Best Controller to play Shmups?

[FuchsHH]

Hi, since many years I'm using the original Xbox One Controller to play Shmups. Soon its time to buy new controller because mine is getting old and unstable.

Whats with the current Xbox Controllers? Can you recommend it for shmups? They have different d-pad, how about that?

What controller do you use to play shmups?

Thanks FuchsHH

[Steven]

As long as you don't have any physical disabilities that prevent you from using a keyboard or leverless, I think it's safe to say that those are objectively the best controllers for all 2D action games, except maybe for things that might require some sort of weird/annoying command inputs like 360 degree spins or whatever.

Otherwise, try a Saturn controller, 6-button MD controller, or M30, which are all basically standard recommendations as of now, I think, or maybe even an original Neo Geo CD controller (not the 8BitDo reproduction) if you want something that is a bit unusual.

[SavagePencil]

I'd say the key here is "find something that you don't have to think about while playing a shmup." If you grew up on joysticks, get one of those. Many today are easy to mod if you really want a specific stick or button feel. If you were rockin' it with an Xbox controller and enjoyed it, stick with that. I personally have terrible luck with bluetooth controllers, so I tend to avoid them and generally prefer something wired. My daily driver is an Octopus TR Fight Stick, but mostly because it has broad compatibility across modern and retro machines.

[XoPachi]

I love this thing a LOT.
https://www.8bitdo.com/m30/

It's replaced my other controllers for any 2D game new or emulated.I got my Mushi Maniac, Mecha Ritz high rank, and Darius Gaiden clears on this thing.

[PC Engine Fan X!]

The 8BitDo Microsoft Wireless arcade stick is awesome -- you can use it wired via extra long 10 foot USB-C cord or with included 2.4gHz wireless dongle: https://www.amazon.com/8Bitdo-Arcade-St ... to_dp&th=1 I have the all-black colored variant version and it's quite responsive with stg titles on both the Microsoft Series S/X consoles + it works flawlessly with a docked Steam Deck setup as well.

It has a "factory-installed" square gate that's required for playing stg titles properly. The arcade stick can easily be swapped with a Sanwa Denshi/Seimitsu based one if you want it to be Japanese "game center" spec if so desired/preferred. Push buttons can swapped out and either Sanwa Denshi or Seimitsu "game center spec" push buttons can be installed for greater versatility if it needed be (if you don't like the stock 8bitdo push buttons and would like something more durable/robust instead). In wireless mode, the built-in lipo battery holds a significant charge before the red colored led light starts to flash indicating that it needs to be charged soon.

PC Engine Fan X! ^_~

[Bassa-Bassa]

Is it true that 2.4 GHz controllers by that maker have an added latency of around 3 ms only?

[PC Engine Fan X!]

Is it true that 2.4 GHz controllers by that maker have an added latency of around 3 ms only?

I'm not sure with the 8bitdo lineup of 2.4gHz based wireless controllers' latency rate are but they are quite responsive as is indeed.

The above mentioned 8bitdo Microsoft wireless arcade stick is the first official Microsoft approved wireless arcade stick to be released in it's entirety, especially for the Microsoft console-based gamers. Of course if used in wired mode, the latency polling rate easily goes away entirely (and no worries in that particular department whatsoever).

If money is no object, there's this expensive Microsoft based arcade stick to consider as well with factory installed Sanwa Denshi parts throughout: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0C4R93HYQ/re ... =UTF8&th=1

PC Engine Fan X! ^_~

[Darkseed_5150]

Xbox controller is no bueno with its asymmetric dpad and face buttons. Plus crappy dpad and face buttons AA batteries and MadCatz look and feel.

Go for a DualSock or DualSense or better yet a joystick.

[OmKol]

8bitdo M30 is really good, did Mushihimesama Ultra clear on this thing. I don't think I've seen anyone yet who disliked this pad. It's so good

[Jonpachi]

There’s like 99 threads on this topic.

[FuchsHH]

There’s like 99 threads on this topic.

Now 100

[Steven]

Is it true that 2.4 GHz controllers by that maker have an added latency of around 3 ms only?

MiSTer input lag database suggests the answer is lol no



The Daemonbite adaptors used to test some of these add 0.75 to 1.604ms of lag, depending on what it is, and the Raphnet converter is at 1.804, so that's also something to consider. Also obviously this all only applies to MiSTer and might not be accurate for other things.

The M30 is at like 1ms wired, though. That fucker's super fast. It's one of the fastest controllers on the market as far as I know.

[Faith]

As long as you don't have any physical disabilities that prevent you from using a keyboard or leverless, I think it's safe to say that those are objectively the best controllers for all 2D action games

Haha, yes, I agree with this. My laptop come with the Cherry MX ultra low profile mechanical keyboard... and this is really the best keyboard ever I feel for STG. For me, it is not just about how well it respond to me... but I also feel closer to the action when playing with my laptop. Smaller screen compared to desktop (which is good for STG), closer to everything, hands nearby. Love it a lot! But anyway, reason I say this is: I did have some other player find it weird I love my laptop a lot for STG. But really, it is the best for me. But it does not stop me from playing good! And... in fact, I find for STG, "low profile" is better... especially for STG which need a lot of fast input... either by spamming shot or by fast movement. Even when I try normal size Cherry MX keyboard now... everything feels too far for me and that it needs too much movement. Of course, a lot of it is own preference and what comfortable with... but definitely... I feel everyone should try low profile!~

[Bassa-Bassa]

MiSTer input lag database suggests the answer is lol no

Thks. Below 5ms is still awesome for a wireless device anyway. What's the difference between "2.4GHz USB dongle" and "2.4GHz USB", though? Do these require something extra to work on Mister?

[tzm_rade]

M30 is good but I get stuck inputs on the directional pad very frequently when using it wireless on my Switch. Could obviously be some signal interference but it drives me nuts and has ruined more than a few runs when I just go flying off in one direction.

[Jonpachi]

M30 is good but I get stuck inputs on the directional pad very frequently when using it wireless on my Switch. Could obviously be some signal interference but it drives me nuts and has ruined more than a few runs when I just go flying off in one direction.

I think the d-pad is trash on these. 100% had this experience, bought a second, then a third. All trash.

[Steven]

What's the difference between "2.4GHz USB dongle" and "2.4GHz USB", though? Do these require something extra to work on Mister?

I think it's the same thing and whoever made it didn't standardize their terminology. The only other thing I can think of is if it's like the 2.4GHz Retro-Bit Sega controllers that have 2 receivers, one for USB ports and one for the MD or Saturn, but in this case I doubt it.

M30 is good but I get stuck inputs on the directional pad very frequently when using it wireless on my Switch. Could obviously be some signal interference but it drives me nuts and has ruined more than a few runs when I just go flying off in one direction.

There are a bunch of different versions of this controller. I have the 2.4g version that works on the real MD and have no problems with it. Obviously I use it wirelessly on the MD, but I only use it wired on PC and MiSTer because my PC and MiSTer have no wireless capabilities of any sort by design, so try wired, if that works.

[tzm_rade]

Well, when I do use it wired on my PC I don't have the input problem. I use the 2.4g version with the dongle plugged into the Switch. I have never tried it wired in the Switch as it apparently has a little more lag when wired.

I do have the 8Bitdo Arcade Stick with a Seimitsu lever and have that connected with 2.4g mode wireless on the Switch with the receiver in the same USB ports and I don't have any input problems. So it's hard to pinpot if it's the dpad or wireless signal of the M30 causing the stuck inputs.

Also I have never been able to update the firmware of the M30 since it just doesn't get picked up in the 8Bitdo updater application on my PC or laptop. Wired or wireless.

[Steven]

So you have the 2.4g version that is not for Mega Drive then... I do not have that one, but assuming that you are using a USB receiver with the Switch, that still counts as "wired" because it still has to go through the USB port, so you'd probably have slightly less lag if you did plug a USB cable into the Switch and then into the controller, provided that that actually works. I plugged mine into my Switch dock once and nothing happened, so no promises.

And yeah, I would definitely try to update the firmware somehow. I had no problem getting mine to update, but again, it's not the same one that you have, so I don't know. I've heard 8BitDo's customer support sucks ass, but if you haven't already tried it, might as well. Also try updating the receiver, as they make updates for the receivers too.

The M30 2.4g (again, the one that is for the real Mega Drive, not the one for the Switch or whatever else) is the only 8BitDo controller that I've tried that I thought was actually good, and I've tried like 10 of them. Most of them were complete shit, although the one that came with the Nt mini Noir is decent. Not great, not bad, and certainly not special, but good enough. Never used a real Famicom or NES or their controllers and have nothing to compare it to, though, and if I play FC or NES games on MiSTer I use a USB PC Engine controller instead because, you know, same thing but with turbo. It and my real PC Engine controllers all have pretty crappy d-pads, though.

I should probably mention that the M30 2.4g causes audio noise on the MD due to insufficient shielding on the receiver or something like that. It's especially noticeable if you play with headphones. That noise is why I stopped using it on the MD and only use it on PC and MiSTer. I have a bunch of PC shooters that don't support keyboard remapping but do support controller remapping, so the M30 is my default PC STG controller.

Planning on converting my RAP N to leverless/WASD this year and put a UFB in it so I can finally have a universal leverless/keyboard-ish thing and stuff so I can finally play ShotTriggers and ACA and on 360 with a keyboard. That will be fun. The M30 will probably get retired at that point.

[PC Engine Fan X!]

Here's an 8bitdo wireless 2.4gHz stickless hitbox controller for the Xbox One, Series S/X & PC being sold through Amazon's Woot site: https://electronics.woot.com/offers/8bi ... nt_wp_2_61 It's on sale at $59.99 usd and it has an original MSRP of $99.99 usd at retail.

And for the PS5 & PC, a Razer Kitsune stickless hitbox controller: https://electronics.woot.com/offers/raz ... nt_wp_0_60 It's being sold at a discount for $199.99 (whereas it has a regular MSRP of $329.99 at retail) through Amazon's Woot discount retailer site.

PC Engine Fan X! ^_~

[copy-paster]

Controllers are very subjective, matter of personal taste thing. There's no "best" controller for shmups as opinions may vary depending on the person.

That being said I've been enjoying M30 2.4Ghz pad for a year and still is, this thing is so good that I thrown my KB as my shmup controller for over a decade.

[beer gas canister]

Another 2.4ghz M30 lover here, used it a ton on Switch and Mister. Got a 2nd one, the dongle-free Bluetooth version, for dedicated Switch 2 usage, so the 2.4 can belong to my Mister. Surely my all time favorite controller for responsiveness and ergonomics. The 2.4 is several years old now, and the dpad is membrane is getting a little sloppy, so that it will occasionally get briefly stuck on a single directional input. Gonna run it into the ground

[Kilmaattikahn]

Is the wired-only M30 compatible with the Steam Deck?

[Steven]

It's an Xbox controller, so it should use X-input and you should be fine. Steam input should fix it in the unlikely case that it doesn't work without Steam input, but no promises. That wired version supposedly has 450% more input lag than the 2.4g version does over wired, which I find rather interesting. Xbox version is still only 4.5ms, but you know~♥

[Starfighter]

8bitdo M30 is really good, did Mushihimesama Ultra clear on this thing. I don't think I've seen anyone yet who disliked this pad. It's so good

I don't care for it at all (my issue is with the floaty disc "dpad" that, on my controller at least, feels like it's balanced incorrectly (turning left bottoms out immediately, turning right feels like I'm pressing the thing "into" the controller)). But other than me you're correct. Not a soul on this earth has anything but love for it. It's quite disturbing to feel so utterly like the odd one out.

[pegboy]

Add me to the list of m30 haters. I primarily use dpad controllers and after all the hype I bought one a while back to test it out. Dpad is unreliable and awkward, and the face buttons never made sense to me why they are different sizes.

It's just bizarre that anyone ever liked the saturn pad imo but at least the shoulder buttons are good on the m30 unlike that disaster.

After reading this thread I gave thr m30 another shot and it was just as bad as I remembered.

[davyK]

Whatever your used to - Gusto's magnificent AGDQ live run of Futari 1.01 Ultra was done with the much maligned 360 pad. (after which he recited a Charles Bukowski poem).

I tend to do better with a stick. In theory a keyboard would be best for bullet hell navigating but it would take me a very long time to adapt to say the least to move over and there's no guarantee I'd be any better as I'm pretty much a scrub player with a handful of 1CCs.

[PC Engine Fan X!]

Whatever your used to - Gusto's magnificent AGDQ live run of Futari 1.01 Ultra was done with the much maligned 360 pad. (the one run after which he recited a Charles Bukowski poem).

I tend to do better with a stick. In theory a keyboard would be best for bullet hell navigating but it would take me a very long time to adapt to say the least to move over and there's no guarantee I'd be any better as I'm pretty much a scrub player with a handful of 1CCs.

It would mean having to retrain your "muscle memory" to get used to using either a keyboard or a "stickless hitbox" controller type of setup indeed. For some folks whom are used to using an arcade stick or gamepad setup, it's a "very steep hill to climb" to adjust to a dedicated keyboard/stickless hitbox layout -- it can be done given enough practice/time until it becomes "rote memory" without having to look at the keys/buttons beforehand.

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I recently bought a 8bitdo Microsoft wireless stickless hitbox controller and I still have look at the actual hitbox keys themselves to make sure I'm pressing the correct ones (which in hindsight, is very cumbersome as it is) -- so yes, there's a lengthy period to learn the hitbox keys by purely feel, touch and overall layout as it's quite very different compared to a dedicated arcade stick or gamepad layout for sure.
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PC Engine Fan X! ^_~

[maximo310]

I've always preferred KB, especially after getting a Ducky One 2 with MX Silvers several years ago. Never really liked pad ( outside of m30 for non-arcade stuff) & never got around to messing around with standalone arcade sticks besides a Quanba Q1.

[Starfighter]

the face buttons never made sense to me why they are different sizes

100%! If XYZ were the same buttons as ABC I'd be much more willing to forgive the floaty disc, but as it stands now - every aspect of it is irritating in some manner.

Like with this one on the Dreamcast, the floaty disc is forgiven because the buttons are uniform and nice.