Hori RAP1/2 Questions

[Icarus]

Before you say it, I have used the Search function and have read through all the informative threads on this particular stick. I still have a few questions for those who have used one or both of these Hori sticks.

1) How sensitive is the default stick? Will it move the ship/character on screen with the lightest feather touch or will I have to really throw the stick to get some kind of response?

2) Ditto for the buttons? Are they responsive to light touches or do they need to be fully depressed?

3) I tend to shy away from using a stick of smaller sizes for fear of wrist pains on prolonged sessions (and I can play for hours). Which one of the two HRAPs is the most comfortable/ergonomic?

4) Is this thing really big (as in XBOX sized) or quite small (as in the mini PSone sized)? (Strange comparison, but it was the only thing that came to mind. ^_-)

5) I hear that the buttons and stick can be swapped out for other arcade parts. Is it easy to do? Is it snap-off, snap-on, or is there more complicated replacement procedures required (like soldering)?

6) Does the HRAP use a square joystick restictor? Is it easy to change to an octoganal restrictor if required? (Yes I know it was sort of talked about in another thread in Hardware, but a more in-depth explanation would be handy).

7) How good are the autofire settings? Is it just one auto setting or more available? And is it blazingly fast or pedestrian slow? (Mmmmm... Ibara...)

8 ) And a question for those using a HRAP with a PS2>Neo convertor for superguns: What buttons are what on the stick (like X is the A button, Square is the B button and so on)? (And do you think it'd be possible to reconfigure the button layout for superguns by hacking up a PS2 joypad extension cable or some other similar method that doesn't involve actually fucking about with the HRAP internals with a soldering iron?)

Yeah, lots of questions, some probably completely stupid. I'm considering buying one, but need plenty of information before I throw down £60 or more on one of these things. Thanks in advance.

[JJG]

Thanks for asking these questions 'cause I'm interested too, I have an HRAP 2 coming in the mail.

[EOJ]

1) How sensitive is the default stick? Will it move the ship/character on screen with the lightest feather touch or will I have to really throw the stick to get some kind of response?

The default stick is a Sanwa and it's very good indeed. I never used a stick before (always a pad man prior) but after nearly 3 months with mine I've found it's far easier to play shmups with my Sanwa stick than on a joypad. Also nice to not have calluses on my thumbs anymore.

2) Ditto for the buttons? Are they responsive to light touches or do they need to be fully depressed?

The stock Hori buttons are average. I swapped mine out with Sanwas, and they're great. I prefer Sanwa buttons to Seimitsu buttons as the Sanwas have a lighter touch. You can put Seimitsu in if you want though.

3) I tend to shy away from using a stick of smaller sizes for fear of wrist pains on prolonged sessions (and I can play for hours). Which one of the two HRAPs is the most comfortable/ergonomic?

I have a HRAP 1 (the original one with the mirror top). I play with the right 6 buttons, and I have the leftmost two buttons removed with black caps in place. Feels very close to a Japanese cab.

4) Is this thing really big (as in XBOX sized) or quite small (as in the mini PSone sized)? (Strange comparison, but it was the only thing that came to mind. ^_-)

Pretty big, but I like it because it's sturdy. I play with it on a platform close to the floor. It's not comfortable to play on your lap. I can post pics if you'd like.

5) I hear that the buttons and stick can be swapped out for other arcade parts. Is it easy to do? Is it snap-off, snap-on, or is there more complicated replacement procedures required (like soldering)?

Yes, this is true and it's easy as pie. I never did anything like this before, but it takes about 5 minutes to unscrew everything and then you just snap on or off the button connectors. I use snap-ins as they are easier to put in than screw-ins. The original mirror face HRAP 1 is easier to mod than the later matte finish HRAP 1 (and you apparently can't put a Seimitsu stick in the latter while you can in the former). The HRAP 2 is just as easy to mod the buttons. Just pull out the connectors, pop out the buttons, put in the new ones, and you're done. No solder needed.

6) Does the HRAP use a square joystick restictor? Is it easy to change to an octoganal restrictor if required? (Yes I know it was sort of talked about in another thread in Hardware, but a more in-depth explanation would be handy).

Yes, it uses a square resistrictor plate. I have an octagonal plate too, and I tried it, but it's AWFUL for shmups. You do not want to be using that, it makes the horizontal 'throw' about 50% longer as well. Really sucks for games that need precision movement. The stock square plate is the only thing any shmup player should be using. And yes, it's very easy to change from a square to octagonal plate, just snap out and snap in.

7) How good are the autofire settings? Is it just one auto setting or more available? And is it blazingly fast or pedestrian slow? (Mmmmm... Ibara...)

You can choose from moderate to fast, I haven't tried it out much though.

8 ) And a question for those using a HRAP with a PS2>Neo convertor for superguns: What buttons are what on the stick (like X is the A button, Square is the B button and so on)? (And do you think it'd be possible to reconfigure the button layout for superguns by hacking up a PS2 joypad extension cable or some other similar method that doesn't involve actually fucking about with the HRAP internals with a soldering iron?)

I have this exact setup. All you do is physically move the button connectors around on the HRAP! I had to just pop them out and reconnect them in a layout that gives me buttons ABC on the top row and D on the bottom left for the supergun. It's great as with all the PS2 shmups you can reconfig the button layout so it's no problem whatsoever.

[Icarus]

The default stick is a Sanwa and it's very good indeed. I never used a stick before (always a pad man prior) but after nearly 3 months with mine I've found it's far easier to play shmups with my Sanwa stick than on a joypad. Also nice to not have calluses on my thumbs anymore.

Is the stick quite sensitive? My main concern is being able to move in precise distances and stick sensitivity to me plays a big part in that. If the stick needs quite a shift before any on-screen reaction occurs I might have to pick up a replacement for the default setup.

The stock Hori buttons are average. I swapped mine out with Sanwas, and they're great. I prefer Sanwa buttons to Seimitsu buttons as the Sanwas have a lighter touch. You can put Seimitsu in if you want though.

I'm a bit of a noob when it comes to arcade parts, as you've probably guessed. Are the default ones that bad? Are all replacement arcade buttons different in pressure sensitivity?

I have a HRAP 1 (the original one with the mirror top). I play with the right 6 buttons, and I have the leftmost two buttons removed with black caps in place. Feels very close to a Japanese cab.

That sounds like a pretty good idea. Does the HRAP come with the blocker caps or would I have to pick them up from somewhere?

Pretty big, but I like it because it's sturdy. I play with it on a platform close to the floor. It's not comfortable to play on your lap. I can post pics if you'd like.

Big is good. ^_^
I prefer big sticks as they are a bit more comfortable. As long as it isn't the size of an X-Arcade (not likely I know) then I'm all for it.

Yes, this is true and it's easy as pie. I never did anything like this before, but it takes about 5 minutes to unscrew everything and then you just snap on or off the button connectors. I use snap-ins as they are easier to put in than screw-ins. The original mirror face HRAP 1 is easier to mod than the later matte finish HRAP 1 (and you apparently can't put a Seimitsu stick in the latter while you can in the former). The HRAP 2 is just as easy to mod the buttons. Just pull out the connectors, pop out the buttons, put in the new ones, and you're done. No solder needed.

Looks like I'll have to avoid that newer version HRAP1.

Is this the one that you have?

Yes, it uses a square resistrictor plate. I have an octagonal plate too, and I tried it, but it's AWFUL for shmups. You do not want to be using that, it makes the horizontal 'throw' about 50% longer as well. Really sucks for games that need precision movement. The stock square plate is the only thing any shmup player should be using. And yes, it's very easy to change from a square to octagonal plate, just snap out and snap in.

Okay, thanks for clarifying that. When the arcades were still around up here I can remember the sticks having both square and octoganal restrictors on them on different cabs, and while I could never see much difference in my play with either, I think the square ones are more comfortable. There was definitely a square restrictor in my Goliath cab a while back.

You can choose from moderate to fast, I haven't tried it out much though.

You have Ibara, might as well test it out. ^_-
If you can get an autofire speed close to the speed of the "Hold A" Shot in Arrange Mode, then that'll definitely interest me. Blazingly fast autofire for some shootemups is what I like. Having it as a selectable switch on a stick is a bonus.

I have this exact setup. All you do is physically move the button connectors around on the HRAP! I had to just pop them out and reconnect them in a layout that gives me buttons ABC on the top row and D on the bottom left for the supergun. It's great as with all the PS2 shmups you can reconfig the button layout so it's no problem whatsoever.

I kind of suspected that you could do that since the buttons could be popped in and out, but that pretty much seals the deal for me.

Thanks for answering the questions, twe. Expert salesman. ^_-

[Pirate1019]

Great, now I'm interested. Can somebody post a link to where I could get one of these?

[Icarus]

Great, now I'm interested. Can somebody post a link to where I could get one of these?

Play-Asia has them for about $80. I have my eyes on YAJ, as there's one on there for about 4000Y (about £25/$45).

[Pirate1019]

Oh. I thought it was a stick for the PC. Since I don't own a PS2 I might just grab this instead.

[Icarus]

Oh. I thought it was a stick for the PC. Since I don't own a PS2 I might just grab this instead.

I'm using a Saturn style USB pad at the moment. I also have a PS2>PC USB convertor lying around as well, which I can use with the stick once I get it.
The last thing to track down is a PS2>Saturn adaptor. -_-;;

[Pirate1019]

I'll really have to look into a setup like that one of these days. When I have more money available I should hunt around for a Saturn-esque pad. Everybody says they're awesome. I love how everybody seems to have some sort of amazing gamepad/arcadestick and I shmup with this.

[EOJ]

Is the stick quite sensitive? My main concern is being able to move in precise distances and stick sensitivity to me plays a big part in that. If the stick needs quite a shift before any on-screen reaction occurs I might have to pick up a replacement for the default setup.

The stick is a Sanwa JLF-TP-8Y, which is standard in most Japanese cabs. The control is extremely precise. Some prefer the Seimitsu LS-32 stick,
and you can put this in a HRAP 1 (v.1) and HRAP 2, but not in a HRAP 1 (v.2, with the non-mirror top).

I'm a bit of a noob when it comes to arcade parts, as you've probably guessed. Are the default ones that bad? Are all replacement arcade buttons different in pressure sensitivity?

There is a noticable difference between the stock buttons and Sanwa replacement buttons. The stock ones have a longer distance before registering, and they just don't feel quite the same (hard to explain, you have to experience it yourself). It's worth it to spend the extra few dollars for quality Sanwa (or Seimitsu) buttons. They can be had for $2-3 each.

That sounds like a pretty good idea. Does the HRAP come with the blocker caps or would I have to pick them up from somewhere?

You'll have to buy the blocker caps. They sell them at the same online places that sell the buttons. They're about a dollar each I believe. Here's a picture of my hori RAP:



I also replaced the stock start and select buttons with Sanwas, but that's not really necessary unless you want it to be truly 'all sanwa'. Only costs a couple extra bucks though.

Big is good. ^_^
I prefer big sticks as they are a bit more comfortable. As long as it isn't the size of an X-Arcade (not likely I know) then I'm all for it.

Yeah, it's nice and big and sturdy but not too big. Just right. Feels like quality through and through, and the easy swapability of parts makes it similar to an arcade cab in terms of control hardware maintenence.

Looks like I'll have to avoid that newer version HRAP1.

Is this the one that you have?

That looks like the mirror top one, so yes. The matte finish top looks pretty much the same as the HRAP 2.

You have Ibara, might as well test it out. ^_-
If you can get an autofire speed close to the speed of the "Hold A" Shot in Arrange Mode, then that'll definitely interest me. Blazingly fast autofire for some shootemups is what I like. Having it as a selectable switch on a stick is a bonus.

I believe it's 12hz for the moderate setting and 23Hz for the fastest setting. IIRC that's what's posted on Hori Japan's site. I'll have to test it out with Ibara.

Thanks for answering the questions, twe. Expert salesman. ^_-

No problem, I was in a similar situation a few months ago when I was hunting for a versatile, high quality arcade stick, so I know how hard it can be to sort out all the info when you're new at it.

[JJG]

What's the real difference between Sanwa and Semitsu buttons, or is it just preferrence or brand loyalty?

[Damocles]

Do the HRAPs use the Sanwa mounting plate, or does the base mount directly to the enclosure? I ask because, assuming there's enough bottom room, you could mount an Ultimarc T-Stik in those puppies for precise shmup action.

[destructor]

What's the real difference between Sanwa and Semitsu buttons, or is it just preferrence or brand loyalty?

It depend from button model.

[Daigohji]

Is the stick quite sensitive? My main concern is being able to move in precise distances and stick sensitivity to me plays a big part in that. If the stick needs quite a shift before any on-screen reaction occurs I might have to pick up a replacement for the default setup.

The stock Sanwa JLF is a very sensitive and accurate stick. It's got a nice soft spring for smooth motions. One thing you'll notice is that the dead zone is about 50% of the way to the restrictor plate, but that's not a major issue since you're only tilting a fairly small angle to get it all the way to the plate.

I'm a bit of a noob when it comes to arcade parts, as you've probably guessed. Are the default ones that bad? Are all replacement arcade buttons different in pressure sensitivity?

The stock Horis are fine, for the most part. However, on my HRAP I found that one of the buttons tended to stick, which I guess was just a quality control issue with that unit. I've since replaced all the buttons with Seimitsus, both to get rid of that faulty button and because I don't like the bright green colour scheme . Most of the buttons I got are the PS-14-GN, which is Seimitsu's basic model. They feel a lot like the Horis, but with a slightly smoother action. Two of the buttons are PS-14-GXNs though, which are Seimitsu's premium action buttons. They look similar, but you can really feel the difference in quality. The GXNs have a much smoother spring action and an audiable click when the microswitch engages (not as loud as a joystick switch, though).

Personally, I think screw-ins are better for the HRAP. The stock Hori buttons are snap-ins and have a tendancy to slide in their holes. Screw-ins are a more secure fit as long as you fasten them tightly.

I have a HRAP 1 (the original one with the mirror top). I play with the right 6 buttons, and I have the leftmost two buttons removed with black caps in place. Feels very close to a Japanese cab.

That sounds like a pretty good idea. Does the HRAP come with the blocker caps or would I have to pick them up from somewhere?

I don't understand why so many people do this. I find the L2 button very useful in some games since I can comforably rest the side of my thumb on it. For example, in Psyvariar 2: Ultimate Final I use [] for fire, /\ for roll and L2 for bomb. This is handy since you need to hold roll most of the time. In Soulcalibur II I use [], /\ and R1 for attacks and L2 for blocking.

Big is good. ^_^
I prefer big sticks as they are a bit more comfortable. As long as it isn't the size of an X-Arcade (not likely I know) then I'm all for it.

It's massive. The HRAP is bigger and heavier than an original model PS2 (the HRAP shipping box dwarfs a PS2 box). I find it comfortable to use on my lap, and the weight means it doesn't slip around. Just make sure you always handle the thing with both hands; it could easily break your foot if you drop it.

Yes, this is true and it's easy as pie. I never did anything like this before, but it takes about 5 minutes to unscrew everything and then you just snap on or off the button connectors. I use snap-ins as they are easier to put in than screw-ins. The original mirror face HRAP 1 is easier to mod than the later matte finish HRAP 1 (and you apparently can't put a Seimitsu stick in the latter while you can in the former). The HRAP 2 is just as easy to mod the buttons. Just pull out the connectors, pop out the buttons, put in the new ones, and you're done. No solder needed.

Looks like I'll have to avoid that newer version HRAP1.

I have the new HRAP 1. It's true that you can't fit a Seimitsu LS-32 to it, but the buttons aren't that hard to switch over. They have quick disconnects just like the old model, but they're crimped tighter than the old type, so you need to use a flathead screwdriver to prise them off and push them onto the new buttons.

Is this the one that you have?

I notice that the owner of that stick hasn't taken the plastic wrap off. The main plate of the HRAP is shipped with a thin protective film over it that quickly starts to peel, as you see there. You'll need a craft knife to remove it fully though, since it's laid under the button rims and fixing screws. The alternative is if you open the HRAP up to replace the buttons, in which case you'll have removed the screws and can just peel the transparent plastic right off.

[EOJ]

Personally, I think screw-ins are better for the HRAP. The stock Hori buttons are snap-ins and have a tendancy to slide in their holes. Screw-ins are a more secure fit as long as you fasten them tightly.

My snap-in Sanwas never slide in their holes. They're tight and well-fitted.
You can use either snap-ins or screw-ins, it doesn't matter really.

I have a HRAP 1 (the original one with the mirror top). I play with the right 6 buttons, and I have the leftmost two buttons removed with black caps in place. Feels very close to a Japanese cab.

That sounds like a pretty good idea. Does the HRAP come with the blocker caps or would I have to pick them up from somewhere?

I don't understand why so many people do this.

I do it because those two buttons on the left just get in the way, and arcade shmup cabs do not have more than 6 buttons aligned in two rows anyway.

[Icarus]

The stock Sanwa JLF is a very sensitive and accurate stick. It's got a nice soft spring for smooth motions. One thing you'll notice is that the dead zone is about 50% of the way to the restrictor plate, but that's not a major issue since you're only tilting a fairly small angle to get it all the way to the plate.

That sounds alright to me. I guess the only way to test it is to plug in a game that requires pixel-precision movements like Mushi Ultra and really give it a workout.

The stock Horis are fine, for the most part. However, on my HRAP I found that one of the buttons tended to stick, which I guess was just a quality control issue with that unit. I've since replaced all the buttons with Seimitsus...

Hmm... button stickiness might be a problem. Could you point me in the direction of somewhere to look at all the different button models (and prices for each)? Going to go and look for potential replacements that have a short depression distance, good springback, maybe a light click on contact, and are sturdy.

(EDIT: I realise that question is like asking someone to "go into a library and find an old book". ^_-)

I don't understand why so many people do this.

I'm very unlikely to play anything other than shmups and maybe a fighting game or two, so removing a couple of buttons is a pretty good idea. At least when they're removed, they won't get in the way, and I'm less likely to press a blocker cap than an inactive button. ^_-

And if I want to play non-shmups that need more buttons, I'll still have joypads available.

It's massive. The HRAP is bigger and heavier than an original model PS2 (the HRAP shipping box dwarfs a PS2 box). I find it comfortable to use on my lap, and the weight means it doesn't slip around. Just make sure you always handle the thing with both hands; it could easily break your foot if you drop it.

Yeah, the size of it is a bit of an issue with regards to buying it, getting it shipped and not getting raped by customs on arrival. Right now I'm leaning on YAJ rather than Play-Asia, as unlike P-A on occasion, Shopping Mall Japan actually mark down the package to avoid customs.

You're in England right? Where'd you get your HRAP from, and how much did it cost to ship?

I notice that the owner of that stick hasn't taken the plastic wrap off. The main plate of the HRAP is shipped with a thin protective film over it that quickly starts to peel, as you see there.

I'll probably keep the plastic thing on the top for a while, as I tend to use things quite a lot once I get them, and avoiding a bit of wear, tear and dirt for a while will be nice.

Hori definitely get a lot of love from shmuppers and fighting game players, their sticks are endlessly talked about on both sets of forums. ^_^ (Still deciding on a RAP1 v1 or RAP2 at the moment...)

[Ganelon]

HRAP2 does not come with the plastic wrap. Everything else is exactly the same as everybody here has described.

Since the L1 and L2 were moved from the left to the right side, you'll probably want to put blockers on them if you intend to get an HRAP2. However, the different button placement also means that your hands will be closer together. The HRAP2's button layout with the rightmost row arching down also fits a straighter wrist, as opposed to the HRAP1, where your wrist generally leans slightly to the right.

Button stickiness seems to be limited to this one case and is not a known issue with HRAPs. Neither are loose cables, which I've heard of only once regarding an HRAP.

[Daigohji]

Hmm... button stickiness might be a problem. Could you point me in the direction of somewhere to look at all the different button models (and prices for each)? Going to go and look for potential replacements that have a short depression distance, good springback, maybe a light click on contact, and are sturdy.

I got my Seimitsu buttons here. They're reliable, but slow because it's not a full scale company. It just seems to be two guys placing bulk orders from Sanwa and Seimitsu, then distributing the parts. They run a constant order update thread in the tech forum over at Shoryuken.com

Yeah, the size of it is a bit of an issue with regards to buying it, getting it shipped and not getting raped by customs on arrival. Right now I'm leaning on YAJ rather than Play-Asia, as unlike P-A on occasion, Shopping Mall Japan actually mark down the package to avoid customs.

You're in England right? Where'd you get your HRAP from, and how much did it cost to ship?

A lot. I ordered from Play-Asia, where courier shipping via UPS cost about $70-80. Despite that it took nearly a week to arrive, and I was charged at the door for VAT, clearance fees, etc, which came to about £35. Including the price of the item, plus shipping and misc. costs, the HRAP ended up costing me about £130.

Don't expect anywhere to mark down the price for a package that size, as it would likely get bounced right back to the sender. They can get away with putting a $10 value for little things like games, but not for a box the size of a PC tower. Also, you can't use budget airmail options for packages weighing over 2kg, so premium couriers are the only option.

[Rastan78]

Icarus, what's up?

Just wanted to bring up a couple points here that might help. Maybe someone can comment on the HRAP and autofire. It will not be a good solution for a game like Ibara and many other shooters unless you can figure out a way to have one A button with auto and one without.

If you get new buttons, I would say to go with Sanwa OBSF-30 snap in buttons. These buttons probably have the lightest touch of anything available. These are standard issue on the newest cabs in Japan. Seimitsu buttons are more old school. Get them if you want to feel a little chunkier button press. Seimitsu snap in buttons are also more prone to spinning in the panel where the Sanwas lock in rock solid.

For joysticks on the other hand the very old school and sturdy feeling Seimitsu LS-32 is the commonly preferred joystick for shmup players in Japan. Check this pic by icycalm of the Mushi Futari loke test machine at Hey arcade. Sanwa buttons w/ LS-32 joystick. All things considered, I think this standard shmup setup would be a good first modded joystick if you decide to go that route.

oxtsu's pics in the first post of his group order thread do a great job of showing the different buttons and what not.

[JJG]

Check ebay for decent prices on HRAP's, I just got my HRAP 2 for $119 shipped.

[Icarus]

Icarus, what's up?

I've decided that I've had enough of using a joypad and having to juggle buttons for games that have or require four or more buttons. ^_-

Just wanted to bring up a couple points here that might help. Maybe someone can comment on the HRAP and autofire. It will not be a good solution for a game like Ibara and many other shooters unless you can figure out a way to have one A button with auto and one without.

For most of the PCBs that I have, just one auto rate will be satisfactory. In the case of Ibara, anything that is faster than the snail-speed default rate will be a godsend to me. And with PS2/MAME, I can set up multiple fire buttons. Got it all sorted.

If you get new buttons, I would say to go with Sanwa OBSF-30 snap in buttons. These buttons probably have the lightest touch of anything available. These are standard issue on the newest cabs in Japan. Seimitsu buttons are more old school. Get them if you want to feel a little chunkier button press. Seimitsu snap in buttons are also more prone to spinning in the panel where the Sanwas lock in rock solid.

That is actually good to know, thanks for telling me that. I do like an extremely light touch, as like the joysticks, sensitivity is important to the way I play. If I have to really hammer and wrench then it's time to replace the equipment.

For joysticks on the other hand the very old school and sturdy feeling Seimitsu LS-32 is the commonly preferred joystick for shmup players in Japan. Check this pic by icycalm of the Mushi Futari loke test machine at Hey arcade. Sanwa buttons w/ LS-32 joystick. All things considered, I think this standard shmup setup would be a good first modded joystick if you decide to go that route.

I've read about the LS-32 on that link that Daigohji posted earlier, and it does say that it has a smaller throw and better springback, which is good. However, if it is indeed impossible to fit the LS-32 into the newer version HRAP1 then it'll be more difficult for me to secure a HRAP as I have to hunt a bit harder to find one of the other two models at a good price. I'd like the choice of being able to fit it if I want/need to, which is why I'm being extremely selective, and also needing to get as much info on these sticks as possible so I can make a better, more informed decision.

oxtsu's pics in the first post of his group order thread do a great job of showing the different buttons and what not.

I've had a look at that. Too many codes and serial numbers. ^_^

If anyone has had experience with the many different button models and can tell the difference between each, please note them down. It'd be helpful not just to me, but to others who wish to mod their sticks and arcade control panels.

Check ebay for decent prices on HRAP's, I just got my HRAP 2 for $119 shipped.

No HRAP2's on evilBay that are available to the UK. One or two on YAJ however. Being English sucks for importing. -_-;;

[Rastan78]

It will not be a good solution for a game like Ibara and many other shooters unless you can figure out a way to have one A button with auto and one without.

For most of the PCBs that I have, just one auto rate will be satisfactory.

You won't need multiple firing rates, but the trick is to have one button with auto and one that is just your standard A button with no auto whatsoever used for charge shots etc. Ibara will be pretty much unplayable without the default A button since you can't lock your options in any direction while holding down autofire.

Even if you only have one A button though, you may be able to toggle on and off auto with an extra finger. Turn auto on, trigger the faster auto rate by holding A for about a half a second. Then you could turn it off and have the auto rate last but still be able to lock the options. (You lose the faster rate again when you die though.) Might also be helpful to start taking piano lessons.

[Icarus]

You won't need multiple firing rates, but the trick is to have one button with auto and one that is just your standard A button with no auto whatsoever used for charge shots etc. Ibara will be pretty much unplayable without the default A button since you can't lock your options in any direction while holding down autofire.

Even if you only have one A button though, you may be able to toggle on and off auto with an extra finger. Turn auto on, trigger the faster auto rate by holding A for about a half a second. Then you could turn it off and have the auto rate last but still be able to lock the options. (You lose the faster rate again when you die though.) Might also be helpful to start taking piano lessons.

I'm aware of the locking Options thing. Thankfully the auto switches are located quite close to the joystick, which could be easily toggled using a little finger. Or if the PS2 version is used, just one button for A and one for A+.

It'll take some getting used to, but I've been joypadding with five or more buttons on some games, so an unusual control setup is nothing new to me. ^_-

You're using the Sanwa inline autofire board right? How does it work? How are your buttons set up?

[ReKleSS]

Slow and fast auto fire? What?

There are 3 positions for each auto fire mode, H T and "." "." is off, H is... hold? and T is full auto. In H mode, it will auto fire as long as you hold down the button. In T mode, it will auto fire constantly regardless of the state of the button. I believe the autofire rate is 23hz (from the box - I left that in HK).

I installed Sanwa RG buttons - the reed switched ones. They're expensive, but the touch is extremely light. Much nicer than the default buttons.

The size: Out of curiosity, I put my HRAP on top of a friend's xbox. I couldn't see the xbox at all. So yeah, it's huge. As a result, shipping it anywhere is expensive... I went to Hong Kong on holiday, and got play-asia to ship it to my hotel (free).

There's a decent summary of the different parts available here.

EDIT: Checked the hori site, it's 23hz, not 30hz

[JJG]

I just got my HRAP 2 today and I'm going to be using it primarily with Dreamcast games. My problem is that the DC only has 6 buttons so the Rectangle and X buttons on the HRAP are basically unusable. I was wondering how hard it would be to rewire it so I could use those buttons on the DC as I think it would be more ergonomic for me.

[Ganelon]

I just got my HRAP 2 today and I'm going to be using it primarily with Dreamcast games. My problem is that the DC only has 6 buttons so the Rectangle and X buttons on the HRAP are basically unusable. I was wondering how hard it would be to rewire it so I could use those buttons on the DC as I think it would be more ergonomic for me.

Huh? Every DC converter I've seen (AKA everything based off the Total Control) lets you map R1 and R2 as the L and R triggers. This configuration works perfectly for stuff like Capcom's fighters. Rectangle and Cross always match X and A respectively.

[JJG]

Yeah I got it fixed, it was an adapter issue.

[Limbrooke]

I'm curious as to why HRAP1v2 cannot be swapped with Seimitsu stick, I've never heard this before.
Regarding that it's unlikely anyone who has bought a HRAP Brand New(within the last year) has gotten a v1, am I correct to assume this?

Even though it seems all facets regarding HRAP has been covered I'll offer my 2 cents.

The throw of the Sanwa stick is fairly precise and I'd say it's perhaps the best stick I've ever used, and that's compared to actual Jap cabinets (although I speculate if I've ever used a Seimitsu). The buttons are strudy enough to take a pounding and have decent response to touch. As mentioned replacement is easy, if you can get the stick open. Perhaps I'm alone in this cause but I don't have a proper tool set and therefore I had shit time taking the top plate off. It's only 6 nuts, but some are in tight spaces, especially if you're using a normal plier.

I feel the size is appropriate for any application, including lap which how I use it most often.
Definitely a worthwhile investment.

[Icarus]

Well, I just picked up a HRAP 1.1 from YAJ for about 7250Y (just under £35). Add shipping, commission and other whatnot and it will probably come up to a fair bit less than £100, yay.

Just running back through the thread and comfirming some information on the best buttons and sticks to mod this thing with, as I want my joystick to perform as close to Japanese arcade standard as possible with the correct sensitivity suited to my play (because I'm a fussy bastard).

Thanks for the help guys. I'll probably be back in a fortnight asking people how to take the top plate off. ^_^

[Daigohji]

Perhaps I'm alone in this cause but I don't have a proper tool set and therefore I had shit time taking the top plate off. It's only 6 nuts, but some are in tight spaces, especially if you're using a normal plier.

Oh yeah, I forgot about that. Those middle two nuts can be a pain to get off because there's high plastic ridges around them. The way I got them off in the end with using the 7mm head from a socket wrench set. If you fit the wrench head to the nut, insert the end of a small pair of scissors into the wrench head's connector end, and then open the scissors, that should give enough leverage to rotate the nut. The alternative is a long pair of needle-nose pliers. Or a 7mm nut spinner if you've got one by some amazing coincidence.