Treasure interview, new shmup

[sideshow]

Yes, Treasure has a reputation for making unbelievable games so I'm sure there newest offering wont disappoint. We might not hear an anouncment till 2008 or later.

[jp]

Please. Don't jinx it.

I was about to say that. When we mention "Treasure" and "shmup" we refer to RSG, Ikaruga and Gradius V, but Silpheed wasn´t exactly a masterpiece. So while Treasure made very outstanding, top-quality games, there are a lot of mediocre games in their history. That doesn´t mean I don´t expect the best

To be fair, while Treasure made some so-so games, none of them were Hiroshi Iuchi/Atsutomo Nakagawa productions. Those two worked on RSG, Ikaruge, Gradius V, and Sin and Punishment. They had not a thing to do with Silpheed (or Bangai-O, for that matter) and their track record is flawless.

So seeing as this is an Iuchi/Nakagawa game, I see no place for pessimism

So Frog, getting a 360 now?

[Arznei]

Great news, shame about the lack of Wii support though. I don't know WHY they are choosing the 360. Let's look at some facts:

Xbox 360's dpad sucks cocks.
The 360 isn't popular in japan.

Ok.. now how are they going to pull this off?

[BAD]

Can't wait to finally get a completely new shooter on the XB360! Project Sylpheed was trash. It also says that they will stick with the XB360 for future projects, and that's also good. I hope they create a whole new generation of killer titles on it.

As far as the XB360 in Japan, it is gaining popularity. Since the releases of Lost Planet, Dead Rising, Blue Dragon, and Senkou No Ronde Rev. X, sales have increased. It's not as "unpopular" and "unaccepted" as people think...

[Macaw]

As far as the XB360 in Japan, it is gaining popularity. Since the releases of Lost Planet, Dead Rising, Blue Dragon, and Senkou No Ronde Rev. X, sales have increased. It's not as "unpopular" and "unaccepted" as people think...

Actualy after seeing recent sales figures the 360 is even more unpopular in Japan than I thought.

[Necronom]

Actualy after seeing recent sales figures the 360 is even more unpopular in Japan than I thought.

Who cares about Japan if you're on the best way to dominate (or being at least a very serious number 2...) the rest of the territories? I'm pretty sure that Treasure is aiming for a worldwide release with this one. Geometry Wars proved that arcade style shooters do sell on the 360 and not only in Japan. The question of course is whether such a title can sell outside of XBLA...that remains to be seen.
And oh yeah, I almost forgot. My speculations why they chose the 360 for this project:

1. Easy and comfortable to develop for
2. Some FPS players might want to check out something different but not too different...happened with Geometry Wars, see text above
3. They would probably prefer the Wii but have no experience with the new controller so while they're doing some experimenting for the Wii project why not earning some money with a solid 360 project?

I really enjoyed Ikaruga on my DC and I'm probably going to buy a 360 in the near future. I bet that I'm not the only one

[DJ Incompetent]

I wonder if their achievement points would be extremely meaningful. Like actually rewarding a 1CC & 1LC for various modes......or just playing any number of hours without credit feeding. That would look good on the Live-nets.

[dai jou bu]

I really enjoyed Ikaruga on my DC and I'm probably going to buy a 360 in the near future. I bet that I'm not the only one

I was immediately sold on Senko no Ronde, and my hunch with Treasure developing a shmup for the system because of G.Rev's involvement turned out to be correct after all.

[Arvandor]

Isn't Senko no Ronde jp only though? Is it possible to hack a 360 for imports yet, or would you have to go multi-console to play US and JP games?

[Stormwatch]

I can remember when everyone was going bonkers over Silpheed's 3D graphics on the SegaCD -- which were top notch for that system.

Except the backgrounds were actually pre-rendered videos...

[SamIAm]

Except the backgrounds were actually pre-rendered videos...

Not to be smug about it or anything, but I find it to be many times more likely that the SegaCD's two 16-bit processors are running a rudimentary 3D engine than it is that they are running a game engine AND displaying a video in the background with no compression artifacts. The fact that the access light isn't always on while running the game reinforces my hunch.

Anyhow, Radiant Silvergun is still my single favorite shmup. I'll be following this project very closely, and I hope it turns out for the best.

[chtimi-CLA]

no mention of an arcade version?

[Minzoku]

You start off with 999999999990 points. You lose points for every enemy you kill.

WIN

[Frogacuda]

Isn't Senko no Ronde jp only though? Is it possible to hack a 360 for imports yet, or would you have to go multi-console to play US and JP games?

Yeah, there's a hack to play copies, and I think you can region mod burns of games. It involves flashing the DVD drive's BIOS

[Frogacuda]

Except the backgrounds were actually pre-rendered videos...

Not to be smug about it or anything, but I find it to be many times more likely that the SegaCD's two 16-bit processors are running a rudimentary 3D engine than it is that they are running a game engine AND displaying a video in the background with no compression artifacts. The fact that the access light isn't always on while running the game reinforces my hunch.

Actually the truth is somewhere in between. It used pre-calculated vectors streamed off the CD. It is rendering the polygons in realtime, but not calculating the 3D behind them. It's more like how Flashback's cutscenes work.

[jp]

You start off with 999999999990 points. You lose points for every enemy you kill.

WIN

You know, I was actually thinking about this scoring system earlier and its primary flaw:
If you died in level 1 without killing anything you would have a max score.

But, I found a solution.

Put in a timer that begins at 999999999990 which decreases by 10 in a set increment of time (pending on how long the game is, so that if you 1CC the game the timer is at 0). But the timer would go up during boss fights to prevent milking (you do not lose points for killing bosses). Also, if you die the timer goes up some number of time, and every time you fire a bullet the timer stops for a few seconds (unless its a boss fight).

So, if you lose a credit, your score is:
999999999990 - points from enemies killed - timer value at time of death.

Of course, if the score was a negative number then you could multiply the score by -1. That way, if people want to play the game via killing enemies in the traditional sense, then there will be a score for them as well. Though the true high scores would stem from no enemies killed and no miss runs.

My reason behind the timer pausing while firing is that, otherwise, the scores would get really funky for players who were GOOD at playing in the traditional sense. So I needed to find a way to keep the number negative as they progressed in the game so that the number didn't eventually become positive and then become really small in the middle of the game. So even if you managed to keep the timer maxed, you would still be losing points from killing enemies and thus would have a lower score than a no shots/no miss run.

Though someone who shoots and misses every enemy and keeps the timer maxed AND the primary score maxed would wind up with a score of 0. Which I guess an all Clear with 0 would be an impressive thing to show off.

And give me a break, I thought up half of this while I was posting this. Damn 490 math class.

[J-Manic]

1UP: But it's at least still a top-down shooter, right?
MM: Yeah. We'll use really great 3D graphics but it will retain the 2D gameplay people love.

1UP: So is this the same team that did Ikaruga?
MM: Yes, the same director and team.

That's all I need to know. Can't wait!!!!!

[zakk]

So the Ikaruga team is doing a 360 game.

So...what about arcade games? I wonder what's going on there, if anything.

[SamIAm]

Actually the truth is somewhere in between. It used pre-calculated vectors streamed off the CD. It is rendering the polygons in realtime, but not calculating the 3D behind them. It's more like how Flashback's cutscenes work.

That makes good sense to me. It explains why, at least in the parts of the game I have seen, there was never anything like a really massive, graphically complex boss, or anything where a lot of polygons moved in response to your playing. Thanks for clearing that up!

[jpj]

yeah, thank god we sorted that out...... meanwhile.

for chtimi, last i heard the arcade division for treasure (iuchi/nakagawa/etc) were making games for taito type x. most people don't realise gradius v was actually an arcade game too i hope for an arcade release, if only because a home console-only game would not get as much attention from the japanese players. soul calibur 3 suffered that fate from being released on console first, then arcade .

[JBC]

I would love to see Gradius V get at least a limited arcade release with it's own cab. A bit late for that of course, but it would be nice. Maybe that can be a part of next summer's gaming project. I can build my own fake ass Gradius V cab with a PS2 inside it

[Kaede]

I would love to see Gradius V get at least a limited arcade release with it's own cab. A bit late for that of course, but it would be nice. Maybe that can be a part of next summer's gaming project. I can build my own fake ass Gradius V cab with a PS2 inside it

Plenty of people hook up DC's to their Japanese candy cabs so why not? I think that would be kinda cool.

[Stormowl]

Great news, shame about the lack of Wii support though. I don't know WHY they are choosing the 360. Let's look at some facts:

Xbox 360's dpad sucks cocks.
The 360 isn't popular in japan.

Ok.. now how are they going to pull this off?

Maegewa has said before that Treasure has many more fans overseas than in Japan...perhaps this is also why they "pulling this off" and making the game on the 360.

either way this is good news and i'm looking forward to seeing what they have up their sleeves.

[JBC]

My demand is becoming increasingly frothulant here.

(sry, can't get enough of that)

[Strider77]

Xbox 360's dpad sucks cocks.
The 360 isn't popular in japan.

Ok.. now how are they going to pull this off?

A: make a game uses the analouge stick
B: who cares, it is here and as long as the game gets released.... besides after a point it's not like the saturn was the most popular, granted not anywhere as dismal as the 360 though.

[professor ganson]

Perhaps a decent dpad will emerge in the coming year. I read somewhere that Microsoft is thinking of releasing something similar to Wii's classic controller. But yeah, another option is to have analogue gameplay. It works for Geometry Wars and Panzer Dragoon (not that the latter is 2D gameplay).

One further thing: if this gets released in the US will Microsoft be ok with having a vertical display option? They won't want to be held responsible for what people might do to their HDTVs.

[GaijinPunch]

Maegewa has said before that Treasure has many more fans overseas than in Japan...perhaps this is also why they "pulling this off" and making the game on the 360.

I'm fairly certain he never said that. It was more like, "Treasure wouldn't be where they are had it not been for their overseas fans." Just b/c Treasure is a semi-recognizable name in the west, doesn't mean they're dead in Japan.

[Stormowl]

Maegewa has said before that Treasure has many more fans overseas than in Japan...perhaps this is also why they "pulling this off" and making the game on the 360.

I'm fairly certain he never said that. It was more like, "Treasure wouldn't be where they are had it not been for their overseas fans." Just b/c Treasure is a semi-recognizable name in the west, doesn't mean they're dead in Japan.

SSM: Finally, do you have any message for your English fans?
MM: If you consider Treasure's users then you have to say that we are more popular abroad then we are in Japan. Certainly, our overseas sales have really helped to support the company. We wouldn't be where we are to day without all your readers' help, so I'd like to say a big thank you and hope that they'll continue to support us in the future as well!

http://www.emuxhaven.net/~silver/SS%20M ... egawa.html

an old article, but it's there nonetheless...should have linked it first post.

[Minzoku]

You start off with 999999999990 points. You lose points for every enemy you kill.

WIN

You know, I was actually thinking about this scoring system earlier and its primary flaw:
If you died in level 1 without killing anything you would have a max score.

But, I found a solution.

Put in a timer that begins at 999999999990 which decreases by 10 in a set increment of time (pending on how long the game is, so that if you 1CC the game the timer is at 0). But the timer would go up during boss fights to prevent milking (you do not lose points for killing bosses). Also, if you die the timer goes up some number of time, and every time you fire a bullet the timer stops for a few seconds (unless its a boss fight).

So, if you lose a credit, your score is:
999999999990 - points from enemies killed - timer value at time of death.

Of course, if the score was a negative number then you could multiply the score by -1. That way, if people want to play the game via killing enemies in the traditional sense, then there will be a score for them as well. Though the true high scores would stem from no enemies killed and no miss runs.

My reason behind the timer pausing while firing is that, otherwise, the scores would get really funky for players who were GOOD at playing in the traditional sense. So I needed to find a way to keep the number negative as they progressed in the game so that the number didn't eventually become positive and then become really small in the middle of the game. So even if you managed to keep the timer maxed, you would still be losing points from killing enemies and thus would have a lower score than a no shots/no miss run.

Though someone who shoots and misses every enemy and keeps the timer maxed AND the primary score maxed would wind up with a score of 0. Which I guess an all Clear with 0 would be an impressive thing to show off.

And give me a break, I thought up half of this while I was posting this. Damn 490 math class.

Oh, I was thinking you meant golf or Hearts scoring, that the lowest score wins.

[system11]

Isn't Senko no Ronde jp only though? Is it possible to hack a 360 for imports yet, or would you have to go multi-console to play US and JP games?

Yeah, there's a hack to play copies, and I think you can region mod burns of games. It involves flashing the DVD drive's BIOS

This is incorrect. You can flash the firmware and play copies, this is true - but unless the game is unregioned, or the right region for your console, you will not be running it. All Japanese releases are region coded for some reason. I'd guess this is a decision on the part of Microsoft Japan. The 360 code protection is currently unbroken - and despite their slip-up on the DVD drive (half by design and half by carelessness if you read up on it), it may never be within the consoles shelf life.

As for why not on the Wii?

Don't even start that, it's obvious that they're going to shoot for high res, and a Wii isn't doing that anytime soon. The Wii is even aimed specifically at non hardcore gamers, which is entirely the wrong crowd. PS3 would have been the expected platform for me, were it not for the issues currently surrounding that platform. Treasure have often pushed the graphical envelope, this is nothing new. Allegedly a better 360 pad is in the works for sometime this year - probably at the same time as the rumoured dropping of the Core model (a good thing - pity they didn't do this from day 1 though).