What [not shmup] game are you playing now?

[XoPachi]

Nope: https://youtu.be/miLd03k0gXc?si=S038hjURATiQa9s8

Well, I guess that further supports the point of it's open endedness.

[Steven]

Nope: https://youtu.be/miLd03k0gXc?si=S038hjURATiQa9s8

Well, I guess that further supports the point of it's open endedness.

Best part is that it isn't even as cool as noob bridge without running: https://youtu.be/5w9FYWR_RYM?si=-qmD_ZBChi9StrpP

[Marc]

It's designed around that. You want every single game to be like WASD/left stick for movement and mouse/right stick for aiming? Oh wait, that is actually the current state of AAA gaming. Thanks to people like you Your wish has been granted.

Chill your boots man, fucking hell.
Have you played it?

Moving while aiming reduces you to the slowest speed possible. From what I remember of the original, the enemies are a bit more speedy/maneuverable as well, it balances without being a 3PS. I'm still all fir rooted shooting in REmake 1 and 0, but it never felt quite right to me in 4. I think this strikes a nice balance.

You're right, sorry about the harsh tone. The only RE games I've never completed so far (or not played at all) are 6, 8, and the remake of 4. I've played through all other RE games at least a few times, including their remakes and different ports such as RE1 on DS, which is great btw Yeah I am a big fan of the original ones too and I love the tank controls. When 4 first came out back then, I was disappointed because it was just not RE to me. But that aside, it's a great horror themed action game. I think it's still worth playing today if you're ever curious and it's available on like 20 different systems. I believe it's way better than its remake. It's just lots of fun, and the combat system is perfect with all the different weapons, knife and melee attacks.

https://youtu.be/z7mwQiIJxTQ?si=SRhig0eBcSWahp18

https://youtu.be/yAHppD_Vvts?si=9U-j3MB5v8nCDTIA

https://youtu.be/KDvpIYzQVv4?si=dvypbjmuY0qt9hsm

It's cool, bit touchy myself that day.
You should play RE4M though, it's FAR from what they did with R5/6, maybe just makes a few modern concessions. It's made me want to replay the original again, don't think I ever progressed beyond that fucking awful Krsuser fight in the day.

[it290]

Just picked up the recent-ish RoboCop FPS. It's about as mid-tier as I expected, which I was perfectly fine with for a trashy popcorn game featuring one my favorite IPs. Love that it has Peter Weller doing VA and it's nice that several other OG actors lent their facial likenesses as well. Having it be as much as a RoboCop simulator as it is an FPS and allowing you to write tickets, listen to citizen complaints, and sign get well letters for your fellow cops is a brilliant touch. They even nailed the Robo walk pretty well and although you can sprint, half the time it's more fun to just slowly walk around and tank bullets while dispatching hot Auto-9 justice.

One caveat: as far as I can tell, there is no crotch-specific damage nor voice lines linked to same, which seems like a huge missed opportunity.

[XoPachi]

being rooted while shooting can already go fuck itself.

Also, as somebody who has shot real firearms a decent amount... Moving while shooting in any direction other than straight forward is pretty hard to do. "Stopping and popping" is a lot closer to how a real person would behave in a zombie apocalypse if you handed them a gun. Not talking about SWAT or SAS Special Forces, but your average person who can shoot a gun and reload it under pressure.

I'm not huge on survival horror so RE is not quite up my alley in general. But having played 2 and 4 yeeaarrs ago, I found 4's rooting to be in the spirit of the older game's limitations. It's a good bridge of tense survival gameplay and action like a beat em up but guns. The camera not being independent is also a commonly overlooked feature that limits the action in a way to emphasize positioning over all else.

And the older games fixed camera/tank controls that I often hear people malign made for a fittingly defensive and cautious game. The framing of every scene builds tension and then the tension comes to a head when 2 zombies are in your way and you can't just blast them down like it's Quake. Acquired taste arguably (it's not my favorite game design) but it can't be said that it isn't finely balanced. It works.

[Sumez]

I never even felt the "stopping while shooting" in RE4 to be a limitation back when I played the game. Seemed totally natural to me, and in line with the game.

[TransatlanticFoe]

Just picked up the recent-ish RoboCop FPS. It's about as mid-tier as I expected, which I was perfectly fine with for a trashy popcorn game featuring one my favorite IPs. Love that it has Peter Weller doing VA and it's nice that several other OG actors lent their facial likenesses as well. Having it be as much as a RoboCop simulator as it is an FPS and allowing you to write tickets, listen to citizen complaints, and sign get well letters for your fellow cops is a brilliant touch. They even nailed the Robo walk pretty well and although you can sprint, half the time it's more fun to just slowly walk around and tank bullets while dispatching hot Auto-9 justice.

One caveat: as far as I can tell, there is no crotch-specific damage nor voice lines linked to same, which seems like a huge missed opportunity.

I don't remember there being specific voice lines for it but you can definitely shoot guys in the nutsack for a unique death animation.

There are loads of references to the first two films, but the best bit is whenever you just stroll along gunning down crooks.... then the main theme kicks in. Easily one of the most enjoyable games in recent history.

[Marc]

Just picked up the recent-ish RoboCop FPS. It's about as mid-tier as I expected, which I was perfectly fine with for a trashy popcorn game featuring one my favorite IPs. Love that it has Peter Weller doing VA and it's nice that several other OG actors lent their facial likenesses as well. Having it be as much as a RoboCop simulator as it is an FPS and allowing you to write tickets, listen to citizen complaints, and sign get well letters for your fellow cops is a brilliant touch. They even nailed the Robo walk pretty well and although you can sprint, half the time it's more fun to just slowly walk around and tank bullets while dispatching hot Auto-9 justice.

One caveat: as far as I can tell, there is no crotch-specific damage nor voice lines linked to same, which seems like a huge missed opportunity.

I don't remember there being specific voice lines for it but you can definitely shoot guys in the nutsack for a unique death animation.

There are loads of references to the first two films, but the best bit is whenever you just stroll along gunning down crooks.... then the main theme kicks in. Easily one of the most enjoyable games in recent history.

Added to my shopping list, cheers.

[Air Master Burst]

I was out of commission for a while, but I just notched my first 1CC of Elevator Action Returns in many years, and probably my first ever on max difficulty. After playing Huntdown to the equivalent of a max difficulty 1CC last year, I feel on direct comparison that Huntdown plays much closer to Contra than EAR, and I'm still looking for something else that scratches the same itch.

Probably about to dive into some OutZone again, because it's been a while, and because the Bitwave Toaplan ports on Steam have all been great so far.

And the older games fixed camera/tank controls that I often hear people malign made for a fittingly defensive and cautious game. The framing of every scene builds tension and then the tension comes to a head when 2 zombies are in your way and you can't just blast them down like it's Quake. Acquired taste arguably (it's not my favorite game design) but it can't be said that it isn't finely balanced. It works.

Tank controls can also work pretty well for straight-up action, as the Onimusha games prove.

See also: God Hand, Dino Crisis 2, Chase The Express, Hard Edge, and probably half a dozen other ps1 games I've forgotten over the years.

[Steven]

the Bitwave Toaplan ports on Steam have all been great so far.

LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL

[Air Master Burst]

the Bitwave Toaplan ports on Steam have all been great so far.

LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL

I haven't noticed any issues with Batsugun apart from the audio mixing being a touch wonky. Truxton seems fine too. Which ones are bad?

[it290]

Just picked up the recent-ish RoboCop FPS. It's about as mid-tier as I expected, which I was perfectly fine with for a trashy popcorn game featuring one my favorite IPs. Love that it has Peter Weller doing VA and it's nice that several other OG actors lent their facial likenesses as well. Having it be as much as a RoboCop simulator as it is an FPS and allowing you to write tickets, listen to citizen complaints, and sign get well letters for your fellow cops is a brilliant touch. They even nailed the Robo walk pretty well and although you can sprint, half the time it's more fun to just slowly walk around and tank bullets while dispatching hot Auto-9 justice.

One caveat: as far as I can tell, there is no crotch-specific damage nor voice lines linked to same, which seems like a huge missed opportunity.

I don't remember there being specific voice lines for it but you can definitely shoot guys in the nutsack for a unique death animation.

There are loads of references to the first two films, but the best bit is whenever you just stroll along gunning down crooks.... then the main theme kicks in. Easily one of the most enjoyable games in recent history.

There is a quest where you go into a video store and in one bit of dialogue a dude asks RoboCop what he thinks about sequels — I was so bummed that there was no 'One sequel is fine, two is one to many' dialogue option

[Arino]

I never even felt the "stopping while shooting" in RE4 to be a limitation back when I played the game. Seemed totally natural to me, and in line with the game.

100%

[Air Master Burst]

I never even felt the "stopping while shooting" in RE4 to be a limitation back when I played the game. Seemed totally natural to me, and in line with the game.

100%

MGS2/3 have my favorite version of this mechanic, where you can shoot forward while running but you have to stand still to actually aim at anything. Just like in real life!

[Steven]

the Bitwave Toaplan ports on Steam have all been great so far.

LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL

I haven't noticed any issues with Batsugun apart from the audio mixing being a touch wonky. Truxton seems fine too. Which ones are bad?

Kyuukyoku Tiger, Out Zone, Tatsujin, Tatsujin Ou, Zero Wing, Dogyuun!!, FixEight, Tiger-Heli, Slap Fight, Hellfire, Hishouzame, Same! Same Same!, Batsugun, Daisenpuu, V-V, and Vimana.

[BulletMagnet]

The first Blasphemous turned out to be a surprise favorite of mine, and I finally got around to the sequel: spent 20-something hours, somewhere around 90 percent overall completion, got to the (I think) last boss, he annoyed the daylights out of me, decided to call it quits.

I do like a lot about the game, at least "on paper"; the overall atmosphere is still there, the controls feel fine generally, map's nice and big with a good amount of QOL features, and the three-weapon setup makes combat more varied. In my head, though...for me, at least, what made the first one really memorable was how it presented itself, in the end, almost as an old-timey scared-straight mystery play, an allegory or twisted ritual instead of an "actual" adventure (not to mention a showcase for the developers' native culture), which both gave the gory bits (which I'm usually not terribly fond of in the games I play) some actual context and really served as the cherry on top to all that gloomy spritework and flavor text.

The sequel does still have all that, but in my mind just doesn't pull the overall act off as well, so even though it smoothes out a number of the original's more oppressive edges I just wasn't motivated to see the whole thing through. Almost, mind you, but not quite.

[Air Master Burst]

LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL

I haven't noticed any issues with Batsugun apart from the audio mixing being a touch wonky. Truxton seems fine too. Which ones are bad?

Kyuukyoku Tiger, Out Zone, Tatsujin, Tatsujin Ou, Zero Wing, Dogyuun!!, FixEight, Tiger-Heli, Slap Fight, Hellfire, Hishouzame, Same! Same Same!, Batsugun, Daisenpuu, V-V, and Vimana.

What's wrong with Batsugun? So far it seems exactly as I remember from the PCB (apart from the aforementioned slightly weird mix on a couple of the songs), although I admit that only applies to original recipe Batsugun since I've never encountered an actual cab with Special.

[Steven]

I haven't noticed any issues with Batsugun apart from the audio mixing being a touch wonky. Truxton seems fine too. Which ones are bad?

Kyuukyoku Tiger, Out Zone, Tatsujin, Tatsujin Ou, Zero Wing, Dogyuun!!, FixEight, Tiger-Heli, Slap Fight, Hellfire, Hishouzame, Same! Same Same!, Batsugun, Daisenpuu, V-V, and Vimana.

What's wrong with Batsugun? So far it seems exactly as I remember from the PCB (apart from the aforementioned slightly weird mix on a couple of the songs), although I admit that only applies to original recipe Batsugun since I've never encountered an actual cab with Special.

Batsugun is the least problematic by far, but as you said the audio is off. The autofire settings also suck and it runs too fast even with the original speed selected, both of which apply to all of the rest, and it has a weird thing with practice mode letting you play higher loops on normal Batsugun that don't exist.

Someone will probably say "it's good enough", to which I say "fuck you, for Toaplan I want and DEMAND absolute perfection and will accept nothing less".

[Air Master Burst]

The autofire settings also suck and it runs too fast even with the original speed selected, both of which apply to all of the rest, and it has a weird thing with practice mode letting you play higher loops on normal Batsugun that don't exist.

I use my own autofire anyway, so that's a nonissue.
Original arcade Batsugun never had a practice mode in the first place, so I'm actually fairly interested in the higher loops for og Batsugun.

The speed thing is interesting; I hadn't noticed a difference, but I also haven't played on a real cab in years. I'll check it against MAME later, though.

They've also patched it a number of times since release, so perhaps they've fixed it?

[Steven]

I'll check it against MAME later, though.

MAME doesn't match PCB speeds correctly on everything that I've compared it with. I haven't done Batsugun PCB/MAME side-by-side, but I would be very surprised if it actually maintained sync. I'm not sure if MAME works on Linux, but if I does I might try comparing it to the PCB next time I go visit someone that has the PCB.

[Air Master Burst]

I'll check it against MAME later, though.

MAME doesn't match PCB speeds correctly on everything that I've compared it with. I haven't done Batsugun PCB/MAME side-by-side, but I would be very surprised if it actually maintained sync. I'm not sure if MAME works on Linux, but if I does I might try comparing it to the PCB next time I go visit someone that has the PCB.

I realize it's not perfect, but it'll at least give me an idea. If it's super noticable against MAME then there's definitely something wrong.

[Steven]

I'll check it against MAME later, though.

MAME doesn't match PCB speeds correctly on everything that I've compared it with. I haven't done Batsugun PCB/MAME side-by-side, but I would be very surprised if it actually maintained sync. I'm not sure if MAME works on Linux, but if I does I might try comparing it to the PCB next time I go visit someone that has the PCB.

I realize it's not perfect, but it'll at least give me an idea. If it's super noticable against MAME then there's definitely something wrong.

Yeah, it's better than nothing.

One of the interesting points with the Bitwave releases is that they intentionally removed all slowdown from every game, so while I'd consider that an upgrade to any game, it is technically inaccurate, although I'll leave determining if that's a bad thing or not to the individual. This is especially noticeable on Hellfire, which has crazy slowdown on PCB just from shooting and even when there are no enemies on screen.

[Sima Tuna]

Removing slowdown is sometimes an upgrade and sometimes not, in my opinion.

If the slowdown is "smooth" and you then remove it, I consider that a downgrade. Because the OG game was built around the smooth slowdown for certain sections and the game becomes much harder with no slowdown.

But if the slowdown is jerky or (even worse) eats inputs/lags, then removing that slowdown is only a benefit. An example would be the lag in Metal Slug games which some people overclock the emulator CPU to bypass. There's a workaround like that for Double Dragon Arcade as well. I've seen superplays of the game running on misterFPGA with slowdown removal. Mark has videos of Metal Slug clears where he removed the slowdown by cranking the shit out of cpu cycles.

[Air Master Burst]

Yeah, it's better than nothing.

One of the interesting points with the Bitwave releases is that they intentionally removed all slowdown from every game, so while I'd consider that an upgrade to any game, it is technically inaccurate, although I'll leave determining if that's a bad thing or not to the individual. This is especially noticeable on Hellfire, which has crazy slowdown on PCB just from shooting and even when there are no enemies on screen.

I could never get into Hellfire anyway, so if anything this might be an improvement.

Also, weren't you the one telling me to just buy Bitwave Batsugun and pretend instead of considering the exa version? That kinda sounds like a tacit "good enough" to me.

[Steven]

Yeah, it's better than nothing.

One of the interesting points with the Bitwave releases is that they intentionally removed all slowdown from every game, so while I'd consider that an upgrade to any game, it is technically inaccurate, although I'll leave determining if that's a bad thing or not to the individual. This is especially noticeable on Hellfire, which has crazy slowdown on PCB just from shooting and even when there are no enemies on screen.

I could never get into Hellfire anyway, so if anything this might be an improvement.

Also, weren't you the one telling me to just buy Bitwave Batsugun and pretend instead of considering the exa version? That kinda sounds like a tacit "good enough" to me.

That's just because I dislike exa for various reasons that I won't discuss here, or anywhere else. It's also way, WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY cheaper. I won't/can't stop you from spending that much if you really want to, but that's up to you. Even buying the PCB and a JAMMA cabinet is cheaper, too.

[Air Master Burst]

Yeah, it's better than nothing.

One of the interesting points with the Bitwave releases is that they intentionally removed all slowdown from every game, so while I'd consider that an upgrade to any game, it is technically inaccurate, although I'll leave determining if that's a bad thing or not to the individual. This is especially noticeable on Hellfire, which has crazy slowdown on PCB just from shooting and even when there are no enemies on screen.

I could never get into Hellfire anyway, so if anything this might be an improvement.

Also, weren't you the one telling me to just buy Bitwave Batsugun and pretend instead of considering the exa version? That kinda sounds like a tacit "good enough" to me.

That's just because I dislike exa for various reasons that I won't discuss here, or anywhere else. It's also way, WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY cheaper. I won't/can't stop you from spending that much if you really want to, but that's up to you.

It would depend entirely on the quality of the new content, otherwise I'd just grab an original recipe PCB. Of course, there is literally one place in the entire US that has exa Batsugun, so I guess I'll just have to wait for the inevitable PS7 port in a decade. I'm a pretty stupid person, but I'm not stupid enough to drop that much blind.

I have a sneaking suspicion the new stuff will be closer to Special than OG Batsugun, though, so I'll probably end up with the PCB at some point.

[BrianC]

One of the interesting points with the Bitwave releases is that they intentionally removed all slowdown from every game

Batsugun has that in common with the Saturn version? This means all of the official (and semi official) home versions so far removed the slowdown?

[Steven]

I could never get into Hellfire anyway, so if anything this might be an improvement.

Also, weren't you the one telling me to just buy Bitwave Batsugun and pretend instead of considering the exa version? That kinda sounds like a tacit "good enough" to me.

That's just because I dislike exa for various reasons that I won't discuss here, or anywhere else. It's also way, WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY cheaper. I won't/can't stop you from spending that much if you really want to, but that's up to you.

It would depend entirely on the quality of the new content, otherwise I'd just grab an original recipe PCB. Of course, there is literally one place in the entire US that has exa Batsugun, so I guess I'll just have to wait for the inevitable PS7 port in a decade. I'm a pretty stupid person, but I'm not stupid enough to drop that much blind.

I have a sneaking suspicion the new stuff will be closer to Special than OG Batsugun, though, so I'll probably end up with the PCB at some point.

I don't think I've seen exa Batsugun yet myself, but I haven't really gone to game centers much for the past year. Quite literally 50% of my entire company got corona simultaneously last summer, so we were short on staff for a little while and I decided that I should probably stay home just in case. Nobody ever uses the exa cabinets in the local arcades anyway. The only thing the players here care about is whatever the newest Tekken is.

One of the interesting points with the Bitwave releases is that they intentionally removed all slowdown from every game

Batsugun has that in common with the Saturn version? This means all of the official (and semi official) home versions so far removed the slowdown?

That's right. You could say that there is no home version that is actually 100% accurate to the arcade version, and you'd be correct if you did, although I'd consider it an upgrade myself. I've only played Batsugun on PCB like twice and Batsugun Special on PCB maybe three times and don't remember where the slowdown even is, though.

[Air Master Burst]

I spent a few summers in the mid 90s hitting a local Batsugun cab pretty hard, but I haven't touched one since like 2011. Madzella's second form and some of the more hectic parts of stage 4 in the clouds are the major ones I remember off top, but I'm sure there are more.

Real talk, how bad is the Bitwave OutZone actually?

[Steven]

Real talk, how bad is the Bitwave OutZone actually?

Sound effects are completely broken. The music sounded weird and had an inconsistent tempo at one point. They fixed some of the music problems, but I don't remember if they fixed all of them.

Game version selection is a weird ROM hack of a beta version that implements all of the music that isn't originally in the beta but still leaves out the scoring mechanics, a mostly finished version that still isn't the final version, and the weird hard version that Uemura-san doesn't remember making at all

When set to original speed and compared to PCB, it runs too fast, except for when it runs too slowly. Yeah, it manages to be both too fast and too slow somehow. At least, I think it does. It's been a while. It might have been MAME that did that, but one of them was both too fast and too slow and both fell out of sync with the PCB. I can go record from the PCB later to compare if I remember.

Local high score table is glitched and doesn't save your name properly. Might have been fixed recently, but I'd have to check.

There might be some other stuff that I forgot, but this is what I remember. Fortunately, since you only need one autofire speed for Out Zone (30Hz), you don't have to worry about not having optimal autofire settings using what is available in the game.