I need your opinion on auto-bombing.

[sumdumgoy]

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[nogden]

I just discovered Ninja Saviors a couple days ago and I’m playing it right now. Such a great game.

[maximo310]

It's counted as a no-miss even with auto-bomb since the term usually applies only for lives.

But if you're still feel like that's not a satisfying clear, I usually recommend the regular arcade modes over Super Easy in the M2 ports, even if you give yourself some extra lives on non-default settings at first.

[emphatic]

Sure it counts as a no-miss clear, for THAT MODE. Really cool to hear you've got your dad into Shmups.

[PC Engine Fan X!]

Cave's DoDonpachi Dai-Fukkatsu v1.5 has auto-bombing from the get-go whereas with DoDonpachi Dai-Fukkatsu Black Label, you can choose to either auto-bomb or not. Have you tried/played those two particular Cave stgs, sumdumgoy?

PC Engine Fan X! ^_~

[donluca]

Definitely counts, IMHO, although auto-bombing has to be done right or it kind of ruins the game.

Games that take one bomb from you to save your ass take it too far: if you get hit, if you have bombs, you have to drop them all, not just one, otherwise I feel that it really becomes too easy.
It also make it pointless to use bombs at all.

[sumdumgoy]

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[Lethe]

The autobomb is worse than a miss, it is multi-missing. Missmaxxing. I hate it being a forced part of a game, if you want me to lose my bombs just do it conventionally when you take my life away. Or pull a Yagawa where having too many unused bombs is its own problem.

In Touhou circles, where formal competitive survival exists, bombing is penalized more heavily than missing is - which makes sense, bombing is advantageous after all. You rarely hear about no-bomb challenge play in arcade games, it's not really a recognized concept outside of scoring.

[SavagePencil]

If auto-bombing is part of the core experience then the developers intended it to be legitimate. The downsides of auto-bomb will come out in the scoring:

Bonus for every bomb remaining
Bonus for every bomb picked up while at max bombs

So it’ll be a legit 1CC, just not with a high score.

[sunnshiner]

I'm a scrubby scrub so I don't mind it as such. The auto-bomb feature in Akai Katana Shin, where if you're on your last life and get hit you lose all your remaining bomb stock is ok. It's taught me not to hang on to bombs too much and just use them when I need to (in that game anyway).

[BrainΦΠΦTemple]

like w/ games such as tiger-heli, auto-bombing can be seen as a kind of shield, like cho ren sha 68k gradius, etc., only one w/ some destructive power. so, my whole stance is just a bit of sOme obvious practical sense tHat if it is a feature/mechanic which is in the game, then it counts as a clear. i've developed an infamous reputation for being anti-autofire if any kind of mod is required or if the game was never originally intended to have tHat feature. so, if you had auto-bombs on as some kind of modification thingy, i wouldn't take the clear very seriously, but i would still aim to be encouraging, at the very least. ^^;
also, like wHat other people have said, you'll probably get a crAp score, but the babby mode difficulty clear is probably designed w/ auto-bombs as a sorta training wheels thingy and built purely arOund survival to develop the proper hand-eye coordination.

anyway, tHat all said, auto-bomb counts if it ain't a mod. so congrats on the 1cc of the babby difficulty mode for ketsui, d00d :]

and congrats to your dad too for his 2cc, especially considering his unfortunately failing eyesight

[BareKnuckleRoo]

Now that you mention it, Rolling Gunner follows this very rule: take a hit, lose all of your bomb stock.

Maybe that's why this kind of auto-bombing felt off!

EDIT: To add to your point, it also encourages a nasty habit that could be carried into practice - never using bombs at all, thinking it'll save you on hit.

The more I think about it, the more I dislike auto-bombing.

Auto-bombing is fine; so long as the penalty for auto-bombing is higher than using a manual bomb, then there's no incentive to simply auto-bomb. You may not like that it feels easier, but you're complaining about an ultra-novice mode added to Ketsui; it's not exactly going to be balanced to be a challenge. Just play a mode without autobombing when you want a bigger challenge.

Rolling Gunner also does not do 1 hit = entire bomb stock loss on Novice or Casual. Each autobomb there only depletes one bomb from the meter, but manual bombs last about 8 times the length and are far more damaging, and they also allow you to pointblank and recover way more meter. Note that Casual is in the arcade release totally unchanged from the home ports, so it's an example of an arcade game with a mode that features a pretty friendly autobomb setup.

Autobombing is problematic I think when games have autobombs simply fire off a full-strength normal bomb costing only 1 bomb. There's literally no reason to manual bomb. Mushihimesama Futari's ridiculously easy Novice mode does this, as does Solid State Survivor by default (you can disable autobombing there though, I'm not sure if it incentivizes you to do so with a better score the way Blue Wish Resurrection does). Futari Novice is hilariously easy and generally you'd be aiming for a no-miss clear even on Novice Ultra.

Bombing is not the same as dying, so in a game with autobombs it's possible to be hit and no-miss. It's still distinct from a no-miss, no-bomb clear. Same goes for games with shields; getting hit while a shield is active is taking damage, but it's not a death and can be tracked separately.

[sumdumgoy]

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[BareKnuckleRoo]

Are you sure? I could swear there's a difficulty mode I experienced in Rolling Gunner where you lose your entire bomb stock if you're saved by a single auto-bomb.

Original and Expert use the entire stock to autobomb. Casual and Novice use 1 bomb per autobomb. In both cases the autobomb sucks and it's always preferable to manual bomb.

Overpower mechanics are different and don't involve bombs but Overpower is terrible and can be disregarded. :V

[sumdumgoy]

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