Anyone playing modern pixel art PC games at 480p on a consumer HD crt?

[deezdrama]

Ive been recapping and rgb modding crts for a couple years now and have probably 30-35 crts scattered across my gamegroom, garage, basement, and storage.
Most are pro monitors but some consumer sets as well but realized ive yet to mess with any consumer HD sets at all after I seen a loewe crt posted near me thats widescreen and 480p/1080i.

Wanting to buy this rare set I realized Ive never even messed with a consumer HD set or tried any of the 540p modelines to bypass the dreaded HD crt image processing.

I remembered a year or so back I picked up a toshiba 26hf84a hd widescreen thats been in storage so last night I brought it home to mess with.
Ive read theres a service menu option on these to set the display to handle 480p and treat it as 540p which bypasses processing much like the hdpt option in the service menu of some sony hd crts.

I thought it would be cool to play some modern indie pixel graphic games from my pc to the hd crt but trying to output 480p is something i have not tried in decades.
Im not even sure if windows supports resolutions this low anymore?

Ive set up and used crt emudriver in the past for 15kHz to a sd crt but hope this setup wont need to be that specialized.

I have a hdmi to vga adapter and a vga/db15 to ypbpr transcoder but not sure if I will need any further device like a downscaling solution? Ive just not looked into these displays much yet so any suggestions are appreciated!

[tongshadow]

Makes 0 sense because the text and HUD elements are gonna look horribly aliased due to downscaling, and also because of black bars.

I've seen good results, but majority of them are designed for 720p widescreen, minimum.

[Josh128]

You dont need to output in 540p or 480p from PC. Output at 1080i and you can enjoy the highest resolution your HDTV is capable of and do it with no input lag. 1080i makes more sense than 540p as it can resolve more vertical detail and its still a fairly common resolution used today in broadcasting, and for that reason most GPUs still support it.

Optimally, you'd want a 16:9 CRT to do this, but 16:9 mode also looks great on the 36" 4:3 HD CRTs as well.

[BazookaBen]

Both you guys are missing the point that the OP is specifically interested in playing modern widescreen 240p and 270p games. Think Sonic Mania and TMNT Shredders Revenge, respectively. Not high-res games that would benefit from 720p or 1080i

But yeah, Deezdrama, you can easily use your HD CRT to play these old pixel art games.

And you basically have the right idea on how to go about it, with converters and stuff. You can definitely select 480p and 540p in Windows, but you have to use "list all modes" in "advanced display properties" to find them. Also make sure you have GPU scaling disabled in your GPU drivers.

But yeah, if your TV only displays 540p lagless, you want to always use that mode. And then just create a custom 480p resolution with big porches (to bring it up to 33.75kzh) for 480p and 240p games.

If you get lucky and get the rare CRT that supports both 540p (33.75kHz) and 480p (31kHz) natively, then you can just use standard timings for 480p.

To get 240p and 270p games to look proper old school, you just want to use a basic Retroarch scanline shader via Reshade. You want to use the simplest one there is: the one that just blanks every other line.

And you don't need Emudriver for this, standard GPU drivers should work fine (unless you want to have SwitchRes compatibility for GroovyMAME and Retroarch)

Also, very important, is to check out the cool new methods on PC for getting super consistent and super low-lag Vsync.

This would be Scanline Sync in RTSS, and even better, Latent Sync in Special K. Latent Sync can even leverage your GPU overhead with an optional "delay bias" where you can reduce input lag to a fraction of a frame, as if you were running the game at 600fps.

Also important, is that you know exactly the resolution of the game you're playing (Special K can show you this when running the game in a 1x window). Otherwise scaling would be off and you'd get ugly artifacts in the image. So for Sonic Mania that's 424x240, for TMNT that's 480x270. For custom resolutions on your HD CRT, you multiply those x2: 848x480, and 960x540. You can make a lot of custom resolutions with CRU, and also save old ones.

[BuckoA51]

This is definitely a topic that needs a more deep dive and some tutorials, I'd never heard of scanline sync for instance.

With the OSSC Pro I was able to down convert 720p to 480p with letterboxing (my CRT was 4:3) and that looked pretty cool, though it seems like there's more options on the PC side for this than I realised.

[deezdrama]

Think Sonic Mania and TMNT Shredders Revenge, respectively. Not high-res games that would benefit from 720p or 1080i

Yes, this is exactly what I had in mind. I bought sonic mania on steam and loved the idea of the game but it just didnt feel right on a modern display so figured I would look into running it on a pc crt eventually and revisit it. Theres also been a ton of indie developer games and pixel art games that I thought would be awesome on a crt like shredders revenge and a dozen or so others that I cant think of their names right now.



I have all the og consoles, mister, and a ton of 15kHz tubes to scratch the 240p itch so figured id use this hd widescreen crt for movies (excited to try netflix via a ps3), later gen consoles, and this specialized modern pc pixel game use case but have been reading some erroneous info that windows doesnt support resolutions under 800x600 anymore. Im surprised to hear modern gpus can output 1080 interlaced as well, i figured I would need an old analog gpu and old drivers for that. Sounds like theres alot of options to test.
Im just not sure how to go about it if a certain game doesnt support a useable res like 480/540p, or 1080i.... Pretty sure 720p would be handled poorly and create a ton of lag but have not tried any of this yet.

Not sure what I can do if a game doesnt support a resolution thats compatible. Is there ways to force a game to run windowed in a lower resolution or would i need a device capable of downscaling?

Thanks guys!

[BuckoA51]

Often changing the desktop resolution is enough to coax them into running in that resolution, though it varies.

I think you will find this thread useful - http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.p ... 951.0.html

You can use the Switchres tool even if you don't have CRT Emudriver installed, just create the custom resolutions like BazookaBen said.

[Bassa-Bassa]

So for Sonic Mania that's 424x240, for TMNT that's 480x270. For custom resolutions on your HD CRT, you multiply those x2: 848x480, and 960x540.

For 424x240 games like Sonic Mania, he'd rather use any of his 15khz CRTs and then correct the aspect ratio with the service menu.

For 480x270 games, it's tricky. I personally would try something which allows me to keep it unscaled, which I believe it's ultimately his point. Best would be a 25khz-compatible monitor, but I've seen a friend using a 4:3 PC CRT for lower than 480p with great results (it was a high-end 22 incher, but still). You'd need to think of those as 480x360 games with borders if your monitor is flexible enough, for which CRT Emu Driver is really helpful.

Obviously, this is all 16:9 windowed for 4:3 displays so you can't expect a big picture or full screen, but getting the native assets resolution back in 2D graphics more than compensates. There's of course the upscaling+shader combo option for 16:9 displays (assuming it's a lagless process), but in that case, why not a good 4k flat panel instead where the shaders really shine.

Be aware that many games just lie about their native resolution though, as their assets have a different resolution to the grid the game actually uses to move them around. Downscaling them won't do them ultimately any good in theory, though it's worth a try. I'd like to know as well which Windows apps are the best for this, as the less the hardware needed, the better.

[Josh128]

I probably annoy folks here with my banter on HD CRTs, but I actually wish more people would post about and review some of the more obscure models. Models like my first HD CRT, the 36" Hitachi Ultravision Digital 36SDX88B have literally nothing but "folk tales" available online, as far as things like lag testing, etc.

One thing I really appreciate even more about that Hitachi now that I have dealt with HD Trinitrons, is that it "only" weighed in at 163 lbs, a full 65 lbs lighter than the HD Sonys of the same size-- Im 99% certain that its 640x480 and 800x600 VGA modes were true 31 and 37KHz scans with zero lag-- I remember connecting my PC to it and dont recall any mouse lag at all, which is one of the easiest ways for humans to actually detect input lag.

In any case-- please try this and update this thread (or make a dedicated thread) to your set and include pictures and tests please!

[deezdrama]

I probably annoy folks here with my banter on HD CRTs, but I actually wish more people would post about and review some of the more obscure models. Models like my first HD CRT, the 36" Hitachi Ultravision Digital 36SDX88B have literally nothing but "folk tales" available online, as far as things like lag testing, etc.

One thing I really appreciate even more about that Hitachi now that I have dealt with HD Trinitrons, is that it "only" weighed in at 163 lbs, a full 65 lbs lighter than the HD Sonys of the same size-- Im 99% certain that its 640x480 and 800x600 VGA modes were true 31 and 37KHz scans with zero lag-- I remember connecting my PC to it and dont recall any mouse lag at all, which is one of the easiest ways for humans to actually detect input lag.

In any case-- please try this and update this thread (or make a dedicated thread) to your set and include pictures and tests please!

Will do, and its funny you mention an ultravision.
I was making a trip out of town a couple years ago to pick up some pvms and lined up a free 36" ultravision (if memory serves me)from fb ... It had the looks of a jvc d series ...curved tube and all but did native 480p and were often used as presentation monitors.
I got there and he told me he just let someone else grab it. I think he might of had second thoughts and decided to keep it. To make peace he offered me this 26hf84a toshiba that this thread is about. Ive yet to plug it in for the first time as ive really not had any ideas for it.

I planned to test a custom 540p modeline with mister on it but not sure if i want to bother. Only info about this model i can find is that they used a lesser orion tube in these smaller sets but that they would treat 480p as 540p so no processing if the 540p mode was enabled in serv menu.

Ill mess with it and post my thoughts but have no time slueth to actually test the lag although I can come up with other methods

[BazookaBen]

Not sure what I can do if a game doesnt support a resolution thats compatible. Is there ways to force a game to run windowed in a lower resolution or would i need a device capable of downscaling?

Almost all pixel art games support their "native" resolution. Like if you are running CRT Emudriver to a SD CRT, and set your desktop to 427x240 (native resolution Blazing Chrome) and launch Blazing Chrome, the game will display pefectly. But if you're off by even one pixel in two directions (like you launch it at 428x241) scaling will be screwed up and you will see artifacts. And of course, if you get the perfect 2x scale (854x480) it will look correct as well

Rarely, there will be some games that auto-output to the wrong resolution, and you have to use something like Special K to force them into the right resolution. Thinking of inti-creates Bloodstained and Blaster Master Zero games.

Im surprised to hear modern gpus can output 1080 interlaced as well

They don't, or at least anything made in the past few years. RDNA and RTX GPUs won't output an interlaced signal.

Well, excpet for the PS5's GPU. It's RDNA 2 and has 1080i as an option.

For 424x240 games like Sonic Mania, he'd rather use any of his 15khz CRTs and then correct the aspect ratio with the service menu.

I don't have a HD CRT TV, so I do native resolution on SD like you're talking about. It is fantastic and letterboxing is fine and dandy

But if I did have HD tube, with all these widescreen pixel art games around, I'd definitely give it a try to see how it stacks up. I could see it being a more fun experience overall. Because really, after you inject scanlines, the main disadvantage would be a slightly dimmer picture than a native SD tube, but as long as ambient lighting isn't crazy bright, that shouldn't be a serious problem. The other visual differences will come down to the scanline sharpness and the overall look of the shadow mask.

Of course I also know Sonic Mania isn't the best example I could have used, since it actually does support 4:3 output with a config file tweak.

[deezdrama]

Not sure what I can do if a game doesnt support a resolution thats compatible. Is there ways to force a game to run windowed in a lower resolution or would i need a device capable of downscaling?

Almost all pixel art games support their "native" resolution. Like if you are running CRT Emudriver to a SD CRT, and set your desktop to 427x240 (native resolution Blazing Chrome) and launch Blazing Chrome, the game will display pefectly. But if you're off by even one pixel in two directions (like you launch it at 428x241) scaling will be screwed up and you will see artifacts. And of course, if you get the perfect 2x scale (854x480) it will look correct as well

Rarely, there will be some games that auto-output to the wrong resolution, and you have to use something like Special K to force them into the right resolution. Thinking of inti-creates Bloodstained and Blaster Master Zero games.

Im surprised to hear modern gpus can output 1080 interlaced as well

They don't, or at least anything made in the past few years. RDNA and RTX GPUs won't output an interlaced signal.

Well, excpet for the PS5's GPU. It's RDNA 2 and has 1080i as an option.

For 424x240 games like Sonic Mania, he'd rather use any of his 15khz CRTs and then correct the aspect ratio with the service menu.

I don't have a HD CRT TV, so I do native resolution on SD like you're talking about. It is fantastic and letterboxing is fine and dandy

But if I did have HD tube, with all these widescreen pixel art games around, I'd definitely give it a try to see how it stacks up. I could see it being a more fun experience overall. Because really, after you inject scanlines, the main disadvantage would be a slightly dimmer picture than a native SD tube, but as long as ambient lighting isn't crazy bright, that shouldn't be a serious problem. The other visual differences will come down to the scanline sharpness and the overall look of the shadow mask.

Of course I also know Sonic Mania isn't the best example I could have used, since it actually does support 4:3 output with a config file tweak.

I knew I should of kept the old amd r9 380x i sold during covid lol... Oh well they are cheap again and maybe ill throw together a specific pc build for this hd crt.

Thanks for all the info, im going to dig out my transcoders and adapters this weekend and ssee if i can get it working.

[Josh128]

Im surprised to hear modern gpus can output 1080 interlaced as well

They don't, or at least anything made in the past few years. RDNA and RTX GPUs won't output an interlaced signal.

Well, excpet for the PS5's GPU. It's RDNA 2 and has 1080i as an option.

This is news to me - Im running a 6700XT now and hadnt tried it-- my previous RX 580 definitely could and my GTX 1050 in my HTPC still does, just tried it. 1080i is there by default in the Nvidia control panel. For my RDNA2 card, Adrenalin 22.11.2 still has the option to create custom resolutions and also has a selectable interlace option, but when I create a 1080i resolution it tells me my monitor doesnt support it and prevents me from trying it. So Im still not certain that the GPU cant do it, but I dont have another monitor to test it with.

Where did you read that modern GPUs dont support interlaced resolutions?

[BazookaBen]

Where did you read that modern GPUs dont support interlaced resolutions?

Just from hearing from other CRT users with these cards, and I personally have a 5700xt (RDNA 1).

So yeah, to be clear, "modern" in this case means RTX and RDNA.

Your GTX 1050 is... GTX. The last generation from Nvidia that supports interlaced.

And honestly, custom interlaced resolutions (everything that isn't 1080i) have been glitchy on Nvidia cards for the better part of a decade before we even got to the RTX cards. Like if I accidentally have a interlaced resolution enabled on my GT 730 (say, 1440i) and restart the PC, it will blue screen on reboot. I have to recover it in safe mode, and make sure I always switch to progressive before a restart/shutdown.

[BazookaBen]

I knew I should of kept the old amd r9 380x i sold during covid lol... Oh well they are cheap again and maybe ill throw together a specific pc build for this hd crt.

Just to be clear, you won't need to run Emudriver for this particular TV, since you won't be making any resolutions under 480p.

But 380x is still a kickass card and would be nice to have. The last, best GPU from AMD that still has analog output

[deezdrama]

Have you guys tested lag with an Extron DSC 301 ?

Im wondering if it would just be easier to use one of these to always scale the secondary output from my rtx3080 from 1080p to 1080i and call it a day. If its a frame or 2 of lag I could live with that since I think modern games wont be as sensitive to this but if 3 or 4 frames or more ill look for another solution. Seems like this solution might not be the most ideal but would sure make an easy option for casual gaming and watching movies from the pc on the hd crt.
Any other/better options for 1080p to interlaced? Cant remember if gbs-c supports this or not
Any thoughts?

[BazookaBen]

Have you guys tested lag with an Extron DSC 301 ?

Im wondering if it would just be easier to use one of these to always scale the secondary output from my rtx3080 from 1080p to 1080i and call it a day. If its a frame or 2 of lag I could live with that since I think modern games wont be as sensitive to this but if 3 or 4 frames or more ill look for another solution. Seems like this solution might not be the most ideal but would sure make an easy option for casual gaming and watching movies from the pc on the hd crt.
Any other/better options for 1080p to interlaced? Cant remember if gbs-c supports this or not
Any thoughts?

First, that would be ugly for pixel art games. You want progressive, and you want integer scale.

But for a typical 3D game, it might be alright. I'd try a cheap Radeon card in a secondary PCIe slot though. Like a r5 240 that you can get for $8 or so. Interlaced output is flawless, and no scaling needed

[orange808]

You shouldn't need an Extron DSC 301 if just want to feed 1080i from a PC.

Nvidia GPUs have integer scaling options and I believe they still output 1080i natively. Just for laughs, I just got 1080i out of an RTX 4090; so, it still works. All you need is a DAC. Shouldn't need a video processor at all. If Windows fights you, download CRU.

I have no idea why 1080i would look soft if you're doing integer scaling on the GPU.
I don't think my card is doing any flicker filtering at all. It's plenty sharp. Obviously, fans of these HD CRTs don't see interlacing combing or they don't care.

Honestly, it's not a bad solution if your display isn't going to handle other signals natively and force 1080i upscaling (anyway).

I'm not a fan of HD CRTs, but you're not going to get a bad image from an nvidia card putting out 1080i through a good DAC.

[Bassa-Bassa]

Only some games use natively 480x270. He'll often face 640x360 and even more often 240p and below. And even for the former, there's 540p, which should be even easier to get than 1080i. I wonder how upscaled 2D graphics with injected scanlines and interlace can ever produce a good image in anyone's eyes whatever the DAC he picks.

[BazookaBen]

Nvidia GPUs have integer scaling options and I believe they still output 1080i natively. Just for laughs, I just got 1080i out of an RTX 4090; so, it still works.

Hmmm, I'm a bit skeptical, based on what I've read in the past. Is your display a LCD or OLED? When you bring up the "information" submenu or whatever on the TV, what resolution does it report? My guess, based on how Nvidia cards in the past act with interlaced resolutions, is that it's being scaled to 1080p or something like that.

On the other hand, maybe when people have told me their RTX cards don't support interlaced output, they were specifically talking about custom resolutions, not standard TV ones.

Honestly, it's not a bad solution if your display isn't going to handle other signals natively and force 1080i upscaling (anyway).

That's the thing, almost every 1080i TV also supports 540p. Which is going to look much better for pixel art. Sony TVs, and some others, also display 480p correctly (though they usually does this via a hidden, centered integer scale, plus a raster stretch to eliminate underscan)

[Josh128]

You shouldn't need an Extron DSC 301 if just want to feed 1080i from a PC.

Nvidia GPUs have integer scaling options and I believe they still output 1080i natively. Just for laughs, I just got 1080i out of an RTX 4090; so, it still works. All you need is a DAC. Shouldn't need a video processor at all. If Windows fights you, download CRU.

Yeah, when Ben said that current gen GPUs dont do 1080i, I was very skeptical-- I mean, they can all still do 640x480, why wouldnt they be able to do a higher resolution? Makes no sense. I'd still like to try my RDNA 2 on one of my HDs to make sure, and possibly just to do some PC gaming testing.

I have no idea why 1080i would look soft if you're doing integer scaling on the GPU.
I don't think my card is doing any flicker filtering at all. It's plenty sharp. Obviously, fans of these HD CRTs don't see interlacing combing or they don't care. Honestly, it's not a bad solution if your display isn't going to handle other signals natively and force 1080i upscaling (anyway).

Contrary to what some people might believe, 1080i actually displays 100% of 1080p information in still images, literally no difference in detail. Obviously not in fast motion, but visible interlacing combing is almost non-existent in practice on these at 1080i for most sources. Think about it-- most people played 99% of DC, PS2, GC, and Xbox in 480i on SDCRTs, how many complained about interlace combing back then? Gradius V is a prime example of this, it looks fantastic on an actual 480i CRT, you dont really see the combing until you go to a digital display and attempt to use built in shitty de-interlacing or even external de-interlacing. The same is true with 1080i on an HD CRT, IMO.

I'm not a fan of HD CRTs, but you're not going to get a bad image from an nvidia card putting out 1080i through a good DAC.

Well, IMO in this day and age you probably should be, at least if you are a fan of CRT as a gaming display technology in general. With the advent of the "super scalers", RT5X and now the OSSC Pro have brought the HD CRT from basically useless for retro-gaming to now being as versatile as a PVM 20L5, yet at a much grander scale. The only real negatives being the size and bulk of them +$300 cost of entry for one of these scalers. People gripe about geometry and fish-eye effect of the FDs, but I have to question whether theyve ever used vertical and horizontal S-correction controls that they have. You can get scrolling as good as any curved tube with proper tuning. Sets like the Hitachi 36" Ultravisions can do native, lag free 640x480 or 800x600 in addition to 1080i, and are much easier to handle than the gargantuan FD Trinitions with the same screen real estate.

[orange808]

Hmmm, I'm a bit skeptical, based on what I've read in the past. Is your display a LCD or OLED? When you bring up the "information" submenu or whatever on the TV, what resolution does it report? My guess, based on how Nvidia cards in the past act with interlaced resolutions, is that it's being scaled to 1080p or something like that.

That odd.

You're right. Something is pulling hijinks behind the scenes and I'm still getting 1080p on the display. It's either Windows 11 or the driver. From what you've said, it must be the nvidia drivers that dropped interlaced support. A CRU profile with only 1080i timings appears to work. It resets the driver and displays the image the way I expected, but the beamer menu reports 1080p.

[Josh128]

Well, just tried my 6700XT PC into my 1080p Sammy plasma, which works fine with 1080i from the GTX 1050, and it kept telling me the "resolution was not compatible with the display" and prevented me from creating it. The PC kept reverting to 1280x1024 though so I dont know if its getting the proper EDID info or has anything to do with my Atlona HDMI switch that is in-line. Maybe, despite having an "interlace" option in the driver to create custom resolutions, it actually doesnt work.

I dont know, but I'll stay out of that rabbit hole and just assume Bens info is correct. Strange. Must be a driver limitation.

[deezdrama]

Well it sounds like 1080i from my rtx3080 wont be happening. Im not opposed to just picking up another amd r9 380x and slapping it in an extra machine I have in storage, just will take some time. Not super confident in this approach either though, seems like all my special builds are always plagued with goofy windows issues when doing uncoventional gpu tasks. If the extron is not a good solution whats the most capable scaler right now? I thought about getting a tink 4k when they drop to play with mask filters on a stupid bright qled i have but dont know if i can justify the price when i play mister 99% of the time on one of my 15kHz tubes. Ive heard good things about the gbs control but not sure if it can do 1080p interlacing.

[BazookaBen]

Not super confident in this approach either though, seems like all my special builds are always plagued with goofy windows issues when doing uncoventional gpu tasks.

Running one Nvidia and one AMD GPU is fine. Just install the RTX 3080 drivers after the r9 380x drivers, because the Nvidia drivers are newer.

Especially if you're playing 2D games and emulators mostly on the CRT, the 380x will handle those fine

The only headache will come when you want play a fancy new 3D game, and render it on the 3080 but output on the 380x, making the 380x the passthrough GPU. Last time I tried this, DX12 and DX11 games worked great, but I had trouble with a couple DX9 and Vulkan games. YMMV on that one. Hopefully it's improved since I tried that last year

[deezdrama]

Well I sold out and went for the simple fix and ordered a Atlona at-hd-sc-500 scaler. Ive read and seen videos with good looking results. The bad thing is its around 18ms of lag but Im short on tinkering time lately and just want to test this interest and play a few casual games and watch some movies on this hd widescreen crt.

Maybe ill invest in a better/ faster scaler if this ends up looking good enough to pursue further. Or I will get an analog gpu to throw in an extra pc.

Ive read the dvdo iscan duo is really low lag but couldnt find one. Not sure what the extron lag is like but ive seen the Atlona mentioned alot and found one at a decent price on ebay and just cant justify a $300+ scaler for testing this set just yet.
I have the opportunity to pick up an awesome loewes widescreen,curved, german made HD 60Hz set for a good price but wanted to first play around with this toshiba to see if a hd crt will have a permanent spot in the game room.

[BazookaBen]

Well I sold out and went for the simple fix and ordered a Atlona at-hd-sc-500 scaler.

Wait, so the initial topic is "modern pixel art games"

After this long thread, are you basically saying you're now just going to just play those games at a 4.5x bilinear scale, interlaced, with a frame of input lag?

[Bassa-Bassa]

lol

Can't blame him, though. The long thread is full of interlace apologism (which actually is not bad for an anime player, seemingly his main purpose after all. How long till he swaps it for a flat panel, though?)

[deezdrama]

Well I sold out and went for the simple fix and ordered a Atlona at-hd-sc-500 scaler.

Wait, so the initial topic is "modern pixel art games"

After this long thread, are you basically saying you're now just going to just play those games at a 4.5x bilinear scale, interlaced, with a frame of input lag?

Just a simple way to display to the set for testing while I take my time pursuing better options. Sometimes its good to start at the bottom to experience the negatives and move forward.

I started with emulation and lcd panels years ago which turned into shelves of og consoles and mister and a new hobby of finding pro monitors, recapping, and rgb modding consumer tubes. None of that would of happened without taking the first step in emulation.

[deezdrama]

Well I sold out and went for the simple fix and ordered a Atlona at-hd-sc-500 scaler.

Wait, so the initial topic is "modern pixel art games"

After this long thread, are you basically saying you're now just going to just play those games at a 4.5x bilinear scale, interlaced, with a frame of input lag?

Just a simple way to display to the set for testing while I take my time pursuing better options. Sometimes its good to start at the bottom to experience the negatives and move forward.

I started with emulation and lcd panels years ago which turned into shelves of og consoles and mister and a new hobby of finding pro monitors, recapping, and rgb modding consumer tubes, and recapping/modding consoles.

None of that would of happened without taking the first step in emulation.