Raiden Fighters Remix Collection

[The_Trooper49]

I've been waiting for the patch (and a sale!) to grab this on switch (yes not the ideal platform, but I like my collection all in one place and play handheld/tabletop a lot).... Just wondering if the 54fps mode introduces any ugly stutter or tearing etc, or does everything play smoothly enough? I'm not a complete perfectionist, but if it's distractingly jittery I want to avoid.

I would not try to play these games in handheld/tabletop. An exercise in frustration and futility as there's too many fast/small bullets to play these at any sort of decent level of competency. If you're a pure handheld player, I'd just skip this one.

Would you say it's similar to other Raiden games in that sense or are the Fighters games even faster/smaller bullets? The main thing holding me back is my terrible skill level in Raiden 1 and 4, but they work ok for me in handheld for visibility at least.

[AGermanArtist]

I'd compare the Fighters games to Fireshark. I find them oppressively difficult. I have to play on Easy. Does this collection have an Easy mode?
Is it fixed now? I have ACES on Xenia, but I'd still buy this for PS5.

[Starfighter]

You can select easy difficulty but to my knowledge it only slightly reduces the amount of bullets. If you want to practice the stage layout and your early medal game there's also a difficulty level that completely removes the bullets.

I played Jet on Xenia and PS5 back and forth a while back and I consistently made it much further on Xenia, it felt like I sort of had more control and had the time to react intuitively (well, sometimes, at least ). Probably due to the lower input latency but now I'm guessing.

I bet this update only focused on the framerate (being an .000001 update after all), larger updates are coming at a later date. And the speed does indeed seem to be fixed, as seen in my comparison video where it's clearly running at the same speed as the original arcade version.

[Serge.EXE]

I think it's playable at least, but I do wish I could get the sound to stop cutting off on my Steam Deck through Xenia

[Jonpachi]

I've been waiting for the patch (and a sale!) to grab this on switch (yes not the ideal platform, but I like my collection all in one place and play handheld/tabletop a lot).... Just wondering if the 54fps mode introduces any ugly stutter or tearing etc, or does everything play smoothly enough? I'm not a complete perfectionist, but if it's distractingly jittery I want to avoid.

I would not try to play these games in handheld/tabletop. An exercise in frustration and futility as there's too many fast/small bullets to play these at any sort of decent level of competency. If you're a pure handheld player, I'd just skip this one.

Would you say it's similar to other Raiden games in that sense or are the Fighters games even faster/smaller bullets? The main thing holding me back is my terrible skill level in Raiden 1 and 4, but they work ok for me in handheld for visibility at least.

It’s probably not your skill level. You just can’t effectively play a game like that on a tiny screen. I bet if you hooked up a proper gaming monitor you’d see your success increase.

To your question though, Fighters throws a lot more bullets at you than mainline Raiden games. It’s less reliant on sniper tanks to get its difficulty, but the later stages can throw some serious fast-moving heat at you, especially bosses.

[The_Trooper49]

I would not try to play these games in handheld/tabletop. An exercise in frustration and futility as there's too many fast/small bullets to play these at any sort of decent level of competency. If you're a pure handheld player, I'd just skip this one.

Would you say it's similar to other Raiden games in that sense or are the Fighters games even faster/smaller bullets? The main thing holding me back is my terrible skill level in Raiden 1 and 4, but they work ok for me in handheld for visibility at least.

It’s probably not your skill level. You just can’t effectively play a game like that on a tiny screen. I bet if you hooked up a proper gaming monitor you’d see your success increase.

To your question though, Fighters throws a lot more bullets at you than mainline Raiden games. It’s less reliant on sniper tanks to get its difficulty, but the later stages can throw some serious fast-moving heat at you, especially bosses.

Thanks for the tips! I'll have to try the 'big TV' some time!! Also spotted that you can buy the Raiden fighters games individually on switch, so I'll keep them on my wishlist and maybe just get one if they go on sale to try them out

[PC Engine Fan X!]

Would you say it's similar to other Raiden games in that sense or are the Fighters games even faster/smaller bullets? The main thing holding me back is my terrible skill level in Raiden 1 and 4, but they work ok for me in handheld for visibility at least.

It’s probably not your skill level. You just can’t effectively play a game like that on a tiny screen. I bet if you hooked up a proper gaming monitor you’d see your success increase.

To your question though, Fighters throws a lot more bullets at you than mainline Raiden games. It’s less reliant on sniper tanks to get its difficulty, but the later stages can throw some serious fast-moving heat at you, especially bosses.

Thanks for the tips! I'll have to try the 'big TV' some time!! Also spotted that you can buy the Raiden fighters games individually on switch, so I'll keep them on my wishlist and maybe just get one if they go on sale to try them out

For The_Trooper49,

It's cheaper to buy the bundled Raiden Fighters Remix Collection rather than buying each Raiden Fighter game separately on the Switch 1 gaming platform indeed. Yes, playing all three Raiden Fighter games in Switch docked mode is superb, especially if playing it with a PC gaming monitor properly rotated in tate -- can't get any better than that, folks.

If you're on the older Switch fw of Ver. 1.0.1, by updating it to the latest fw of Ver. 1.1.0 will have the necessary and crucial Arcade 54fps framerate option -- this is the correct and proper way to play all three Raiden Fighter games like how it is on the Seibu Kaihatsu SPI arcade motherboard platform with all three SPI carts of Raiden Fighters, Raiden Fighter 2: Operation Hell Dive and Raiden Fighters Jet on a dedicated Japanese candy cab or portable supergun setup nowadays.

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If playing RFRC on an Oled Switch setup with tate enabled + scanlines enabled, be sure to increase the overall brightness to compensate for lower screen brightness factor with the scanline filter applied. Easy as pie.
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PC Engine Fan X! ^_~

[The_Trooper49]

Thanks PC Engine Fan X!

[guigui]

I was told, and I still can not believe, that this game has a filter which adds a travelling black band across the screen ; the way one used to see cathodic monitors when filmed back in the old days of 1980's.
Is that true ? If yes why does this filter exist in the first place ?

[Jonpachi]

I was told, and I still can not believe, that this game has a filter which adds a travelling black band across the screen ; the way one used to see cathodic monitors when filmed back in the old days of 1980's.
Is that true ? If yes why does this filter exist in the first place ?

Yes, it's true. No idea what they were thinking other than a very young dev team that thinks that just how CRTs used to look IRL.

[hamfighterx]

I would not try to play these games in handheld/tabletop. An exercise in frustration and futility as there's too many fast/small bullets to play these at any sort of decent level of competency. If you're a pure handheld player, I'd just skip this one.

Eh, to each their own. I don't find the full sized Switch 1/OLED/2 to be all that bad for visibility, especially rotating it for some tabletop TATE mode action on a stand. Is it the perfect official high score setup for Very Serious STG Boys and Girls? No. But it's perfectly playable to me and very convenient, it's not like we're talking about a Gameboy Micro here.

For me personally, any poor performance in Raiden Fighters is definitely a skill thing. I'm about equally mediocre playing Switch tabletop, Switch on TV, Xbox 360 over RGB on a nice CRT (Sony PVM), arcade...

I realize YMMV, and some of this is just down to a person's vision, distance from screen, and personal preference. But I don't think I'd go so far as to try to scare off "pure handheld" people by telling them to just skip this one - anybody who's a handheld exclusive player is probably already inherently a little more comfortable with that screen size.

[PC Engine Fan X!]

I was told, and I still can not believe, that this game has a filter which adds a travelling black band across the screen ; the way one used to see cathodic monitors when filmed back in the old days of 1980's.
Is that true ? If yes why does this filter exist in the first place ?

Yes, the so-called travelling black band was prevalent if a video camera was filming such arcade CRT monitors back in the 1980s-1990s era -- if you turned off the video camera's built-in video image stabilization functionality, the dreaded "travelling black band" issue would go away (but most average "Joe" folks wouldn't know about that little nugget of info in hindsight/retrospect nowadays). Strange but true indeed.

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As an experiment of sorts nowadays, you can take an NTSC-based Sony Mini DV based camcorder and point it directly at a candy cab's CRT monitor and still get the dreaded "black band" scrolling issue but if you turn off the camcorder's image stabilization feature, it'll go away -- easy as pie. Works wonders on the arcade jamma pcbs that have a stable and consistent 60fps framerate setup.
----------

PC Engine Fan X! ^_~

[Jonpachi]

I would not try to play these games in handheld/tabletop. An exercise in frustration and futility as there's too many fast/small bullets to play these at any sort of decent level of competency. If you're a pure handheld player, I'd just skip this one.

Eh, to each their own. I don't find the full sized Switch 1/OLED/2 to be all that bad for visibility, especially rotating it for some tabletop TATE mode action on a stand. Is it the perfect official high score setup for Very Serious STG Boys and Girls? No. But it's perfectly playable to me and very convenient, it's not like we're talking about a Gameboy Micro here.

For me personally, any poor performance in Raiden Fighters is definitely a skill thing. I'm about equally mediocre playing Switch tabletop, Switch on TV, Xbox 360 over RGB on a nice CRT (Sony PVM), arcade...

I realize YMMV, and some of this is just down to a person's vision, distance from screen, and personal preference. But I don't think I'd go so far as to try to scare off "pure handheld" people by telling them to just skip this one - anybody who's a handheld exclusive player is probably already inherently a little more comfortable with that screen size.

Hard disagree. You're fooling yourself if you think you can play just as well on a screen the size of a letter vs a real monitor. Readability, awareness, precision, and focus/immersion are all greatly enhanced. I have a Flip-Grip for basic macro practice, but it's only for very high level routing. I stand by the statement that if you really are limited to JUST handheld gaming you're wasting your time trying to play this game.

[SavagePencil]

So with the frame rate thing outta the way, any reason to play this vs the 360 version?

[PC Engine Fan X!]

I would not try to play these games in handheld/tabletop. An exercise in frustration and futility as there's too many fast/small bullets to play these at any sort of decent level of competency. If you're a pure handheld player, I'd just skip this one.

Eh, to each their own. I don't find the full sized Switch 1/OLED/2 to be all that bad for visibility, especially rotating it for some tabletop TATE mode action on a stand. Is it the perfect official high score setup for Very Serious STG Boys and Girls? No. But it's perfectly playable to me and very convenient, it's not like we're talking about a Gameboy Micro here.

For me personally, any poor performance in Raiden Fighters is definitely a skill thing. I'm about equally mediocre playing Switch tabletop, Switch on TV, Xbox 360 over RGB on a nice CRT (Sony PVM), arcade...

I realize YMMV, and some of this is just down to a person's vision, distance from screen, and personal preference. But I don't think I'd go so far as to try to scare off "pure handheld" people by telling them to just skip this one - anybody who's a handheld exclusive player is probably already inherently a little more comfortable with that screen size.

Hard disagree. You're fooling yourself if you think you can play just as well on a screen the size of a letter vs a real monitor. Readability, awareness, precision, and focus/immersion are all greatly enhanced. I have a Flip-Grip for basic macro practice, but it's only for very high level routing. I stand by the statement that if you really are limited to JUST handheld gaming you're wasting your time trying to play this game.

The major three Nintendo Switch accessories that enable it to be played in tate are:

The Filp-Grip (this accessory doesn't allow the option to charge up the Switch when attached -- you have to physically remove the Flip-Grip just to charge the Switch indeed is the only major gripe/issue/flaw about it.)

The Pintendo (this handy accessory allows one to charge the Switch while still setup for tate + besting the Flip-Grip with it's "highly-touted" Switch charging ability.)

and lastly,

Retro Frog's Switch RoTATE Stand (this particular Switch 3rd-party produced accessory allows the Switch to tate in either 270 degree orientation or even 90 degree orientation -- how cool is that? Plus it still allows the ability to charge the Switch in either tate or yoko orientation + it has it's own dedicated stand and is further adjustable at various degrees, viewing-wise. Sadly, it's currently OOP -- "out of production" and was a limited time production deal to begin with. It works just fine with both of the 1st-gen LCD and 2nd-gen Oled Switch console setups.)

PC Engine Fan X! ^_~

[lastemperorjubei]

Eh, to each their own. I don't find the full sized Switch 1/OLED/2 to be all that bad for visibility, especially rotating it for some tabletop TATE mode action on a stand. Is it the perfect official high score setup for Very Serious STG Boys and Girls? No. But it's perfectly playable to me and very convenient, it's not like we're talking about a Gameboy Micro here.

For me personally, any poor performance in Raiden Fighters is definitely a skill thing. I'm about equally mediocre playing Switch tabletop, Switch on TV, Xbox 360 over RGB on a nice CRT (Sony PVM), arcade...

I realize YMMV, and some of this is just down to a person's vision, distance from screen, and personal preference. But I don't think I'd go so far as to try to scare off "pure handheld" people by telling them to just skip this one - anybody who's a handheld exclusive player is probably already inherently a little more comfortable with that screen size.

Hard disagree. You're fooling yourself if you think you can play just as well on a screen the size of a letter vs a real monitor. Readability, awareness, precision, and focus/immersion are all greatly enhanced. I have a Flip-Grip for basic macro practice, but it's only for very high level routing. I stand by the statement that if you really are limited to JUST handheld gaming you're wasting your time trying to play this game.

The major three Nintendo Switch accessories that enable it to be played in tate are:

The Filp-Grip (this accessory doesn't allow the option to charge up the Switch when attached & besting the Flip-Grip with it's "highly touted" charging ability.)

The Pintendo (this handy accessory allows one to charge the Switch while still setup for tate.)

and lastly,

Retro Frog's Switch RoTATE Stand (this particular Switch 3rd-party produced accessory allows the Switch to tate in either 270 degree orientation or even 90 degree orientation -- how cool is that? Plus it still allows the ability to charge the Switch in either tate or yoko orientation + it has it's own dedicated stand and is adjustable at various degrees, viewing-wise. Sadly, it's currently OOP -- "out of production" and was a limited time production deal to begin with.)

PC Engine Fan X! ^_~

The fourth mayor accessory that is imo superior to everything you mentioned is a foldable laptop bed desk for couch / sofa with height adjustment. This way you can sit on the couch/bed, use any controller you like, don't have the weight of the mobile device in your hands, don't look down all the time (tech neck) and can adust the distance to your eyes.

[PC Engine Fan X!]

Hard disagree. You're fooling yourself if you think you can play just as well on a screen the size of a letter vs a real monitor. Readability, awareness, precision, and focus/immersion are all greatly enhanced. I have a Flip-Grip for basic macro practice, but it's only for very high level routing. I stand by the statement that if you really are limited to JUST handheld gaming you're wasting your time trying to play this game.

The major three Nintendo Switch accessories that enable it to be played in tate are:

The Filp-Grip (this accessory doesn't allow the option to charge up the Switch when attached.)

The Pintendo (this handy accessory allows one to charge the Switch while still setup for tate & besting the Flip-Grip with it's "highly-touted" charging ability.)

and lastly,

Retro Frog's Switch RoTATE Stand (this particular Switch 3rd-party produced accessory allows the Switch to tate in either 270 degree orientation or even 90 degree orientation -- how cool is that? Plus it still allows the ability to charge the Switch in either tate or yoko orientation + it has it's own dedicated stand and is adjustable at various degrees, viewing-wise. Sadly, it's currently OOP -- "out of production" and was a limited time production deal to begin with.)

PC Engine Fan X! ^_~

The fourth major accessory that is imo superior to everything you mentioned is a foldable laptop bed desk for couch / sofa with height adjustment. This way you can sit on the couch/bed, use any controller you like, don't have the weight of the mobile device in your hands, don't look down all the time (tech neck) and can adust the distance to your eyes.

Wow, your fourth tate suggestion sounds quite good, lastemperorjubei.

PC Engine Fan X! ^_~

[Serge.EXE]

So with the frame rate thing outta the way, any reason to play this vs the 360 version?

Input Lag is noticeably better on Aces for 360. I think last count I saw Remix Collection input lag was roughly 90~100ms, or 5-6 frames. Aces seems to be 3 frames according to a document I found on Scribd.

It's a pretty major difference IMO. Is Remix completely unplayable? I certainly don't think so. But Aces just feels better, less like ice-skating

[R79]

Yeah, many of us had some great sticks for 360, hooked up to '90s TVs, felt hella authentic. Aces was no doubt the bomb, but sadly denied a release in Europe or region free J edition, so tricky to source and play.

It's a shame the forum doesn't really do photos, as we could see some of these goofy Switch set-ups and obscure accessories in action... I personally was disappointed you can't seem to alter the controls on those Toaplan packs for holding the thing upwards and maybe using the left d-pad as fire/bomb buttons. Playing Batsugun in yoko mode on like a screen barely bigger than a Gameboy Advance isn't really much of a flex, and again, kind of a step backwards from the Saturn version which had those control options 30 years ago, and still looks and sounds a treat on a flipped old Bush that came out of a skip.

[R79]

Just looking on eBay... RFR NS (game card) still looks to be Japan only, even though Raiden IV has a PAL release on the same system. Boo!

Looks you can buy it as DLC though, hmm

[seiatsu]

I would not try to play these games in handheld/tabletop. An exercise in frustration and futility as there's too many fast/small bullets to play these at any sort of decent level of competency. If you're a pure handheld player, I'd just skip this one.

Eh, to each their own. I don't find the full sized Switch 1/OLED/2 to be all that bad for visibility, especially rotating it for some tabletop TATE mode action on a stand. Is it the perfect official high score setup for Very Serious STG Boys and Girls? No. But it's perfectly playable to me and very convenient, it's not like we're talking about a Gameboy Micro here.

For me personally, any poor performance in Raiden Fighters is definitely a skill thing. I'm about equally mediocre playing Switch tabletop, Switch on TV, Xbox 360 over RGB on a nice CRT (Sony PVM), arcade...

I realize YMMV, and some of this is just down to a person's vision, distance from screen, and personal preference. But I don't think I'd go so far as to try to scare off "pure handheld" people by telling them to just skip this one - anybody who's a handheld exclusive player is probably already inherently a little more comfortable with that screen size.

Hard disagree. You're fooling yourself if you think you can play just as well on a screen the size of a letter vs a real monitor. Readability, awareness, precision, and focus/immersion are all greatly enhanced. I have a Flip-Grip for basic macro practice, but it's only for very high level routing. I stand by the statement that if you really are limited to JUST handheld gaming you're wasting your time trying to play this game.

I'll have to say, this is a very subjective take. Everyone will have their preference. I play on both a monitor and on switch. Depending on what is going on or which game, switch is sometimes my preference. Often times I find myself reaching for the switch. There are times in both scenarios when I've gotten PBs / 1CCs for the same game.

Just because it doesn't work for you doesn't mean it doesn't work for others. As long as the game in question performs well on the device in question, each player can decide on which tools are comfortable for them to enjoy them.

[PC Engine Fan X!]

Yeah, many of us had some great sticks for 360, hooked up to '90s TVs, felt hella authentic. Aces was no doubt the bomb, but sadly denied a release in Europe or region free J edition, so tricky to source and play.

It's a shame the forum doesn't really do photos, as we could see some of these goofy Switch set-ups and obscure accessories in action... I personally was disappointed you can't seem to alter the controls on those Toaplan packs for holding the thing upwards and maybe using the left d-pad as fire/bomb buttons. Playing Batsugun in yoko mode on like a screen barely bigger than a Gameboy Advance isn't really much of a flex, and again, kind of a step backwards from the Saturn version which had those control options 30 years ago, and still looks and sounds a treat on a flipped old Bush that came out of a skip.

A couple of the Xbox 360 based Hori Real Arcade Pro EX-SE (Special Edition variant) and the exclusive Amazon.co.jp released Hori RAP VX-SE Kai have all Seimitsu arcade parts installed from the get-go making them awesome arcade sticks for playing with the Xbox 360 stgs titles, indeed, including the USA region Xbox 360 release of Raiden Fighters Aces. You might recall that the Hori EX-SA (Special Addition variant) has all Denshi Sanwa arcade parts and same arcade parts applies to the Hori RAP VX-SA Kai as well.

PC Engine Fan X! ^_~

[m.sniffles.esq]

To add my 2¢ on the 'vert shooters with switch' conversation, You can get a 15.5-16" portable monitor on newegg for like $70. They're all designed identically with a swivel stand so you can set them up yoko/tate/reverse-tate, and weigh about a half an ounce (14g, if you swing that way). The only drawbacks is that you need a flat surface to set them on, and the built-in speakers suck so you need headphones/external speakers.

Personally, it's what I use for every vert, and don't fuck with them undocked at all anymore. I keep it under my coffee table and connect the switch to my soundbar via bluetooth. Sure, a flip grip/stand will make the experience less shitty, but for the most part, it's still pretty shitty. And while it means I can't play any verts on the bus, there are other things I can play.

[Firehawke]

Got the 360 set, but considering eventually picking this up just to have access on a modern platform. The 360 hardware doesn't have the best reliability record, after all.

[hamfighterx]

To add my 2¢ on the 'vert shooters with switch' conversation, You can get a 15.5-16" portable monitor on newegg for like $70. They're all designed identically with a swivel stand so you can set them up yoko/tate/reverse-tate, and weigh about a half an ounce (14g, if you swing that way). The only drawbacks is that you need a flat surface to set them on, and the built-in speakers suck so you need headphones/external speakers.

Personally, it's what I use for every vert, and don't fuck with them undocked at all anymore. I keep it under my coffee table and connect the switch to my soundbar via bluetooth. Sure, a flip grip/stand will make the experience less shitty, but for the most part, it's still pretty shitty. And while it means I can't play any verts on the bus, there are other things I can play.

That's not a bad idea either. I have a cheap ~16" portable Azorpa (budget Chinese company, Amazon sells a ton of them) monitor that I normally use as a second screen for my work Macbook. It's super light (I usually put it on a cell phone stand while I work all day) and portable, and surprisingly solid gaming performance at 1ms response time. Colors aren't the most vibrant, but it looks totally fine and I paid less than $100 for it.

I really only used it for games on a couple work trips, bit it did work well! Also used it for a while when I bought an Analogue 3D and their initial release firmware was messing up people's sound systems due to an HDMI CEC issue (requiring physically unplugging all devices to make them recognized again, real hassle until they fixed it) - so I relegated the system to this monitor until it was no longer contagious, and it worked pretty great on that too - N64 games in HDMI. Would indeed be a nice quick-and-easy home TATE solution too for any HDMI output system..

[lastemperorjubei]

To add my 2¢ on the 'vert shooters with switch' conversation, You can get a 15.5-16" portable monitor on newegg for like $70. They're all designed identically with a swivel stand so you can set them up yoko/tate/reverse-tate, and weigh about a half an ounce (14g, if you swing that way). The only drawbacks is that you need a flat surface to set them on, and the built-in speakers suck so you need headphones/external speakers.

Personally, it's what I use for every vert, and don't fuck with them undocked at all anymore. I keep it under my coffee table and connect the switch to my soundbar via bluetooth. Sure, a flip grip/stand will make the experience less shitty, but for the most part, it's still pretty shitty. And while it means I can't play any verts on the bus, there are other things I can play.

That's not a bad idea either. I have a cheap ~16" portable Azorpa (budget Chinese company, Amazon sells a ton of them) monitor that I normally use as a second screen for my work Macbook. It's super light (I usually put it on a cell phone stand while I work all day) and portable, and surprisingly solid gaming performance at 1ms response time. Colors aren't the most vibrant, but it looks totally fine and I paid less than $100 for it.

I really only used it for games on a couple work trips, bit it did work well! Also used it for a while when I bought an Analogue 3D and their initial release firmware was messing up people's sound systems due to an HDMI CEC issue (requiring physically unplugging all devices to make them recognized again, real hassle until they fixed it) - so I relegated the system to this monitor until it was no longer contagious, and it worked pretty great on that too - N64 games in HDMI. Would indeed be a nice quick-and-easy home TATE solution too for any HDMI output system..

I also have a portable Arzopa monitor and used it a couple times with the Switch 1 without problems. Takes a few minutes to set up.