret of Mana] to assist the Player 1 pilot by aiming and firing supplemental minigame-based weapons or flying infinite-lives, timed-respawning mini support ships. Game ends only when player 1 dies.

-A decent story [Silpheed] with (meaningful) in-game wingman radio chatter (that isn't captioned) [Silpheed/Star Fox]. Key plot points unfolding mid-stage. If a player misses it, who cares...player will be replaying for 1CC anyway. I wouldn't mind piecing together a cryptic in-game story while refining my skills.

-Not dumbing down any STG mechanics already done but refining a whole new game for a wide array of difficulty levels with totally different rule-sets. Some rank-based, others suicide-bullet-based, etc. Honest developer attempts to build on everything that has been done. Cave's scoring systems + Sexy Parodius' "show what killed you" + Ikaruga's bullet color absorbing + Compile's giant array of subweapons + Raizing Scoring depth & hidden bosses + Psikyo's spirit-crushing loop 2 + G.Rev's Beams, Capturing, & Countering, + etc...

-CUSTOM SOUNDTRACKS

Pirate1019 · Post by **Pirate1019** » Fri Apr 13, 2007 1:43 pm

DJ Incompetent wrote:Stuff

Thought this through have you?

DJ Incompetent · Post by **DJ Incompetent** » Fri Apr 13, 2007 1:49 pm

Pirate1019 wrote:
DJ Incompetent wrote:Stuff
Thought this through have you?

For ages.

If I got a team together...

Fuck, I should just write, p-shop, and publish my concept..

it290 · Post by **it290** » Fri Apr 13, 2007 3:13 pm

Less reliance on gimmicks.

Fighter17 · Post by **Fighter17** » Fri Apr 13, 2007 3:19 pm

Ketsui on something for once.

Michaelm · Post by **Michaelm** » Fri Apr 13, 2007 3:27 pm

Delivered with a cab

Gungriffon Geona · Post by **Gungriffon Geona** » Fri Apr 13, 2007 4:01 pm

it290 wrote:Less reliance on gimmicks.

I don't think that one will be happening for a loooooooooong time.

Nuke · Post by **Nuke** » Fri Apr 13, 2007 4:21 pm

A shmup that ROCKS! And I'm talking Lords of thunder/Musha Aleste thrash metal-ish manic mayhem! With a healthy dose of bio-gigerish enviroments and kick-ass mechas and powerups that destroy the whole cities!

Blade · Post by **Blade** » Fri Apr 13, 2007 4:38 pm

Something that can Tate left, right, up, down, etc etc....I'm tired of the problems generated by Ikaruga!!!

SFKhoa · Post by **SFKhoa** » Fri Apr 13, 2007 6:21 pm

More shmup RPGs, damnit.

iatneH · Post by **iatneH** » Fri Apr 13, 2007 6:45 pm

The exact same stuff we got in shooters from 1997.

Pirate1019 · Post by **Pirate1019** » Fri Apr 13, 2007 7:32 pm

DJ Incompetent wrote:
Pirate1019 wrote:
DJ Incompetent wrote:Stuff
Thought this through have you?
For ages.

If I got a team together...[/size]

Oh, Oh! Pick me! I agree with pretty much every idea you had plus one more thing:

Treasure's overelaborate boss explosions.

Nuke · Post by **Nuke** » Fri Apr 13, 2007 7:39 pm

Overly dramatic boss explotions that shatter everything around them and damage/throw away your ship if it's in the heart of them.
Physics people, physics!

popawell · Post by **popawell** » Fri Apr 13, 2007 8:49 pm

Camera changes from side view to top view and to back view with everything else in between during a level. WITH the game dynamics of a shmup!

SFKhoa · Post by **SFKhoa** » Fri Apr 13, 2007 8:53 pm

popawell wrote:Camera changes from side view to top view and to back view with everything else in between during a level. WITH the game dynamics of a shmup!

I miss Philosoma.

ARCADIA · Post by **ARCADIA** » Fri Apr 13, 2007 9:00 pm

More 2D Shmups with net play feature, more Co-op mode than VS mode

Ceph · Post by **Ceph** » Fri Apr 13, 2007 9:07 pm

How about a vertical shmup that has multiple layers like foreground and background that you can switch to (imagine cool camera zooms); could be multi-player as well.

Nuke · Post by **Nuke** » Fri Apr 13, 2007 9:37 pm

More insain power-ups and transformations. It's one aspect I miss from early to mid 1980's shmups.

stuntman · Post by **stuntman** » Fri Apr 13, 2007 10:26 pm

Another release for the Dreamcast, but one that really shows this console was ahead of its time. I'd settle for an Under Defeat sequel.

UnscathedFlyingObject · Fri Apr 13, 2007 11:00 pm

How about a good 'ole yoko shmup?

Post by **BulletMagnet** » Fri Apr 13, 2007 11:04 pm

Ceph wrote:How about a vertical shmup that has multiple layers like foreground and background that you can switch to (imagine cool camera zooms); could be multi-player as well.

Cue the Wrath of Rob!

Rob · Post by **Rob** » Fri Apr 13, 2007 11:21 pm

rockaroller wrote: - Innovative gameplay mechanics

Either this or more somewhat old timey throwbacks like Gradius V. Plain dodge and shoot 16-bit style side-scrollers. Getting tired of elaborate scoring systems when the gimmick is not that interesting (Trigger Heart Exelica).

Cue the Wrath of Rob!

And I cue nasty-tooth the dinosaur.

rockaroller · Post by **rockaroller** » Fri Apr 13, 2007 11:28 pm

ARCADIA wrote:More 2D Shmups with net play feature, more Co-op mode than VS mode

Oh yeah, that would be really nice. I'd really like to have someone to play with.

Dandy J · Post by **Dandy J** » Sat Apr 14, 2007 12:02 am

ketsui or espgaluda 2

Nuke · Post by **Nuke** » Sat Apr 14, 2007 12:45 am

Dandy J wrote:ketsui or espgaluda 2

Scrap that!

Ketsuigaluda!!!!!

LSU · Post by **LSU** » Sat Apr 14, 2007 1:58 am

Something that plays just a little bit different every time. I love memorizers as much as the next guy and I admit this is usually an integral part of the whole shmup experience, but this would be just for something a little different, for a change...

Enemies with some degree of A.I. that don't just move / shoot in predifined patterns would be cool. Bosses that remember your previous attacks from past plays and try to defend themselves accordingly. I'm thinking at the very least, something like the 'slightly different each time' experience of Defender in a fixed-scrolling shmup presentation - or maybe at the most, something like the boss situation 'Undo' from Radiant Silvergun but instead of simply sitting in the center and attacking in pre-defined patterns, uses a form of A.I. to use his scenery for cover in adaptive ways, according to how the player likes to fight him. (More like the movements the player makes in order to fight the boss, actually.) Even maybe a boss that could come up with their own bullet patterns, or adapt the types of weapons they carry over time, or steal tactics from the player and use them back against them.

This could definitely potentially make it less traditionally 'shmup like' and move the game slightly more into borderliner territory, but if it's done carefully I think it'd be something interesting and different, at least.

icepick · Post by **icepick** » Sat Apr 14, 2007 3:41 am

LSU, I can't help but imagine that the type of game that you described would drive you up the wall at some point. It's definitely an interesting idea, but I have this imagine in my head of after playing the game on a console for a certain amount of time, the "A.I." has gotten to the point where you start off in a level, and this crazy red ship comes out of nowhere to point-blank you with this big pulse shotgun, and then this silver one pegs you in the back right after you get your next ship, and then the next enemy uses the forward-thinking player's "precognition bomb" technique to finish the job.

This is all considering that the game was developed with a console edition in mind... Imagine playing the game in the arcade, after a number of different (some highly skilled) players have had their try. People would unplug the machine themselves to get it to reset.

(That's all worst-case scenario, but I think that strategies against bosses are an integral part of the experience; Figuring out what works for survival, figuring out what works for score; If they learned your attack methods between sessions and compensated, I could imagine it going very bad very fast.)

There are some very well-done doujin games that feature randomly-generated attack patterns, and they're interesting, but scripted enemy sequences is part of the developers' presentation in a way. I absolutely don't mean to harp on your desire for a game like the one that you described, but these are the things that come to mind. It's nontheless a nice idea.

Net play seems like it would have a huge problem with latency, but I've never tried it, so maybe it works out.

As for what I want in a shmup for 2007... I was going to say "a home port," but then I noticed that the question is for the genre itself. The topic seems similar to the "shmup theme" topic, which I have a reply for, but in this one I'll say... a yoko or hori would be nice, even though Otomedius is making the rounds. (I suppose that the lack of hori these days is to make for the prevalence way back when, but still.)

I haven't seen enough of the shmups that already exist to want much from the ones that surface this year, but if I had to base wishes off of my current experience... nope, that's it. I was going to say something about depth of gameplay, scoring, audio, visuals and story, but those all seem to be on a nice curve (albeit not necessarily balanced). I'm happy.

Nuke: